That's what I did when I discovered this a few weeks ago. Didn't even mention it to JJP, and I'm far from shy about issues (as you probably know

It's just bizarre that JJP goes to amazing lengths to make a great game and then they put scratchy balls in. Stern had this reputation of shipping cheap balls and you'd think JJP would have learned from Stern's missteps.

Nothing like plunking down 9k and then having to send out for balls that don't mess up the PF. Gotta love pinball to take this abuse...that's for sure!

snaroff

Does your pf look like mine?

Like I said I used balls from Marco Specialties and have the same issue. They are a lot cleaner and shinier than the ones that came with the game and yet it does the same thing and leaves marks. Seems to me that it is pretty normal I don’t know. You can’t see it unless you shine a light on the play field from a certain angle. It is definitely different I have never seen a pin do this brand new but like I said seems like oil or grease. Maybe there is grease in the scoop or something I saw another pinsider post about that earlier

I didn't inspect it that closely. After I noticed the scratches around the flippers, I focused more on the cause and less on the absolute number of scratches. If the scratches effected play OR were more visible, I would be more upset. In my case, it's really only noticeable when you run your fingers over the PF (which I only do after cleaning/waxing).

Just to be clear, I'm not telling you what to do! You have every right to be upset that the balls that were supplied with the machine caused this damage. No doubt. The resolution is the tricky part

snaroff

Can you share a pic of your pf?

I was a bit surprised myself at the stock balls that came with the game.
After eye balling them, I choose to use new balls from my local distributor.

I can’t recall seeing any of these marks on my pf which Damien has highlighted.

Frank and the JJP crew are awesome; but not sure if this will warrant a pf replacement.

Still, it shouldn’t happen and I would send those videos off to JJP.
Hopefully some further buffing & waxing will help.

Stern is replacing pfs for having a couple of ghosted inserts. I have a friend that just got one.

I don't think it's crazy to think this could (and probably should) be an option.

Damien, I had my GBLE pf replaced as well (ghosted inserts and clear chipping in the shooter lane & around the drop targets). My local distributor & Stern were great in remedying that situation.

Don’t get me wrong, I think JJP should make this right for you as well.
I find their service team top notch each time I’ve reached out- hope they can find a good solution for you.

I personally think it's just balls beating the heck out of the metal protectors then screwing up balls. My CE did it and I did a fresh buff, wax, new super Shiny balls, and new cliffy protectors no problem since...

New playfield??? Really??? Not a chance...little elbow grease and some new parts by a pinball machine owner are always expected no matter how new or old it is...

Just looked at my playfield with bright light and its much worse than yours .... i have 1300 games in mine tho. You cant see it unless u bring a bright light out at a certain angle. To me it looks like normal clearcoat scratches just like all my other pins if u look at them a certain way . Im not really to worried about it as i dont expect the clearcoat to stay super shiny and unscathed. Its there for protection which is what its doing imo. Yea scratches suck but that's what happens with a metal bal whipping around l on clearcoat. Heck if you use a paper towel on your car it scratches the clearcoat lol.....

Yes, except these are NOT the scratches that I have on my other pins, or any other pin I've seen for that matter. They are straight lines, almost like the way planking looks.

My other games are scratched up like crazy, and never once complained about that. Even the chipping on the new CGC games that is annoying as hell, I just swallowed and moved on.

JJP has provided nothing but excellent support so far. I will await their response on this.

That looks really minor to me, those scratches are probably only in the uppermost layer of clear. You're going to have all kinds of scratches and dimples in that clear over the life of your machine. Most likely what happened is one of your pinballs got a nick in it from hitting something metal on the playfield and then started scratching the playfield as it rolled around. My advice would be to change out your balls, keep playing and don't worry about it. People seem to think that clearcoat is indestructible. While it is harder and applied more thickly than the varnish that playfields use to have on them back in the day, it still scratches and dimples when a steel ball impacts it.

Mine are bad also....only c it with bright light tho20180121_005948 (resized).jpg20180121_010013 (resized).jpg

Cant tell when playing... it does look like planks but is just surface scratches in clear.....20180121_011821 (resized).jpg20180121_012153 (resized).jpg

I just changed the pinballs 200 or so ganes ago and they are pretty rough already...... so something in the game does damage them rather quickly....

Mine throws the ball straight into the wireform in front of the phone eject. It hits exactly where the cross piece is welded across the rails. I wonder if that is causing damage to the balls and then playfield? Anyone else’s doing that?
I’ve turned the power right down to it but still happening.

Your scoop needs bent down so it dont hit that

Thanks. Only had it for 24 hrs or so. Previous owner said to me that it was designed to slow down the ball. Didn’t seem correct to me.

Lol.... yea not supposed to hit the wireform

Keep turning the phone eject power down until the ball doesn't go airborne.

Absolutely not correct. Lower eject power is more effective at slowing the ball properly.

I’ve turned the power right down and it was still hitting it. I will adjust the scoop so it misses.

Million thanks for the advice!

First of all, this was not JJP:s fault - I had to carry the pin downstairs and I had disconnected these connectors and it seems I did not do a through job in putting them back: 1) the connector in the backbox apparently had missed some pins - it is just a pain to put the connector back there, the spot is tight! And 2) also the connector at the coin door apparently was reversed as I first had sound only in the other headphone speaker. I turned it around and now its working beautifully. I took some pics - this is the orientation of the connectors that work in my pin, in case anyone needs them for reference.

Connector2 (resized).JPG

Connector1 (resized).JPG

Ive got an led out in my phone, #17 lower right. Blank in test mode. Is there a fix for this?

Definitely bend the scoop down as per advice above, I went through this a few weeks ago, tried various scoop eject power settings but in the end it was just the scoop bending backwards over time. I believe the steel isn't thick enough because a day or 2 later I had to bend it down again! It's really easy to bend, no tools required.

I can't begin to tell you how many threads I read where I look up toward heaven and say "Thank God I'm not OCD"

Now mind you I am a bit of a perfectionist when it comes to my own work so I understand that what is seen can't be unseen. I am also acutely aware that if one has the OCD gene, things will just eat at you until it consumes your every thought.

I'm just not sure pinball is the best hobby for those that are OCD.

I will have to check this. My DialedIn only has sound on one side of my headset. I have been focused on other minor issues so nes to check this next. Thanks for the info!

I agree.

I understand the disappointment he may feel value- wise, but it doesn't affect the fun of the game.

I couldn't even see any scratches unless the light reflection was directly over it, knowing what I was looking for.

You need to bend the scoop down slightly until it does not hit the wire form.

I think I give up on getting theater magnet working consistently. Some new observances. All balls in machine not equal. Some that work well at -80; others don’t. -110 seems to be about the best compromise for me. However, now on almost any setting, fast direct hits up the theater sometimes go straight through. Magnet doesn’t catch it in time. Optos seem to work fine. Could the magnet coil be weak?

I guess it is something I live with as I haven’t been able to get in touch with JJP during a time I can be near my machine. Luckily it doesn’t greatly affect game play.

It's hard to tell from a video, but your scratches look fainter than what I'm seeing on my pf.

I think the industry is the way it is because many people just suck it up. If greater quality or service was demanded of the companies now making pins, we'd see a change. Especially if we pulled away from giving them our money.

But the fact so many people just "take it", gives them the license to turnout games with a plethora of issues.

Sure, the scratches on DI probably are par for the course to some, but it's unlike anything I've seen on any 90s game that has 20+ years of play on it.

And that's where we are. Just making excuses or rolling over so they can maximize profits and make these game on the cheap.

Cheers!

Trust me i dont like it but i dont think its out of the ordinary for the most part . Now if the art started getting damaged id be concerned but u cant see the scratches unless under ideal conditions. Seems to just be in the first layer of clear. Id also bet that its bc all the magnet action thst do has. The balls can stop on a dime and reverse direction when magnets are active which will cause scratchs .

This is a good observation,I don't believe there has been a game with magnets that are so powerful and used so offen and I would not want to see what they can do on high power,this could be the cause of the scratches,I dont even believe jjp had an idea of this,I had these scratches on my early le and my distro was kind enough to replace it with a new one and I looked at the new playfield and it was perfect and I installed new pinball life super shiney balls and quess what ,ya game looked just like the old one in a few dozen plays those magnets are crazy

Awesome and you are welcome. Glad you got it going and that’s great you posted up these pics for other that may need to know how the orientation goes on that plug.

Got my game just days ago. I have a playfield protector installed from the dealer and it covers the magnets. The balls are beaten up anyway and the PP has got tiny scratches all over. My guess is the inner sides of the scoop under the phone, they look really sharp and the ball hit the edges at high speed. Could also be the auto-launcher. I'm changing balls now to see if the stock ones are too soft.

It happens with different pinballs from other manufacturers. These scratches are totally normal. It happens on every pinball machine. Metal pinball vs wood, it will scratch not sure why as this comes as such a surprise. There is a pretty clear distinction in most pinball machines between normal wear and manufacturer defect.

Nah it's not normal. I've had 2 NIB's, GB pro ( an early one so no ghosting luckily ) which doesn't have any of these scratches, and DI which had deep scratches near the flippers after only 3 or 4 games. Swapped the balls, no more scratches. JJP balls either already damaged or are soft and got damaged in the machine. 500 plays now, 4 with JJP balls scratching the playfield, and 496 with stern balls causing zero damage.

I've always assumed that all pinballs were made from the same factory with minor differences in quality based on type of ball ordered. Are the balls outsourced out of the country or made in the US?

So then how do you explain this same problem happening with different pinballs from different manufacturers. I have owned many sterns and used the supplied pinballs from them and the scratches still happen. Shine a bright light from up by the trans light with no other lights on in the room I would bet you have scratches. That’s the thing you can’t see them at all unless lighting conditions are a certain way.

The theater magnet has become a pia. Way too erratic. It should never drop it sdtm, but some times it will. They need to fix the magnet behavior in the next code release. Either it throws it up and around or the qed guy needs to move to deflect it coming down. There should not be a need for any other behavior. The adjustments don't seem to hold. I know it's random, but if that is the way it supposed to be, why have a setting at all. It has nothing to do with the mylar over it.

This was an issue with twd prison magnet, but you can hit the flippers, it will pulse the magnet and throw it so it doesn't go sdtm.

I can't, I can only relay my experience with DI balls, and other UK owners who all got machines at the same time and were scared shitless that the clearcoat hadn't cured....then we changed the balls and lived happily ever after.

Lol ok cool well I will try some stern pinballs in my DI but would be surprised if it helps. Anyway glad it worked out for you.

So... this is NOT a paid advertisement :eye roll towards the haters:. Now that we got that out of the way. I wanted to share my first ever experience with Pinstadium lights. The package came well prepared and organized. I did about 10 minutes of phone help with Dialed In because it’s just a tad more complex than plug and play but easy enough for someone who has 0 mechanical ability. With that said. Here are 2 photos in 100% dark room. 1st is with 75% blue and 100% white. The second is 100% white settings. AEnjoy! This is definitely a top three mod for me now going into the future behind pdi glass and a color dmd. It looks even better in person!

48541E2C-4167-478B-86BB-83E3A703F285.jpeg
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What does it hook to for the power source? I saw a youtube vid where it flashes in concert with the flashers and did NOT like that, but thinking of replacing the massive number of light towers to light a WoZ for dark rooms with this instead...

Pic of dile in dark room.... no extra lighting needed imo and its one the best out if the box lit pins ever imo. The inserts and gi can be turned up more if needed also. 99c3c70ad655591607f6c0468fac25e24534a234 (resized).jpg

Stock DILE is like the SUN compared to stock WoZ.

What are you, like 12?

Looks nice thanks for sharing pics.I want to give these a try but am a little iffy on the installation. There aren’t any good tutorials or installation videos.

Maybe it’s your camera, but the “on” picture washes out the drone and bob lights compared to the “off” pic. I suspect it would wash out other insert lights too. I much prefer accent lighting where it is dark and not putting a spotlight on the entire play field. The insert lights on the game really pop and when you shine a light on them, the effect is lost.