(Topic ID: 78147)

EAG London,pins and chat with Gary

By poibug

10 years ago


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    #1 10 years ago

    So,I was at the E.A.G yesterday in London,bit of a trek but worth it.

    As usual,and expected, a plethora of redemption games,fruit machines,crane machines,kiddie rides,but thankfully a few pins as well.

    There was a Pinball Heaven/JJP stand there - with no Jack.He wasn't there yesterday,hadn't been there previous days,and don't believe he is there today either.
    On the stand were two new normal WOZ,and one 75th Anniversary.
    WOZ aint really for me but IMO the red 75th looks better - tho the best would be the red version but with the green backglass/lcd surround,as the red don't look as good,others commented the same.
    There was a ST one one stand-Wesex.

    Gary Stern and Shelly Sax were there on the Electrocoin stand,along with two ST pro's and an AC/DC Luci.
    I love AC/DC and am still humming and ha'ing about getting one and to me I think Luci looks the best.I like the extra Luci-esque pictures on the lower playfield,tho for me would have prefered just them,and they got rid of "flame man",as i think that just looks poor.Only other negatives for me re Luci is the bleed thru on the translite,and the blue marks on Luci's shoulder on the cab,at first I thought it was cab damage but now realise it is paort of the artwork.
    Would still if going the new route get a Luci tho.

    As I was there I wanted a chat about Metallica,and wanted to put forward my views to Shelley and Gary,but tried to be constructive.Explained howw I have a few Sterns-LOTR,FG,MOP-NIB,RBION-first ever NIB,also until recently had a SM and that I also have a GnR.
    I basically stated how disappointed I was that after over 6months of buying an LE for approx $10,000 I still have features listed on the playfield that don't exist,I was bothered how the code still aint done.
    I stated how bad it would be,as an example if I was In a, say Ford Mustang with Gary and I asked him to put the aircon on,and I tried to connect my music player to the aux socket only to be told"they don't work-yet".
    But more importantly VERY dissappointed at the poor communications from Stern,re info on the magnet problems,and also info re software.I mentioned how many others in the community felt the same.
    I quoted the facts their only comms re code was on their facebook page on Jan 2nd.
    Gary then said how the community would be upset if they had said we will release so and so on Jan 16th,but if they date went past that we would be up in arms.
    I reiterated the point,that it does not have to be ultimately specific with set in stone dates,as I know how things change but in the 21st century with their facebook page,web site etc,their communications is very lacking.I pointed out how yes,at times companies don't like admitting they made a mistake,but I felt that it is better to admit them rather than to say nothing at all.Gary stated that he communicates to the community by going to shows,pinside hq etc,and I stated IMO that was not enough,it is so easy for them to post relevant info on their sites without having to fly somewhere.

    I went on to say that I for one,would never preorder another Stern again due to lack of modes/communication,and knew of others that were thinking the same,and I mentioned how I don't think that would be good for Stern as Pinheads would buy a high percentage of the LE titles.
    He did,around that point write in his little black book-better communications.

    In more of the conversation he admitted the "fooked up" with Metallica,and going forward things are to change.Stating they now have manpower in place for three projects - three designers-Borg,Ritchie and Trudeau - NOT Gomez as he overseas not designs,and how they have three main software guys - Lyman,Ropp and Waison.
    Also stated there are also junior software guys too.
    He had to go as someone was waiting for him so I asked "are you working on code for Metallica",he said "be paitient my friend be patient".
    I then said(prob more sternly)"Gary I do not expect a date,please just answer the question,are you working on Metallica code,yes or no?"

    "Yes we are" he said - took a lot of getting out,but felt it was good to here from him.

    I thanked him and Shelly for thier time,and off I went.

    Sorry for this being a long post,and to some(most?)there is no new info here,just wanted to let fellow pinheads know he may be interested

    poibug

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    #2 10 years ago

    Great interview! Finaly someone who asked the things we want to know. I am realy dissappointed about guys like the one from the pinball magazin that just want to promote new pins or celebrate old ones but avoids to ask about real problems. Perhaps he is to afraid that he won't get interviews in the future.

    Only if you remind them about the things they do wrong they can do better.

    But i just don' t get why it's so hard for Gary to admit that they are working on the Metallica code?

    #3 10 years ago

    Great post!

    Wow, Gary should have gone into politics

    Stern have someone manically deleting facebook posts all day long and yet they can't give code updates....

    #4 10 years ago

    Would be nice if they could even give a month time frame at the least...like we should be able to release new code in February or if they are going to miss it, let people know...like OP said. Communication is such a big key in keeping people happy/informed.....it's too bad Stern is trying to improve this.

    #5 10 years ago

    Stern needs to acknowledge their business has changed once the LEs were added to their lineup. Home owners need more care and communication.

    #6 10 years ago

    Thanks so much for doing this! He needs to know how upset people are and that, as you said, communication must improve through all of the social media outlets available these days.

    #7 10 years ago

    "Be patient my friend be patient" ... LMFAO

    #8 10 years ago

    Stay thirsty my friend....that's what he meant to say.

    #9 10 years ago
    Quoted from movingpictures:

    "Be patient my friend be patient" ... LMFAO

    I'm glad someone put Gary's feet to the fire. He is at a lot of shows, he needs to hear this more.

    #10 10 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    I'm glad someone put Gary's feet to the fire. he needs to hear this more.

    100% agree...anyone know his adddress...I have a couple torches and pitchforks I can donate to the cause

    #11 10 years ago

    Appreciate this, but after reading this I feel that Stern is not working on the code. If they truly were he would have admitted it more freely. It's like he felt that you were not going to take "no" for an answer so he just said what you wanted to hear so he could get away.

    #12 10 years ago
    Quoted from Iceman5000:

    Appreciate this, but after reading this I feel that Stern is not working on the code. If they truly were he would have admitted it more freely. It's like he felt that you were not going to take "no" for an answer so he just said what you wanted to hear so he could get away.

    Wrong. Lyman has been working on Metallica, that is a fact. He's a master tournament player, and you can bet that he's making sure everything works well together and feels organic, fun, and has strategy. Remember - there's more to these games than just the code. Being licensed, sometimes they have to go back and forth with the licensor for approvals. It's quite possible that the code IS "done" ...but they need to go back and forth with Metallica on some details before they can release it. At this point it'll be here sooner than later.

    #13 10 years ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    Wrong. Lyman has been working on Metallica, that is a fact. He's a master tournament player, and you can bet that he's making sure everything works well together and feels organic, fun, and has strategy. Remember - there's more to these games than just the code. Being licensed, sometimes they have to go back and forth with the licensor for approvals. It's quite possible that the code IS "done" ...but they need to go back and forth with Metallica on some details before they can release it. At this point it'll be here sooner than later.

    ALL of this is forgivable if they would just TELL US. Instead we're left guessing.

    #14 10 years ago

    Sure he wants to make it very balanced, so you can't exploit a code weakness like some other games.

    http://papa.org/2012/12/03/kings-of-steel-tutorial/

    #15 10 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    ALL of this is forgivable if they would just TELL US. Instead we're left guessing.

    Totally. I really wonder what IS the psychology behind the push back on more communication and even "vague" updates. Everyone would like vague updates just fine if they aren't comfortable with specifics. All they have to say is "Hey guys, we hear your concerns and are truly sorry Metallica's code update hasn't been released yet - we're shooting for Q1 '14, stay tuned". Gary was in the room (George's presentation) when I brought this up concerning X-Men & TF at the PPE show a few years ago. Plenty of other people have brought it up at shows and via Email. So, they're not unaware that this is a huge problem with home buyers.

    #16 10 years ago

    Keep in mind, they might have been hearing it from a few folks here and there, but then you look at the sales #s and they were still selling the machines so that's kind of conflicting data. Maybe now they are realizing that it is important and is/potentially affecting future sales.

    I def hope their communications improves - think it would do a LOT to make folks happy even if there are inevitable delays.

    #17 10 years ago

    Good job Poi. I couldn't make it this year, but would have liked to have asked the exact same things. Whether I'd have had the nerve to is a different matter, so well done fella.

    Lloyd

    #18 10 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    Stern needs to acknowledge their business has changed once the LEs were added to their lineup. Home owners need more care and communication.

    He sorta did.He did say how it's more complicated as they have numerous B.O.M due to the different versions,more than one kind of rules etc.
    Admittedly I never said what was on my mind-just make a normal version and a bling version.That is one thing JJP have right.

    #19 10 years ago
    Quoted from Iceman5000:

    If they truly were he would have admitted it more freely. It's like he felt that you were not going to take "no" for an answer so he just said what you wanted to hear so he could get away.

    Gary is just the figurehead at Stern.

    He does not know when the code is going to be finished, or what problems even exist with it.

    =

    It would be the same as asking Bill Ford when will the new Sync software will be out for your car because your 160g ipod does not completely index. He would not know.

    #20 10 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Gary is just the figurehead at Stern.
    He does not know when the code is going to be finished, or what problems even exist with it.
    =
    It would be the same as asking Bill Ford when will the new Sync software will be out for your car because your 160g ipod does not completely index. He would not know.

    Thats a really good observation, however Ford is a much larger company than Stern, so I would imagine that Gary would be a little closer to the status of what is going on day to day at his company, but then again, maybe not!

    #21 10 years ago
    Quoted from poibug:

    Admittedly I never said what was on my mind-just make a normal version and a bling version.That is one thing JJP have right.

    Well, they sort of do.

    If you think about it, the Premium & LE is similar to Jack's Standard and LE. Same exact gameplay features - LE's got a bit more bling.

    Plenty of people are happy with having a lower cost alternative with the Pro model. That price is way more palatable for most ops and collectors….and from buyer reviews, plenty of people love their Pro models of Metallica, Star Trek, etc….some people even prefer the Pro models! Stern offering 3 choices has really worked out for their business & customer satisfaction.

    #22 10 years ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    Well, they sort of do.

    If you think about it, the Premium & LE is similar to Jack's Standard and LE. Same exact gameplay features - LE's got a bit more bling.

    Yes, this is a good analogy. JJP does not have a matching model to the Pro, and if they did you know it would be severely changed, so we can't jump on Stern too much about maintaining a $5k price point that has changes.

    #23 10 years ago
    Quoted from Hudson:

    Thats a really good observation, however Ford is a much larger company than Stern, so I would imagine that Gary would be a little closer to the status of what is going on day to day at his company, but then again, maybe not!

    I've talked to him many times.

    He is a super nice guy, but you can instantly tell he does not know any technical details.

    #24 10 years ago

    Thanks for the feedback.

    Any reason why Heighway pinball did not show up? Zero information on their website.

    #25 10 years ago

    3 legged stool?

    #26 10 years ago

    Good interview man, thanks for taking the time to do it.

    #27 10 years ago

    Keep on doing this who ever will meet gary from now on. Ask him face to face, over and over again about the code.

    Finaly not a brown nose interview. Well done.

    #28 10 years ago

    Great post!! Gary needs to learn how to be a straight shooter and communicate in the year 2014. You brought up so many good points and I appreciate you hammering those points to Gary. The expectation for communication has increased due to the existence of social media. Companies can no longer do what they have done for years. Companies can now have an intimate relationship with their customers and welcome feedback in a way that they never could. For those company's who except it, it will be very positive, for those who refuse it, they will get loaded with hate mail and posts.

    #29 10 years ago

    Mate took the photo as I was talking

    met talk.jpgmet talk.jpg
    #30 10 years ago
    Quoted from jlm33:

    Any reason why Heighway pinball did not show up? Zero information on their website.

    Yeah, real bummer they didn't make it. I know they had planned on it to debut the final prototype of Full Throttle and the show is in their backyard. Obviously something didn't come together as planned and they had to torpedo the whole show. Hopefully we'll get an update sooner than later.

    #31 10 years ago

    Bummer, their website hasn't even been updated since November.

    Quoted from frolic:

    Yeah, real bummer they didn't make it. I know they had planned on it to debut the final prototype of Full Throttle and the show is in their backyard. Obviously something didn't come together as planned and they had to torpedo the whole show. Hopefully we'll get an update sooner than later.

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