Dummy needs help with a Shuffle Alley

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#1 4 years ago

OP

EH

Mcrics

Pinside member

Lincoln, NE

4y 29,400 17 8 7

Hi all!

New to the hobby, and to the boards.

Recently purchased a 1964 Tiger Shuffle Alley in perfect-ish working condition. Lugged it up a flight of stairs, drove it 500 miles, nearly killed myself getting into the basement and.... now it doesn't quite work right.

It appears the M, N, O and P playfield switches are not firing, making it impossible to get a strike. Everything else, including scoring, seems to be working fine. It seems like this could be an easy fix for a competent collector. Unfortunately, that's not me. Can anyone offer so basic help on this?

Thank you!

IMG_1702 (resized).jpg

IMG_1703 (resized).jpg

IMG_1705 (resized).jpg

IMG_1706 (resized).jpg

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#2 4 years ago

M

MarkG

Fun With Pinball

9y 71,300 4,364

Did it work before you moved it? If you're lucky the jones plugs and sockets between the alley and the backbox just need to be cleaned.

/Mark

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#3 4 years ago

OP

EH

Mcrics

Pinside member

Lincoln, NE

4y 29,400 17 8 7

Thanks. Everything worked before I moved it.

Unfortunately, i've tried plugging and unplugging the sockets that connect the alley to the backbox several times and gave them a cleaning to no effect.

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#4 4 years ago

M

MarkG

Fun With Pinball

9y 71,300 4,364

It seems unlikely that 4 switches stopped working together. More likely something in common to the switches may not be working. How did you narrow in on the M, N, O and P switches? And do you mean switches or rollovers? The N and O rollovers for example activate at least two switches each.

If the problem is that you can't score strikes, it would be helpful to see the circuit for the Strike relay coil.

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#5 4 years ago

GTW

Gotemwill

Pinside+ Frequent

5y 62,300 916 1

Do the M, N, O, P rollover switches register points if you depress them individually?

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#6 4 years ago

OP

EH

Mcrics

Pinside member

Lincoln, NE

4y 29,400 17 8 7

Thanks for the replies. I should be more precise in my language.

If i depress the M, N, O or P rollovers, nothing happens. The pins don't go up, no score registers, nothing.

This is true whether i depress them individually, in combination with other rollovers, or after depressing the A-L rollovers that the puck would trigger before hitting M-P during normal gameplay.

The other rollovers, A-L, and the 1st and 2nd ball relays in the very back all appear to work correctly. Pins go up, scores fine.

I CAN actually generate a strike by cheating and manually depressing combinations of the A-L rollovers that would be impossible to trigger with the puck during normal gameplay. Hence, I don't think the problem is with the strike relay, but with the M-P rollovers.

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#7 4 years ago

M

MarkG

Fun With Pinball

9y 71,300 4,364

Looking at your schematic the M-P rollover switches all rely on the brown wire drawn across the lower part of the schematic. The brown wire in turn relies on a switch on the 1 Pin relay being closed because the 1 Pin relay has tripped. And the 1 Pin relay should trip if either the A or B rollover switch closes.

It would help to understand which of the switches on the brown wire are working and which aren't so try the following tests. Reset the pins before each test so the tests don't interfere with each other. For each test start by closing the A or B rollover switch. You should hear the 1 Pin relay trip, and you should be able to see that is has tripped by looking in the back. Once the 1 Pin relay is tripped each of the switches (working from left to right along the brown wire in the schematic) should behave as described here:

- closing the O rollover switches should trip the 2 Pin, 4 Pin and 6 Pin relays
- closing the N rollover switches should trip the 4 Pin, 6 Pin and 3 Pin relays
- closing the G rollover switches should trip the 7 Pin relay
- closing the W rollover switch should only trip the 7 Pin if the 2 Pin relay has not already been tripped
- closing the P rollover switch should only trip the 7 Pin relay if the Strike Zone Control adjustment is set to A/Easy Strike
- closing the M rollover switch should only trip the 10 Pin relay if the Strike Zone Control adjustment is set to A/Easy Strike
- closing the T rollover switch should only trip the 10 Pin relay if the 3 Pin relay has not already been tripped
- closing the H rollover switch should trip the 10 Pin relay

So are just the M-P switches not doing what is described above, or are other switches misbehaving too?

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#8 4 years ago

STC

chas10e

Pinside member

Kittery, ME

8y 51,550 1,311 7

Quoted from MarkG:
Looking at your schematic the M-P rollover switches all rely on the brown wire drawn across the lower part of the schematic. The brown wire in turn relies on a switch on the 1 Pin relay being closed because the 1 Pin relay has tripped. And the 1 Pin relay should trip if either the A or B rollover switch closes.
It would help to understand which of the switches on the brown wire are working and which aren't so try the following tests. Reset the pins before each test so the tests don't interfere with each other. For each test start by closing the A or B rollover switch. You should hear the 1 Pin relay trip, and you should be able to see that is has tripped by looking in the back. Once the 1 Pin relay is tripped each of the switches (working from left to right along the brown wire in the schematic) should behave as described here:
- closing the O rollover switches should trip the 2 Pin, 4 Pin and 6 Pin relays
- closing the N rollover switches should trip the 4 Pin, 6 Pin and 3 Pin relays
- closing the G rollover switches should trip the 7 Pin relay
- closing the W rollover switch should only trip the 7 Pin if the 2 Pin relay has not already been tripped
- closing the P rollover switch should only trip the 7 Pin relay if the Strike Zone Control adjustment is set to A/Easy Strike
- closing the M rollover switch should only trip the 10 Pin relay if the Strike Zone Control adjustment is set to A/Easy Strike
- closing the T rollover switch should only trip the 10 Pin relay if the 3 Pin relay has not already been tripped
- closing the H rollover switch should trip the 10 Pin relay
So are just the M-P switches not doing what is described above, or are other switches misbehaving too?

I'm following this topic 'cause I'm working on one of these as well & trying to wrap my head around how it all works.

This post is very helpful

looking at the images, does one of the switch stacks look loose on the " #1 pin relay" ?

I also noticed it seems to be set for "easy strikes" according to the placard

number 1 pin relay (resized).jpg

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1

#9 4 years ago

OP

EH

Mcrics

Pinside member

Lincoln, NE

4y 29,400 17 8 7

MarkG, Chas10e - you guys cracked the case.

I think the 1 pin relay was giving me problems. The pin would go up, but the switches in the back weren't opening/closing properly to make the M-P switches go live. A little sandpaper and compressed air to eliminate some corrosion, and viola! It's working now in regulation scoring.

Now I need to figure out why the other scoring options (flash, bonus, etc) aren't working, but I suspect it'll be similar issues.

THANK YOU!

By Mcrics

4 years ago

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