Goth, Industrial, Post-punk and alternative music Discussion thread.

I never got too far into heavy metal as much as classic rock (sabbath etc) then I wandered into NIN and didn’t really branch out that much until a couple years ago got into Joy Division, Bauhaus.

Watched so some videos where Trent said he was influenced by Ministry and Skinny Puppy.

I always would tune into Lithium or First Wave on SiriusXM but probably into Nirvana more than the other grunge bands I also like STP and Soundgarden, but the first wave seemed to have more of what I was after.

I like the dark wave of goth music more, so lately I’ve bought some Cure (Disinigration, Pornography) and ordered some Ministry and Skinny Puppy.

I’m trying to figure if industrial is related (meaning came down from goth) NIN doing ‘Dead Souls’ from Joy Division was that a lark or was he inspired from the early goth bands?

What do you guys like in this realm of music?

I got two Radiohead (Bends and OK Computer). Not sure where Radiohead fit into first wave or what? I have not listened to much yet but the Bends sounds like Coldplay which I’m not sure if I like all that much. Only song song I knew from that is High and Dry (I like Creep from the first Radiohead LP). Have not listened to OKC yet supposed to be good.

The Cure Disintigration is better for me, I know a lot of those tunes from first wave radio.

-1

#2 5 years ago

ACE

pinzrfun

Pinside+ Frequent

Belleville, MI

11y 90,300 4,305 20

No.

#3 5 years ago

CHD

Cheddar

I'm a big fan of SP and Ministry. I followed the path from dark wave to industrial in the late 80s.

I assume Trent was influenced by Dark/New Wave in the 80s. He was in a band called the problems (I think that was it) that has a scene in the movie "Light of Day". The band was very new wave

I always thought of industrial as a punk/wave hybrid

#4 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

Oh yeah!

As far as the Cure is concerned, the first album will always be the best for me. Killing an Arab, etc...

I remember it was only available as an import.

#5 5 years ago

DAV

EdisonArcade

Pinside member

11y 68,800 681

Ministry! They were awesome at Lollapalooza 2, so loud. Was lucky to see them in Seattle in 92 with Helmet and Sepultura. The highlight was when Chris Cornell sang 'So What'.

#6 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

I've been thinking about starting a similar thread covering all alternative rock for the longest time, but figured on this site, it might be a real lonely thread.

#7 5 years ago

PJF

rai

Pinside member

Quoted from o-din:
I've been thinking about starting a similar thread covering all alternative rock for the longest time, but figured on this site, it might be a real lonely thread.

Well this can be added to the discussion.

I’m curious alternative includes grunge is this an equivalent to what punk was to normal rock was back in the 70s?

What’s the lineage like Rock led to punk which led to post punk (?) Joy Division (etc).

I’m not sure on U2 is that just rock or some wave?

I realize REM is alternative but I’m not very interested in their music but I do like Talking Heads and Peter Gabriel.

#8 5 years ago

CHD

Cheddar

Quoted from o-din:
Oh yeah!
As far as the Cure is concerned, the first album will always be the best for me. Killing an Arab, etc...
I remember it was only available as an import.

My favorite Cure album is Pornography. Such loud dark music

#9 5 years ago

CMS

Xenon75

Pinside member

11y 86,800 1,968

Other great Industrial bands:
KMFDM
PIG
SKOLD
Gravity Kills
Sister Machine Gun
My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult
Genitorturers
Drown
En Esch
Slick Idiot
Combichrist
Rammstein
Death Ride 69
How to Destroy Angels
Hate Dept.
Motionless In White
Orgy

#10 5 years ago

CHD

Cheddar

Quoted from Xenon75:
Other great Industrial bands:
KMFDM ++
Genitorturers +++

I'll throw in Scraping Foetus Off the Wheel but I don't know if that's really industrial

#11 5 years ago

PJF

rai

Pinside member

NIN favorite of mine is The Fragile

#12 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

I have never really seen any connection between early goth and industrial music at all. Other than the bands could like each other.
I did see the terms being used completely interchangeabley at some point and just sort of gave up. Like anything else, "goth" started to be defined by fashion and not the music at all; ie Marilyn Manson height.

I do t think k it could ever be done better than the OGs Bauhaus & Joy Division.
And I think the American industrial time of NiN and Ministry were tops there.
Nothing last though... NIN is, well I don't even know what the hell it is but I wouldn't call it industrial, and he never would have anyway. And ministry just turned into shit metal.

#13 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from EdisonArcade:
The highlight was when Chris Cornell sang 'So What'.

As he always did... I think he sand everything on the album minus 1 or 2.

#14 5 years ago

CHD

Cheddar

Chris Connelly not Cornell https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Connelly_(musician)

#15 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_rock

OP
Quoted from rai:
Well this can be added to the discussion.

I’m curious alternative includes grunge is this an equivalent to what punk was to normal rock was back in the 70s?

What’s the lineage like Rock led to punk which led to post punk (?) Joy Division (etc).

I’m not sure on U2 is that just rock or some wave?

I realize REM is alternative but I’m not very interested in their music but I do like Talking Heads and Peter Gabriel.

It's a pretty deep subject and even back in the 70s I seeked out music not of the norm. Wiki has a pretty good article covering the history.

I'm throwing a little Siouxsie And The Banshees out there now to stick with topic.

#16 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from Cheddar:
Chris Connelly not Cornell https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Connelly_(musician)

Ha, whoops.

#17 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

OP
Quoted from rai:
I’m not sure on U2 is that just rock or some wave?
I realize REM is alternative...

Bands like U2 and INXS were def of the beaten path when coming out. "shadows and tall trees" from Boy is very diff'rent thsn standard rock.

REM will always be the worst band with the biggest amount of good songs for me.

#18 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

When U-2 came out they were definitely part of the new wave and only got played on stations that specialized in that genre. Like many others though, they hit the mainstream in a few short years.

It was great seeing them in a small venue like the Hollywood Palladium when they only had two albums worth of material to work with.

#19 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

I'm thinking Magazine was one of the first bands I heard that bridged the gap between punk and goth. Singer Howard Devoto was formerly a member of the Buzzcocks.

If you've never listened to them, they were pretty awesome.

#20 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

That shit's 40 years old now. Waaaaayyyyy ahead of their time.

#21 5 years ago

LUV

RandomGuyOffCL

Pinside member

9y 83,800 2,075

Boy George count?

I jam out to that chameleon song with my daughter in the car

#22 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from RandomGuyOffCL:
Boy George count?

I jam out to that chameleon song with my daughter in the car

It counts as the beginning of the end of all that was cool about the new wave/ post punk scene. Throw the Human League in there as well.

#23 5 years ago

PJF

rai

Pinside member

So why isn’t Black Sabbath goth?

#24 5 years ago

MDS

Wmsfan-GAP

Pinside+ Frequent

14y 122K 1,702 1

The Cure BTW, just got voted in for the 2019 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees.

#25 5 years ago

JPJ

Frippertron

Pinside member

Sparta, NJ

7y 60,800 2,301

The be all end all Goth band, in my opinion.

il_570xN.1421125638_dt6g (resized).jpg

#26 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothic_metal#Precursors

OP
Quoted from rai:
So why isn’t Black Sabbath goth?

See "Metal Goth" or "Gothic Metal"

#27 5 years ago

DAD

Thermionic

Inactive member

Don’t care for Industrial (I’ve tried), but Darkwave/Goth and Doom/Goth Metal is great. Out of all the great bands, I think Fields of the Nephilim was/is my favorite:

(But I’d say the Cure “Faith” album might be the peak of Goth songwriting.j

#28 5 years ago

DAD

Thermionic

Inactive member

Eva O is also worth mentioning:

#29 5 years ago

LKD

Luckydogg420

Pinside member

Kitchener, ON

11y 115K 5,859 14

Do any of you guys like tool?

#30 5 years ago

PJF

rai

Pinside member

#31 5 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from Luckydogg420:
Do any of you guys like tool?

I used to. They were kind of a staple back in the 90s. Local band gone big.

#32 5 years ago

???

Pickle

Pinside member

Pearland, TX

11y 78,800 3,002 5

How about Nitzer Ebb....Kind of like some of their stuff.

#33 5 years ago

JCA

lodgingdolphin

Severedmods

Rochester, NY

9y 106K 712 13 21

#34 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from Thermionic:
...think Fields of the Nephilim was/is my favorite:

Nephilim was fucking great...sick bass and both guitars; and obviously Carl.

Quoted from Wmsfan-GAP:
The Cure BTW, just got voted in for the 2019 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees.

I guess they have a bit better of chnace this year than last but they'll get screwed over.

#35 5 years ago

PHB

Chisox

Pinside member

Frankfort, IL

9y 129K 4,278 9 37

Quoted from o-din:
I used to. They were kind of a staple back in the 90s. Local band gone big.

Damn O-din my finger’s cramping up from upvoting all your music posts the last couple days.

#36 5 years ago

???

Joydivision

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 69,550 654 11

Quoted from o-din:
I'm thinking Magazine was one of the first bands I heard that bridged the gap between punk and goth. Singer Howard Devoto was formerly a member of the Buzzcocks.
If you've never listened to them, they were pretty awesome.

Yea, Magazine's "Real life" is great - will never date either IMO. I like everything Howard Devoto has done including the kind of lost album by his later band Luxuria -"Unaswerable lust".

One of my favorite bands & album over the decades has been The sisters of mercy & "Floodland".

#37 5 years ago

PJF

rai

Pinside member

Quoted from Joydivision:
Yea, Magazine's "Real life" is great - will never date either IMO. I like everything Howard Devoto has done including the kind of lost album by his later band Luxuria -"Unaswerable lust".
One of my favorite bands & album over the decades has been The sisters of mercy & "Floodland".

just noticed your screen name Joy Division

#38 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from Joydivision:
One of my favorite bands & album over the decades has been The sisters of mercy & "Floodland".

First last and always and Floodland are both completely perfect albums from start to finish in diff'rent ways.
Shit they have some great cover songs too.

#39 5 years ago

EAG

Pinsterwmass

Pinside member

Holyoke, MA

5y 43,650 124 12

Rammstein

#40 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Early Wolfgang Press is good stuff too before they went club.
Other tall stories is a solid collection, top notch album.

#41 5 years ago

DAD

Thermionic

Inactive member

Quoted from TheLaw:
Nephilim was fucking great...sick bass and both guitars; and obviously Carl.

One of the best live acts I’ve seen - the band was faultless, Carl’s performance was from some other plane of existence, there was just enough improvising to make things interesting but no pretentious indulgent bullshit, and there was a great vibe in the crowd.

#42 5 years ago

DAD

PW79

Inactive member

Wentzville, MO

12y 102K 7,501 6 6

NIN & Manson, listened to em a lot for sure.

The shit has not aged well tho. Or maybe I'm just 40.

#43 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from Thermionic:
One of the best live acts I’ve seen - the band was faultless,

Holy shit you saw them live?!? Wow, nice.

#44 5 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

Pinside+ Addict

If those Cure and Banshee fans aren't familiar with, Blue Sunshine by The Glove is an awesome album. Perfect drug fueled one off.

#45 5 years ago

DAD

Thermionic

Inactive member

Quoted from TheLaw:
Holy shit you saw them live?!? Wow, nice.

Nottingham, July ‘90 (don’t recall the exact day).

I did a summer semester at Univ. of Nottingham, and FOTN (freshly introduced to me by one of the friends I had made) was one of a few cool bands I saw (New Model Army was another good one) that never toured much in the U.S.

(Edited to say “Shit, I just dated myself, didn’t I?”)

#46 5 years ago

ART

OLDPINGUY

Arts Arcade

12y 171K 12,507 7

Quoted from Pinsterwmass:
Rammstein

One band Id love to see!

Too many concerts! SOAD kicks my Ass!

pasted_image (resized).png

#47 5 years ago

???

Joydivision

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 69,550 654 11

Quoted from TheLaw:
First last and always and Floodland are both completely perfect albums from start to finish in diff'rent ways.
Shit they have some great cover songs too.

Totally agree & yea, some great cover versions, like knocking on heavens door, Emma, 1969 ect & of course the great clip for "Black Planet".

#48 5 years ago

DAD

Thermionic

Inactive member