Earthshaker
Williams, 1989You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider awarner.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
I'm the marketing side of the Basement Arcade ES mod. I think Mark said he was going to do some more. We finished our 4th run of Doctor Who kits early this year. I'll ask him. PM me if you're interested and I'll let him know people want these.
Quoted from Hawk007:ANYHOW about your post..... I have an original ES with the sinking building factory installed. If it would help I could send pictures etc. I think we could put a request through to Rick at PPS as I think they want to do kits like this and put what bean counters left out of all WB games back in with full package add on kits. So sweet!
Thanks for trying to find a way to put someone who redeveloped the product and has stood by every one that he sold out of business. That's really good for pinball.
That's the reason that the inferior Doctor Who Wobble head was created. They were cheap, but they didn't work like the original. People noticed and we eventually made more of our better product.
<HighHorse> Actually, a huge problem with this hobby is people inventing things for it any others stealing them. The green mirror for Creature was a friend of mine's and it was stolen. Wobble-Head was the same way. People need to stop discouraging others from even trying. </HighHorse>
Quoted from FrederikFrost:If someone were to make a product that would readily be available, that'd be much better than some guys making a batch whenever they feel like it. It's not patented or anything, is it? Have products available, and no one else will make this, unless you are charging severely more than it cost to make in parts and time, as there would be no business case for others.. It's all your choice.
OK, let's take a look at what it takes to make one of these. All of the parts are made, one at a time with a C&C. Some individual parts take over an hour each. After you have all the parts you made (at considerable expense), you then have to source motors that will work. You purchase the motors (that probably went up since the last time you made these) and now all you need is wiring harnesses which uses connectors that are not available anywhere so you MAKE YOUR OWN CONNECTORS that allow the unit to be installed without having to splice a single wire. Finally, you assemble it all and put it in a box to sell. Because you don't have unlimited funds, you can only spend $5000.00 of your own money until you get some more orders or can sell the ones you made. then when you sell them, some people start complaining that "They are too expensive" or "They can make them cheaper". This goes along until you sell them all and people want them again. Then they complain that they would pay anything for one now and that you should spend your entire life making these things not knowing if you'll ever sell another.
We have lives with Families. We make this stuff for a modest profit and provide something that no one else does. We can't make them faster, we can only make them well and on our schedule. We've had one return in the 10 years we've made Wobble Heads and ES kits and that was from someone that had someone else install it (ES Kit) for them and that person was annoyed that he had to do it for some reason. We took it back and replaced the motor they stripped out and resold it. Everyone that has them has had no complaints.
So, without any "Skin in the game" you can say whatever you want, but people who start looking for a way to undercut the people really trying to add products to the hobby really piss me off.
Quoted from Stu:I don't think you really understand the magnitude behind producing Reproduction Parts ( Like this one )....A small exercise: The Mod sells for $275 and the actual "cost to produce" is let's say $ 250 (I'm guessing here) so if the guy financing the project makes 50 of these he is into the project for $ 12,500 before he even sells just 1. So his profit is $ 1,250 +/-.....So to make an Additional 50 ( Just to have Hanging Around Collecting Dust While he Trys to Sell Them ) would cost an Additional $ 12,500 > bringing his total Initial Investment to $ 25,000....This being said, he has No Guarantee that he will Ever make his Investment Back, Let Alone a "Profit"....and thats just with 50 extras...If he were to do 100 "extras" to sit on a Shelf collecting dust for a couple of years, then his Inital Investment would be $ 75,000.....Now, I dont know about "you" but I sure dont have that kind of Disposable Income to just let it sit on a shelf and collect dust......Just my 2 ¢
Or... Like HE said!
Quoted from FrederikFrost:Let it be known that I have bought an ES kit from Basementarcade - And I'm loving it. However I'm not against the idea of someone doing the same thing as others have done, if they can reduce cost, improve availability etc. I mean, it's a niche hobby in the first place, with expensive and limited resources... Impoving upon that is not bad for the average consumer, I believe.
How much do you want for your mod? I'm ready to buy it back. Matter of fact, I'll send it to Stu free of charge.
Quoted from FrederikFrost:I'm not selling it. As a matter of fact I already stated that I love it.
Don't get your knickers in a twist, just because we don't agree how the market should be...
So would you love it as much if we hadn't over-engineered it so it would work perfectly for years? (My Wobble head kit is 13 years old), Or that you had to splice all of those wires into the harness yourself? I really want that kit back.
Quoted from FrederikFrost:Why would you want the kit back?
Stu deserves it more than you do.
Quoted from FrederikFrost:But if the supply cannot meet the demand, although small - What's wrong with more suppliers?
Because little guys don't have lawyers and it's not about supply meeting demand, it's about little guys getting pushed out by big guys with bigger sticks. When the big guys control everything, you'll be glad to pay whatever you want.
Quoted from Quietmouse:I think I missed something. Hawk 007 said he would post pictures of the ORIGINAL sinking building produced by WILLIAMS.
Then everyone got bent out of shape as if he were going to post pictures of the Basement Arcade sinking building and people were going to copy it and steal from Basement Arcade?
Ummmm:
http://pinballobsession.com/ at the bottom of the page and stuff... We've never hidden anything about the mech. And you can even see how we changed it over the years. All of them still work well as far as we know.
Quoted from FrederikFrost:I know where you are coming from.. But I don't know if I think it'll happen too much in the small industry that is pinball.. However since you yourself said you won't be making any of these, due to previous events, I really don't see the hate for the idea of others making it.
Pinball Obsession is dead. Mark has made more devices since we shut it down. I still help coordinate the sales for which he pays me nothing! He's a friend and we do things for each other. I'm talking to him now about another run of these, but we won't need to if you would just sell yours back to me so I can give it to Stu.
Install guide is still on Pinball Obsession:
http://www.pinballobsession.com
Use the latest, we went through a few iterations.
Thanks,
-Al-
You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider awarner.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/earthshaker-sinking-building?tu=awarner and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.
Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.
Cumming, GA