They are in a tough spot since they are dealing with lots of buyers who are clueless at business.

A big chunk of their market thinks they are "being cheap" and make 100% profit margins.

People want more stuff, better art, on and on but no one wants to pay up for it.

You are probably right that they should put out a super duper no holds barred game every year... problem with that would be the endless screaming about how they are "screwing" their customer base by putting out a pin they cant afford.

No matter what they do they will get shit....

To me their licensing costs are the issue.

If they continue to go after some of the most expensive licenses out there the options after paying up are to

1. charge more (Elvira or Batman 66)

2. strip the game back (LZ and Star Wars)

Doing some original themes would be the compromise... would people buy those though??

Maybe an experiment to see if they could make more money and if it would sell?

Plus its the only original theme they did.... and its not really original since its the 3rd Black Knight game.

All I know is the more they spend on a license the less they have to spend on the actual game and related hardware.

They seem pretty committed to the licensed theme concept overall.

Maybe Covid will change some of these issues...

Stern has always looked at operator sales and that is one of the reasons BOM is kept low on Pros... they cant price them out of range for Ops to make money off them.

Now that operating pinball on location isnt happening or will probably be happening less maybe they will focus more on the home market?

Ops want a low issue cheap as possible game that will make money... thats what they get usually with a pro.

I doubt it... much like restaurants so many locations are going to go under that it will take some time to come back.

It may never come back to where it was... "fully deployed" could be two years.

I think Stern has always seen themselves as operators first and home second... that switched this year.

Like allot of companies they found out this year that they can still sell a ton of games when locations arent buying.

No its not... there are way more "rich people" in the hobby than you think and more and more get in every day.

Why do you think LEs sell out every run?

If your pin budget is 5-10K a year you arent their market to begin with.

They arent trying to sell pins to someone who can afford one pin a year.

They want collectors and people with a house full of pins.

They put out 4 or 5 a year.. this is what 25-50k in disposable income a year to spend on a toy?

Most people I know with "collections" have over 100K in them.. that is their market.

Like allot of businesses Stern has been doing things one way forever so its hard for then to think any different.

They were selling to operators when there was no home market.... Gary will always think Ops are "the business" because he is old school.

All I am saying is now with sales up when operators aren't buying that may make them pivot to catering more to home buyers faster than they ever would have otherwise.

Same kind of adjustments many business have to make if they are going to stay viable during covid.

be a pretty shitty business if their goal was to sell less than one pin a year to everyone.

I can assure you as someone who knows a few dealers personally that you are wrong.

Most people in the hobby buy multiple games a year and most times multiple at a time. I know many people with every single new Stern from the last two years in a row (LEs even)

You have noticed that their games are sold out and backordered?

You think thats all from single buyers picking up one game each all year?

Its the exact opposite of what you think it is.. honestly.

May depend on area or demographics but for the people I know they have a house full of pins and consider buying every new one that comes out.

OK I give up .. we can agree to disagree.

There is no business on the planet that looks at their core market as the ones who buy the least.

Its not a superiority complex.. its math that most people dont seem to get.

The assumption here is that they are making this huge margin per game by "cheating" home buyers out of features etc.

They arent.. they are in a small margin volume business. They need to sell as many as possible.

And yes.. as a business they want to make money.

yah but I also know the dealers that sell to these people and I can tell you they dont just buy one a year... its actually rare for someone to buy one and then disappear for a year.

One or two a year would actually be considered a bad customer.

Its a low margin high volume business... if it was just selling one here and one there it wouldnt exist.

Its an expensive hobby and there are no lack of people in it that can afford to buy whatever they want ( and do).

You cant compare a computer which everyone needs to a toy that costs 5K..

computers are also meant to last a few years its not something you buy on a whim.

Plus pins are designed to get you excited about every new one that comes up.. why do you think they spend so much on licensing.

Its a low margin business so they need to move lots of games to make money... dealers and Stern.

I am sure they love you anyways.

I am a bad customer too since I hate buying NIB and I never buy without playing first

Since their games are selling out and there are backorders on most games I would think they are already there.

I dont see much motivation for them to change unless sales drop which hasnt happened.

They run pretty thin already.. cant add more to games without charging more.

He is 100% correct but I think he has already found that audience if you look at demand outstripping supply right now.

He has more people buying than he can support (nice problem to have BTW).

Good point... Dialed in is pretty awesome though.

Theme kind of sucks the life out of it, if the theme was cooler it would have been an all time great game.

I think they need to go the opposite route and do more of "the pin"

OK.. Ill leave now.