I haven't signed up for itunes but apparently that it what it will take to upgrade my 2009 Mac Mini with Snow Leopard to a newer operating system such as El Capitan before I can go any further. But it is free, and my old machine will support it, so I'm not complaining.

I'm running out of browsers that still support my old system.

Try getting 8 years out of a PC...... Yeah right. Apple all the way

I paid like $500 for the thing.

I just upgraded to a Galaxy S7 from a flip phone so I'm in no position to offer substantive feedback on technological devices. I'm chiming in just to say it's nice to see you posting, Azmodeos. Although we never met, I was following the thread Vid started and am happy to hear that you're doing well and posting again. Wishing you all health in the world, my man! Hope you're back to playing some pinball too. Be well!

Buy pro grade hardware and re-install the OS every couple years and you can get 8 years out of a PC... of course not much if any less than a Mac.

I have an early 2008 pro with dual quad xeon processors and 16GB ram. 9 years old now and still smokes many new consumer PC's.

no need to, corporate PC's come off lease cheap because there are so many. I just bought an i5 4670 quad core dell (less than 2 years old) for $250 shipped. Toss in a $200 video card and it's oculus rift ready. Even if I buy a used desktop every 3 years it's cheaper than buying equivalent used mac hardware.

I don't know how you treat your PC's, but I can easily get 8 years out of mine. Currently going on 5 on the machine I'm currently typing on, and its still more powerful than my 1y/o Macbook Pro I use at work, and we maxed that out so that I can do video on it.

totally agree. ive built my own PCs for years.. upgrade whenever i want.... add more hard drives etc. i dont need mobility, so i just keep a nice desktop PC at home....

I built my kids windows pc almost 10 years ago, still running strong, never had a single issue. My ASUS windows laptop is going on 5 years, works like new still. Kids laptop is an ASUS windows laptop that gets abused by them daily, has worked perfect for 3 years. My office windows desktop pc has been going strong for 8 years, no problems. Had a windows phone for 2 years, never had a problem. Have a galaxy s7 now, never had a single problem yet. My wife's work MacBook hard drive crashed last year, then recently she said it wouldn't even boot up. Her ipad for work lost its mind a couple times, just totally locked up, needed to be reset to factory and she lost everything saved on it. I've had the opposite experience of you to be honest. People like what they like though, that's fine. I'm open to any technology really.

I've got a graveyard in the basement of old PC parts. Some not that old. I ony use my PC only for downloading and Server 2011 for my home setup.

My Air is the best laptop ever. I can take it anywhere and get a full day battery. All my files are accessible on my iMac and my laptop. I can answer my phone on my PC's and text message with my phone being somewhere else in the house. These features are a real bonus for me and my job. No games, just work.

As for iTunes. I never use it. I can load everything with Waltr. Never touch itunes.

Also never have to get that urgent email out or check something and find out windows is about to take an update that could be 1 min or 1 hour. That drives me nuts. Even MS Office seems to have an update every time I load it. Not a big fan of MS these days. Windows 10 was much better than 8 but could have been much better had they not put all the crap in it.

I'm not as computer savvy as many of you . I worked for a guy that had one set up in 79 maybe 80. I built his shelves and maintained his warehouse, and he told me to knock myself out on his computer. Which I had several hours a day to do. It was on a shelf I built. On Fridays I drove to LA and took the money to the chief for gas money and $20.The snake game was the best software on it.

One day I said "I can't make any money playing this all day" , and moved on. To be continued... maybe.

Im not that computer savvy either. One thing I do know, I plug in a IMac and it works, and works, and works. No defragmenting, no virus scans, no adware BS, and no hassle.

I pay upfront then Im done. For me its the only choice.

That can be a real pain in the arse If you have to go to the apple store to get them to fix your ipad. my daughter's get messed up by the grandson, and she didn't still have the email address. What a royal pain.

I found out Apple's operating systems are free to download but requires i-tune registration. A fully bootable flash drive of the latest and any system is available for under $15 shipped. Which is what it will cost me to upgrade from Snow Leopard to Sierra without signing up.

However it appears pinside has fixed the problem so now there is no need.

Ok, I'll join the bitch train...

Loved Apple for years. Invested in the company and made a ton. Steve died and the shit went bad quick. Some idiot redesigned the software interface to stuff features in with the most unintuitive crap navigation. Let me clarify: hardware great, software shit; I can't navigate iTunes without rolling my eyes and cursing.

If Steve saw this crap he would go ape.

I'll keep my Apple products though. The Android pond has its own stink, and i don't need the pain of change, for now.

Just bought more AAPL stock so I'm still apple all the way. It just works, it really does.

Yep my iPhone, iPad, and Mac just work, no viruses or issues. I'll stick with Apple thanks.

I have a mid 2010 MacBook. It was losing support with most browsers, and software (even turbotax). I upgraded to OS Sierra and it ran too slow to use. I wasn't thrilled with the idea of dropping a grand on a new MacBook. Upgraded from 2gb to 8gb ram (less than $100 and 10 min to do) now it works like a champ. I'm optimistic I will get another few years out of it.

Well nuts... my work Galaxy S5 died. My employer refuses to hand out anything but an iPhone.

Here we go...

I got a box with the phone from this guy and a strip of bacon. Being on a low carb diet, at least he did not have cookies
faz

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I've said this ever since we had a client that wanted a Pages template designed about 10 years ago. I'm a designer who uses InDesign, Photoshop, and Illustrator. When Word templates are requested, I cringe. Pages was pretty new back then, and I was about to throw the computer out the window, from my cubicle. The window was clear across the other side of the building from where my cubicle was.

I spent 3 days trying to figure out how to move a square box. Checking and unchecking the box that said that it would allow the box to move didn't work. Nope, there was an option buried even deeper than turned on and off the ability to turn on and off that option to make that box move.

Then when I started getting into doing video, I was working in Final Cut 9, and I wanted to go pick up my computer from the middle of the street and throw it through the 3rd floor window of the building across the street.

Apple software is Crap. Hardware is great. Software crap.

My wife has a Samsung tablet, all that I can say is that it can never compare to an iPad.

Threads like this make me VERY happy that I've never embraced Apple-ever-and certainly don't plan to. Too cult-ish & trendy" for me. Android has never failed me. My Galaxy 6 is just fine, while others in my office are constantly pissing & moaning over various issues with their iphones.

Can definitely concur with your lack of computer savviness. You are using a 20 year old argument. I can't remember the last time I ran a virus scan or defragmented a hard drive LOL. I have 3 laptops two are 7 years old and one is 4 years old. They do nothing but work. They also all updated for free to the latest version of the operating system. Windows 10 as stable as hell and I've never seen the slightest hint of spyware or a virus. Paid upfront and no hassle just plug and play. Shrug.

Some people like living in the past.

Defrag? Wow, I remember that one from years ago, must have been prior to 2012 when the last time I ran defrag. Nice to know that I will never need to run it ever again.
Virus scans? How about the Keranger or Mokes.A fiascos from 2016 and more predictions of apple viruses predicted to be worse than ever for this year?
Adware not on mac? Really? Apple support pages have tons of people asking how to get rid of adware.
No hassle? Same for PC... plug it in and it just works.
Some of you guys really need to get out of the past.

I am an owner of AAPL stock but I have never owned an Apple product. Cultist keep buying them, it helps my stock's values.

Just realized my Dell laptop is from 2004 and that the warranty expired 12 years ago. Still running just fine. Hardware is a 'bit' dated, so he now has a cushy job compiling PALASM code and controlling the programming of EPROMs and CPLDs. I think that just might be a little bit beyond the 8 years that some posters mentioned.

Yep..... and every time a new iPhone comes out I can sell my old one to cover the cost. Tell me an android phone that holds value like that

Better check your arguement twice there. Maybe you can sell your subsidized iPhone to buy a new subsidized iPhone. You can't sell an old iPhone to cover the cost of a new one out right. Unless you downscale from a plus to a regular or reduce storage.
Galaxy is very similar in that though. But who buys phones these days anyhow. Live cycle of max one year?
I am on T-mobile jump and simply switch my phone at least once a year, no extra cost. Yes, switch is extra, but over all I still pay less than I would on Verizon or ATT.

I laugh a little inside very time I drop my Galaxy into the wireless charging cradle or connect it to my PC as a simple USB drive to load whatever media files I want onto it without freakin itunes. I am however grateful for that flawless Apple security bringing us some nice celebrity pictures LOL.

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you all crack me up

^ This-you should see the reaction from iPhone users when I do this!

+1

As a Apple user, this is annoying whenever I want to put a file(s) on my phone.

I don't have any issues with my iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch or Apple TV. It all seems to work how I'd expect it to work. I also have a ton of movies through iTunes and it works seamlessly on all my devices. Not sure what more I'd really want besides 4K from my Apple TV.

Apple is also ahead as far as encryption goes and I appreciate that.

Seems like a big deal about nothing, I'm not even sure why some people are so passionate about the whole android vs apple thing anyways.

I've been using my iPhone 6 for a little over a week.
Screen looks fantastic
Battery life is great after a whole week!
There's a few apps that I wanted on Samsung that are not offered, but are on iPhone... cool!
Most my favorite Samsung apps had an iPhone port...although the depth of options is lacking in a few.

Easy to use for sure.. one touch or one button for everything.
Easy to terminate tasks when they stop working correctly... a simple swipe of the fast app switcher... Gone!
Easy to soft reset when memory gets corrupted... just hold the power button and restart
Easy to hard reset when the soft reset does not work. hold power and the home button for 10 seconds

I love it.... it's so "Easy" :/
faz

I have found that most "Apple lovers" rarely do much more than email, web browsing and graphic design. For these functions, pretty well ANY computer will work fine.

Try designing a printed circuit board or schematic, running coil design programs or a huge host of other things simply not supported on the Apple platform. Sure, you can fire up a Windows emulator to run these programs (slows things down) but why bother?

Seems to me that those who "prefer" Apple products like the cool, sleek design over actual practicality and usefulness (and this is very much in the eye of the beholder).

That's fine, as long as you don't need to use your computer for many real world applications.

Apple laptops are very poorly designed mechanically with no ventilation and poor assembly engineering design. All that went out the window for a "sleek look". They are also grossly overpriced.

I could not stand being held captive by their restrictive policies. It will never happen.

How many iPhone owners thank Samsung for the processor, RAM, touch screen and who knows how many other parts that make their iPhone work?

Apple only assemble stuff - they don't actually make anything.....

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Whaat? I can't say I have never had to restart my Samsung due to a glitch, but it seems like that is a main feature of your phone? It is nice it works for you, but I expect stuff to just work, by and large. A commonly used feature shouldn't be "gets rid of buggy applications fast" .

And I can hard reset my phone by pulling the battery out in about 15 seconds if that is a thing I need to do (I haven't yet... knock on wood).

You are correct. I'm not an Apple Hater (far from it) nor a Droid lover... just having a bit of fun while I'm sharing my experience.

My Android had all kinds of weirds, but honestly not with the velocity that I'm experiencing. An example: Pandora... a major app just worked in an Android environment. But I need to reset it every 3-4 hours. The main issue is that the interface to the phone completely stops working. I mean, I can't stop/start/skip ... the screen is dead. When I'm standing at my desk at work, this is not a huge deal. Kill the app and restart... starts working again. I never had to do that with countless Android versions over the last 4-5 years (over two devices).

This weekend I had to shuttle my sons to two different colleges (5 hour round trip for one and 6 hour RT for the other). The phone disconnects from the car in weird ways. The display updates (song titles) freeze on the display and my phone will not allow me to dial phone numbers with the car interface (voice or touch) until I disconnect Bluetooth / reconnect. Some times, I have to reset the app too. Again, never had to do this with the Samsung. I had to keep pulling over to reset the car/phone. Grrrrrr.

Obviously, Pandora can't "not work" for everyone with an iPhone... Something in my echo-system is a catalyst.

I've sent feedback to Pandora but that's a black hole of electrons. I'll keep providing feedback and maybe it will get better.

On the flip-side. I've had an iPad Mini since it first came out. It is a ROCK! Works perfectly and is a great interface for playing games, watching Amazon Prime, reading books. But I don't have to rely on it for integration to my employers systems (which are complex).

My wife's Mac (she's on her 5th or 6th now and she's ready to get another) have ALWAYS worked extremely well even though I'm not very strong in administering it. Luckily, there's lots of good doc on the interwebs.

faz

Apple doesn't assemble anything, they are assembled in China. Apple just really designs it. Samsung (or any computer hardware manufacturer) outsources a lot too btw. Also, Apple is generally known for reliable products. Yes, they focus heavily on aesthetics, but they do a good job on the inside as well. As far as ventilation, they have discrete (sometimes near the hinge) vents and fans and are designed out of aluminum which has high thermal conductivity. So, I'd actually say it's pretty brilliant engineering. I mean, wouldn't it be easier to have a shit box with huge vents to keep it cool?

I know, two of the largest factories around that assemble Apple stuff are within 10kms of my factory here in Shenzhen.

The Taiwanese owned and run Foxcon also assemble a lot of things for Dell, Lenovo and many others. That's just what they do best.

Apple design is far from "smart" or clever engineering. Those discreet vents you talk about get clogged very easily in the real world. I get to see this garbage being repaired almost weekly in the electronic markets here, I have first hand knowledge as to just how unreliable Apple stuff is.

In any case, Apple products just are not as easy to use in the real world as practically anything else. I am talking about using computers for actual work - Apple is too restrictive and limits what you can do.

Apple stuff "looks" pretty (to some) but that's where the perceived advantage finishes - IN THE REAL WORLD!

Needless to say, out of more than 30 computers in the Homepin factory not a single one is Apple and they certainly will never be while I'm running the show. I want to actually get work done, not sit around "looking cool" - or is that "kewl"?

Flame away "Apple fan bois".

(added)
Typed on my (made in China) X250 i7 ThinkPad running Win10 - LOL

I guess I must be using its products in the spirit world then, good thing I suppose. Must have been luck how they became the most profitable company in the world.

No skin off my back though. I enjoy its products and they work for me. Sounds like its competitors work for you. It's nice to have options.

100% Apple in this house. Running a sweet iMac and a 17" MacBook Pro, both from 2009, zero problems ever. Just threw a new solid state hard drive in the MacBook Pro last year and the speed increase made it feel as good as new again, and it's been cruising ever since.

My wife and kids all have iPads, iPods + etc, plus their own accounts on the iMac, so cataloging, backing up + synching all of their stuff and moving it between device upgrades over the years has been a breeze.

And with the Apple TV, AirPort Express + AirPort connectivity, there's wireless all through my house, on the deck, at the hot tub and all the way out to the picnic table I have in the woods. On top of that, I can stream the music from any of the devices sharing everyone's music library through my home theatre, other rooms, use multiple speakers + etc. with music and all controlled by the remote app on my phone. It's sick. People are amazed when they see how nicely integrated my system is.

Been using Apple since kindergarten, back in 1982 or so, never looked back, never regretted it, never had a virus or issue with support in the rare chance I've needed it.

This is all fantastic and it's great that you are having an excellent run.

You make my point exactly. Apple works fine for home type applications such as yours.

When it comes to actually using a computer in the work environment to actually design and manufacture things they just don't cut it by any subjective measure.

Actually, I can thank Apple for providing a means to earn a living for the past 20 years. It's paid for itself time and time again plus my pinball collection + etc. all from web development + SEO work. But I do believe you're right about other designing tools, like CAD software and etc. I'm somewhat frustrated I can't run some things, like the visual pinball or pinmame stuff. I don't mind being without those things for the peace of mind and stability it's provided.

In addition, Apple currently makes the Mac Pro in the USA, with components sourced from Arizona, Texas, Illinois, Florida and Kentucky. And there's discussion of more of their products having production and assembly moving back home. Too bad Steve Jobs isn't still around, that's the real sad part. A lot of Apple died with him, but they're still very relevant.

One million percent agreed.

Ha!! I just hacked off my favorite Samsung ringtones/sounds off my old phone.

I can't make the iPhone look/work like a Samsung, but now it's gonna sound like one!
faz

Within the past year my Note 4 constantly restarts by itself. No warning, and no reason I can see. I've tried to figure it out, but can't. So far luckily it hasn't restarted in mission critical times yet. But I'll have it sitting on the desk, and the red Verizon reboot screen will show.

But it's still not bad enough for me to consider getting an iPhone.

Go to OSCON or Velocity, etc (Web developer conferences), and you'll see about 3/4 of people toting MacBooks around. I'd wager the ratio to be even higher at whatever conferences graphic artists, or photo/video editors attend.

For sure there are industries with specialized software that only run on a certain platform. That doesn't mean the other platform is useless beyond email and web.

I have used (and continue to use) many Windows and Mac OS machines both professionally and at home. There really is no need to turn these things into regions.

Even though I'll never own an iPhone, I'll always own an Apple computer. Just like you mentioned, it's kind of a perception issue with design. Even though I work on a PC at home, my work machine, and my personal laptop are macs. As a designer, I even question one's ability if they do their design work on a PC out in public.

I believe this thread needs this video

I agree. If I find someone using Apple I tend NOT to employ them because usually they will be too closed minded to see outside the square and rarely innovative. My perception is usually that they are easily conned or fooled and so they believe they are using the best when that simply is not the case. I want people who are not blinded by "pretty looks" working for me.