(Topic ID: 250259)

Don't stock up on parts


By pinheadpierre

55 days ago



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  • Latest reply 52 days ago by Fifty
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    There are 168 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 4.
    #51 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    I decided to change the title since I don't know how other vendors would handle complaints about defective parts after a long period of time had passed.

    I wish we could fast forward 10 years so we can all enjoy your thread complaining about the chipped coil sleeve you bought from Pinball Life today.

    #52 55 days ago

    In the future, everything will eventually be broken

    #53 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    A little of both, yes. Is time really such a factor when we have confirmation that these parts are known to be defective?

    It is if marco has changed vendors for these parts...

    #54 55 days ago
    Quoted from gjm:

    I'm not saying he wouldn't have replaced them, I was just thinking on how the conversation would have went.

    Yeah that would have been epic for sure!

    -1
    #55 55 days ago
    Quoted from cosmokramer:

    It is if marco has changed vendors for these parts...

    Why? I get it that they couldn't send the defective stuff back to the manufacturer but keeping the profit made selling unusable parts isn't defensible either.

    #56 55 days ago

    The lesson I've learned from this thread is don't stock up on soup.

    #57 55 days ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    don't stock up on soup.

    Preppers be damned!

    #58 55 days ago
    Quoted from Chalkey:

    Marco's rules. You can't expect them to replace parts you ordered 3 years ago, that's unreasonable.

    Actually in the car restoration industry there are a few companies that will cover items purchased years ago. They know people stock up parts till the car is ready to be assembled and it is good customer service.

    I had a company ship me a missing part from a kit that was part of a shipment years prior. I gave them the invoice number and they sent the missing piece.

    It would not be an unreasonable request to ask for replacement on so many defective parts.

    Not like there are going to go bad sitting on a shelf.

    #59 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    I decided to change the title since I don't know how other vendors would handle complaints about defective parts after a long period of time had passed.

    I'll give you one- Contacted a vendor to let them know some GI LED's I ordered from them in 2017 were all going tits up. This was a polite "heads up" and I was asking nothing in return, just a "hey this product is not so hot" guys.

    They went through invoices and credited me for the pieces. unasked.

    I have since showered them with several hundred dollars worth of orders. Outstanding service.

    Marco could have at least offered a discount on another set of sockets IMHO.

    #60 55 days ago

    Given the amount of time that has passed, Marco is obviously under no obligation to replace the defective parts. That being said, we aren't really talking about a lot of money for a large company like Marco. In my eyes, the good will gained by taking care of a customer is worth far more than the small financial loss they would incur.

    #61 55 days ago

    Honest question: do most of you examine everything under a magnifying glass and/or perform a reasonable stress test on every part upon receiving them? These looked fine to the naked eye but several posts here indicate that this particular part is often crap.

    On my end, it's less about the money than the principal of it, not to mention the time already spent installing a bunch of these only to turn right around, desolder them all and replace them.

    18
    #62 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Honest question: do most of you examine everything under a magnifying glass and/or perform a reasonable stress test on every part prior to installation?

    No dude. I just throw them in a box with the rest of all of it and forget I even have it when I order it again.

    #63 55 days ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    I just throw them in a box with the rest of all of it and forget I even have it when I order it again.

    So true....(sometimes, not all of the time )

    #64 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Honest question: do most of you examine everything under a magnifying glass and/or perform a reasonable stress test on every part prior to installation? These looked fine to the naked eye but several posts here indicate that this particular part is often crap.
    On my end, it's less about the money than the principal of it, not to mention the time already spent installing a bunch of these only to turn right around, desolder them all and replace them.

    Its hard to think someone can always pick up on every minor thing that can be an issue right when getting an order. For the few extra minutes it takes when getting an order it can sure relieve some of the possible future stress, I will be seeing myself doing this every order now.

    If your not happy with marco and switching suppliers will you just toss the new supplier items in a box till you need them knowing the other suppliers provide a superior product? Will you be ordering parts from others knowing you can go back to them at a later date for replacements for possible manufacturing issues? Send a email or call the other suppliers first prior to your next order to find out what the policy what duration of time is acceptable and see if they are willing to refund / exchange product or help someone out in some way.

    #65 55 days ago

    My irritation is that you took your pictures on top of turned over pinball manual pages instead of your bank statement... Boring.

    #66 55 days ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    My irritation is that you took your pictures on top of turned over pinball manual pages instead of your bank statement... Boring.

    lool funny because i was trying to be snoopy and see what it was also. lol

    #67 55 days ago
    Quoted from Tsskinne:

    I bought a can of soup approximately 13 years ago while in college, I recently discovered it in a cabinet, when I cooked it the distinct taste of can couldn't be avoided, sure the used by date was from roughly a decade ago, but I called Kroger, sent them pictures, and at this point in time I feel I will be taking my business to Payless to teach them a lesson in customer service! I hope the rest of you learn from my mistake!

    There’s a guy on YouTube who opens up canned food from the 50’s-60’s

    It’s hilarious, he acts disappointed and disgusted by what comes out.

    #68 55 days ago

    Look at Chris Hutchins post. He says these are still crap today. Wouldn't matter if you bought them 3 years ago or today. Although it's not reasonable to expect Marco to replace these after 3 years, he sure as shit should replace them if you bought them now. Problem is the replacement would probably break. I have just soldered small wires on these to fix - sucks to have to do extra work on new parts just to use them.

    #69 55 days ago

    Sorry to hear about your issues. Could have been avoided though by checking the order when it arrived. If you did that you could still stock up on parts. Maybe you can solder them as suggested and salvage them too.

    Was just thinking that the service I have received from Pinball vendors has been some of the best service I have ever received, period. I have purchased many other items of higher cost but for some reason the pinball vendors really exceeded my expectations.

    For example, Marco's, Pinball Life, The Pinball Resource, Ball Barron, BigLaw and Mr. Tantrum (to name a few) have followed up on orders immediately. Shipped so fast I couldn't believe it and a couple even followed up with emails asking about my order. One vendor even sent parts to me with an invoice to be paid. Who does that in 2019? Steve Young took the time to talk with me on the phone an answer questions I now realize were really dumb.

    #70 55 days ago

    Some of you guys say it's not alot of money, well, throw $39 in the trash can and see how it feels. I think it's more the idea that they all were junk, not the idea of a refund. I'd ask for refund too, but not expecting to really get one. Lay off the poor guy!!!!

    -1
    #71 55 days ago

    I have some green toy solders that have lost the tips off their rifles when I was 6. Calling Marcos just sounds like the right thing to do

    #72 55 days ago
    Quoted from wolffcub:

    If your not happy with marco and switching suppliers will you just toss the new supplier items in a box till you need them knowing the other suppliers provide a superior product? Will you be ordering parts from others knowing you can go back to them at a later date for replacements for possible manufacturing issues? Send a email or call the other suppliers first prior to your next order to find out what the policy what duration of time is acceptable and see if they are willing to refund / exchange product or help someone out in some way.

    What I'll be doing going forward:

    * Checking all orders for completeness (nothing missing)
    * Carefully examining each part for visible defects
    * If there is an expected twist, push or pull type stress expected to be placed on the part during installation or use I will do that with reasonable force to see if it seems okay
    * Return anything defective pronto

    As for the remaining stock of parts I have on hand, I will just adopt a mindset that I was foolish to trust that I was buying functional stuff and know that some of it might be headed straight out of its packaging and into the trash.

    #73 55 days ago
    Quoted from FlippinJimmy:

    Sorry to hear about your issues. Could have been avoided though by checking the order when it arrived.

    I did check the order when I got it. I did not tug on each lead of each lamp socket which is what I would have had to do to discover this when I received it. That seems unreasonable.

    Quoted from FlippinJimmy:

    Was just thinking that the service I have received from Pinball vendors has been some of the best service I have ever received, period. I have purchased many other items of higher cost but for some reason the pinball vendors really exceeded my expectations.
    For example, Marco's, Pinball Life, The Pinball Resource, Ball Barron, BigLaw and Mr. Tantrum (to name a few) have followed up on orders immediately. Shipped so fast I couldn't believe it and a couple even followed up with emails asking about my order. One vendor even sent parts to me with an invoice to be paid. Who does that in 2019? Steve Young took the time to talk with me on the phone an answer questions I now realize were really dumb.

    I have for the most part had the same experience. For what it's worth, I believe I have purchased roughly the same amount of stuff over the years from Marco, PBR and PinballLife. I have never had anything left out of an order from PBR or PinballLife. Marco sometimes charges for stuff and then forgets to put it in the box. I never say anything. I just order it again, sometimes from someone else. I have never had a defective part from PBR. Ever. I had one minor bad part from PinballLife. They stuck a replacement in with my next order. I have received at least half a dozen pop bumper rings from Marco that went straight into the trash can. Ditto for these 12 lamp sockets. I also once purchased one of their LED display sets for a system 9 game. It didn't display any of the commas. Eventually they accepted a return but not without a lot of hassle (and yes, I notified them immediately).

    #74 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    A little of both, yes. Is time really such a factor when we have confirmation that these parts are known to be defective?

    Yes.

    #75 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Still, I have to ask, why put a disgruntled customer through the added hassle of sending photos if you know you're not going to help them?

    The first person from Marco that contacted you may have been doing what they are supposed to. Try to help and get details.

    When they checked into replacing or not it probably escalated up the ladder to someone else who checked the time involved and found out too much time had passed.

    Marco are nice people. I'm sure they didn't intend to hassle you. Just the process they follow.

    LTG : )

    #76 55 days ago
    Quoted from wolfemaaan:

    I have some green toy solders that have lost the tips off their rifles when I was 6. Calling Marcos just sounds like the right thing to do

    Lol, that ain't right.

    #77 55 days ago
    Quoted from MarkInc:

    Some business go above and beyond. Case in point - Bay Area Amusements - and missing/incorrect rubbers:
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/thanks-to-bay-area-amusements#post-4840596

    Literally the biggest parts distributor around.....

    -1
    #78 55 days ago

    You wait that long to look them over or install them and then shout all this BS from the rooftops about one of the best pinball suppliers in the business. Get a life.

    #79 55 days ago
    Quoted from High_End_Pins:

    Unfortunately These shitty pop bumper lamp sockets continue to be sold to this day

    I think the OP has a point. And Marco is being penny wise and pound foolish.

    Of course the OP doesn’t really have a case for a refund, but I refuse to lecture him for trying.

    #80 55 days ago

    nah, still gonna stock up on parts.

    #81 55 days ago

    Remind me when I worked at RadioShack and this lady came in with this huge dinosaur remote in a very clean looking package, and the receipt she pulled out said “December 5th, 1992”

    WHAT THE F@$#?!
    It was so old it wasn’t even in the ancient catalogs we kept in back. I have no way of ever proving it was even ours to begin with aside from the receipt.

    In the end the manager told her to go pound sand. But people are friggin’ crazy.
    I’ve heard Price Chopper (regional northeastern supermarket) will take back thanksgiving turkey’s even if it’s been 6 months and it’s all nasty and rotten at that point as long as you have a receipt.

    Some people are complete jackwagons. You bought junk forever ago and now you don’t want it. Go to goodwill or have a garage sale, don’t try to bang the store over the head YEARS later.
    Imagine if I bought a pin from you and then 5 years later the board looks like I toasted marshmallows on them, and I get angry about some hack you did and demand my money back???

    #82 55 days ago

    I am guilty of ordering parts in advance of what I needed. I was gathering parts to convert an nba fast break into an afm.

    Then I had the stroke and the three brain surgeries. I still have all the parts.

    All of the vendors who sold me bigger parts like the play field reached out personally and offered to back buy my conversion parts.

    I still have them all. It might be nostalgia now.

    I also wanted to say I have dealt with Marco and they have been top notch in every way.

    I like their presence at the shows, like the upcoming pinball madness in banning. I bet they will be there.

    Pinball madness plug, I slipped it in!

    #83 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    I had an unfortunate customer service experience last week with Marco Specialties that I have decided merits talking about here so that others might avoid a similar experience. Part of the problem I encountered stems from my own behavior - I have a tendency to order parts I anticipate needing for a particular project or known upcoming maintenance task all at once. Sometimes, I will not get to that project or maintenance task for a year or more. Some parts I just like to have on hand so I can perform common repairs as needed without both waiting and paying for delivery of a single part or two.
    This has worked out fairly well for me as a general practice over the years, with a couple of exceptions - both of which have involved Marco and both coincidentally involving pop bumper parts. The first issue I ran across was poorly peened shaft attachments on pop bumper rings. The issue here is that sometimes the shafts are so poorly attached to the ring that the slightest flex or overtightening of the nuts will easily pull the two pieces apart. I have thrown at least a half dozen of these in the trash over the past couple of years, not bothering to ask for replacements.
    Perhaps because of this experience, I was less willing to let slide an issue I encountered with some pop bumper lamp sockets last week. Again, the issue came down to poor (almost non-existent) attachment of the leads to the body. The slightest twist (as is reasonable to expect when installing them or changing a bulb) and the lamp socket comes right off. This was not a situation like the rings where some were good and some were bad. ALL 12 of the lamp sockets were bad! At $2.89 each that's $34.68 plus shipping straight into the trash. In the scheme of things in the pinball world, that's chump change but still annoying enough that I felt compelled to reach out to Marco directly, let them know what I had encountered and ask for replacements since I was rebuilding a bunch of pop bumpers and could not finish the job since I didn't have any usable new sockets.
    Granted, it had been a long time since I had originally purchased these. (According to Marco, it had been three years. I am sure it had not been nearly that long. I thought it had been about a year.) Nevertheless, given that these were defective parts that had an unexpected defect not visible to the naked eye I fully expected that they would apologize for the inconvenience and simply replace them.
    Sadly, that was not the case. They initially asked me for photos so I sent them these pictures:
    [quoted image]
    [quoted image]
    [quoted image]
    Cale at Marco emailed me back asking me to allow him time to look into it. A little over a hour later he wrote back again informing me that too much time had elapsed to do anything for me. Duly noted. Still, I have to ask, why put a disgruntled customer through the added hassle of sending photos if you know you're not going to help them?
    Since we can't change others, I will be changing my own behavior. I will no longer trust vendors to replace brand new defective parts unless the order is less than 30 days old. I will no longer order parts in advance unless I know I will be installing them within 30 days. I will no longer order parts from Marco Specialties. That might mean that I won't be able to get some stuff. That's a bummer, but I have decided that the convenience of their superior website search function and large inventory are not worth the (usually) higher prices or risk of eating it if something proves to be defective.
    I've got another big restoration project coming up. I'll be dropping a minimum of $500-$700 on parts for it. Looks like between PinballLife and PBR I can cover all the bases, so that's where my money is going now.

    Drill out the brass Brad. Solder the two pieces back together. Get some #4 machine screws and put them back together. If the #4 screw will not work then superglue them or tape back together with some Gorilla duct tape.

    No need to trash them.

    #84 55 days ago

    My dad used to have this beat up Craftsman Breaker bar with gauge on it to measure the pounds. It was rusted, and gauge bent all to hell and I remembered playing with it when I was 5. Many years later my dad had me drive him to Sears because he said it wasn't working properly (no shit) and said he wanted to exchange it. There was no way in hell they were going to replace it, but I just took him to humor him and see the look on those poor sears guys in the basement. Low and behold, those mofos not only gave him a brand new one, but they said come back in 2 weeks and well clean up the original and you can have it back. They did just that.

    Now maybe that's what the OP was expecting out of Marcos? Well, Marcos needs to stay in business and we see what happened to Sears for being good guys. But hey, I buy Craftsman to this day for this reason

    #85 55 days ago
    Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

    Imagine if I bought a pin from you and then 5 years later the board looks like I toasted marshmallows on them, and I get angry about some hack you did and demand my money back???

    Wow - way to come up with a completely irrelevant analogy. Okay - let's imagine that:

    You buy a used machine from me and use it for five years....somehow in your mind that equates to buying a new part and never using it but discovering later that it is defective and unusable? Not the same at all. Not even close.

    #86 55 days ago

    3 years? I thought I was an anal MF'er. Just solder as described and move on.

    #87 55 days ago
    Quoted from wolfemaaan:

    My dad used to have this beat up Craftsman Breaker bar with gauge on it to measure the pounds. It was rusted, and gauge bent all to hell and I remembered playing with it when I was 5. Many years later my dad had me drive him to Sears because he said it wasn't working properly (no shit) and said he wanted to exchange it. There was no way in hell they were going to replace it, but I just took him to humor him and see the look on those poor sears guys in the basement. Low and behold, those mofos not only gave him a brand new one, but they said come back in 2 weeks and well clean up the original and you can have it back. They did just that.
    Now maybe that's what the OP was expecting out of Marcos? Well, Marcos needs to stay in business and we see what happened to Sears for being good guys. But hey, I buy Craftsman to this day for this reason

    Again - not even remotely similar situations.

    #88 55 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    Drill out the brass Brad. Solder the two pieces back together. Get some #4 machine screws and put them back together. If the #4 screw will not work then superglue them or tape back together with some Gorilla duct tape.
    No need to trash them.

    Thanks I'll keep that along with other repair suggestions in mind for the future.

    #89 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Yes - three years is a long time. 3 years is what Marco says. They base this off of all that I have to go on which is an order number on the bag that I keep this style of lamp sockets in. As a matter or organization, I tend to consolidate identical stuff in one bag from whatever vendor it came from. Under this system, multiple orders of a part can easily end up in the same bag. That's clearly a bad idea. Again, I don't think these are three years old, but I can't look it up like I could on PinballLife which allows customers to look back through old orders. Maybe they are that old, maybe not. I don't have a way of really knowing.
    If only some of them had been defective, I would've just thrown them in the trash and carried on without much more thought about it. It was the fact that ALL of them were defective that made me give them a call.
    I actually didn't ask for anything originally. What I did was call them and tell them what was going on. Maybe I was doing something wrong and breaking perfectly good parts? Maybe this was something that they know about and would be happy to help with? Maybe they would tell me what many of the comments here suggest and tell me to do a thorough quality check/stress test on all the parts I order rather than trust that they are all good? I felt it was worth a call. The result of the call with the weird photograph hoop jump prior to the half expected denial of exchange was what struck me as weird.

    That's what I'm saying. Thank you.

    I'm really not that ticked off. I mainly want to warn others not to buy parts in advance unless they are a professional repair business that mows through parts quickly. For the rest of us, our personal and professional lives often cause hobby projects to get shoved to the far back burner for longer periods of time than expected.

    You are right. Anything would have gone a long way and this would not be an issue. The dollar amount doesn't matter. This is a matter of principle for me since I am talking about new, unused parts that could easily still be on their shelves.

    Thanks for verifying that. I guess that's the crux of the matter for me. They know I bought these from them and very likely know they are defective.

    Marcos told me to fix them with jb-weld.

    This is what puzzled me, too.

    I don't know about that, but it could be a win-win for them and other customers. Maybe a few people who have practiced the same dumb habits that I have will also change their ways and Marcos will have fewer calls about merchandise defects from guys like me after way too much time has passed.

    So you save your receipts?

    #90 55 days ago
    Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:

    There’s a guy on YouTube who opens up canned food from the 50’s-60’s
    It’s hilarious, he acts disappointed and disgusted by what comes out.

    Ran across that channel last week. MRE'S

    #91 55 days ago
    Quoted from cottonm4:

    So you save your receipts?

    Usually just from PBR since those double as invoices. The rest I rely upon online order records.

    #92 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinheadpierre:

    Usually just from PBR since those double as invoices. The rest I rely upon online order records.

    Twenty years worth, at least.

    Habit from work. If it isn't on paper, it never happened as far as the state is concerned.

    Not a big deal to drop invoices in a file cabinet at the end of a month.

    #93 55 days ago

    I do the same thing. No way will I pay $8 shipping for a $5 part. So the tendency is to place a decent sized order to justify the shipping. I work on a lot of games and order a fair amount of parts. You cant be expected to go over everything with a fine toothed comb. A quick check of parts shipped to parts ordered (make sure quantities are correct etc..) is usually all I do. Marco should have offered something. Personally I would have probably just soldered wires on as someone already suggested, but everyone is different. I understand where you are coming from OP.

    #94 55 days ago
    Quoted from pinstyle:

    You cant be expected to go over everything with a fine toothed comb.

    I do.

    If I order parts they are for my business/livelihood. I can't afford to not inspect anything coming in. It could be the difference between a game earning or a game being down.

    LTG : )

    #95 55 days ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    I do.
    If I order parts they are for my business/livelihood. I can't afford to not inspect anything coming in. It could be the difference between a game earning or a game being down.
    LTG : )

    Good to know. Sometimes doing something seems like overkill until you learn how seasoned pros approach things like order verification and qc checks.

    #96 55 days ago

    Here is what you do. Order more of the same part. Then contact Marco and tell them the part(s) were defective. When they ask for pictures send them pictures of the defective ones from 3 years ago. Keep the new ones and return the defective ones for replacement. Now you have twice as many you need and they were essentially free. It's not like these things have serial numbers on them.

    Don't let honesty or morals get in your way!

    [Note1: If you read this and thought "Hey, that's a great idea" then you should really quit pinball and become a politician, or lobbyist]

    [Note2: For those that don't know me, I wrote this as a joke. Though I know this method of "returns" happens all the time in retail]

    #97 55 days ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    I do.
    If I order parts they are for my business/livelihood. I can't afford to not inspect anything coming in. It could be the difference between a game earning or a game being down.
    LTG : )

    Agreed, but to the point of tugging on leads to a lamp socket? Probably not...

    #98 55 days ago

    This reminds my of my TWD premium, 267 plays. No GI and no computer controlled lights. Bad node board. NO QUALITY!

    #99 55 days ago

    That reminds me. I bought those micro switches with the straight long wire that you can bend into whatever shape you need. I figured they’d come in handy sometime. Well, when I finally decided to use them I found out they were complete junk. The wire broke off right were they are tacked to the trigger plate. Every one I bought. I just ate it and used the switch body. Lesson learned.

    #100 54 days ago
    Quoted from pinstyle:

    Agreed, but to the point of tugging on leads to a lamp socket? Probably not...

    Actually I do. When I tear a pop bumper apart, unsolder the wires below the playfield, and put in a new part. I want to be damn sure I'm not back in there a day or two later doing the same thing. Especially if it's under a ramp or other things I'd have to move again.

    I don't like doing stuff twice.

    LTG : )

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