EDIT: If you had your FB post deleted and were lucky enough to get a screen shot before post it here for posterities sake. If you were banned and want to vent this is the place. - End Edit

I shared Stern Pinball's facebook page about their aftermarket add on's and congratulated them on the move to start selling them. I followed with a statement of not going after the other 3rd party market people so they don't alienate themselves. And it was deleted. I reposted it and it was deleted and I was banned. I just bought a $5,000 machine and helped them by sharing the post on our groups pinball page and I get banned? Was this worth a facebook ban? Here is the post (yes it has a typo):

SternPage.jpg

I guess I'm not either as I heard they were like social media nazis. It is swell that I can still share their stuff though.

Thanks! I hope it isn't permanent. I own a company with a facebook page and I would NEVER delete my customers posts unless there was some moral issue i.e. racist or threatening remarks.

Was your ban temporary?

So you have a self imposed ban then. I like it

Tigerlaw, Have I ben banned from the "All Pinball" section?

I disagree with the few post saying Facebook is just a marketing site. It is first and foremost a social networking site to keep up with friends and family. It is only in facebooks recent history that business pages have become very popular as the facebook users like to interact with the businesses they like and share these experiences with their friends. I own a business and we have a facebook page. Our customers leave us ratings as well as ask us questions. We answer them all and never delete a one of them. It is commonly know in the business world not to delete or alter user interactions on sites like these as to the damage it does to your reputation. This post and all of these interactions just go to prove that it is a correct theroy as well. Most sites such as Yelp locks the business from doing such stupid things and all of them encourage businesses to post answers back to the customers leaving the questions/complaints/compliments.

I know RobT. I had to do it though. I know they monitor this site and they pissed me off. Now they get to pay with a little hit to their reputation. If I see Gary at IAAPA next month I plan on telling him as well!

I am too! Very much so!

Yeah, I'm not hiding it. The title and original post is pretty straight forward. They don't value customer feedback. My comment wasn't negative towards them. It congratulated them on the initial idea then states not to go after other 3rd party people as it would alienate themselves. Now they are alienating themselves. I'll think long and hard before giving Gary Stern more money. Each person they piss off is a potential $5,000 to $8,000 sale for them or their distributors. I'm still going to enjoy my machine I just purchased but it will be a long time before I purchase another from them. I'll be looking at the Hobbit or Pat Lawlor's new game before I look at Stern. (Honestly JJP is kind of pissy too. Having a Mod take down Aurich's image of a Hobbit machine that was clearly just a mock up of what he would have liked to have seen)

Funny Blondetall. I didn't think about it as a Mod Request title.

I do get it: Deleting posts and questions on social media is a known No No in the corporate advertising world. They are practicing it and not repsonding to questions and comments as is the best business practice. I just made my post where it is permanent and can't be deleted. I now know how many other people have been banned for silly things as well really stressing the point that businesses shouldn't delete post but respond to them. My business, and any normal business, would have responded to a post like mine similar to this: Thanks for the message _insert name here__. Stern is excited to offer these new aftermarket products as we know how people like to personalize their machines. We also value the other modification makers you referenced as well and think most are doing a great job. However if someone does infringe on a copyright we would unfortunately need to protect it. Thanks for the feedback and hope you enjoy your next Stern pinball!

Oh, and I was in the middle of sending them a message detailing the thougt process much further when I was banned and the message could no longer be sent. I dont' even have a message them option any longer. I'll probably find their corporate email today and send one as well.

double post

I could (and will eventually) but right now I'm not. If I have the money to buy another pin in the next few months you can bet I'll be looking at JJP or Dutch before Stern at this point in time. That is in no way in Stern's best interest. If the dozen or so other people that have mentioned being banned (there are a lot more that have not posted here) do the same thing then Stern has an issue. If it is a killer title you are right. As upset as I am I would consider it but look at Mustang (or any mediocre title that didn't sell well). If people like me, and the other banned users, are on the fence do they buy it or look elsewhere? Even a few percentage points of the high end toys we play with add up to a lot of money. Ulitmately, I would like Stern to stop these communist era practices and realize that social media is just that, social. Interact with your customers and fans and make them feel apart of your business and as if they have an influence with what you are producing. At least JJP lets people know what is up with their titles and looks at feedback and such as the process rolls along. Some suggestions they can use and others they can't. As pissy as they can be they are at least interactive with their customers.

I see your point. Wasn't my intention with it. I was refering to the other companies that send out C&D letters like they are going out of style. The ones everyone complains about when someone makes a part to fix a game that isn't currently being made. Then they get a C&D letter anyway because the company wants the right to do it later but, as we all know, they wont.

Edit: I obviously could have done a better job with the wording and was trying to message them more details about it when the ban hit. The message could not be sent after that.

I feel ya. I don't really have anything for or against that machine though. I just used it as an example of title that didn't sell well.

Edit: Off topic here but I hear that the LE's play better than the pros. I haven't played one to test the therory.

Is that better?

I've screen shot the entire post up to this point in time. It is about 20 images. If the posts disappear I'll post them up here in the official Delete This Stern! thread.

Warning it is long - Sorry. So many people were complaining about posts being deleted I had to go ahead and post it for posterities sake

There is way too many post to go through and see what is being deleted. If you want to read them before Stern redacted them here is what I have. It isn't perfect and at the end I miss a few

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Glad to see you go and feel the need to let us know. Do you have any idea what is going on on their page right now? This is a fairly big issue with over 150 post in a little over an hour. We care as this company needs to learn and get into the 18th century from their 17th century thinking. Al Gore will role over in his grave after he dies when he learns how Stern is treating his precious internet he invented.

Now if anyone wants to see what was posted up to this point there it is. I'm done and getting back to life today. Enjoy if you posted there and now are banned today.

Boy could we get a ton of discussion on that topic!

The main topic here is Stern deleting posts and banning people but it's hard not to discuss what the topics are they are deleting and banning people from. I understand your point but I'd rather have it in my game room over a The Walking Dead and I'm a HUGE fan of that show. I'd be self concious evertime friends and family visited and looked at it over a Whoa Nellie. (Not that I'll have either at this point)

You hit the nail on the head Tiger. And how apropos that the next day they post "Whoa Nellie" that gets a shit storm of negative comments from the sexism crowd. There was no way I couldn't screen shot it and keep it for posterities sake. This thread is the perfect repository for Stern FB screen shots before they get redacted. I got three personal thank you's from people for doing it. Maybe if I have time I'll go count how many posts were deleted out of the thread that I captured. Might be an interesting number to learn. People on the FB page were getting so pissed off that their posts were being deleted in this day and age which is why I created this thread. Stern signed up for a "social media" account and expects people to treat it like it is thier personal property. That isn't how social media works. My hope is that as they monitor Pinside (and we know they do) they will learn how much they are turning off a crowd of loyal customers in a hobby that needs more, not less, of them. All it takes is for enough of their employees to keep suggesting to Gary they need to change their habits. I'd be willing to bet a few have but met with great resistance. Now they can have evidence that we are pissed off when they bring it up.

You wouldnt sale many pinballs than wood you?

It isn't an advertising outlet. It is a "social media" page. Designed for interactions between businesses and fans or customers. Their reaction is always a "head in the sand" approach. Plus I've messaged them as well and had no response. In fact I've sent them emails over the past few years on many a subject and have never been graced with a reply. Thanks though.

That's great but how does that relate to a company deleting comments and questions then banning users? We're not talking about users that said bad things but some that just asked questions about code updates. Also, If a company is filling up your news feed its an easy fix to turn off notifications from them or simply unlike them.

The Facebook page is where you are supposed to ask things of a company. Stern has no other recourse to do so reliably. Please don't say email as they don't respond to those either. One phone call from me does not show them they are doing something wrong. Many post on here from people saying they were wronged might.

First, this isn't just about me. This is about Stern's Facebook practices. I know at the beginning of the thread it is more slanted to asking if I personally should have been banned. I could go change it but that is revisionist history. The main point is, should stern be deleting and banning innocuous comments from customers.

Second, have you guys not read my earlier posts? It is against all social media advertising protocols to act the way they do on their page. The pages are there to talk about their products as is all business pages. However, most businesses would never delete and ban a customers comment. They would respond to all questions and comments in a timely professional manner. The trail of comments is there for any customer to see that they respond and care about what all of their customers think. So if you think Facebook is nothing but an advertising outlet for corporations you are sadly misinformed.

Vid. That is a good analogy. I appreciate the point of view. Thanks for not telling me to "move along" lol. I don't treat our FB page the way your company does and will not. The big distinction is your company communicates to the person in violation of your policies where as Stern has never communicated with me and seems to never communicate to the others complaining here. They don't even respond to emails I've sent asking questions or suggesting themes etc... I promote them by sharing their posts on our groups pinball page all the time and buy their products. Most of the banned users are customers as well. Stern just needs to communicate, just like your company seems to do, and make their customers feel appreciated even if they feel the need to delete posts. I still contend that deleting posts is a terrible idea and there are many articles in the corporate world that back it up. I've also been to seminars at conventions that teach what I'm talking about. I'm sure there are a few that back up the front yard theory as well. Ultimately and hopefully Stern will soften their stance and start communicating.

You didn't but there are a bunch of posts that alude to that theory. Sorry I lumped you with the others.

Thanks and it's hard not to veer off track and discuss what the Stern topic is that is causing the deletes and bans. I really didn't want others to get together and stop buying from Stern but show that I, and others like me, might think twice about buying from Stern because of this. Why, when JJP is making really cool looking machines and cutting into their market, would they alienate potential buyers of their goods? It makes no business sense to me and their facebook tactics are short sighted instead of looking at the big picture. IMHO

Ding Ding Ding - We have a winner!!

That is a no win question.
Since Stern can't confirm or deny they thought of it, we will never know.

"Whoa Nellie" Vid. You can't possibly believe Stern has a list of every possible theme ever created known to man? I.e. Janitor Man - Ramp shot is clean up on aisle 9, a scoop shot that unclogs the toilet and starts mop head multiball. I know that analogy is way overboard but there is no way Stern knows it all.

Edit: The analogy above was a joke and I know it isn't a liscensed theme. - The more I reread your post to me the more I get offended. I don't like the tone of "your not good enough to come up with a theme they haven't thought of" in your post. Plus it isn't relative to my topic of this thread in the least bit. All theme's don't have to be Movie's or TV shows. Asking me what possible ideas I could have is insulting and is below you Vid! For your information I know a couple of independent film producers. Many films are shot and produced then brought to a major film company for distribution. So I do know of two or three movies at the moment that Stern has no idea exists as the producers haven't even approached a movie company to distribute it. I also am privie to their TV show sizzle reels they made to pitch to multiple TV companies like Discovery and HBO.

No No your point is fine

Ok, again, this has nothing to do with my topic and is still on the condescending side. My whole point is that Stern needs to respond to, and not ignore, customers. Their practices are barbaric in today's world. As I stated, I've been to many education classes on business protocol in the social media world. The only thing Stern has done right was set up a Facebook page. Their management of it is terrible. Every interaction a prospective customer has with a company needs to be positive, helpful or informative in some way. Negative is NEVER an acceptable customer reaction. I'll repeat it, NEGATIVE is NEVER acceptable!! Will there be negative reactions? Sure, no one or no company can avoid it all together. But it doesn't mean you go out there and create the negative reactions yourself. That is plain stupid. Negative reactions should be treated as opportunites to show off how much you care about their concerns and how good your customer service is. Even if the negative problem doesn't get fixed it can be abated by good communication.

This is long but I've cut the unimportant parts that didn't pertain to this discussion. Stern needs to read this! It is from an article I found on connecting with customers in both social and standard mediums.

14 Proven Ways to Connect With Customers

Today, there are more ways than ever to connect with customers. ...
Data integration is often underestimated and poorly implemented, taking time and resources.

1. Survey your customers.

2. Use newsletters.

3. Blog. "One of the best ways to connect with customers is by blogging," says Deborah Sweeney, CEO, MyCorporation.com, an incorporation and trademarking service. "If you actively keep up a quality blog, not only will your customers read your blog, but they will respond to your blog," she notes. "This creates a positive flow of communication"--and helps build customer loyalty.

4. Pick up the phone.

5. Go visit.

6. Respond to email. "At our company, we make it our goal to respond to customer emails within five minutes, and the response we receive from our customers is usually something like 'Wow, that was fast' or 'Fastest response I've ever received. Thanks so much," says Giancarlo Massaro, the cofounder of ViralSweep, which provides businesses tools to create giveaways on their website. "How has this helped us? People love amazing customer service and in turn have been referring people to our service, all because of our customer service."

7. Send a personalized note or a postcard.

8. Be active on Twitter and Facebook. "One of the best ways to connect with customers is through social media, such as Facebook and Twitter," says Ian Aronovich, cofounder and president, GovernmentAuctions.org, a site that compiles and provides information about government auctions of seized and surplus merchandise from all over the country.

"With social media, you can reach out to your customers at any moment rather than wait for customers to send you emails or phone calls with feedback," Aronovich says. Use your company's Facebook fan page or Twitter account to "engage your followers and keep conversations going. Social media can also be used as a form of customer service, where company representatives can directly answer customer questions and concerns," he says.

“It's critical to have a social media listening post to quickly respond to each issue that arises," notes Chuck Wall, founder and CEO, Customer CEO Consulting. "You may not be able to solve their specific problem, but don't ignore them. They will give you credit for listening and acknowledging their situation."

9. Use Instagram.

10. Offer webinars.

11. Empower salespeople.

12. Provide exceptional customer service. "One of the most powerful tools an organization has to connect with its customers is its employee base," says Rick DeMarco, managing director, West Coast Operations, Inward Strategic Consulting, a marketing, branding and positioning firm."Every interaction between a customer and employee, whether that is pre-sale, the actual sales process, after sales support or billing, provides an opportunity to either add or detract from the equity of your brand and company," DeMarco says. "Significant empirical evidence exists that makes a direct connection between employee engagement and satisfaction and customer satisfaction and loyalty." So one of the best ways to connect and engage with customers, he says, is to "turn your employees into company ambassadors and brand advocates who deliver on your brand promise and business strategy at every single customer touch point."

13. Go mobile.

14. Monitor review sites. "Whether it's Yelp, TripAdvisor or Angie's List, find out what customers are saying about your business [on review sites]," says Lisa Parkin, president of Social Climber, LLC, a social media consultancy.

"Responding to customer reviews on these popular sites shows that your company is aware of any problems and is willing to fix them," Parkin says. However, she urges caution when replying to negative comments. Instead of being defensive or picking a fight, try to understand and offer to fix the problem or provide an inducement for the customer to try your product, service or establishment again.

Jennifer Lonoff Schiff is a business and technology writer and a contributor to CIO.com. She also runs Schiff & Schiff Communications, a marketing firm focused on helping organizations better interact with their customers, employees and partners.

I'm cool with people complaining about JJP deleting posts here as well. I don't interact with them much to know if they are as bad as Stern or not. The big issue is if either of them are doing it they should stop. It is bad business no matter how many people say "it is their page and they can do what they want". I wan't to keep buying pinball machines in the future and if they treat customers this way they won't be selling them but for a few more years. (please don't reply to this and say a few is hard set to 3 and I'm crazy to think they would close in three years. You know what I mean) It will start slow and build and when it hits critical mass it will be too late for them to realize what they've done and fix it.

You seem to know a lot of people there. I nominate you to call since you think the phone is the best way to get them to see how many people the've upset. With your gravitas they'll listen more than if just I call.

I think what "I'm trying to accomplish" is fairly well stated in most of my posts. It is bad business practice plain and simple. It will catch up with them eventually. There are a limited number of pinball purchasers in the world and banning them and ignoring them is not in Sterns best interest. Anyone that thinks it is has a proverbial screw loose in my opinion.

If I bow out as you suggest then Stern (and from what I'm learning JJP) will keep up their arcane social practices. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. All of the people who like Stern banning people and posting to let it go will just propagate the practice further. It's a free country and and
anyone can feel free to keep disagreeing with me here but it's not helpful to the cause if you really agree with it.

I also find it humorous how many people like to throw in snide comments about me either blatantly or hidden in condescending innuendo. They are not helpful, but hurtful, and truly show who they are hidden behind that keyboard. I do not need to defend my age, my business acumen or intelligence. I have a clear point and that is Stern should stop doing what they are doing.

Exactly, how many does that extrapolate to over a year? The deleted post number must be astronomical. In the hundreds this year as they deleted massive amounts last week alone. Let's look back at our marketing lesson again shall we:

“It's critical to have a social media listening post to quickly respond to each issue that arises," notes Chuck Wall, founder and CEO, Customer CEO Consulting. "You may not be able to solve their specific problem, but don't ignore them. They will give you credit for listening and acknowledging their situation."

Be sure to cover your study guides and read the chapter as we will be having a test next class.

I can understand a permanent ban for the extreme cases of malfeasance. Threats, Racism etc.... no room anywhere for that sort of stuff.

You are right! That is a great testament for the car. That is publicity you can't buy. Where in the world did you get the numbers of deleted post from Ford?

Also I should mentioned above about banned users for extreme malfeasance would also extend to posts.

Now knowing a company would delete posts for extreme malfeasance Ford has sooo many more people to deal with. 187 times as many people in fact. Stern has 15,000 likes to Fords main page of 2,800,000 likes. Out of that many people 25,000 posts (if correct) is less than 1% of their likes in a year. Stern is probably already surpassed 1% of their page likes with post deletes in the last few months. I agree with the post above that car fanatics are probably WAY more diverse than pinheads and there are probably more people who are likely to make threatening, racist, sexist or vile offensive posts than we have. At least I'd like to think so although I know we have them too. (Like the people who made the YouTube videos I used to enjoy before they got bad)

Also, thanks for bringing Ford up as an example. They do exactly what they are supposed to do. They respond to Facebook fans and have open dialogues with them making them feel appreciated and building brand loyalty.

image.jpg

OMG, how did I miss this comment? I guess it's because I'm a pinhead and not as smart as a car driver. Wait, I do have a state issued license so I am smart.

Doesn't matter what the comments are and who made up a rule that complaints and suggestions are the only factor to get responses? Find one from Stern on their page interacting with a fan/owner. The point is Ford interacts with their facebook users making them feel good and building brand loyalty.

I never said I would call or email them about this issue specifically. If you are trying to back me into a corner asking it go ahead. Vid insisted on a phone call or email approach. I've stated earlier they have never responded to any email from me or others I've spoken to. You can feel free to try your hand at it but I won't bang my head on that wall again. Also, according to Vid you can call Gary directly and enjoy his frankness.

I'm not saying facebook is a way of getting parts and service. I wouldn't try to get parts and service from a social media site. And I highly doubt Ford is paying high school kids to say "wow" and "great" or whatever. Stern obviously has someone reading every post so they can delete them. Not much harder to type a few things to their fans as well.

I think you are just plain "special" and don't have to be lit to make post like that. As much as I might be dissagreeing with some people here they are here talking about it. Not posting a snide comment and running away. Andy BTW, it isn't their web page it is their social media facebook page.

What is sad is that there could be. A little interaction could make it much better. As it stands it is just a glorified web page with stuff they don't want to put on their webpage directly.

If that is all they do is post day in and day out and start each thing with awesome it wouldn't take much skill. You do realize that is just from one section of one thread on their page right? I'm sure I can go find some other more meaningful interactions if you really make me do it. But the intereactions, however worded, prove my point anyway. Ford is responding and Stern isn't

Well I couldn't help but go look to see and the first Ford Facebook page I went to was their Mustang page. It has 8,036,000 likes. WOW! Add that to the 2,800,000 from the main page and the numbers are getting astronomical. If you add just those two pages together the 25,000 deleted posts are just .0023% of their likes. Look what their high school students can post:

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I didn't need to scroll long amounts of posts to find it. Their high school students are posting meaningful messages to their followers on the first post I saw! They didn't even delete the post from the person saying they didnt' like the shirts. Stern would have that down in seconds. Here is what Ford did instead:

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I appologize for the condescending tone of this post in advance. I'm just so tired of the people trying so hard to prove I'm wrong and that Stern should have free reign to delete, not respond and ban at will on a social media site they chose to participate in. Of course they have the right to do it but is still is bad business!

EDIT: I took out some of the condescending post at the begining. I don't like revisionist history but I thought it was rather arrogant and insulting so I removed it. Sorry!

That sounds good but if that were true you and the others would not have been trying to point out things that made my theory incorrect. Using different techniques of condescension or blatantly implying that I'm stupid and wrong. I fell prey to being condescending in my last post but honestly had one too many to drink last night when I made it. I've tried to keep my posts above board as much as possible.

For you to say "It's just Facebook" is a statement from someone who doesn't understand the importance of social media today. Business, and the world we conduct it in, is changing. It's not just Facebook, but a myriad of similar sites, and Stern will use these same practices on any of them if they aren't already. (I have no idea if they are utilizing the other social sites as of this post) The practices are giving their customers negative experiences and I am obviously one of them. How can a business think it is a good idea to give negative experiences to their customers on a daily basis? The big picture is that pinball doesn't have much room for it. How many customers can you piss off before your sales figures hurt. Ford obviously values the posts from their customers and responds in kind just as I showed above. Can Ford make that lady like the shirts? No. But they responded and asked if she had seen the rest of the collection. It doesn't fix the lady's problem of not liking the shirts but she knows she's been heard. Stern doens't need 25 full time employees to maintain a page with just 15,000 likes. They already pay someone to monitor it or else how could they delete every posts and ban users. In less time than it takes to anaylize every post on the worthiness of staying or not they could have just typed a response to those people.

My ban has been lifted. The crusade wasn't about my ban being lifted though. Stern really needs to get on the bandwagon of how to operate in today's world.

Kids are always looking for a new place that their parents won't be able to monitor their activities. As I said before, most companies are moving to those sites and apps as well. Stern might have, I don't know. If they haven't they should and they should change their practices while doing so. It isnt' just a facebook thing dude. It is the entire social media thing. Facebook just happens to be the medium we were discussing the problem with and the one Stern is doing the wrong thing with. Your oppinion of why anyone would use it isn't relevant. Obviously 15,000 people want to interact with them on it.

C'mon man, the point was how rapidly things are changing and they aren't even close now to the way business has been conducted in the past 300 years. The past 10 years has been a renaissance of how business works.

Not even remotely similar.

Yes I've checked to see if and when I would be reinstated. We do a lot with our local pinball group (and all the other nearby groups around our area) on facebook keeping up with each other and all the local tournaments and games for sale. Tons of great information gets dissemenated to all us "kids" on facebook.

Well wow. There is just so much wrong here where would you start? Was the plan to confuse people?

I'm quite sure Ford values each customer and understands how each interaction with someone is as important as is the one for the sale of the car. Your company may toy with customers and pander to them and talk about them being idiots but Ford doesn't. It is a professionaly run corporation.

As for the facebook comment, you obviously want to keep proving your lack of understanding of social media and all of its uses both personal and professional. I am far from a facebook fan and really only use it to keep up with this hobby I love and a few friends and family. The point is while you might not like it and use it, that doesn't mean the rest of the world does not like it and use it. It is there and being used and Stern is utilizing it in a poor fashion. Once again I want to see Stern utilize it in a fashion that promotes customer loyalty not to turn them away. (This goes for any social media not just facebook)

No, your not missing it here. Your just confusing the two as if they are related. I was saying what I personally use facebook for most of the time and since we are discussing Stern you thought they were tied together. Our local group does a lot of communicating with each other via facebook and it is a great medium for it. We have about 90 members all talking about pinball, collections, tournaments, repair etc... Even with the ban I was able to share Stern information with the other members if I chose to do it. My concern is that Stern is upsetting people for no good reason when it is so easy to keep them either happy or at least complacent. Why go out of the way to upset customers as a business model?

You are probably correct unless the magical person at Stern that can affect change reads this. I'm looking for the power of the group to hold Stern to a higher standard. I dont want to be the person on the sidelines at the Boston Tea Party laughing and saying "What do those guys think they will accomplish throwing that tea overboard. What a waste of good tea."

Now that is funny!

I agree with you here as well. It is just how rapid business has changed in a wholesale way that is amazing. Most other changes have taken centuries and or decades to take full affect and this is happening so rapidly its crazy. Businesses are starting to adapt and things are changing before they finish adapting. We're really talking about the same thing and I think whatever the original point was is now lost in this.

And, Vid, as much as you might have me wanting to pull my hair out some days on this thread I commend you for staying and discussing your points. You are a stalwart of the forum and your repair series are second to none. I am amazed at your knowledge on other subjects as well such as photography. (I believe it was you discussing photography skills on the thread where the other idiots were bashing the poor girls posing for the calendar. ) I truly don't understand the people who feel the need to announce they will drain a thread after they make the post saying how much they think your post is stupid. It's kind of akin to a kid grabbing his toys and going home.

Thanks for the laugh! Are you the one that posted that pic in the "Robins Gone" thread?

Why wouldn't they? Anyway we've established it's their page and they can do what they want. It just so happens doing what they want is not a good idea. Obviously they can't respond to every post but they delete posts regularly and it goes against business and marketing principles to do so. I don't know many business schools teaching business 101 that teaches students its a good idea to make customers upset on a daily basis.

As to why would FB give people the ability to delete and ban: Threats, Racism, Porn....

ROFL

That is a good point. There sure is no harm in trying to help them help themselves though. And if Stern really operates under the "eh, not so much" theory then whole hearted Screw Them is in order. If that is the case then the boutique manufacturers will gain steam fairly quickly as Stern continues down a path of destruction. I don't think that is the case though. Stern is just mis guided in how to operate a social media site and are probably patting themselves on the back that they have one and have 15,000 followers at the moment.

Apparently the two of you haven't read most of the thread. Just the first post or two then post back here. The main point is that Stern has a social media page on Facebook. They delete and ban users on a daily basis. This is a known mistake in the corporate advertising/marketing world. We have a hobby with a limited numbers of customers. Pissing them off is not in anyones best interest. Your's, mine, Sterns, no ones! If they sell a couple fewer pins each time then they will make up the difference in price increases. If they piss off enough people it could reach a tipping point which, again, is no good for anyone.

You have no idea what my qualifications are and "developing/designing/budgeting/engineering/innovating........pinball machines" has nothing to do with this thread nor do I have aspirations to do any of it.

Keeping it clean and running a communist state are two different things lol. Vid, you and I have discussed this ad nauseam at this point haven't we?

I don't think I posted critically and I reposted really because I didn't think it got posted the first time. I was wondering if they really deleted it or if I didnt hit the post button on the phone correctly. I was unaware of how bad their reputation was about it till I reposted it and was told by someone that they deleted it on purpose and would probably ban me now. Sure enough within minutes the prediction came true. I have never seen a professional organization run a page in this manner and it is stunning how many people accept it as ok behavior. I have explained how it isn't in acceptable norms of today's marketing world and shown great examples of how a page should be run. Too many people are just jumping on the "sour grapes" theory without an understanding of what is truly the topic here.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Great analogy.

Crusade is a strong word. I was obviously upset at the begining and I admit that. Even though I'm not upset and I'm not banned anymore I'm still wanting Stern to change. My opinion of their procedures is unaffected by that.

This is just plumb ass crazy for all of us to accept as acceptable behaviour in todays world. Social media is not supposed to be used like that. Their website is supposed to be used like that. I guess if 99.99% of all pinball purchasers from collectors to operators to distributors who get posts deleted or banned think that way then so be it. I'm wrong and will say so. But you said it yourself "They don't care if they hurt your feelings" There is no way and in no world where that is a good business practice. One less purchase of a machine hurts us all as collectors/operators/distrubitors. The next game will be 2 less, and the next 4 and so forth and so forth. Since engaging people on social media sites makes them feel connected to your company Stern's goal of selling more pinball machines would be even easier.

Well that sure would be nice

So they contacted you and didn't ban you. I disagree with the deleted posts but two giants steps ahead of Stern. They followed up with you from the contact as well. That is great too. You won't purchase from them again so this proves my point of Stern shouldn't be pissing people off. You can make fun my assertion but you just proved it. One less customer for them to sell to and they did contact you, where as Stern would simply have deleted, ignored and maybe banned you.

If you are a Facebook hater then this point is moot. Move along please. Many companies engage their customers in meaningful ways on Facebook. Your experience with it does not equal the rest of the worlds experience with it. Hundreds of millions of people use it for all sorts of reasons.

You can't change what you don't asked to be changed. Letting it go is not helpful to anyone. If you don't like reading about it then fine. Stern is not acting in a known way to achieve customer loyalty and sense of ownership in their company. They instead are acting in a known way to alienate themselves from their once loyal base. They could sell even more machines if they changed. So please quit telling them via this page the way they act is ok. No one is asking for a Stern boycot or anything but just to let them know they aren't acting in a professional manner.

Boy has then been discussed. You are just trying to back people into a corner but it won't work. Censorship is nesessary as we have discussed earlier. Racism, Hatred, Threats of Violence... the list is long and once again we've discussed it. There are many posts on pinside complaining of pinside and of pinside moderators. They don't delete these unless they fit the criteria discussed.

And the people who agreed with me at the begining of the thread. They, unlike you guys, made comments and moved along. Some of you seem very intent on coming back to say let it go or go give youself a circle jerk.... I have to ask why any of you don't let it go? None of the tones of my posts were mean natured. I simply asked for an opinion if my posts should have been deleted and me banned. I didn't go off on a rant. There sure seem to be a lot of rants saying I'm on a rant. My point is so clear and I restate it over and over and over. Stern is not following known marketing strategies for increasing customer base and customer loyalty. Plain and simple. All the let it go speech is not refuting it nor very helpful. If you want to me to "let it go" follow your own requests please as saying it once was enough. And before you say "why do you keep coming back to say something about our posts" its because it's my thread so of course I'm going to keep explaining my position.

Even if you are a contractor now I agree with Arcade. Thanks for your past service! I obviously don't see eye to eye with you on this topic but I do appreciate your sacrifice you made for us.

Well the one you got is awesome! Good luck finding more when you get back!

I would love to play that game to Motley Crue's Kick Start My Heart. It is my ultimate blood pumping song!