(Topic ID: 75226)

Early WOZ owners -- If you had it to do over………….


By pindome

6 years ago



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#1 6 years ago

With 20/20 hindsight would you early WOZ owners wished you would have postponed your game till the bugs were worked out?

Or was it better to be one of the first to play? It seems like those that routed it have done very well.

We postponed ours and are debating about another push back.

#2 6 years ago

Just like a new model car, it's always better to wait.

But, at the same time, you are only on this earth for so long.....would getting an extra year or two of WOZ play be worth fixing lights, pop bumper rings, monkey, doors, 1/2 code, ect ?

#3 6 years ago

All games have issues. I haven't had a nib yet that was issue free. Get the Woz and enjoy it.

#4 6 years ago

I have no regrets being an early bird. I've gotten to see the code progress which gives me an appreciation of the development seen. The initial code was rather basic but still fun. Seeing where the code has gone from there has been a lot of fun.

I also feel like I've been part of the process and that working on some of my bugs may have helped the manufacturing process and maybe even the code development.

The rule set has become insanely deep and knowing there are further advancements to come keeps me excited and reading these kind of posts.

#5 6 years ago

The worst part was tying your money up for 2-3 years when you didn't have to.

Prices are pretty much getting back to pre order levels… without the wait.

#6 6 years ago

I'm glad I was an early adopter. As somebody who came back to pinball because of WOZ and bought it as his first NIB, the RGB board problems, fuse problems, and shaker motor problems forced me to learn how to fix my own machine. What used to look like the flight panel of a 767 jumbo jet now makes sense to me.

I'm still an idiot, mind you...just a smarter idiot.

12
#7 6 years ago

I was a fairly early adopter.

I requested a refund shortly thereafter due to a few (IMO) sleight of hand updates.

Clearly I made the right choice as I still wouldn't have my game & what was supposed to be an on time, fully coded & trouble free game of all games has now become a delayed, incomplete coded game with lots of issues.

All games are late, incomplete & lacking QC so I'm not singling out JJP.

Stern almost guarantees a shit show, JJP promised the opposite however & then strung people along for years while strutting like a cock so that's why they get so much grief.

No regrets. I will buy anything JJP makes if it appeals to me... but a preorder is out of the question.

#8 6 years ago

I'm also glad I made the plunge because I've met a ton of great people through this and JJP's message board. Patient people willing to give their own time to help somebody new to the hobby. You just don't see that everywhere you go, and it's been a wonderful and unexpected part of the WOZ experience for me...

...and then there are all the people that have me set to "ignore" that will never see this. F them!

#9 6 years ago

bought the game early and have had no issues with it (led boards, thumper ring) etc. would do it over again.

#10 6 years ago

If I knew then what I know now, I would have done it in a heart beat.

LTG : )

#11 6 years ago

I doubt anyone will admit they should have waited. It's a lot of money and people take their purchases very personally.
Maybe make this thread in another 5-10 years.

#12 6 years ago

Jack said he would underpromise and overdeliver, but all he has done is overpromise and underdeliver. I didn't buy that statement anyway. New company, new operation, new game, you simply can't promise anything within a brand's first 3 years.

#13 6 years ago

Paid early, lost the money, but thought it wasn't fair I missed out, so bought a LE Aus WOZ last week, and everyone is very happy. Only trouble is, makes all my other games seem average now! Pre-paid for Hobbit as well, just won't learn (but end up happy).

#14 6 years ago

I have one of the very first. "Early adopter issues" are greatly exaggerated. Honestly, I seem to have far fewer problems than some that received theirs much later. Just like every other NIB I've purchased, problems seem more luck the draw than anything else. I'd do it again without hesitation.

#15 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

The worst part was tying your money up for 2-3 years when you didn't have to.
Prices are pretty much getting back to pre order levels… without the wait.

This is no joke- If you want to sell me you WOZLE for pre order pricing ($6500), I'll drive from Canton, MI to Canton, OH to pick it up next week. Heck, any NIB game should drop at least 10% once it's opened, which would put WOZLE preorders in the 5's, but I would pay $6500 for an HUO one.

I've always said that 5K is my pin ceiling, but I've recently had a change of heart in how I feel about WOZ.

#16 6 years ago
Quoted from usandthem:

This is no joke- If you want to sell me you WOZLE for pre order pricing ($6500), I'll drive from Canton, MI to Canton, OH to pick it up next week. Heck, any NIB game should drop at least 10% once it's opened, which would put WOZLE preorders in the 5's, but I would pay $6500 for an HUO one.
I've always said that 5K is my pin ceiling, but I've recently had a change of heart in how I feel about WOZ.

Preorder pricing also included many paying $7500. Prices are there now… who knows, in another 6 months when the rest get delivered you may not have to drive far to get one at $6500.

#17 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

Preorder pricing also included many paying $7500. Prices are there now… who knows, in another 6 months when the rest get delivered you may not have to drive far to get one at $6500.

Understood...So $7500 is more along the lines of what you were thinking at this time?

-1
#18 6 years ago
Quoted from usandthem:

Understood...So $7500 is more along the lines of what you were thinking at this time?

Yep, that is what they are selling at. Even NIB WoZLE's are now in the upper 7's...

#19 6 years ago
Quoted from PinCrush:

I have one of the very first. "Early adopter issues" are greatly exaggerated. Honestly, I seem to have far fewer problems than some that received theirs much later. Just like every other NIB I've purchased, problems seem more luck the draw than anything else. I'd do it again without hesitation.

They're not greatly exaggerated when they happen to you.

#20 6 years ago

If Jack hits a home run with Hobbit, flushing more wozle's into the market, that will cause more price drops. If so, very nice HUO wozle's will settle somewhere between 5000-6000 in a couple years, IMO. (unless demand picks up)Wonder how many pre-ordered wozle at 6500?

#21 6 years ago

If I could turn back time, I would have jumped on board and ordered the Wizard Of Oz when it was first available.
Jack has exceeded my expectations with this machine.

#22 6 years ago

I would do it again but only because it was a start up and probably would not have happened without the money up front. I would not and won't do it for the second game.

Its a great game and I still play 5-6 games a night. It hasn't gotten old yet.

#23 6 years ago

No regrets here. It's a great pin and a refreshing change from others in my lineup. Variety is the spice of life.

#24 6 years ago

Yes, I would do it again. The game is the most feature packed game made since twilight zone. I don't think anyone can argue that. It will have the deepest code since lotr. I don't think anyone can argue that. The game has the highest quality cabinet ever put on a game. That is not disputable. I got all of this for a price that no one can seem to touch today for a NIB pin. You can argue shots, theme, etc.

I also did something else, I helped Jack do what no one thought was possible, namely starting a new pinball company from scratch. Since Woz started working into the pipeline, Stern has raised their game too. This is a win for everyone in the hobby!

Ken
Www.pinballrebel.com

#25 6 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

I'm glad I was an early adopter. As somebody who came back to pinball because of WOZ and bought it as his first NIB, the RGB board problems, fuse problems, and shaker motor problems forced me to learn how to fix my own machine. What used to look like the flight panel of a 767 jumbo jet now makes sense to me.
I'm still an idiot, mind you...just a smarter idiot.

I think your post sums it up best, with all the problems you have posted about and you still have no regrets about getting in early.

I think we will request our game be put back into the build que.

Thanks all for your responses.

#26 6 years ago

I wish I was a later game only for the fact that I would rather have all the bugs out of the game. I had my first light board go. it just scares me that it might be the beginning of others to go. I'm also told the gi is better on the newer ones - I have no idea if that's true as I have only seen my woz.

I was an acdc early buyer and have the cloudy window - of course it never bothered me until I saw one without the cloudy window - what a difference.

I just realized it's better to wait now and maybe pay a little more.

I love the woz gameplay - I will say it's best game ever - just my opinion - can't wait for the hobbit - although I am waiting till I can pay and have it the next day. the $500 savings wasn't enough to be a pre order.

thanks ed

#27 6 years ago

Honestly, I would pass. The game has been broken so much it's been more frustration than fun. When it is working, I'm just waiting for it to die. I can't relax and enjoy it. If I could do it all over I'd definitely have passed.

#28 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

The worst part was tying your money up for 2-3 years when you didn't have to.
Prices are pretty much getting back to pre order levels… without the wait.

The part I hated most was the trolls telling me how bad it looks, how bad the theme is, and how I did something with my money that they do not agree with like they have any say in what I do with my money. Bugger off and worry about your own money, I have mine under control.

The rest was fun to watch, history in the making.

#29 6 years ago
Quoted from absocountry2:

The part I hated most was the trolls telling me how bad it looks, how bad the theme is, and how I did something with my money that they do not agree with like they have any say in what I do with my money. Bugger off and worry about your own money, I have mine under control.
The rest was fun to watch, history in the making.

Trolls because we give opinions that you do not like? Why even care so much? If you love WoZ and the whole experience than what's the big deal? The only thing that matters is what you think and feel about it otherwise this is a forum and you will get different views, opinions, comments, etc...

Look in the Stern posts. Plenty of positive and negative comments there. Look in the FS posts. Plenty of 'trolls' as you want to call them there.

WoZ guys seem so sensitive. If you love it great but if you don't you're just a troll?

#30 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

WoZ guys seems so sensitive. If you love it great but if you don't you're just a troll...

I could also be because some of the people referred to as trolls only seem to be visible on pinside in the exact same type of threads, and contribute little else.

#31 6 years ago
Quoted from Atomicboy:

I could also be because some of the people referred to as trolls only seem to be visible on pinside in the exact same type of threads, and contribute little else.

probably... glad I am not one of those losers.

-2
#32 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

probably... glad I am not one of those losers.

You pretty much are. That's why a moderator (actually multiple) have called you out in it.

#33 6 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

You pretty much are. That's why a moderator (actually multiple) have called you out in it.

No, its not about being a troll or personally attacking someone like you will do on occasion its about who/what you support.

#34 6 years ago

I welcome opinions a couple of times but this thread is for early WOZ owners, why are you here? I posted my opinion as an early WOZ owner and now you are trying to make me the bad guy who is suppressing others because I do not agree? You are the one jumping on me for giving my opinion. Do you not see your own hypocrisy?

Show me where I bash Stern? Good luck with that. There are trolls everywhere but they back off after a warning and then the keep coming back. I am pretty sure you have been warned about backing off of WOZ threads yourself, but here you are.

You ask why care so much? I do not, why do you?

I am not sensitive, just tired of your trolling WOZ. We know you do not like it, got it, now go try to discuss something you care about. Most of us are here to have a good time and enjoy pinball.

#35 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

No, its not about being a troll or personally attacking someone like you will do on occasion its about who/what you support.

It is not and Robin has told you that before. The topic is early WOZ owners.

-2
#36 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

No, its not about being a troll or personally attacking someone like you will do on occasion its about who/what you support.

That's all well and good and we know you don't support woz. You wear that badge proudly. So much so that it can be seen from outside the thread. You aren't welcome in woz threads yet you find it necessary to jump in to every one.

#37 6 years ago

It's a great game, but if I could do it over, I wouldn't have ordered. I had the money set aside for Kingpin (riiiiiiiight), but could have bought a Tron LE for $5k in June of 2011. I could have spent two+ years playing that, sold it for more than a NIB WOZ and bought WOZ now. Plus, I'd have the extra $1900 available (nevertheless whatever over the price of a WOZ the Tron sold for). My feelings aren't necessarily WOZ-centric though. I think I'd pass on any NIB until the code and bugs are fixed.

On top of all of that, I became a father to twins in March 2013, so pinball playing time is scarce. My WOZ and Metallica get played about every two weeks at the moment. Not nearly enough to justify over $10k sitting around in my house. When I ordered WOZ, my time and finances were in a much different place. If I had known in Jan 2011 where I'd be now, there's no way I would have bit.

Again, great game, and if everyone had my point of view, WOZ wouldn't exist at all, so I'm very glad JJP pulled it off and raised the bar for the entire industry.

#38 6 years ago

I could go both ways answering this question.

As my first NIB it was cool to get a game early and experiencing the code development is pretty interesting. If I had my druthers I would have been delivered a pin with completed code and no issues but the JJP support has been beyond my expectations and having input into how rules are getting hashed out is a pretty bisque experience.

As it stands, with 1.24, I think the code is far enough along that receiving a game with it will keep most players entertained for a while. The issues with boards and such seems to be an ongoing thing that JJP is working through and that is about all they can do as they try to root out the problem.

At this point I wouldn't worry about pushing back delivery unless you want the code to be 100% but who knows when that will happen. Mid '14? Ever?

#39 6 years ago
Quoted from callmesteam:

It's a great game, but if I could do it over, I wouldn't have ordered. I had the money set aside for Kingpin (riiiiiiiight), but could have bought a Tron LE for $5k in June of 2011. I could have spent two+ years playing that, sold it for more than a NIB WOZ and bought WOZ now. Plus, I'd have the extra $1900 available (nevertheless whatever over the price of a WOZ the Tron sold for). My feelings aren't necessarily WOZ-centric though. I think I'd pass on any NIB until the code and bugs are fixed.
On top of all of that, I became a father to twins in March 2013, so pinball playing time is scarce. My WOZ and Metallica get played about every two weeks at the moment. Not nearly enough to justify over $10k sitting around in my house. When I ordered WOZ, my time and finances were in a much different place. If I had known in Jan 2011 where I'd be now, there's no way I would have bit.
Again, great game, and if everyone had my point of view, WOZ wouldn't exist at all, so I'm very glad JJP pulled it off and raised the bar for the entire industry.

Which one is getting sold first?

#40 6 years ago
Quoted from TaylorVA:

Which one is getting sold first?

haha... Good question! Metallica would definately go first.

Quoted from TaylorVA:

As it stands, with 1.24, I think the code is far enough along that receiving a game with it will keep most players entertained for a while.

I received my WOZ with 1.17 installed (I think) and even back then the code was deeper than Metallica is right now, but thats a discussion for another (SUPER LONG) thread.

#41 6 years ago

I wish I could have waited.

I received my machine in the late summer. It's been sitting in my basement dead for 48 days now. I'm supposed to be receiving some parts today for it and I pray this round of Band-Aids actually gets it running.

It is a really cool looking machine, but that's all I really know about it, as I haven't played one in months now. If it ever works again, it had better "wow" me or it's out the door the second I have it up and running. I have better ways to spend my time.

#42 6 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

That's all well and good and we know you don't support woz. You wear that badge proudly. So much so that it can be seen from outside the thread. You aren't welcome in woz threads yet you find it necessary to jump in to every one.

What I don't get is why Tony wants to alienate such a big portion of the pinball community as a person that sells pinball machines.

Even though he posts his FS threads on Mr. Pinball as Tony from Canton I would think that you would want to embrace all of pinball as a "seller/flipper".

Quoted from teekee:

WoZ guys seem so sensitive. If you love it great but if you don't you're just a troll?

Over and over again in every Woz thread is what's called a "TROLL".....

#43 6 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Over and over again in every Woz thread is what's called a "TROLL".....

Sounds like Ice would fit the bill as well! Over and Over!

-1
#44 6 years ago
Quoted from Alphajerk3000:

I wish I could have waited.
I received my machine in the late summer. It's been sitting in my basement dead for 48 days now. I'm supposed to be receiving some parts today for it and I pray this round of Band-Aids actually gets it running.
It is a really cool looking machine, but that's all I really know about it, as I haven't played one in months now. If it ever works again, it had better "wow" me or it's out the door the second I have it up and running. I have better ways to spend my time.

48 DAYS?? PM sent!

-1
#45 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

Preorder pricing also included many paying $7500. Prices are there now… who knows, in another 6 months when the rest get delivered you may not have to drive far to get one at $6500.

If that is true, and you never know, it might happen, then it will all be relative and that Acdc premium will be selling for $4500 and every other pin out there will be dropping as well.

Of course you do know this now as you've had to drop prices significantly if you want to sell anything. You'd have to have your head buried somewhere not to see FS threads sitting there and prices dropping across the board.

So I'm a positive "troll" because I love the game, Ok, I'll take it

#46 6 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

If that is true, and you never know, it might happen, then it will all be relative and that Acdc premium will be selling for $4500 and every other pin out there will be dropping as well.
Of course you do know this now as you've had to drop prices significantly if you want to sell anything. You'd have to have your head buried somewhere not to see FS threads sitting there and prices dropping across the board.

Absolutely! Prices on just about everything have dropped and may continue to drop... I have never said anything different.

#47 6 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

Absolutely! Prices on just about everything have dropped... I have never said anything different.

I know you have been saying that, I'm pointing out that if Woz does drop to $6500, which I would doubt, but it might, then it will only be because the entire market continues to free fall as the new supply far outstrips the demand and people feel the need to sell old titles to fund new ones.

Acdc, the premium I own, has a whole lot farther to drop based on the sheer numbers of production and the fact they are still being made.

#48 6 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I know you have been saying that, I'm pointing out that if Woz does drop to $6500, which I would doubt, but it might, then it will only be because the entire market continues to free fall as the new supply far outstrips the demand and people feel the need to sell old titles to fund new ones.

I agree for the most part but WoZ is more vulnerable than many others because of the number produced with more to come. Everything will take a hit but the ones with the biggest supply will get hit even more... simple SUPPLY and demand.

I could go into more of my thoughts but we've all heard them before...

Now stop quoting me and asking me questions... I'm not supposed to be here! Shhh!

#49 6 years ago
Quoted from callmesteam:

haha... Good question! Metallica would definately go first.

I received my WOZ with 1.17 installed (I think) and even back then the code was deeper than Metallica is right now, but thats a discussion for another (SUPER LONG) thread.

If only you had a podcast to discuss such topics. #dontblowyourgoodmaterialonpinside

#50 6 years ago

Truth is I would have waited even at the 6500 vs 7500 price - absolutely no benefit to ordering early and your money was tied up for 3 years. I was in the first 100 games - got mine in August and mine has worked fine (knock on wood) - but these early ones are akin to the first batches of xbox 360's - the light boards are eventually going to fail as it is a design defect. I think the build quality of materials is excellent but the jury is still very much out on how reliable the hardware is - I don't see these running virtually trouble free 10-12 years from now similar to the bally williams games of the 90's - too many things that can fail in the hardware components due to heat, let alone operating these right now. The GI setup is...unfortunately.....not very good and just doesn't work well at all - This will be fixed for the hobbit and i know a lot of this should be expected with unproven hardware and design. I wish jack all the best and applaud the efforts but I would have waited....... I did not pre-order hobbit and will wait and see on the final product and the first batch of early adopters/ errr... beta testers flame suit on! lol

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