I have to say that I am surprised at how many people seem to have thought their money was much safer that it was /is. When you prepay like we did (me on WOZ), you are risking 100% of your money regardless of any “Full Refund” policy. That is simply a method of making people feel comfortable. In the case of bankruptcy or a “run on the bank” you will likely lose everything.

When WOZ was first announced, there was no way I was going to have my money on the line. I waited until the 2012 Christmas party when I saw and could play the game. I happily paid the extra $1,000 to keep my money safe…by the time I would be done paying I would have my game! Boy was my thinking wrong. I considered a refund many times but decided to stay in and I am glad I did. The game is great and it worked out for me. Even still, I could have easily lost everything (and probably almost did)

I am not saying that people should stay in and I certainly do not want to see people lose their money. In this situation I would pull out for sure…just surprised at people not realizing the risk they accepted. I would like to see TBL buit and would probably be an owner one day but no more pre-payment for me.

Full Disclosure – I am in on MMRLE from PPS and have $1,000 on the line. There was no way JJP was getting anymore of my $ and I only committed because with PPS I do not pay until it ships. I will gladly do it that way again.

Also, I must say that many of you must be a better person than I am (or much richer) to leave your money at great risk to “help out” someone else’s business which you share no profit in.

~Dave

Recap:
1) Phil (USA Partner) got nervous of business practices and potential licensing issues and unilaterally issued refunds to USA customers (Phil wants out of DP and his intention to leave is being met with resistance)
2) Phil aired details which made everyone nervous about the kind of organization their $$$ are tied up with
3) A "run on the bank" ensued and many are waiting on refunds
4) DP has been way too silent and have not properly addressed things
5) It is questionable whether DP will be able to survive and if TBL will actual get made

How did I do everyone?

Just because a prototype looks great and there is demand for the game, does not mean that it is a viable business venture. There are minimum expenses which need to get paid and require a certain number of games to be sold (preorders or not) for the business to stay afloat. Good intentions and best wishes are not going to get games produced. They need capital, either from preorders or investment. The sad truth is that if enough people get refunds and they cant fund this company (and have the orders to make it viable) it's over.

Since it would be difficult for any pinball venture to get private investment, it would seem TBL will only happen with preorders. Only those with "balls of steel" need apply.

DP is a private company...why do you think "everybody else" will get a full accounting. The only thing people got with preorder was a statement of refund, not a commitment to full accounting. I agree that if they are well funded and were to provide a full financial accounting it would really help. Unless you can truly stomach the potential lose of your dollars, it is best to get your refund and buy later if they manage to produce the game.

I think you are missing the point that they are not in bankruptcy and until that point, people with pre-orders have no right to financial disclosure.

There is no reason for DP to declare bankruptcy (which I certainly hope they do not do as I want to see them survive and make great games) until creditors demanding payment push them to seek that protection.

No...what you are missing the very significant distinction of bankruptcy filing which DP would not do unless creditors were pushing legal action requiring them to declare bankruptcy.

I think we are actually in agreement. I absolutely agree that it is in DP best interest to provide that transparency to avoid a forced bankruptcy, the only point I was trying to make is that the pre-order person is not legally entitled to that information until bankruptcy.