(Topic ID: 250333)

DIY Playfield post repair and chip proofing. How To all brands

By Yelobird

4 years ago


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  • 291 posts
  • 97 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 months ago by kruzman
  • Topic is favorited by 195 Pinsiders

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There are 291 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 6.
#251 3 years ago
Quoted from Spelunk71:

Just FYI, the iron caused the clear to crack around one of my posts. It was probably my fault for leaving the iron on too long (everyone else seems to have had great results), but be careful!

Yes,the iron has no thermostat so it just gets hotter and hotter. Unplug it and cool it down frequently. The least heat possible to do the job is what you want.

#252 3 years ago
Quoted from Shmilder:

Can someone post a link to the iron. I'm in Australia but can't find one anywhere, here or international.

Just be carefull. Due to the chemicals in the kit I had two irons returned by Aus Customs. Had to ask the seller to remove chemicals and just send Iron to finally get one here.

#253 3 years ago

just thinking aloud here but maybe the ironing doesnt only harden the clear enough to not crack up again but may it also make the inking better stick to the playfield? if so this could also be used as a preventive measure in a new game with playfield susceptible to pooling and chipping?

#254 3 years ago

Putting Mylar washers on my GNR SE this weekend. No pooling on mine. Arrived fall last year.

#255 3 years ago
Quoted from MeesterPieter:

just thinking aloud here but maybe the ironing doesnt only harden the clear enough to not crack up again but may it also make the inking better stick to the playfield? if so this could also be used as a preventive measure in a new game with playfield susceptible to pooling and chipping?

I would not be able to verify that though I suspect the applied ink is not an adhesive layer so likely would not be assisted. If however they are base coating the playfield with a layer of cure Then applying ink then possibly it could assist to adhere there.

#256 3 years ago

Where do you get the Mylar washers?

#257 3 years ago

With all of the continuing playfield issue threads it Sadly appears this problem is still far from resolved at the OEM level. While this repair Does work very well I do want to Strongly suggest a preemptive suggestion to hopefully avoid doing this repair in the first place! When you get your game take 15 minutes to pull the primary posts at the slings and install mylar protectors Before the damage appears! While not a 100% guarantee I feel certain this preemptive measure will drastically reduce the probability. Having the surface bonded as one large layer should help prevent it from spreading independently and reduce the probability of that surface rolling and eventually cracking! Again, just an opinion and yes does not seem fair that we need to service a New machine but it is what it is for now. Good Luck!

#258 3 years ago
Quoted from NightTrain:

Where do you get the Mylar washers?

I wanted to Avoid this as I did NOT want this help thread to come across as a Sales thread but due to Soooooo many emails we are going to offer these on our site for as Cheap as we can. No Profit! Just to hopefully entice people to preemptively try to prevent this. Will be listed today.

#259 3 years ago
Quoted from MeesterPieter:

just thinking aloud here but maybe the ironing doesnt only harden the clear enough to not crack up again but may it also make the inking better stick to the playfield? if so this could also be used as a preventive measure in a new game with playfield susceptible to pooling and chipping?

I -strongly- advise against this.

I had some art lifting under a post on Wonka CE - it was otherwise perfect (no pooling etc) and I decided to iron it down as a "pre-emptive" fix.
The first time I did it, it worked. The second time, I overheated it and the clear lifted and cracked.

It's fortunately not in a gameplay area and I bought myself a playfield anyway because we play the everloving crap out of that game, so I'm gruntled.

Let my mistake inform others: never fix what isn't broken, beware the iron heat, only iron if you're pooled and need to do it to arrest damage.

#260 3 years ago
Quoted from zaphX:

I -strongly- advise against this.
I had some art lifting under a post on Wonka CE - it was otherwise perfect (no pooling etc) and I decided to iron it down as a "pre-emptive" fix.
The first time I did it, it worked. The second time, I overheated it and the clear lifted and cracked.
It's fortunately not in a gameplay area and I bought myself a playfield anyway because we play the everloving crap out of that game, so I'm gruntled.
Let my mistake inform others: never fix what isn't broken, beware the iron heat, only iron if you're pooled and need to do it to arrest damage.

Agreed. Preemptive just install Mylar we are not making a grilled cheese here! Also, the iron does Not have a temp gauge. Prepare the area Then plug in the iron. It should be overly warm Not lava hot! The only people that said they had an issue let the iron heat for 5 plus minutes then tried to repair. Do not do that! Plug it in and use within 60 seconds. When repaired Unplug it to cool.

#261 3 years ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

Agreed. Preemptive just install Mylar we are not making a grilled cheese here! Also, the iron does Not have a temp gauge. Prepare the area Then plug in the iron. It should be overly warm Not lava hot! The only people that said they had an issue let the iron heat for 5 plus minutes then tried to repair. Do not do that! Plug it in and use within 60 seconds. When repaired Unplug it to cool.

Definitely unplug it between applications. It's a very crude device and will just heat and heat and heat.

#262 3 years ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

I wanted to Avoid this as I did NOT want this help thread to come across as a Sales thread but due to Soooooo many emails we are going to offer these on our site for as Cheap as we can. No Profit! Just to hopefully entice people to preemptively try to prevent this. Will be listed today.

THANK GOD. Nothing will make me happier than someone else offering mylar washers. People were ordering like a Small and a Medium 10 pack before. Now, with this GnR fiasco, people are ordering like ten 10 packs at a time. It's crazy. Tons of backorders because I just wasn't ready for the massive volume spike. More than happy to have you take the Mylar washer mantle.

#263 3 years ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

I wanted to Avoid this as I did NOT want this help thread to come across as a Sales thread but due to Soooooo many emails we are going to offer these on our site for as Cheap as we can. No Profit! Just to hopefully entice people to preemptively try to prevent this. Will be listed today.

I went to your site to buy some and could not find them. Just some feedback from a old guy.

#264 3 years ago
Quoted from JohnTTwo:

I went to your site to buy some and could not find them. Just some feedback from a old guy.

Sorry not old I am just Slow... lol I promise to have them up Tonight.

#265 3 years ago

A product we are sad to offer but unfortunately for now you have to protect your investment. These mylar rings can be used after playfield repair using an iron etc. I however STRONGLY suggest using these to protect the playfield post areas BEFORE damage happens! A preemptive solution. Very simple to install and while not guaranteed has proven to mitigate or avoid issues long term which are often not reversible once the damage is done. Take a few minutes to protect your investment! This size was designed to support Both large and small playfield posts. You do Not want anything smaller as the goal is to bond that mass area as one so it stays together and does not pool up or allow the post to bite in or twist the surface area. Kit is sold as a pack of (10) which should be enough for most any game. Free US shipping on this kit!

www.TheModCouplePinball.com

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1 week later
#266 3 years ago

If the iron just hearts up forever, my ghetto heat gun / measuring cup idea is probably better because the heat is so controlled.

See post 192: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/diy-playfield-post-repair-and-chip-proofing-how-to-all-brands/page/4#post-5527572

5 months later
#268 2 years ago

Because your leather heating tool isnt available in France i made my own.

it is made of brass turned on a metal lathe and designed to be mounted on a conventional soldering iron.

I will do some test to know if it works !

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#269 2 years ago
Quoted from Jjlp:

Because your leather heating tool isnt available in France i made my own.

it is made of brass turned on a metal lathe and designed to be mounted on a conventional soldering iron.
I will do some test to know if it works !
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

#270 2 years ago

I got a cheep iron needed while on a trip and noticed it included a flat thumb sized tip that would work for pooling repair. Of coarse it would get too hot over time like the other tools, but it will work if you unplug it to regulate the temperature. ($18 at Lowes)

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1 month later
#271 2 years ago

I don't really think you need an iron for JJP playfields (at least for mine anyway). I just used a hair dryer for a few seconds on the area of pooling then tightened the PETG washer down. When I raised the PETG washer again all was completely flat.
I just mentioned this because it may be unnecessary for people to be searching for and paying for irons when the fix is likely as easy as a common hair dryer.

#272 2 years ago
Quoted from Drac:

I don't really think you need an iron for JJP playfields (at least for mine anyway). I just used a hair dryer for a few seconds on the area of pooling then tightened the PETG washer down. When I raised the PETG washer again all was completely flat.
I just mentioned this because it may be unnecessary for people to be searching for and paying for irons when the fix is likely as easy as a common hair dryer.

Glad you got it all fixed. The direction of this thread was in hopes that owners Addressed the issue and provide a suggested start point to do so. I can say for a fact ignoring this issue Always gets worse! Once it fails and chips its to late unfortunatly. The iron used (in first post) cost near nothing compared to what we spend on general pinball items lol. A hair dryer can absolutely work but I personally found it heats a much larger area vs the controlled press approach. Will that matter? Don't know but also didn't want to find out fixing other peoples games... My Hope is that we Never need to use this iron tool or technique ever again! Unfortunately I have had to use this on more playfields (not only JJP) then I care to mention. Really late update but with a year in none of the repaired then mylar ring sealed fixes none have had an issue since.

1 week later
#273 2 years ago
Quoted from Neal_W:

I got a cheep iron needed while on a trip and noticed it included a flat thumb sized tip that would work for pooling repair. Of coarse it would get too hot over time like the other tools, but it will work if you unplug it to regulate the temperature. ($18 at Lowes)
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

My 40 watt Weller solder station has adjustable output. This 20 watt iron should plug right in and work.
$17.00 on Amazon...

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000EMBEY0/ref=redir_mobile_desktop

1 month later
#274 2 years ago
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:

My 40 watt Weller solder station has adjustable output. This 20 watt iron should plug right in and work.
$17.00 on Amazon...
amazon.com link »

This seems like a great idea, assuming that a weller wood burning tip would screw into their soldering iron. It's a shame I can't just buy the tip. Went to Weller's site and had no luck either.

#275 2 years ago
Quoted from Broohaha:

This seems like a great idea, assuming that a weller wood burning tip would screw into their soldering iron. It's a shame I can't just buy the tip. Went to Weller's site and had no luck either.

No no, just plug in the Weller woodburning iron into the Weller solder station shown here.. I have a couple different irons for mine.. See various pics...
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000AS28UC/ref=redir_mobile_desktop

1 month later
#276 2 years ago

So, can a first run game like JP, where this issue was present everywhere, be fixed this late in the game? 3 years or so with the pooling. Worried removing any posts will just pull/chip up the pooling art/clear before you can even try the iron. Anyone do the repair on a game after it has had this damage sitting for a couple years plus?

2 weeks later
#277 2 years ago
Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:

So, can a first run game like JP, where this issue was present everywhere, be fixed this late in the game? 3 years or so with the pooling. Worried removing any posts will just pull/chip up the pooling art/clear before you can even try the iron. Anyone do the repair on a game after it has had this damage sitting for a couple years plus?

I had slight pooling on a game from 2018 and pulled the posts and did this in September 2021, but your game may be different. Just don’t keep the iron on the pooling location for too long. Less is definitely more here. You can always go back and do it again once it cools down.

6 months later
#278 1 year ago

If you choose to purchase the Permatex Vinyl and Leather Repair Kit please read what is included in the package. MAKE SURE IT HAS A "HEATING TOOL" IN IT NOT A "HEAT TRANSFER TOOL". There are several renditions of this kit and you need to buy the correct one. Preferably the "Ultra Complete Repair System". Just FYI.
Thanks to Yelobird for coming up with this technique.
I used a combo of ironing, clearcoat on the areas that were cracked or chipped and mylar rings (Pin Monk) or Clifffy's carbon fiber rings depending on what was going on in that particular area.
I had no idea it was so bad and really involved every post until I started a major shop job on my IMDN Pro. Some posts I really could not appreciate the extent of the damage until I removed them.

#279 1 year ago
Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:

So, can a first run game like JP, where this issue was present everywhere, be fixed this late in the game? 3 years or so with the pooling. Worried removing any posts will just pull/chip up the pooling art/clear before you can even try the iron. Anyone do the repair on a game after it has had this damage sitting for a couple years plus?

Yes. As stated above I am now in the process of ironing/repairing all the post areas on my Iron Maiden Pro. I actually did not pull anything up when removing but each post/game is different, so assess each one and approach it accordingly. Some come right up. Some need a little massaging.

1 month later
#280 1 year ago
Quoted from Neal_W:

I got a cheep iron needed while on a trip and noticed it included a flat thumb sized tip that would work for pooling repair. Of coarse it would get too hot over time like the other tools, but it will work if you unplug it to regulate the temperature. ($18 at Lowes)
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

I own this iron as well so I have the tip. Has anyone used this particular iron with success? My concern is it's called "Woodburning Kit", I'm not looking to burn anything. I am afraid this may get too hot when compared to the vinyl iron shown in the original post. I also have an adjustable temp soldering iron that may accommodate the brass tip and if so, what temp do I set the iron too?

8 months later
#281 9 months ago

Yelobird
Has the Mylar disc fix proven effective over a couple years to prevent pooling? I just found some pooling on a Mirco pf. Im going to iron it (already experienced with a jjpotc) and just want to know if the Mylar rings are still the preferred solution?

5 months later
#282 4 months ago

How would anyone fix this?

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#283 4 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

How would anyone fix this?
[quoted image][quoted image]

Is that a garbage Mirco repro with the soft clear? How long has it been like that?

IF it's a Mirco and it hasn't been years, I'd try the vinyl iron to smooth it out again. But if it's been too long and the clear is hardened completely, it might not relax again with the heat.

#284 4 months ago

It’s older. So do I do super glue or do I razor it and put Mylar down?

The clear is not sticky. I thought about buying a playfield protector and calling it a day. I did buy one, though still wanting to fix as that’s a last resort.

#285 4 months ago
Quoted from hank527:

It’s older. So do I do super glue or do I razor it and put Mylar down?
The clear is not sticky. I thought about buying a playfield protector and calling it a day. I did buy one, though still wanting to fix as that’s a last resort.

I'd defer to kruzman on this one. Do you know whose repro PF this is? Classic Playfields?

#286 4 months ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

I'd defer to kruzman on this one. Do you know whose repro PF this is? Classic Playfields?

Bill Heatherly cleared it years ago. I think it just pooled and other owner didn’t fix it ASAP.

I’ll try the heat and see if it sticks. Other thought is super glue or a repair kit as I remember someone had these.

#287 4 months ago

I sell a kit that is for installing playfields that have a clearcoat, which is everything post WPC except wade krausse pfs. (He doesn't use automotive clear on his repros)
That ghosting happens a lot of micro pfs, or any pf where the clear is all done in one or 2 days (production clear).
The install kit has 13 diamond dremmil bits of all shapes and sizes so that you can remove a small area of clear, just enough so threads or the head of a screw or a cheap drill bit wont lift the clear. Then you have a nice clean spot that is not puckered, cracked clear.
The other half of the kit is the glue kit. Its got 2 main uses. The first is after you remove a spot of clear, I like to drip a drop of the glue on the bare wood, (where you removed the clear), and it wicks thru the wood, under the clear and grabs it from under.
The other use for the glue kit is mistakes and stuff like this. It comes with different size needles, and an oz of the thinned out glue. if you get the eye of the needle so it is right at where the clear and surface meet (and there is a slight gap there from the mistake). I carefully release a couple drops right there and it will wick in to the gaps most of the time. Most of the time you can fill the gaps and lock it down to not get any worse. sometimes it only fills part of the ghosting or gap, but still locks it down from now on.

It works great when you knock the edge of a pf in to a door frame. I use the pf so gravity is in my favor, and it only takes a couple drops from the hypodermic needles.

Also some pfs come with wood burrs that are covered in clear that have to be removed, and when you remove the clear from a t nut depression, they work like they are suppose to without bending the teeth. The most important use is for setting the pop bumper nail/screws so they are level to the surface.

There are pics of me repairing issues like yours and others on my thread, but no idea where. so if you have time you can scan thru it. I would start at the end and work backwards because I think I fixed some stuff in the last couple weeks. here is a link to my thread:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/kruzman-monthly-playfield-thread/page/84#post-7997395

I suggest that folks be really careful about over tightening screws on pfs. never use a cordless driver for tightening, do it by hand, because some pfs are easy to ghost. This is because the clear is all done in one day, which kind of means its just one thick coat, and if it wasnt sanded before, its not going to have a great bite to the smooth pf. This is just common issues with production clear coats. I think you can over tighten any clear though.

My install kits help pay to keep the light and heat on in my studio. They are 100 shipped and I really appreaciate the support. They include 13 or more dremmil bits, a stone to clean them, a tool to measure screws and drill bits as well as a template to make circles, plus the glue kit which is 1oz of thinned out glue, and 6 hypos with different sized needles. if you ever need to restock your kit just contact me.

#288 4 months ago
Quoted from kruzman:

I sell a kit that is for installing playfields that have a clearcoat, which is everything post WPC except wade krausse pfs. (He doesn't use automotive clear on his repros)
That ghosting happens a lot of micro pfs, or any pf where the clear is all done in one or 2 days (production clear).
The install kit has 13 diamond dremmil bits of all shapes and sizes so that you can remove a small area of clear, just enough so threads or the head of a screw or a cheap drill bit wont lift the clear. Then you have a nice clean spot that is not puckered, cracked clear.
The other half of the kit is the glue kit. Its got 2 main uses. The first is after you remove a spot of clear, I like to drip a drop of the glue on the bare wood, (where you removed the clear), and it wicks thru the wood, under the clear and grabs it from under.
The other use for the glue kit is mistakes and stuff like this. It comes with different size needles, and an oz of the thinned out glue. if you get the eye of the needle so it is right at where the clear and surface meet (and there is a slight gap there from the mistake). I carefully release a couple drops right there and it will wick in to the gaps most of the time. Most of the time you can fill the gaps and lock it down to not get any worse. sometimes it only fills part of the ghosting or gap, but still locks it down from now on.
It works great when you knock the edge of a pf in to a door frame. I use the pf so gravity is in my favor, and it only takes a couple drops from the hypodermic needles.
Also some pfs come with wood burrs that are covered in clear that have to be removed, and when you remove the clear from a t nut depression, they work like they are suppose to without bending the teeth. The most important use is for setting the pop bumper nail/screws so they are level to the surface.
There are pics of me repairing issues like yours and others on my thread, but no idea where. so if you have time you can scan thru it. I would start at the end and work backwards because I think I fixed some stuff in the last couple weeks. here is a link to my thread:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/kruzman-monthly-playfield-thread/page/84#post-7997395
I suggest that folks be really careful about over tightening screws on pfs. never use a cordless driver for tightening, do it by hand, because some pfs are easy to ghost. This is because the clear is all done in one day, which kind of means its just one thick coat, and if it wasnt sanded before, its not going to have a great bite to the smooth pf. This is just common issues with production clear coats. I think you can over tighten any clear though.
My install kits help pay to keep the light and heat on in my studio. They are 100 shipped and I really appreaciate the support. They include 13 or more dremmil bits, a stone to clean them, a tool to measure screws and drill bits as well as a template to make circles, plus the glue kit which is 1oz of thinned out glue, and 6 hypos with different sized needles. if you ever need to restock your kit just contact me.

I just purchased two playfields and a kit from Ron recently about 4 months ago. I used the kit and followed his instructions verbatim. After cleaning the holes with the dremmel the syringe and glue worked perfectly you could see it penetrating the wood and going under the clear coat to seal it. I wouldn’t do an install without it, everything turned out beyond expectations.

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#289 4 months ago
Quoted from Judoratt:

I just purchased two playfields and a kit from Ron recently about 4 months ago. I used the kit and followed his instructions verbatim. After cleaning the holes with the dremmel the syringe and glue worked perfectly you could see it penetrating the wood and going under the clear coat to seal it. I wouldn’t do an install without it, everything turned out beyond expectations.[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

That came out fantastic. I am glad the kit helped. I think it makes for the best finished product, plus like I mentioned before, at some point you wil have to work on it and remove things from the pf, and if you have the clear removed around the hole you wont have any problems. I am really glad it helped. if you ever need more glue or syringes or anything else, I will be glad to help.
BTW you have great taste in games. is that a royal flush also?

#290 4 months ago
Quoted from kruzman:

That came out fantastic. I am glad the kit helped. I think it makes for the best finished product, plus like I mentioned before, at some point you wil have to work on it and remove things from the pf, and if you have the clear removed around the hole you wont have any problems. I am really glad it helped. if you ever need more glue or syringes or anything else, I will be glad to help.
BTW you have great taste in games. is that a royal flush also?

Yes Ron I am happy with the PF swap the kit was exactly what I needed. I have plenty of glue and syringes left. That is a Lucky hand in the pic. Royal flush is on the other end of the line, 100% original no touchups. Thanks again Ron the PF is gorgeous!

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#291 4 months ago

wow!!! good ol lead based ink!!!

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