(Topic ID: 24704)

Data East speaker noise - ideas for a cure

By roc-noc

11 years ago


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  • 961 posts
  • 218 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by 2x286ps
  • Topic is favorited by 188 Pinsiders

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There are 961 posts in this topic. You are on page 17 of 20.
#801 2 years ago

Got mine today! Will try to install tonight and report back!

#802 2 years ago

It’s here! Now I need to find time to do before and after recordings.

985C5867-DA58-42C4-ADE4-D052959E597E (resized).jpeg985C5867-DA58-42C4-ADE4-D052959E597E (resized).jpeg
#803 2 years ago

Just installed this in my JP today and wow. What a difference! Thank you.

#804 2 years ago

Finally installed in my Laser War. Makes a big difference! Dropped the standing dBs by about 8-10 dBs standing in front of the machine. Definitely recommend.

#805 2 years ago

Unfortunately it is no longer available on the site. Do you know when it will be available again? Thanks

#806 2 years ago
Quoted from jamex:

Unfortunately it is no longer available on the site. Do you know when it will be available again? Thanks

Yes! We have more coming, the size of the order is going to be somewhat dependent on the orders we get from the vendor. I see that you’re in Italy! We dont have a vendor there yet, but we’d be interested in one for sure.

#807 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

Yes! We have more coming, the size of the order is going to be somewhat dependent on the orders we get from the vendor. I see that you’re in Italy! We dont have a vendor there yet, but we’d be interested in one for sure.

Yes I live in Italy, I hope you will be able to find a vendor in Italy, I will still order from the piballlife site because it would be the perfect solution for my JP

#808 2 years ago
Quoted from jamex:

Yes I live in Italy, I hope you will be able to find a vendor in Italy, I will still order from the piballlife site because it would be the perfect solution for my JP

For sure! I’m not familiar with who the larger vendors are in Europe, any favourites to mention?

#809 2 years ago

Got mine installed in R&B. Very easy to install and it did reduce the noise a bunch. I can still hear the buzz but only if I get up close to the speakers. I am happy with the result.

One of the pads was not populated. I don’t remember the designator but it was a small smd ~603 pad in the corner. Is this intentional?

08E67CD3-51C5-4122-B2D9-320370C86085 (resized).jpeg08E67CD3-51C5-4122-B2D9-320370C86085 (resized).jpeg

#810 2 years ago

Is that pin soldered well?

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#811 2 years ago
Quoted from harig:

Is that pin soldered well?
[quoted image]

We triple checked every solder point on each individual board, but I know the occasional one on the through hole might have a slight indentation where the curvature of the pin concaves in and sucked the solder down. However Gotfrogs, please PM me a shot of the board and I’ll take a closer look. Should be fine tho.

Quoted from Gotfrogs:

One of the pads was not populated. I don’t remember the designator but it was a small smd ~603 pad in the corner. Is this intentional?
[quoted image]

Bottom left corner, yes. Was a diode we removed at the very beginning of production. Jeff changed his mind literally 5 boards in. The next run won’t even have the pads. ☺️

#812 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

For sure! I’m not familiar with who the larger vendors are in Europe, any favourites to mention?

The most important sellers in Europe are pu-parts.com, pinball center, best of pinball and ministry of pinball

#813 2 years ago

The board dropped my JP from 61 dB to 55 dB, when it’s just sitting in attract mode. There is still a noticeable hum in a quit house but it is better.

#814 2 years ago

The filter works great and the annoyance I would get from the 60Hz hum is gone. Here is a before and after video. Note, that I didn’t use the section where my DMD buzz kicks in, These old DMDs just buzz and my ears seem to forgive the DMD a lot more than the high pitch hum. Great work.

#815 2 years ago

Following. I would love to buy one of these for my tftc

#816 2 years ago

I'm really bummed to report that this had zero impact on my Frankenstein. To be fair I only did very basic troubleshooting before going down this path since the machine was a recent purchase and I saw this board was in development...so I just waited for it. Reading through this thread it seems the most likely candidate would be the sound board, so I'm going to look at a replacement for that next.

#817 2 years ago
Quoted from slizzap:

I'm really bummed to report that this had zero impact on my Frankenstein. To be fair I only did very basic troubleshooting before going down this path since the machine was a recent purchase and I saw this board was in development...so I just waited for it. Reading through this thread it seems the most likely candidate would be the sound board, so I'm going to look at a replacement for that next.

Has the power supply ever been serviced? There are a few caps on there that are known to fail and in some cases leak and start etching the traces. May be worth checking that out first. It may help some with the noise issue and even if it doesn’t it can ensure your game continues to run well in the future.

On the original sound board it may be time to have the caps replaced on that. It will cost less than any replacement board. Unless there are other parts that have failed that should help.

Nothing will eliminate all the noise but it can be made manageable.

#818 2 years ago

I would like to purchase one of the filters when they are in stock.

#819 2 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Has the power supply ever been serviced? There are a few caps on there that are known to fail and in some cases leak and start etching the traces. May be worth checking that out first. It may help some with the noise issue and even if it doesn’t it can ensure your game continues to run well in the future.
On the original sound board it may be time to have the caps replaced on that. It will cost less than any replacement board. Unless there are other parts that have failed that should help.
Nothing will eliminate all the noise but it can be made manageable.

I agree with all of this, sorry I wasn’t able to help you.

From all the feedback we’ve been getting this seems to be the only case where it was a non-existent result. You may have some other underlying conditions in the game.

Quoted from frakstar:

I would like to purchase one of the filters when they are in stock.

For sure. Keep an eye on this thread or our Instagram and we’ll let people know when the next batch (a big one) is out the door. Also talk to your local vendor, the more of them that approach us, the more we’ll make and get into everyone’s hands that want one.

1 week later
#820 2 years ago

I'm happy to report that after installing the noise filter, I feel like 75% of the nasty hum is gone! I can easily live with the 25% that's left.

Tip/careful: the big plastic sleeve that contains all the wires that goes from the head to the cabinet might push on the new gizmo. Pull the sleeve towards you a little and be careful if you ever lower the head.

#821 2 years ago
Quoted from Bendit:

I'm happy to report that after installing the noise filter, I feel like 75% of the nasty hum is gone! I can easily live with the 25% that's left.
Tip/careful: the big plastic sleeve that contains all the wires that goes from the head to the cabinet might push on the new gizmo. Pull the sleeve towards you a little and be careful if you ever lower the head.

Thanks. Hopefully, these come... Soon? Missed the first batch, unfortunately.

#822 2 years ago

When I installed a White North Retro board in my JP I had some new strange noises during boot-up. I now had buzzing and popping noises. Those noises were not present when booting without the Retro board.

After boot-up the pops an buzzes went away but, the hum was as bad as before. After a couple of exchanges of PMs with ChanceJK, he suggested that the power supply my be a bit flaky and suggested that I try re-capping it.

I just finished the re-capping. Observations/results
* There was still a hum without the White North Retro board installed. Although it was a little less than before.
* With the Retro board installed the Pin booted without pops and buzzing and there is virtually no DE hum.
* I think this is a great product and the customer service was excellent.

Thanks for providing this product and you help.
Phil

#823 2 years ago

Mine arrives this week! Will report back.

2 weeks later
#824 2 years ago

Happy New Year everyone. Hope everyone is doing well and had good holidays.

Is there any update on this new batch yet by chance? Just checking in. Thanks all!

#825 2 years ago
Quoted from Lateralus:

Happy New Year everyone. Hope everyone is doing well and had good holidays.
Is there any update on this new batch yet by chance? Just checking in. Thanks all!

Nothing yet. Still waiting on chips I’m afraid.

4 weeks later
#826 2 years ago

So I finally got to install my Retro Noise Filter. Nothing good to report here. Actually quite bad. The moment I install the filter, my display goes dead. Won't show anything at all. Take the filter out and display is up and running again. Really weird. Anyone any idea?

#827 2 years ago
Quoted from StrangeSubset1:

So I finally got to install my Retro Noise Filter. Nothing good to report here. Actually quite bad. The moment I install the filter, my display goes dead. Won't show anything at all. Take the filter out and display is up and running again. Really weird. Anyone any idea?

Which game are you running it on?

#828 2 years ago
Quoted from radial_head:

Which game are you running it on?

Last Action Hero Data East

#829 2 years ago
Quoted from StrangeSubset1:

So I finally got to install my Retro Noise Filter. Nothing good to report here. Actually quite bad. The moment I install the filter, my display goes dead. Won't show anything at all. Take the filter out and display is up and running again. Really weird. Anyone any idea?

Thats a new one completely. Might want to check your voltages with and without the board and report back. With how simple the board is in its operation, it sounds like your game has a pre-existing condition. Might want to also think about rebuilding your power supply.

#830 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

Thats a new one completely. Might want to check your voltages with and without the board and report back. With how simple the board is in its operation, it sounds like your game has a pre-existing condition. Might want to also think about rebuilding your power supply.

Wouldn't be fun if there aren't new challenges
@ +12V: 12.35
@ -12V: -15.98V
@ +5V: 4.85V

Same voltage with or without the noise filter, plus minus 0.05V

#831 2 years ago
Quoted from StrangeSubset1:

Wouldn't be fun if there aren't new challenges
@ +12V: 12.35
@ -12V: -15.98V
@ +5V: 4.85V
Same voltage with or without the noise filter, plus minus 0.05V

Looks like your 5V is a little low. Has anything been done to your power supply? If nothing else check C2 on the power board. That often goes bad and leaks which can etch the PCB traces under it. I've also seen C7 leak and occasionally C3. I replace all of those. They are the main ones to look at.

#832 2 years ago

I'll check them. Don't think the 5V is low. I tried it with a dedicated PSU as well. Clean 5.05. same results.

#833 2 years ago

5v wouldn’t be a thing on our board anyways, its only working with the +12v. All the other pins are pass thru.

#834 2 years ago

Well, I didn't get my noise reducer because they sold out, but I did try my own buckboost made with the board that this one was based off of with mediocre results.

On my Rocky and Bullwinkle it sent the MPU into a frenzy and disrupted the logic line and made the game go nuts.

On Baywatch, it worked! However after a while, it sent the display into pure chaos and ultimately made it stop working.

Removing the buckboost boards resolved both issues.

Both games were running aftermarket PSUs.

#835 2 years ago

Hey all,

Just my two cents.

Normally the buzz/humming noise is generated from the power supply (bad capacitors) creating feedback in the power feed in turn amplified through the sound board.

Try recapping your power supply board or replacing it with a more modern board. Also recap the sound board at the same time.

This will be a good place to start.

Also a bad ground can cause some buzz/humming as well.

In my Data East Star Wars, I recapped the power supply and then the sound board with very good results.

I ultimately replaced the sound board with a PinSound board and it eliminated the buzz/humming all together but was costly.

PinSound boards are definitely awesome just pricy.

Hope this helps!

#836 2 years ago
Quoted from TheCollector:

Try recapping your power supply board or replacing it with a more modern board.

Bad advice; some new boards generate even more noise than the originals.

#837 2 years ago

This thread has been on-going for 9 years. There are multiple sources of noise and all can contribute. I tend to believe that many of these were noisy since day one. Back then most were probably in noisy arcades where no one noticed and no one cared. As they aged some may have gotten a bit worse but in a home environment people notice.

Some may be aging caps on the sound board, some from aging caps on the power supply, probably some from ground loops, etc. One of the more common sources seems to come from the 12V supply, at least on some games. That is where adding a DC/DC converter has helped on some machines. I've built a few of the adapters (but put them in plastic cases) and for those specific machines (one was a Star Wars) it really helped and cut down the noise to an acceptable level. It just doesn't help for all of the games.

It seems the only sure way to eliminate all the noise is just install a dedicated separate power supply for the sound card. From all the posts I've read that works when everything else has failed.

#838 2 years ago

I've worked on and sold enough new Data East games to confidently say, they did not hum like this when they were new.

#839 2 years ago
Quoted from NYP:

I've worked on and sold enough new Data East games to confidently say, they did not hum like this when they were new.

Proofs that DE is more human than we thought. We older people tend to make weird noises as well

#840 2 years ago

I hate to have riled up a bunch of people in this thread. I'm just posting my results when I tried to do this.

I fixed my noise issue on R&B by using the MeanWell triple output power supply that has been posted here many times, making my own power connector for the board, and tying the new external PSU into the normal ground braid of the game.
https://www.amazon.com/MEAN-WELL-RT-65B-Supply-Triple/dp/B005T7FHCK/ref=sr_1_3

#841 2 years ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Bad advice; some new boards generate even more noise than the originals.

Bad advice, lol

If you don’t check the specs of distortion on a power supply board before installing it then you have no business doing so.

Again I would recommend recapping it.

My opinion, didn’t mean to upset you. I use quality boards that surpass the originals.

#842 2 years ago
Quoted from TheCollector:

Bad advice, lol
If you don’t check the specs of distortion on a power supply board before installing it then you have no business doing so.
Again I would recommend recapping it.
My opinion, didn’t mean to upset you. I use quality boards that surpass the originals.

X-Pin is notorious for making noise, I know I purchased one "as the best" for an LW3

I'm not upset at all, I'm just pointing out what people and myself have experienced.

#843 2 years ago

Man, I am such a noob when it comes to voltage and stuff. I have a TFTC with speaker hum and am so desperate to try something to get rid of it, but am trying to find the best approach to resolve it. This is my one and only DE pin.

It has an X-Pin PSU and from all the reading I've done, it seems like I need a separate psu for the sound board, possibly? Should I buy a new sound board and psu at the same time? I plan on getting a flipper fidelity kit or pinwoofer for it eventually as my wife and I like to play it with an external sub, but the hum is just annoying.

If there's anyone that can help walk me through some basic steps via PM or something, I would really appreciate the support. I'm a software engineer, so I'm not a total moron, but would like to make sure I'm doing it right is all.

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#844 2 years ago
Quoted from Lateralus:

Man, I am such a noob when it comes to voltage and stuff. I have a TFTC with speaker hum and am so desperate to try something to get rid of it, but am trying to find the best approach to resolve it. This is my one and only DE pin.

I had superb results with buckboosters but they were so hit or miss on reliability I stopped making them. The filter board sold by the Canadian guys is a good place to start if all your connections are good and you have no obvious cap issues.

#845 2 years ago
Quoted from TheCollector:

Bad advice, lol
If you don’t check the specs of distortion on a power supply board before installing it then you have no business doing so.
Again I would recommend recapping it.
My opinion, didn’t mean to upset you. I use quality boards that surpass the originals.

If the power supply hasn't been serviced there is no question that should be addressed first. That can affect the whole game. It just seems that even with that many games still make excessive noise when that has been done. Even if the sound card was done too.

While some of the aftermarket power supplies may be ok I have read about several instances where they performed worse than the original they were trying to replace. For the most part I prefer to rebuild the original boards. Exception is the early Bally/Stern rectifier boards which are often toast.

#846 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

5v wouldn’t be a thing on our board anyways, its only working with the +12v. All the other pins are pass thru.

Update.... and this is one of those shameful ones.
Turns out it wasn't the filter. Just based on the filter extending off the board a bit further, the ribbon cable got pressed weirdly against the back of the DMD which caused the issue ‍♂️. No filter, ribbon cable free = working, lol. So I just placed the cable different to not be squeezed and the filter performs as expected.
Still humming, but a lot less. It reduces the hum about the exact same amount as a dedicated PSU.

#847 2 years ago
Quoted from StrangeSubset1:

Update.... and this is one of those shameful ones.
Turns out it wasn't the filter. Just based on the filter extending off the board a bit further, the ribbon cable got pressed weirdly against the back of the DMD which caused the issue ‍♂️. No filter, ribbon cable free = working, lol. So I just placed the cable different to not be squeezed and the filter performs as expected.
Still humming, but a lot less. It reduces the hum about the exact same amount as a dedicated PSU.

Awesome! Great to hear you solved this I’ll keep this one In mind if anyone else has a similar problem.

#848 2 years ago

More parts are in stock and have been ordered! We’ll update soon with availability, as well as how you can win a free one!

#849 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

More parts are in stock and have been ordered! We’ll update soon with availability, as well as how you can win a free one!

Perfect. Really would like to try one. Thanks for the update

#850 2 years ago
Quoted from ChanceKJ:

More parts are in stock and have been ordered! We’ll update soon with availability, as well as how you can win a free one!

Just got a TFTC and would love to place an order with you!

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