To clarify, I dont know when this sticker was stopped being used, so it is only a general identifier of age.
To clarify, I dont know when this sticker was stopped being used, so it is only a general identifier of age.
Quoted from pinballlife:This is incorrect. Check that length again. They are 30-9/16", although I believe Stern documents them at 30-1/2"
Corrected. Thanks Terry. Stern are as stated, as a generality 30 1/2”.
As for Sega, the legs on my Frank were powdercoated at some point, so that sticker is long gone if it was even there. That’s the only Sega game I have at the moment.
Perfect timing for this thread, I was putting games in the trailer for Pintastic and you saved me hours going through my pile of legs, you definitely confirmed some of the info I thought I knew was correct, Thanks
Quoted from SirScott:Anyone know what the correct legs are for a Baywatch?
Oh S$^^! I knew this coming!
Quoted from hawknole:Well the good news is my HH looks correct, LOTR is fine. But looks like my BK legs are wrong @ 28.5”. I actually wouldn’t mind getting 27’s for just the front...PBR
I have a pretty nice set of refurbished 27’s if we happen to meet up anytime soon before you order some.
5A05674B-4D4E-4B1D-A206-35243B0D0A63 (resized).jpegQuoted from Colsond3:I have a pretty nice set of refurbished 27’s if we happen to meet up anytime soon before you order some.
Cool, thanks for the offer. Maybe we will catch up at Bart’s, he was talking about a possible mini tourney.
Quoted from o-din:!965 Williams front legs. Who makes these?
Those are tough to find. I've had to cut down longer legs a few times. And just try to move one of those games with a pin lift.
Quoted from DennisDodel:Those are tough to find.
Harder to find original red steel legs for late 50s Williams, and maybe even harder the correct wood legs for earlier games.
Quoted from Puffdanny:My imamaculate pins don't even have legs
Hahaha, wow, the Baywatch thread spills over everywhere.
Just checked Steve Young's site and he lists the following for legs, scroll down to the "Most Popular Applications Chart" area:
http://www.pbresource.com/legs.html
Quoted from hawknole:Just checked Steve Young's site and he lists the following for legs, scroll down to the "Most Popular Applications Chart" area:
http://www.pbresource.com/legs.html
Also, just talked to Steve on the phone and he said, "27 inch legs are for Gottlieb only." So, my 28.5's on my BK are good.
Quoted from hawknole:Also, just talked to Steve on the phone and he said, "27 inch legs are for Gottlieb only." So, my 28.5's on my BK are good.
If Steve said that, then it is gospel.
Not sure if already posted, but check out the application chart at the bottom:
http://www.pbresource.com/legs.html
Edit: yup, duplicate link... carry on!
I have a low ceiling and a sloped floor to contend with. Some creative swapping helped: by swapping the back legs of CBW with the front legs of FT, I was able to gain the proper playfield slope with the topper nearly pinned to the ceiling (otherwise the game would be unplayable unless the topper was removed) This also improved the slope of CBW, which had levelers all the way up and propped up on 2X4 platform.
Quoted from Colsond3:That is good...pics below for reference. So the legs on Frank are 30 1/2”, but the manual refers to 30 1/4” similar to Baywatch, which is interesting.
Quoted from Colsond3:70’s Bally EM....28”.
Hi Colsond3 and anyone who's interested -
there still is some big misunderstanding going on regarding BALLY-LEGS.
BALLY-Legs from mid-1967 to 1974 (all models with the lift-up-cabinet-frame) have slightly shorter legs (71 cm) in black or dark-grey
From 1974 on (the new cabinet) they have exactly the same length as Wiilliams (72,5 cm) in black or dark-grey
I do not know exactly what this means 'in inches' but it's a fact!
The early models (1963 to mid-1967) had 77cm grey legs (the same colour as the front-door)
What is mentioned above regarding Bally '1968 to 1983' is absolutely bullshit, sory!
Hi,
that's not difficult.
Left - Gottlieb-Multiplayer-Cabinet 1964-1975 - long Gottlieb-legs 79cm
2nd from the right - Gottlieb-Cabinet 1975-onwards - short Gottlieb-legs 69cm
the other 3 should have all the same legs - Williams 72,5cm
Quoted from o-din:!965 Williams front legs. Who makes these?
I had a set of those at one time, I never knew what they were for so pretty sure I pitched them but I will look around.
Quoted from cottonm4:but all down the line the play fields are at same height.
Quoted from Mardi-Gras-Man:Hi Colsond3 and anyone who's interested -
there still is some big misunderstanding going on regarding BALLY-LEGS.
BALLY-Legs from mid-1967 to 1974 (all models with the lift-up-cabinet-frame) have slightly shorter legs (71 cm) in black or dark-grey
From 1974 on (the new cabinet) they have exactly the same length as Wiilliams (72,5 cm) in black or dark-grey
I do not know exactly what this means 'in inches' but it's a fact!
Use conversion tables before you call BS there Mardi man....
84FDED89-A734-4BBD-8763-055961DB4B65 (resized).jpeg9F442D90-2E19-4961-BE5E-9F94E5F5284D (resized).jpegQuoted from Colsond3:Use conversion tables before you call BS there Mardi man....
What I meant with BS is - there are 2 different legs but in the list pictured you find only 1 length for '1968 to 1983' and this is absolutely wrong for 2 reasons, first because the new length started in mid-1967 after Capersville, and second because there was the mentioned change in 1974.
This information is incorrect and lots of Bally-Games from 67 to 74 stand on wrong legs therefore.
And I never meant to attack YOU of course, I wanted to do you a favour regarding your Vampire.
There are more mistakes in that 'flipper.be' listing, regarding Willams from 1966 upwards - they used 28,5 and nothing else since the early sixties until 1999, only in 1965 and 1966 they used very short front-legs for the 'lowcharger-cabinet'
Plus, Bally-legs were black or dark-grey until Williams took over, and not just until 1983.
And classic Stern never used chrome, they all had light-grey painted legs.
Quoted from Colsond3:Why it’s important to have the proper legs on a game with all of them at the proper height...
yep, but the prob on your case is the penetration angle
...
and i know for sure, before reading, that baywatch would be part of this topic
For WMS Sys 11’s, does anyone know which pin they switched from half rib to full rib?
Says 1987 in the link provided but i think F-14 should have half rib still.
Quoted from Completist:For WMS Sys 11’s, does anyone know which pin they switched from half rib to full rib?
Says 1987 in the link provided but i think F-14 should have half rib still.
Toteally. Ok, we won’t revisit that mess.
Most F-14’s I have come across had half ribs on them. I think the issue with all WMS games is that most people just buy a new set of legs with the full ribs because they are shiny and new.
Here is the short rib leg compatibility list we came up with, but can't guarantee it is 100 percent complete -
https://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=1939
Terry.
Cool. Thanks Terry. Now I’m going to have to order a couple sets. I’m overdue for a PBL order anyway.
Quoted from Colsond3:That is good...pics below for reference. So the legs on Frank are 30 1/2”, but the manual refers to 30 1/4” similar to Baywatch, which is interesting.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
Can someone confirm this is wrong re williams at 27" ? PB resource has them at 28.5 ?
For Barracora, Firepower, Starlight etc.
Thankyou!
Resurrecting this thread: I have a bunch of WMS games and a pile of legs to match up. I was going by the above guide, and there's some confusion between half rib and full rib from Pinball Resource, Flipper.be and Pinball Life. I think I can muddle through that, but when I start to look at IPDB for most of the WMS System 6 to 11 stuff, I see a ton of black legs, even in some of the flyers. Are all these IPDB pictures wrong, or were black legs sometimes an option. Because I seem to have more black legs than machines. IPDB shows black on games like Pharaoh, Gorgar, EATPM, Rollergames, Firepower, etc.
Williams changed from half to full-rib in the winter from 1989 to 1990. I saw Bad Cats and Whirlwind new out of the box at the distributors with both kind of legs.
Black legs were only used by Bally (from 1967 until Williams took finally over) and by Atari.
Most owners do not care what sort of legs their pins have, that's why there are so many 'disturbing' pics in the IPDB.
Williams never used black legs, and if it seems so in the flyer it must be some sort of refection.
You can believe me, I was very curious about pinball-legs from early on because it bothered me that so many machines stood either too low or much too high because the operators didn't give a damn to select the original legs, and so it became a sort of hobby to take record of this.
There are different hints to recognize the legs from different manufancturers immediately - Bally-legs for example have a sharp-edged 90-degree-angle on the lower side, Williams, classic Stern and Atari-legs have a wide round 'angle' and Gottlieb's have a 'smaller and slightly rounded' angle at the lower side (bottom)
I see so many Gottlieb/Premier games with the wrong legs on them its ludacris. Aren't they all 27" for them?
Quoted from Mardi-Gras-Man:Williams changed from half to full-rib in the winter from 1989 to 1990. I saw Bad Cats and Whirlwind new out of the box at the distributors with both kind of legs.
Black legs were only used by Bally (from 1967 until Williams took finally over) and by Atari.
Most owners do not care what sort of legs their pins have, that's why there are so many 'disturbing' pics in the IPDB.
Williams never used black legs, and if it seems so in the flyer it must be some sort of refection.
You can believe me, I was very curious about pinball-legs from early on because it bothered me that so many machines stood either too low or much too high because the operators didn't give a damn to select the original legs, and so it became a sort of hobby to take record of this.
There are different hints to recognize the legs from different manufancturers immediately - Bally-legs for example have a sharp-edged 90-degree-angle on the lower side, Williams, classic Stern and Atari-legs have a wide round 'angle' and Gottlieb's have a 'smaller and slightly rounded' angle at the lower side (bottom)
Thanks....Elvira still looks black or at least dark gray in the flyer. It does not look chrome
Quoted from robertmee:Thanks....Elvira still looks black or at least dark gray in the flyer. It does not look chrome
https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=782&picno=4190
Elvira and the Party Monsters is black legs, shipped with game. I know EATPM pretty well, restored 3 at the same time.
Anyone know the official leg lengths of a 1977 Williams Big Deal? I think all four of mine are 28.5", but to even get the thing to 5.5 degrees of tilts requires the back screws to be completely spun out to the last threads (sitting on a 2X4 scrap piece too) and the fronts completely up with nothing under them.
Quoted from jj44114:Bally did not use black legs. You must mean dark gray.
Yes of course, it's not an 'absolute' black. But I think when I say 'Black' everyone knows what is meant, and it won't be confusing when it comes to the grey legs from Stern.
Quoted from robertmee:Thanks....Elvira still looks black or at least dark gray in the flyer. It does not look chrome
https://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=782&picno=4190
When I wrote "Williams finally took over" I meant that it took a little while before Bally changed to Williams-legs, sorry. Yes, Elvira still used black (or dark-grey) legs of course.
Quoted from MD_Pinball_Dude:Anyone know the official leg lengths of a 1977 Williams Big Deal? I think all four of mine are 28.5", but to even get the thing to 5.5 degrees of tilts requires the back screws to be completely spun out to the last threads (sitting on a 2X4 scrap piece too) and the fronts completely up with nothing under them.
These are the original Williams-legs, no doubt about it.
Quoted from Mardi-Gras-Man:Yes of course, it's not an 'absolute' black. But I think when I say 'Black' everyone knows what is meant, and it won't be confusing when it comes to the grey legs from Stern.
When I wrote "Williams finally took over" I meant that it took a little while before Bally changed to Williams-legs, sorry. Yes, Elvira still used black (or dark-grey) legs of course.
These are the original Williams-legs, no doubt about it.
Now I'm really confused? Elvira was never Bally...it was a system 11 wms.
Quoted from robertmee:Now I'm really confused? Elvira was never Bally...it was a system 11 wms.
No
That's exactly what I meant with "the time Willams took over"
It's a machine under the BALLY-brand which belonged to Williams since a couple of years. Bally then still used the black legs for some time.
Quoted from GravitaR:I see so many Gottlieb/Premier games with the wrong legs on them its ludacris. Aren't they all 27" for them?
Gottlieb used only 2 kinds of metal-legs from their beginning in 1956 until their end - ca 31.1" or 79cm and ca 27.2" or 69cm.
Quoted from robertmee:Now I'm really confused? Elvira was never Bally...it was a system 11 wms.
EATPM was originally a Bally game released by Midway, but under the Williams parent corp. The Bally name is present in the upper right backglass and on the speaker panel.
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