Hi all,

This is my first post on pin side so thank you for your patience.

I picked up a DE Secret Service that was not working.
Replaced the power supply and got it to boot up but it won't kick out a ball for play and the flippers don't work.

I checked all the fuses and they are solid. Diagnostics didn't turn up anything. So I'm not sure of the next step. Any pros have advice?

Thanks.

I checked all the fuses out of the holders but for fun I went back and checked them again. They are all ok.

I'm using the power supply out of my DE Playboy. It boots up the game and lets it take a credit. Then it starts the game but doesn't kick out the ball or let the flippers work.

I haven't had time to work on it more but will add updates as I do.

Thanks for the help.

There was a fuse holder cracked on the smaller flipper board. I think the manual calls this the 50 VDC Coil Power Supply Bd. Yes? I think this is what is the issue. I will repair it and report back. Is this what you were talking about shacklersrevenge?

Incidentally the fuse in it is ok but I can't read what value it should be - 3A SB? I can't make it out. Anyone know? The manual doesn't list it - or if it does I can't find it.

I checked every other fuse out of the holders again for the third time. No other cracked holders or bad fuses, including under the playfield.

Thanks for all your help.

I will fix the cracked holder and let you know.

Ok - fixed the fuse holder. Put in a fuse.

Now when I fire it up the flippers work, but the game still won't kick the ball out to start play. The top 3rd flipper has issues and is not moving very far - I will rebuild it.

Also the Player 3 and Player 4 score displays don't light up - which makes diagnostics hard - plus it's in French. I'm kinda stuck there.

The ball saver that pops up is constantly up too so the ball won't drain when it is in play.

I can swap over parts from my Playboy machine - like I did the power supply - in order to figure out which systems are not functioning but as of right now I figure it's not the MPU or other boards.

OK - I replaced the displays with the ones from my Playboy. And lo and behold the diagnostics are now in English. WTF? But the fwd/rev switch is broken so I can only do diagnostics. Lucky? Maybe.

I have a few dead switches but the main issue is the coils. None of them are firing. That is causing the balls to just sit in the trough and not get kicked forward. As well as the ball not getting kicked out into the shooter so you can start playing.

I ran out of time but I will go back and check the fuses again tomorrow. This is just sort of an update.

There are no batteries in the holder. I get the nice Adjusts Reset every time I fire it up.

I also found that the pop up ball saver has broken free from the coil. Not sure if I can buy a new one... I am missing the right spinner. Need a repair/rebuild kit for the top right flipper. Need to repair all 5 drop targets. And get a new fwd/rev switch installed in the diagnostics buttons.

Thanks for all the help so far.

I have learned to never listen to a seller when buying a dead pin. And to offer a serious low ball when buying a pin if it isn't working. Lol

Yes - none of the coils fire (bumpers, kickouts, target resets, etc.) and that has me stumped for now. Again all the fuses on the playfield underside are good as are the ones in the back-box. I ran the coil diagnostics and none of them fire. I can't go much further with the fwd/reverse switch not operational. Any ideas there?

I fixed the ball saver and I think it will work correctly.

I like fixing them. Like a giant puzzle. And it's forcing me to learn about electronic issues that I didn't know about.
I want to repair them rather than just throw boards at them. I just know nothing about tracing or testing the board circuits...
But I can learn, which I love to do.

And I like the artwork of the older pins from the late 70's - early 80's. I like the playfield on the wall idea.

Also most of the switches work (all but 2 target) - I checked them in diagnostics mode. All of the switches in the trough work - its just that the coil won't kick the ball forward...

It doesn't say ball missing when all three balls are sitting in the trough.

And last but not least -

When the upper right flipper is at rest should the EOS be open or closed? I'm thinking closed (down) at rest like the bottom flippers and mine is open, which is why it won't work correctly.

Again that's the upper playfield flipper.

I don't see any power to any of the coils. With game running the DMM should show a reading of 25 to 80 volts DC if I ground out one DMM lead and put the other lead on the coil lug - correct? In either event I get nothing. On any coil.

It's not the power supply - that came from my working Playboy 35th.

From here I am stumped. I'm not all that good at electronics but will try and muddle through it.

Thanks for all the help so far. And for your patience. I'm slowly learning as I go.

Thanks sniper. I do hear the relay click very faintly when you press start. I put my finger on it and felt it click also.

I'm not sure how to check the plugs at the cabinet bottom. I wiggled them all and they are all seated. None are burned. Can you please elaborate a bit on taking that further...

And I don't know how to check the bridges either - can you elaborate on that?

Thanks.

So I finally pulled the MPU board off to look at it in the light because where I am working is fairly dark and my trouble light casts shadows.

First thing I notice is that CN11 is burnt - not the plug but above it the transistors and the board itself. The remaining transistor was bent over the gap so it wasn't obvious...
It looks horrible in the picture but wasn't immediately noticeable in the machine when viewed head on.

So sorry for not noting that earlier. Could have saved some time.

I'm guessing it's by a new MPU time? This area on mine is quite charred. Not sure its repairable (definitely not repairable by me).

My question now is if this area shorted out and burned could that have been what killed the power supply? Or did the power supply cause this?

CN11 Damage.jpg

Thanks.

From the beginning this game never worked. When I replaced the original power supply with the one from my Playboy the game fired up but none of the solenoids fired.

So I assumed that the original power supply is bad and was wondering what direction to go to fix it. I figured maybe the burned MPU would point in which direction to look for issues.

All of the fuses are correct. The only fuse issue was on the 50 VDC Coil Power Supply Bd - I repaired the fuse holder and set a new fuse in it.

There is no knocker coil in this machine - I know the manual says there is one but there isn't. Not one that I can find with a flashlight. I looked in the back-box and inside the cabinet. There are no cut wires that would suggest there is one either...

So I'm thinking that the previous owner cut the coil out and kept on playing. Because there would be no issue with Q40 gone - would there?

So still not sure about next step.

So I'm assuming this is where I'm headed then, testing the L/R relay.....

Found this on KLOV

On most DataEast/Sega games, the "L" (or "A") bank was for coils, and the "R" (or "B") bank is for flashlamps. But on games from Time Machine to the Simpsons, this logic was reversed. In these games the "L" bank was used for flashlamps (instead of coils), and the "R" bank was used for coils (instead of flashlamps). Keep this in mind when diagnosing problems.

The first thing to do is to test the solenoid L/R select relay. Turn the game on, and enter diagnostics (entering diagnostics should de-energize the L/R relay; on some games the L/R relay will stay energized after finishing a game because of an after-game flasher light show). Take an alligator test wire and connect it to the metal tab on transistor Q29. Then with the game on and in attract or diagnostic mode, touch the other end of the alligator clip to the ground strap in the backbox (WWF Royal Rumble and later, make sure the coin door is closed). The L/R select relay on the PPB board should click "on and off"; it will click on when the transistor is grounded, and off when not.

Another way to test the L/R relay is find the 1N4004 diode next to the L/R relay. This is the blocking diode for the relay. If the Non-Banded side of this diode is grounded using an alligator test lead, this will also energize the relay. On games with PPB boards, remember the L/R relay is mounted on this board (and its diode is right next to the relay). On the first two DE games that don't have a PPB board (Laser Wars and Secret Service), the L/R relay (if the games have one, I'm not sure!) would be mounted under the playfield.

If the relay "click" is not heard, do a quick test of transistor Q29 using a DMM:

* Turn the game off.
* Put the DMM on ohms (buzz tone).
* Put one lead on the ground strap in the backbox.
* Touch the other lead to the metal tab on transistor Q29.
* If the DMM shows zero ohms (buzz), the transistor is bad! (shorted on). This bad transistor will cause the L/R relay to stay energized.

The Q29 transistor can stay grounded for a period of time. This will not ruin the transistor or the relay. Do not leave Q29 grounded for more than a few minutes. That should be plenty of time to test any coils.

Low Coil Voltage.
Another problem is that the L/R relay can have pitted contacts on its switches. This can cause some resistance, and lower the coil voltage. If testing the coil voltage at the coils shows less than 50 volts or 25 volts DC (depending which voltage the coil uses), the L/R relay should be checked. Often the plastic cover that goes over the relay can be removed, and the switch contacts gently files. Also check for cold solder joints on the relay solder points. Also keep in mind that the 50 volt coil voltage will usually test at 70 volts (because there is no load, and the voltage is unregulated). The 25 volt system will often test as high was 38 volts.

Is the Solenoid L/R Select Relay Bad?
Be aware that relays can go bad too. This can especially happen if transistor Q29 locks on for an extended time, and leaves power to the relay turned on. The relay can actually get so hot, it burns the relay contacts together. Sometimes the solder joints on the L/R select relay can go "cold" or fatique. This often will make an L/R select relay not work (but reflowing the relay solder joints can generally fix this).

Also my kicker is in fact gone. I found the 2 wires taped up inside the cabinet.

Thank you for the photo and location information. Helped me out.

Run the solenoid tests. That's what was wrong with mine.