(Topic ID: 48082)

Drop Targets on Swords of Fury not registering. -FIXED-

By travisbmartin

11 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 22 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by Vandal
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 11 years ago

One step forward and two steps back on my SOF. I've been slowly getting this yard sale find to a playable status and now the Drop Targets will not register. They used to word just fine, now I've got nothing. I know the switch matrix wiring is ok, because every other switch works.

I checked my manual and I can't find the schematic pertaining to the drop target board. Does anyone have some sort of schematic, or at least an idea what the diode and transistors are on it so I can replace them if need be?

#2 11 years ago

Do you have both manuals or just one? I have a manual that has the schematic/diagram of each of the boards, but unfortunately no wiring schematic to show me where everything plugs in. I am currently working on the same issue, but mine is random as sometimes they work and sometimes they don't.

If you need me to scan anything for you let me know. If you figure out the problem let me know and I will do the same.

#3 11 years ago

I have the Operations Manual that has the test procedures, reference, and schematics.

#4 11 years ago

Before getting too far down the line, make sure to check the easiest thing first since they were working at one time: the connectors that plug into the driver board for the drop target bank. Usually with Sys 11s, the drop target bank on the underside of the playfield has two connectors going into a small PCB board. Sometimes these can get jostled out or need to be repinned. That would be the easiest fix and the first place I'd double check before getting into the potential board issues.

#5 11 years ago

A good suggestion for the OP, however that's not the issue with mine as I replaced the original board with a new one from Great Lakes.

I will double check the two manuals I have at home and try to make some scans for you if needed.

After inspecting the boards last night I noticed two resistors that went bad at some point in time. Not sure if they are bad now, or went bad and were replaced. One is on the aux power board and on on the CPU board. I will list those tonight and see of you have had similar issues. I don't know if these resistors have anything to do with the drop targets or not as I have yet to figure out what parts are associated with them. Haven't found anyone yet that knows.

#6 11 years ago

Thanks for the help guys. I not sure what happened, which is why I'm looking for a schematic to follow through. When I first got the game, the drop targets were working fine. I left everything alone for a month or two while I was waiting on the sound board to be repaired, and after a couple plays when that came back the targets stopped working.

#7 11 years ago
Quoted from travisbmartin:

I'm looking for a schematic

http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/2486/Williams_1988_Swords_of_Fury_Operations_Manual.pdf

Optical switches may be dirty. A Q-Tip and some Windex cleans them up nicely. Just a thought...

#8 11 years ago

Another PDF for my collection. Thanks, but I didn't see a schematic in there for the Drop Target board.

I'm going to clean out the optos later today, but it would be weird that they all stopped working at once. Then again, I'm learning pinballs and weirdness like to go hand in hand

#9 11 years ago

Cleaned the sensors with no luck. I grabbed my meter and checked the power going to the board and got roughly 10V. I then started experimenting on the signal cable by jumpering each wire to ground. Everything works fine on the signal cable.

is 10V too low for the optos?

#10 11 years ago

Kept poking around and had an 'Aha!' moment. I noticed that the power to the board was changing all over the place from 0 to 10V. Fiddled around with the wires and traced it back to the power supply. Sure enough I had some bad solder joints on the power supply. Got it all working now!

#11 11 years ago

Well you fixed it now so you probably don't need this but here it is for the future.

http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/2486/Williams_1988_Swords_of_Fury_Parts_Information_Manual_no_schematics.pdf

Also, what setting did you put the meter on for testing? Still a bit new to testing curcuits on a pin. Don't wanna use the wrong setting and mess up something. Also, can you photograph which solder joints were bad on your power supply?

#12 11 years ago
Quoted from EvilJack:

Also, what setting did you put the meter on for testing? Still a bit new to testing curcuits on a pin.

Voltage tests on a pin's internal circuitry will have the DMM set to DC voltage. If auto-ranging, you don't have to adjust anything; if not, you just have to set within the range of what you will be testing. For DC voltages, measurements are taken relative to ground. So, your black lead needs to go to ground (ground strap, side rails, any other area you know to be common ground) and then your red lead will touch at the point you want to test (coil lug, male pin, test point, etc.).

#13 11 years ago
Quoted from EvilJack:

Well you fixed it now so you probably don't need this but here it is for the future.
http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/2486/Williams_1988_Swords_of_Fury_Parts_Information_Manual_no_schematics.pdf
Also, what setting did you put the meter on for testing? Still a bit new to testing curcuits on a pin. Don't wanna use the wrong setting and mess up something. Also, can you photograph which solder joints were bad on your power supply?

Actually, that may come in handy. I like to have as much information about my pinball as possible, so thank you.

I worked my way up from the opto board, to the interconnect board, and then the power supply in the back box. I set my Multimeter to 20V. I unplugged the power plug that connects to the opto board and checked for 12V. Then, on the interconnect board in mine, there are a set of unused pads on the circuit board or 12V and I checked it there. After not seeing a full 12V there I checked to power supply cable and noticed that the 12V would drop to 5 or 0V if I moved the cable from the power supply. So, I took the power supply off and checked the solder job on it.

Sorry for the longwinded explanation. I'm afraid my method doesn't translate well into text.

I'm already home from the arcade, so I can't offer a picture at the moment. But, if you take the power supply out and look at the top edge, there are two places cables connect to. I resoldered those two connectors and my voltages stabilized

#14 11 years ago

Photos?

#15 11 years ago

I'll have to take pictures tomorrow when I go in to work.

#16 11 years ago
Quoted from travisbmartin:

I'll have to take pictures tomorrow when I go in to work.

Cool thanks.

#17 11 years ago

I had the same problem with my drop targets not registering, I replaced the two larger capacitors on the power supply board and it definitely helped, but every now and then they start acting up again

#18 11 years ago

Took some pictures with my phone tonight. They aren't the best, but they should give an idea of what I did to fix mine. Not that I'm holding the camera in one hand, and the black lead of my meter in the other. I couldn't hold both leads and the camera, obviously.

01. I took the power plug off the drop target board and used my multimeter (set to voltage) to check the voltage here by putting each lead of the meter on the power and ground.

02. On the interconnect board, I found a place to check the +12V. Near the Williams logo, right next to this white sticker.

03. I put my meter leads to +12 and GND pads here.

04. Up to the power supply. I found out that moving these two plugs while checking the voltage at the interconnect board caused my reading to go crazy.

05. So I took the board out...

06. And flipped it over. It looked like the solder connecting the plugs to the board needed a touch up, so I resoldered all of them. It also looks like the previous owner did some work on the bottom right here. I'll have to keep an eye on that.

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#19 11 years ago

I just realized that in the second and third picture, my meter leads are plugged in to measure amperage, not voltage. Looks like someone borrowed my meter since I used it monday and I didnt notice. Make sure when you use your meter to measure voltage it is in the correct setup.

#20 11 years ago

Thanks for the photos. Hopefully I can get a chance to work on it this weekend.

4 months later
#21 10 years ago

I have the same problems has anyone found a solution?

7 years later
#22 3 years ago

Thanks pinside! Another problem quickly dealt with.

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