(Topic ID: 139318)

Early Stern display missing segment...

By swillie

6 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 17 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Bay78
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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#1 6 years ago

Just picked up a Flight 2000. In the player one display, the same segment of all 7 digits is out being the upper left side segment. I swapped it with player four to fix the immediate problem. Same segments are out at the player four now so I know the problem is on the displays board. I was thinking to reflow the solder on all the pins for starters. I figure it could be that, or one of the small components on the board. I don't know if the schematic can point me in the right direction.

Anybody have a more specific idea of what I should be looking for or which components or pin the check?

#3 6 years ago

Well that is the exact information I needed, thank you so much !!

I will replace Q18 and go from there.

#4 6 years ago

www.papinball.com/tips/Stern_Classic_SB_15.pdf

#5 6 years ago

Thanks Raff as well...what a great resource for this pin, now I can test it and isolate the exact problem before ordering parts. Awesome.

#6 6 years ago

when removing the connectors from the displays or plugging them back in make sure you turn the power off

#7 6 years ago

Well...upon looking at the display board, Q18 was located in the 1000 digit section. The segment sections were clearly marked, and the F segment group had Q13. I confirmed this on the schematic for Flight 2000. It's a DA-300 B 7 digit display. Anyway I replace the Q13 transistor, and reflowed the solder on the connector pins as it clearly needed it. F segment still out on all displays. I followed the path from Q13 to the glass checking for continuity of the traces, all seems okay. So I suppose it could be one or both of the resistors in the 'F' segment section, or the decoder chip.

At least it is moved to display 4 where it will get very little to no use. I don't think I have ever played a 4 player game on any of my pins, other than for testing purposes, usually with EM games in particular. I have to decide whether to start throwing effort at this one or leave it. It will bug me a little, I don't go for full blown restoration on my pins, but I do like everything to function as close to 100% as I can get.

How can I test the resistors with the multimeter? Where would I source the decoder?

#8 6 years ago

Turn the game off when unplugging boards and measuring resistance. Test resistors with the meter set to Ω . Put the leads on either end and see what you get. The number you get can be affected by other devices in parallel with the part being tested.

4543 decoder chips here: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=11&pg=3

Put it in a socket. I like the SIP strips at the top of the page - they snap to length to fit any chip. : https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=161

While you're at it, get some 1/2 watt 100KΩ resistors and replace R26, R30, R32, R33, R34, R39, and R44 on all four player displays as well as R1, R3, R5, R7, R9, and R11 on the credit/match board. Might as well if they're out getting header pins soldered. https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/RCF_Half.asp

#9 6 years ago
Quoted from balzofsteel:

Turn the game off when unplugging boards and measuring resistance. Test resistors with the meter set to Ω . Put the leads on either end and see what you get. The number you get can be affected by other devices in parallel with the part being tested.
4543 decoder chips here: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=11&pg=3
Put it in a socket. I like the SIP strips at the top of the page - they snap to length to fit any chip. : https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=161
While you're at it, get some 1/2 watt 100KΩ resistors and replace R26, R30, R32, R33, R34, R39, and R44 on all four player displays as well as R1, R3, R5, R7, R9, and R11 on the credit/match board. Might as well if they're out getting header pins soldered. https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/RCF_Half.asp

I don't think you need to go out of your way to change the 100k resistors in the digit drive to 1/2w. In my XP they only fail when there is some other problem that makes them fail, like a locked digit driver.

For the OP issue with missing segment.... Replace segment 'f' driver at Q18. Still no go, replace the 7 segment decoder IC 4543. Still no go, follow the segment circuit up to where it goes into the glass. Compare to other segments in display test with DMM. If good there, the display is bad itself.

#10 6 years ago
Quoted from barakandl:

I don't think you need to go out of your way to change the 100k resistors in the digit drive to 1/2w. In my XP they only fail when there is some other problem that makes them fail, like a locked digit driver.

I agree with barakandi when i fixed one of my stern machine display the problem wasnt where i thought it would be ,
the first thing i changed was the header pins J1 , if you want practice your soldiering skills this is good to work on
parts are cheap change Q18 if no good R28,then R23

#11 6 years ago

swillie,

I apologize for giving you the wrong transistor number. I got my information from PinWiki. Fortunately you found the mistake before replacing the wrong one. I was not that fortunate, I replaced several resistors as suggested on PinWiki and they were the wrong numbers.

It seems PinWiki does not know the Stern DA-300 board is different from the other display boards.

Bob

#12 6 years ago

Thanks for all of the input. I ordered decoders , sockets and resistors from link above and am gonna give it another try. Board traces checks out all the way to the glass, hopefully it is okay. I'm on a mission now to get this display fixed.

#13 6 years ago

Well I replaced the decoder and resistors for segment F, no luck. I followed the troubleshooting guide tree posted and it looks like the glass display is bad. Oh well, another display has the 1000 digit stuck on, replaced the level shifter and it works perfect. So I feel somewhat redeemed.

New old display??? Anyone have a good link, would appreciate it much.

#14 6 years ago

I know the displays are getting more expensive, but Pinball Life has glass for $57.95 http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=538.

You can probably get new glass or entire used displays on Ebay cheaper if you want to take the chance and go that route.

#16 6 years ago

Thanks for the links schudel5 and Cheddar. I decided to order the Ebay display for 50$. I will follow up with how it works when I get it. The seller buys olds boards/displays to repair and resell. Could curb some of the cost, but I will maybe just keep this one for parts.

5 years later
#17 1 year ago
Quoted from barakandl:

I don't think you need to go out of your way to change the 100k resistors in the digit drive to 1/2w. In my XP they only fail when there is some other problem that makes them fail, like a locked digit driver.
For the OP issue with missing segment.... Replace segment 'f' driver at Q18. Still no go, replace the 7 segment decoder IC 4543. Still no go, follow the segment circuit up to where it goes into the glass. Compare to other segments in display test with DMM. If good there, the display is bad itself.

I had a very similar issue to the OP and I did end up finding a bridged solder point where the display segment solders on to the display board. Fixed up the bridge and plugged display back in and now working MINT! This was a lot of help. Thanks guys.

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