(Topic ID: 242158)

DumbAss test and reproduction PCBs

By DumbAss

3 years ago


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  • Latest reply 11 minutes ago by Robotworkshop
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    There are 940 posts in this topic. You are on page 19 of 19.
    #901 44 days ago

    I like the purple boards. maybe victor would consider making all of the newer ones available that color for the rest of this year

    on another note, has anyone created a digikey or mouser shopping cart for any of the bare board components. specifically, I'm looking for the WPC 89 fliptronic or audio board parts cart (I didn't realize just how many parts are on that audio board

    #902 44 days ago

    There's a typo, lol. "Detction."

    Quoted from DumbAss:

    This one is tough call because I like a polished product and providing these boards is contra to a polished product. I have to think about spinning this board. It's electrically correct and some people tolerate small errors like this better than others.

    I'd think of it like the art masters and call it a deliberate feature. Seriously, the work you do is so good and so prolific and of such high quality that this should not even be an issue on your radar.

    #903 44 days ago
    Quoted from transprtr4u:

    dumbass website address ?
    reading that back it sounds odd

    Better than the ISP Web One. Everyone ended up with email addresses @WeBone.com.au....

    #904 44 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    I know I try hard to verify everything but I also know that I make mistakes. In hindsight I don't think I would've spotted this - ever. I still look at it and it reads fine. That just goes to show that the human brain see what it wants to to see.

    This one is tough call because I like a polished product and providing these boards is contra to a polished product. I have to think about spinning this board. It's electrically correct and some people tolerate small errors like this better than others.

    Eh...put a sticker over it...
    --
    Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
    http://www.ChrisHiblerPinball.com/Contact
    https://www.youtube.com/c/ChrisHiblerPinball
    http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

    #905 43 days ago
    Quoted from SYS6:

    I'd think of it like the art masters and call it a deliberate feature. Seriously, the work you do is so good and so prolific and of such high quality that this should not even be an issue on your radar.

    Thank you for the very kind words.

    Took me all afternoon and into the evening yesterday to build the cables. Got the display tested tonight (along with a bunch of other boards).

    boards_249.jpg

    #906 42 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    Took me all afternoon and into the evening yesterday to build the cables.

    I think this says it all. Just for cables to TEST your product before shipping.

    I hope to have the need to buy some boards from you in the near future.

    If you had No-Pop speaker boards, would take a bunch from you now (we chatted about this briefly before your vacation).

    11
    #907 41 days ago

    In honor of a local collecting giant (Chris) who passed over a year ago my buddy declared that Sunday is "Pinball Machine Work Day". This was something Chris would do most weekends. Of course, now this means one less day for me to do board stuff but like everything in life it's about prioritizing what's important to you and your friends. While not directly related to this thread he is putting together a Medieval Madness from parts and this afternoon we spent working on figuring out problems with boards he put together - a blank re-print of the CPU and power board I bought a few years ago (before I started my own board stuff) and the AV that I reproduced. The AV board is definitely not for the faint hearted but rewarding when it works. He had problems with the ASIC daughter board but they were fixed with some simple continuity diagnostics and touch up soldering.

    The other week he also tested the reproduction Dot Matrix Controller (DMC) board that was made about 2.5 years ago. When I first built it I got "RAM ADDRESS ERROR" and didn't spend too much time trying to figure out. I swapped SRAM ICs and all the ICs on the board but to no avail. He swapped an SRAM in and it worked. Go figure. This confirmed that there is nothing wrong with the electrical connections on the board. I still don't know exactly the actual cause but I decided to build another board and this one works fine. Again ... go figure. So I made progress on this and can declare it functioning.

    boards_250.jpg

    I also run a side hustle of doing board repairs for local people and the occasional NVRAM install by request. I just finished one and went to pull the nozzle out to clean it and the heating element broke on the FR-300 I have. This is the second heating element so now I am on my third heating element. I need to buy another spare before Hakko considers discontinuing it and thereby rendering my FR-300 permanently obsolete and broken if it breaks again. I just noticed the manufacturing date on my unit is 2014 so it's had many years of use and is actually still going strong!

    • Broken heating element and nozzle.00_fr300_heating_element.jpg
    • Heating element stuck in nozzle.01_fr300_heating_element.jpg
    • Out with the old and in with the new.02_fr300_heating_element.jpg
      • I have a pack list a mile long (ok not a mile but it is long) and I will be working through that list this coming week. Once I clear all those out I will have some time to finish other smaller tasks (people who have been waiting patiently). If I get all those finished I can spend some time looking at the System 3-7 unified board and maybe get that going seeing as I appear to be on a roll for getting boards working.

    #908 41 days ago
    Quoted from lemmings418:

    If you had No-Pop speaker boards, would take a bunch from you now (we chatted about this briefly before your vacation).

    I have these working but there are some minor adjustments for fitment in DCS machines that I want to work on. It's tight and there's not a lot of space with this board set.

    #909 40 days ago

    Speaking of modern components, do you know if the EZ-something 5v switching regulators draw less power on the 9v AC pins of the WPC power board secondary connector? I think those are discontinued but I bought a few of them ahead of time. I currently have a game with a factory LM323K and soldered in secondary wire harness and would like to fix that header/connector correctly without the 9v pins overheating again.

    #910 40 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    I need to buy another spare before Hakko considers discontinuing it and thereby rendering my FR-300 permanently obsolete and broken if it breaks again

    I feel your pain.
    I had been using an old Hakko 470D bench unit with the 802 "gun". The gun uses an A1098 heating element.
    Those heating elements somehow become uncleanably clogged over time and destroy themselves. I have one spare but Hakko no longer makes them.

    In the meantime, I've pressed one of my Hakko 808s into service. The 808 has a better solder capture system and doesn't clog nearly as much. It goes through more filters, but that's life.

    All of these through hole tools are or are going obsolete. It's a shame. But that's business and I understand it.
    --
    Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
    http://www.ChrisHiblerPinball.com/Contact
    https://www.youtube.com/c/ChrisHiblerPinball
    http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

    #911 40 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    people who have been waiting patiently). If I get all those finished I can spend some time looking at the System 3-7 unified board

    Puts hand up
    I'm happy to wait as long as it takes.

    I am enjoying watching all these other boards and projects you are doing, fantastic work.

    Matt.

    #912 40 days ago
    Quoted from Crash:

    Speaking of modern components, do you know if the EZ-something 5v switching regulators draw less power on the 9v AC pins of the WPC power board secondary connector? I think those are discontinued but I bought a few of them ahead of time. I currently have a game with a factory LM323K and soldered in secondary wire harness and would like to fix that header/connector correctly without the 9v pins overheating again.

    I don't know about the draw on the transformer secondary. The switching regulator is more efficient and dissipates a lot less heat (the wasted electric potential is not burned off as heat). Unfortunately I'm not schooled in electronics so I really cannot answer your question. Someone like Ed (GPE) would probably be a better person to ask.

    I think the overheating of the connector comes from poor conductivity from the connector pin to the header pin on the board. This happens from repeated insertion and removal that grinds off the plating. The header and connector are only rated for a certain number of insertion and removal cycles.

    Remember I am not an authority on anything electronic. I learned by reading and reading and reading not by any form of tertiary education on electronics. I only did high school physics (basic V=IR stuff).

    #913 40 days ago
    Quoted from Crash:

    Speaking of modern components, do you know if the EZ-something 5v switching regulators draw less power on the 9v AC pins of the WPC power board secondary connector? I think those are discontinued but I bought a few of them ahead of time. I currently have a game with a factory LM323K and soldered in secondary wire harness and would like to fix that header/connector correctly without the 9v pins overheating again.

    Not obsolete.
    https://www.ezsbc.com/product/psu5/

    Repin and rehead J101 and enjoy. Every 9VAC connector I see looks to be caused by loose pin connections. Loose pins generate heat due to a bad connection. Loose pins are normally caused by excessive connect/disconnect lifetime cycles, which is not an unlimited number of times before the pins start losing their tension against the header pins

    I had repinned 3 J101 connectors in my games well over 8 years ago and still look new just as I had repinned them.

    #914 40 days ago

    Simple fix then! Thanks.

    #915 39 days ago

    Im glad Im not the only one who gets clogged tips. I thought it may have been my technique or not letting the pump run long enough after each solder pad. Sounds like this just happens from time to time.

    1 week later
    #916 28 days ago
    Quoted from ibis:

    Im glad Im not the only one who gets clogged tips. I thought it may have been my technique or not letting the pump run long enough after each solder pad. Sounds like this just happens from time to time.

    Desoldering tips crap out after a while. Get some new ones and it will work like brand new.

    #917 27 days ago

    I just acquired a bare system 11B board for Victor.

    I have the BOM list, but does anyone that has populated one of these have a part number list by vendor for this board. Of course, I could simply start from scratch; just figured I ask first.

    Thank you
    Shelby

    #918 27 days ago
    Quoted from Scoomie:

    I just acquired a bare system 11B board for Victor.
    I have the BOM list, but does anyone that has populated one of these have a part number list by vendor for this board. Of course, I could simply start from scratch; just figured I ask first.
    Thank you
    Shelby

    Ask Victor, he may give recommendations.

    #919 27 days ago
    Quoted from T-Tommy:

    Desoldering tips crap out after a while. Get some new ones and it will work like brand new.

    I use a small drill bit to clean them out while the tip is hot/warm. The most important thing with a desoldering tool is to KEEP IT CLEAN. Clean out the tip and heating element after every use. Clean out the vacuum (diaphragm) area periodically.

    22
    #920 27 days ago

    Update. I am leaving for time off. Total time off is one month (the month of September). I have been feverishly working to get my load clear prior to departure and allocating quota to the month of October and beyond. I am repeating this again in December into early January. I probably mentioned this before but I made a resolution before COVID hit to make more frequent trips to visit family. This is keeping my promise to my resolution (after the two year hiatus from travel due to COVID). I apologize if this means I deliver things more slowly (longer time frames) but everyone has to prioritize what's important to them.

    A couple of small things I have images for. Most of the other things are just building, building and building then verifying, packing and shipping. Not really that interesting.

    These two sets of boards are being transported for local delivery.

    boards_251.jpgboards_252.jpg

    This board is for my buddy who is building a Medieval Madness from parts - aka "machine in a tote".

    boards_253.jpg

    These boards are opportunistic small boards. My buddy is rebuilding his Demolition Man so I took these boards for reproduction while the assemblies are out being cleaned and rebuilt. The elevator board needs revision (hole placement is slightly wrong). The cryoclaw board fits correctly with good clearance.

    boards_254.jpg

    This board is a re-worked DCS signal board for the speaker pop elimination board set. I changed the position of the headers to allow for better clearance of the connectors.

    boards_255.jpg

    I have a few more things to pack up and ship out for domestic US before shutting everything down for a month. I will still be connected so if communication is required I will still be online and able to answer questions or post support. It may be a little slower than what most people in the US would expect (due to a time zone difference from the US) so apologies in advance.

    #921 27 days ago

    Enjoy some much deserved time off Victor!

    #922 26 days ago

    Enjoy your time off Victor.

    #923 26 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    Update. I am leaving for time off. Total time off is one month (the month of September)

    Enjoy it. You surely deserve it.

    LTG : )

    #924 26 days ago

    Thanks for all your help and advice! Taking family time is good for the soul and for them too. Get some good rest after the jet lag.

    #925 25 days ago

    I've been putting together a list of links for parts for both the WPC 89 fliptronics and audio boards. some of the parts are getting harder to source so when I've finally found them from sources outside of digikey and mouser, I've been ordering quantity.

    I will post what I have extras of when everything finally arrives for those also building their own boards.
    I will also post my shopping carts links to make it a little easier to order. I was able to procure most of my parts from mouser.com but some parts are on backorder through 2023-24 so I've had to source them at places like:

    ebay
    (fliptronics board - TIP102, TIP36C)

    pinball spare parts australia
    (audio board - 4.7uH inductor, 4584, 74LS11, 74LS74, TL084, YM2151)

    great plains electronics
    (audio board - 74LS04, HC-55536, 74LC374)

    arcadepartsandrepair.com
    (audio board - 27C040, 68B09E)

    arcadechips.com
    (audio board - LM1875, TL082, x9503, YM3012, 6264)

    #926 25 days ago
    Quoted from j_m_:

    I've been putting together a list of links for parts for both the WPC 89 fliptronics and audio boards. some of the parts are getting harder to source so when I've finally found them from sources outside of digikey and mouser, I've been ordering quantity.
    I will post what I have extras of when everything finally arrives for those also building their own boards.
    I will also post my shopping carts links to make it a little easier to order. I was able to procure most of my parts from mouser.com but some parts are on backorder through 2023-24 so I've had to source them at places like:
    ebay
    (fliptronics board - TIP102, TIP36C)
    pinball spare parts australia
    (audio board - 4.7uH inductor, 4584, 74LS11, 74LS74, TL084, YM2151)
    great plains electronics
    (audio board - 74LS04, HC-55536, 74LC374)
    arcadepartsandrepair.com
    (audio board - 27C040, 68B09E)
    arcadechips.com
    (audio board - LM1875, TL082, x9503, YM3012, 6264)

    Just a FYI, GPE is for sale, Ed is retiring, and he is not restocking parts as they sell out.

    #927 24 days ago

    don't buy tip36c from ebay as you will likely get a fake under spec'd junk as it is is a major target for fakers. Only buy power transistors from authorized distributors or you are taking a risk of getting fake junk.

    check LCSC and Arrow. I buy a lot of stuff form those places. LCSC will almost for certainly have the best price on passives and simple actives. You have to weigh in the overseas shipping though and might not make sense unless it is a big order.

    https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Bipolar-Transistors-BJT_STMicroelectronics-TIP36C_C84567.html

    If you are penny pinching, i'd trust this 10x more than the eBay/Amazon/AliExpress specials. At least it has an official datasheet and is likely a fine part, but never heerd of SPTECH brand...

    https://lcsc.com/product-detail/Bipolar-Transistors-BJT_SPTECH-TIP36C_C480161.html

    1 week later
    #928 13 days ago
    Quoted from barakandl:

    don't buy tip36c from ebay as you will likely get a fake under spec'd junk

    [So true barakandl ]
    I have a stash of fake/bad "ST TIP122".
    The transistor works great on a Data East board to activate Bright/Flashers #89 bulbs etc...
    However, the transistor explodes/fries/burns up.. when you add back to the circuitry, a 32volt coil.
    -- I tried two times to fix the board with the transistors I got from Ebay; to no avail.
    Finally, got another set of TIP122 from GPE and the board finally works correctly.

    #929 8 days ago

    Question about the solenoid fused board. My High Speed is using a Rottendog Board and the connection is IJ19? I have transistors to the left of the header that keeps the board from being installed. Am I missing something or will this not work on this board? Thanks

    #930 8 days ago
    Quoted from Aflacjack:

    Question about the solenoid fused board. My High Speed is using a Rottendog Board and the connection is IJ19? I have transistors to the left of the header that keeps the board from being installed. Am I missing something or will this not work on this board?

    You are the first person to report this. It never crossed my mind to think about compatibility with the Rottendog System 11 CPU boards (MPU9211 or MPU004). I don't have these boards.

    Based on the images of the Rottendog boards the solenoid fuse board is incompatible with the Rottendog boards. The line of MOSFETs adjacent to 1J19 will physically interfere with connection of the solenoid fuse board.

    Apologies for this. I have a responded to your private message with potential resolutions to the problem.

    #931 2 days ago

    I realize, reading these posts, that the master is on vacay.

    Can someone explain or send me a link to an explanation of NDIP and WDIP IC packages?

    Pulling a parts order together from Mouser and don't want to get the wrong bits!

    I can pull up several explanations about so many other different types of packaging, but see nothing regarding NDIP or WDIP.

    This is for the parts on the DMD display board "DBU-M16-04K"

    Parts I'm referencing:

    U1-U2
    2
    74HC04=6x NOT-1 (CMOS,NDIP-14)
    SOIC-14

    U3-U6
    4
    74HC595=shift register (CMOS,NDIP-16)
    SOIC-16

    U7-U14
    8
    TLC5926=LED Driver (WDIP-24)
    SOIC-24

    #932 2 days ago

    Still reading stuff.

    I use NDIP to represent NARROW (0.3"=7.62mm) DIP and WDIP to represent WIDE (0.6"=15.24mm) DIP. These are for THROUGH HOLE parts.

    The DMD uses SURFACE MOUNT. There are MANY more surface mount packages and it's even more confusing.

    You want SOIC-XX where XX is the number of pins. You do NOT want SSOP or TSSOP or HTSSOP. Those are different package sizes and pin spread.

    The LED driver (TLC5926) is ONLY available as surface mount. I don't see those in stock at the usual suspects so this may be harder to find. There are also compatible LED drivers but those, too, might also be out of stock. For this you want TLC5926IDWR.

    Search for:

    • CD74HC04M96
    • CD74HC595M96
    • TLC5926IDWR
    #933 2 days ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    Still reading stuff.
    I use NDIP to represent NARROW (0.3"=7.62mm) DIP and WDIP to represent WIDE (0.6"=15.24mm) DIP. These are for THROUGH HOLE parts.
    The DMD uses SURFACE MOUNT. There are MANY more surface mount packages and it's even more confusing.
    You want SOIC-XX where XX is the number of pins. You do NOT want SSOP or TSSOP or HTSSOP. Those are different package sizes and pin spread.
    The LED driver (TLC5926) is ONLY available as surface mount. I don't see those in stock at the usual suspects so this may be harder to find. There are also compatible LED drivers but those, too, might also be out of stock. For this you want TLC5926IDWR.
    Search for:

    CD74HC04M96
    CD74HC595M96
    TLC5926IDWR

    Thank you!!!!

    #934 1 day ago

    I should have the last headers today for the fliptronics board. if that happens, I will post a photo of my completed board along with a link for a spreadsheet all of the parts (links to mouser/digikey) that I used for the build.

    I did end up using 2% resistors instead of the recommended 5% tolerance where possible because the price difference was just a few pennies and I could get them by all the same component manufacturer (to help make the board look a little nicer and uniform).

    #935 1 day ago
    Quoted from j_m_:

    it's a right of passage to put together your cart and receive the parts, only to find that you've only ordered approx. 95% correctly.
    it's a further right to place another order for the remaining parts to then realize that you've still not ordered all of the correct parts a 2nd time.
    ask me how I know this

    This tells me that I haven't provided enough information in the BOM tables. I always strive to improve things and this is one area I should probably adjust. The issue is that I have a master spreadsheet that I need to go through to add all this information and it's a LOT of entries I need to go back and look through. Realistically, it isn't likely to happen any time soon.

    If in doubt, please feel free to ask before committing to a purchase if you're concerned.

    Quoted from j_m_:

    - diameters of some of the capacitors

    Quoted from j_m_:

    fliptronics board - (c2), 100uf electrolytic (a maximum of 10mm dia)

    I, too, have done this. You'd think I make these so I know what I'm doing but I have used a 10mm diameter footprint for a radial capacitor only to find that I need to allow for the potential to use a 12.5mm diameter. The supply chain issues force me to look for alternatives and sometimes (in this specific example) I can only find a 12.5mm diameter replacement but I can't use it because I made the board with a 10mm diameter. Sometimes, there is no physical space for a 12.5mm diameter (such as the fliptronic board) so I am forced to use a 10mm diameter. I recently revised the WPC-89 Power Driver board from using a 10mm to using a 12.5mm for this reason (supply chain shortages).

    Quoted from j_m_:

    - correct series and pitch for the vertical molex headers (.100 are KK 254, .156 are KK 396)

    • 0.100" = 2.54mm
    • 0.156" = 3.96mm

    The US uses "mils" (an imperial scale). The rest of the world uses "mm" (a metric scale). When I make these I use metric but use multiples of "mils".

    #936 1 day ago

    Hey Victor, have not stopped by here in a long while. Just got a grail game to me and it is an old Data East Lethal Weapon 3.

    Wondering if there are any plans on your side to remake these boards. My game would totally benefit of having some fresh board in there as the ones I have have been, well... seen better days.

    I think I asked before about whitestar boards, and I think you had no plans for those, I assume it is the same for DE boards but figured I would give it a shot.

    #937 21 hours ago

    I've started slotted one or both of the capacitor holes for flexibility on shopping for caps and don't have to update the board when I find a sweet deal on a different lead pitch.

    #938 10 hours ago
    Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

    Wondering if there are any plans on your side to remake these boards.

    You mean this ... https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/dumbass-test-and-reproduction-pcbs/page/9#post-6156405

    The board works but I recently discovered a small caveat with it. You need a single ROM configuration. I haven't looked at it yet as there is an easy workaround (write a single ROM from a double image).

    Quoted from Pin_Fandango:

    I think I asked before about whitestar boards, and I think you had no plans for those, I assume it is the same for DE boards but figured I would give it a shot.

    Whitestar is definitely lower on the priority list - if at all. The BSMT2000 as well as possibly the amplifiers in the sound section area going to be the blocking issues.

    #939 10 hours ago
    Quoted from barakandl:

    I've started slotted one or both of the capacitor holes for flexibility on shopping for caps and don't have to update the board when I find a sweet deal on a different lead pitch.

    This is a great idea to be able to cover:

    • 2.0mm
    • 2.5mm
    • 3.5mm
    • 5mm

    Radial snap-in appears to be fixed at 10mm with varying diameter and height.

    #940 11 minutes ago
    Quoted from DumbAss:

    You are the first person to report this. It never crossed my mind to think about compatibility with the Rottendog System 11 CPU boards (MPU9211 or MPU004). I don't have these boards.
    Based on the images of the Rottendog boards the solenoid fuse board is incompatible with the Rottendog boards. The line of MOSFETs adjacent to 1J19 will physically interfere with connection of the solenoid fuse board.
    Apologies for this. I have a responded to your private message with potential resolutions to the problem.

    Hello Victor,

    If you update your add on fuse board can I suggest an update? There is one Via on the board and it is close to a fuse clip. It looks like that can easily be moved up and over away from it. At the moment it is closer than I’d like. I’d also add a couple additional vias for it to increase current capacity and leave those untented so someone can either fill in with solder or solder a wire in. As it stands now it could act as another fuse.

    There are 940 posts in this topic. You are on page 19 of 19.

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