(Topic ID: 109642)

Data East pinball club

By PinballManiac40

9 years ago


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  • 3,043 posts
  • 505 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 days ago by Alan_L
  • Topic is favorited by 218 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Do you have any Data East Pinball machines??”

  • Yes, I have one. 567 votes
    58%
  • I have one or more. 279 votes
    29%
  • Considering buying one or more. 84 votes
    9%
  • No, never 44 votes
    5%

(Multiple choice - 974 votes by 932 Pinsiders)

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#968 5 years ago

Does anyone happen to have a good picture of the CPU clock area on the Data East CPU board? I am trying to get a Rocky and Bullwinkle going this morning and trying to confirm the specs on the crystal oscillator.

Thank you!

#970 5 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

I have yet to see one failed. Is there battery corrosion in this area on the board you are working on?

Battery corrosion on the crystal. It took all the writing off the top. Luckily the rest of the board looks awesome and I only have a couple traces to fix. I have a drawer full of replacement oscillators of the proper size but just need to confirm the speed.

I agree that it is rare to see one of these go bad but that battery damage is a wildcard. I'll post a picture later once I get to pull it off my phone. I was able to rebuild the power supply this morning and if I can confirm the crystal and have the right one on hand I may be able to try out the game tonight. It's my first Data East and I'm looking forward to playing it. At least if I get it going I can figure out what other parts I'll need to go through the rest of the machine.

I've fixed other Data East boards before for a friend and now finally have my own set to work on.

#972 5 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

8Mhz on the CPU board.

Thank you! That helps confirm the orientation too. If all goes well I may be able to try it out later today.

#974 5 years ago

Not working yet. I have a solid 5v now but the CPU isn't booting. Going to take a closer look at the CPU socket and see if I can get it to boot on the bench.

#975 5 years ago

I was able to fix it! The one trace for the reset that comes off the test loop to the CPU socket was open. Got it up and running first on the bench and have it running in the machine. Fun game. Just need to order a few parts, clean it up, add cliffys, and fresh rubber.

1 month later
#1011 5 years ago

It looks like the two wires together may be for a ground connection. No way for us to tell why that was added unless we see where it goes on the other side. Only a portion is pictured.

#1016 5 years ago
Quoted from SunMonkeyAZ:

The part cut off of the picture is the same wires looping back. They had tape over a section and here’s with the tape off. Not sure what this is. Both wires have one and then meet back up and are soldered together on the board.
Also it is on the backside of RA16 not CN10. I looked at the wrong part there.
[quoted image]

It looks like a potentiometer between the data line and ground. The could adjust the resistance across one of the built in resistors on that resistor pack. Is that resistor pack cracked on the other side?

I've seen a lot of weird things but this is a new one that I haven't come across yet. I really don't know what they were thinking and those should probably be pulled off and the solder connections cleaned up on the board.

1 year later
#1315 4 years ago

Does anyone have a source for the correct short rubber bungee that is used to hold up the playfield on games like Rocky and Bullwinkle?

3 weeks later
#1367 4 years ago

When looking for Data East parts has anyone come across the correct rubber bungee strap to hold up the playfield? I could use a replacement for a Rocky and Bullwinkle.

2 months later
#1511 4 years ago
Quoted from SWMurphy:

Thank you after Christmas i may send my original board there to see if he can fix the battery corrosion which is why i switched to the Rotten Dog in the first place. I did have a tech come out yesterday and he was able to replace the three fet's i shorted on the rotten dog board at my house so i was very lucky. Glad to have the game playing again.

Do you have any pictures of the board that shows how extensive the corrosion is? On those boards I usually have to replace the CPU socket and CPU and a few other parts along with fixing a few traces.

Some boards just aren't worth the effort if there is too much corrosion unless there is no other option.

4 weeks later
#1569 4 years ago

Has anyone ever come across a source for a new short bungie cord used to hold up the playfield on games like Rocky and Bullwinkle?

#1572 4 years ago
Quoted from freddy:

You could use a short chain and two s hooks.
More reliable as rubber bungies dry out

That is an excellent suggestion. I may pickup a short piece of chain and try it out. Thank you.

1 month later
#1624 4 years ago
Quoted from radial_head:

This one is exhibiting some really crappy problems that I suspect are all due to a faulty power supply. Worked fine for a while then slowly went downhill. It also has a pretty crappy decal job on it before I got it. I'm thinking of stripping the cabinet, re-decal'ing, color DMD, new power supply. I'm thinking of stripping down the playfield and giving it a good wiping down, adding cliffy's, then selling it. That's what, $750 total?
I shouldn't complain because I got it for an absolute bargain...

If you replace the power board I'd be interested in your old broken one to rebuild.

2 months later
#1792 3 years ago

Has anyone pulled the whole playfield on a Rocky and Bullwinkle? Just wondering in advance how many wires need to unplug and how it lifts out. My old Stern, Bally, and Williams games are easy but this one isn’t as obvious.

I have a set of game blades to install and want to pull the playfield for access.

#1798 3 years ago
Quoted from radial_head:

I currently have a R&B playfield that I pulled out for shopping to prep for a sale (so watch out anybody who's interested). I labeled all the connectors in the same way cottonm4 did. Comes out really easily once you have everything unplugged and labeled, albeit a tad heavy for one person to do safely. Might be best to ask a partner or friend to help.
But yes, additionally, the playfield can be taken out fairly easily without unplugging everything as well.
[quoted image]

I didn’t think any of the playfield harnesses would be long enough to do that with out disconnecting them. I have help so lifting it out won’t be an issue. Just think it will be so much easier to install the game blades with it out.

1 month later
#1967 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Just making sure. Currently trying to correlate the insert with the left bridge rectifier causing the DMD and insert lamps issues. I have seen fuses fail before when turned on but ohm out ok when the game is off.

It looks like the 25v feeds that fuse so you’ll want to check everything that runs at 34v that the bridge supplies.

#1969 3 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

That is a short summary of what I said in post #1958 and only feeds the saw motor.
Problem is I only ever seen a blown fuse for the left side to take out the DMD and the insert lamps.
Basically, suggests there are 2 issues here.

That’s the way these go. Always a bunch of issues to fix. Took a look at the pictures and one of the connectors on the power board is a different color. Was it replaced? Always triple check prior work.

#1974 3 years ago

Does anyone have the JEDEC images for the two PAL chips (U19 and U20) On the Data East sound board? I think they are supposed to be 16L8 types. I am repairing one of these boards and it is looking like one of them may be bad. If I can get the images for them I can make replacements to try.

1 month later
#2013 3 years ago
Quoted from Shabazz18:

Picked up my first DE several weeks ago. Just now setting it up and having a sound issue
Music plays fine. All 3 channels work. No voices at all and nothing from sound rom 1/2 test. Ideas?

What game is it? Have you checked to make sure all the speakers are connected?

6 months later
#2244 3 years ago
Quoted from FlipperNTS:

I did test with pot on and off of sound board.
Same result

If you find that one of the 20-pin PLD chips is bad I have replacements for those. I've had to fix a couple sound cards and those were bad on one.

#2248 3 years ago
Quoted from FlipperNTS:

What chips would those be?

U19 and U20 but I wouldn't start out with those first. It sounds like you've already done the caps. While that can be a factor I don't think it would have prevented all the sounds unless one or more were completely shot. They usually degrade and cause poor audio quality way before cutting anything off completely.

I'd check the following:

- Triple check your work replacing the caps (orientation, part placement, soldering
- You have all the voltages present on the board +5V, +12V, -12V and then the power after the regulators VR1 and VR2 on the board.
- Verify the contents of all the EPROM's on the board. Maybe burn a fresh set for testing. On rare cases I've had ROM's verify ok but not work in a board
- If you have a RAM tester then test the SRAM chip at U4 (usually 6264 8K chip) as I have had to replace them before.
- If you have another 68B09EP chip try swapping the processor. Make sure it is the E version since the non E version won't work. I've run into a bad processor with some dead outputs before
- Are there signs of prior work? Always suspect that and double check everything done. See my note below on what I found on a used sound board I bought.
- After that I would try the U19 and U20 PLD chips
- If you have another Data East game then try swapping the BSMT2000 chip. Luckily I've never run into a bad one but it could happen. Looks like they are available but not cheap so confirm you really need one before buying. I keep a spare DE sound card for bench testing and it helps since I can swap that part and confirm it is ok.
- Other than that you'll have to dig deeper. Is there CPU on that board running and had activity?
- If the CPU on the sound card is running with a scope start looking at the audio where it is generated through the amps to see where the failure is. May be an analog issue. There are some odd parts used but I think they are still available.

One of the boards I rebuilt was a non-working board from TNT amusements on ebay. It was missing the 8K RAM chip and sold as non-working. Someone had previously installed a TIP120 instead of a voltage regulator! I guess they thought they both had three pins and looked the same why not try it?? Luckily it just blew and after replacing that with the correct part, new DIP socket and RAM, Fresh ROM's and the PLD's it was up and running.

Hope this helps.

Robert

#2253 3 years ago
Quoted from FlipperNTS:

OOOF that's a lot!
I don't have replacement parts or oscilloscope to do that major testing unfortunately.
I have verified the soldering, and gotten a second opinion on that as well...I may be screwed here...

It could be a lot but you may not need all those steps. If you have access to someone local with a similar machine it would certainly help to be able to test that board in another machine. While you can upgrade to a Pinsound you should be able to get your board repaired for a reasonable price if you run out of options.

2 weeks later
#2272 3 years ago

Has anyone found a source for the correct replacement bungee cord? Mine has a loop pulled out. It was suggested at one point to try a short small chain in it's place. Still think that may be a better option since the rubber bungee could break or pull out an end like mine is. It is in the Rocky and Bullwinkle

2 months later
#2353 2 years ago
Quoted from Bellystyle:

The only Data East worth owning is Tales From the Crypt. Fight me....

Seriously? This has got to be a joke or a troll post. There are a bunch of great Data East games. Rocky and Bullwinkle is a great family friendly machine with a great flow to it and a lot going on. No plans to selling mine anytime soon. A friend has a Data East Batman and it was a lot more fun than I expected from the reviews and I enjoyed playing that too. Once you address all the known issues (fuse clips, bad caps on power supply, etc) they are solid games. Last action Hero looks like it is a blast and have heard good things about that as well as Jurassic park, and LW3.

I've heard Tales from the Crypt is a good playing game but personally not one that I would ever want in the house because I'm not a fan of the theme. But the same goes for Gorgar. Great games but not my thing. That's the nice thing about so many different titles. Everyone can find something they like.

4 weeks later
#2411 2 years ago
Quoted from Tophervette:

Hook just put out a puff of smoke when turned on from back box. The big board has a huge vertical black streak running up the board and the Stock DMD is blank when turned on. I am in over my head. Does anyone even make replacement boards for Data East machines?

Can you post pictures? It may not be as bad as you think.

3 weeks later
#2432 2 years ago

Question about the mini spotlight in the game. Should it be aimed at the large alien ship or pointing down towards the alien that opens up?

#2434 2 years ago

Sorry! I thought I posted this in the Independence Day thread. My mistake. I guess it could sort of fit since it has a lot of Data East parts on it.

2 months later
#2446 2 years ago
Quoted from bossk4hire:

Has anyone put a different set of playfield support brackets on? My LW3 ones are getting pretty rough and loose.
If so, which ones?

I may have a set along with some other LW3 parts from a machine that was left outside. Cabinet was wasted but playfield and other parts like the brackets can be salvaged.

2 months later
#2479 2 years ago
Quoted from sbmania:

I absolutely HATE DE pins and Rottendog boards!!! It seems to me that every time I have that combination, there's gonna be trouble. Latest episode:
Finished up a DE Star War. Really nice, full LED's, excellent condition. I noticed that the original DMD took about 10 seconds to come on when the game was first turned on, but it was rock solid after the initial 10 seconds. Had the game for at least 6 months and played it regularly throughout that time with no problems.
Delivered it to a guy's house and the display would not come on at all. WTF?? Checked for loose connections, checked voltages, etc. Only thing I saw was the Rottendog power supply was putting out -150v for both the -100 and -110v test points. Reseated ribbon connectors as well as all ps connectors. At one point got a partial display with lots of background garbage, but that went out and then nothing again.
Took it back home, put a new DMD in it and still nothing. Borrowed a DMD av board and Rottendog ps from a friend and started out by putting in the new Rottendog ps. Game gave out an instant loud hum, several solenoids pulled in, and I turned off the game quickly. I did measure the voltages though before turning it off and the -100 and -110 were right on.
Put in the original Rottendog ps that was in the game and now no hum but the MPU isn't powering up. No controlled lighting or game music. Tried the new DMD av board and it displayed the garbage screen for a second and then nothing. At this point, I have no idea what happened, but I know one thing - I HATE DE games with Rottendog boards in them!! Anyone with any idea what happened?

I would double check all the connections and check the 5V at the test points on the MPU board and work back to the power supply. Check all the fuses with a meter. Some of the RD boards are built well but I seem to recall reading about a possible over voltage issue with some power supplies for the displays. That could possibly damage the display in the game if left too long.

For DE games I prefer the original power supply boards over any of the aftermarket boards. I've always rebuilt the originals and those are solid. If for some reason one was burned up I'll get a non working project one off ebay and rebuild that. Any issues with those are well know and once address they are trouble free.

1 week later
#2493 2 years ago
Quoted from STLOkie:

Wow you're good, I'm reading 132v. It's a brand new power supply that has been working fine, do you think I have a weak resister connection somewhere?

Is it an aftermarket power supply? If so I seem to recall there are issues with some having over voltage for the displays. The original power supply boards are solid once rebuilt and I prefer those over the aftermarket ones.

#2516 2 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Anytime I see the TIP36 shorted and blowing a fuse on the original DE flipper board, is because the TIP32(c?) with it also has an issue.

Anyone work on the Rottendog flipper board? If you have one can you confirm what part Q7 is supposed to be? Someone replaced it but it is bad. Not sure if they used the correct part.

6 months later
#2691 1 year ago
Quoted from oradke:

I have random resets in my LAH. Already exchanged the PDB. Any suggestion on further troubleshooting? I do have a PinSound and ColorDMD, but they‘ve been in there for years. Nothing recently added.

The small capacitor for the 5V is known to leak and go bad. If it has never been replaced it is probably time.

#2696 1 year ago
Quoted from oradke:

Sorry, I mean the power supply board. I got a brand new replacement (rottendog), but resets still happen.

Is the transformer wiring setup to the correct voltage for your region? Have you measured the voltage at the outlet to ensure it isn't low?

3 months later
#2727 1 year ago
Quoted from radial_head:

Crags boards are amazing, I own two of them, but they do not solve the issue I'm describing. When I say "strobing" I mean being able to visibly see the refresh rate of the LED when the ball is moving past.

That strobing effect is awful on some games. Last one I ran into was on a Gameplan SharpShooter II and that one was fixed/upgraded by removing the cheap LEDs and replacing with #47 bulbs. LEDs aren’t always better.

On other games benefit greatly from a proper LED job. You may want to buy a few of these bulbs to try:

https://www.cometpinball.com/products/1flux-bulbs

They cost a bit more but I have had good results with them.

I can’t stand that strobing effect. Either higher quality LEDs or back to bulbs.

1 month later
#2747 1 year ago
Quoted from DropTarget:

Hi All,
My DE Jurassic Park has started to give me trouble. It's near mint, and has never had issues before.
Lately, when I power it up, the G.I.s come on, I hear a click like I always have before the diagnostics start, but then nothing...no DMD, no diagnostics. Eventually it will come back to life, but when it does, I makes that roaring sound much more frequently than it used to, and that sound will interrupt other sounds/music.
It has a Rottendog MPU and the 6.0 ROM.
Has anyone see/heard of similar symptoms?
Thanks

Original power supply? Has it ever been serviced? There are a couple caps that go bad on the original power board. They can leak and etch open a trace on the board. Not too bad to fix. Also the fuse clips are a known weak spot on these.

4 weeks later
#2762 1 year ago
Quoted from radial_head:

Curious if anybody local to new england has a spare DE MPU 520-5003-04. Some light corrosion would be fine, but my coil area is burnt to a crisp on one game and I would like to secure one that's a little cleaner before I put my R&B out on location again.

You don't need a -04. I think it came with a -03 but a -04 will work in the game. So, you should be able to use either one.

#2768 1 year ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

Heads up on ROTTENDOG MPU004 - 3 for Data East games.
The PIA's used on the board, I have been trouble shooting, has some kind
of issue with addressing the DMD. W65C21N6TPG-14 lots ABC655.1 2123G029
are flawed.
I have switched around the PIA's to no avail.
I have tested continuity...etc on all components associated with CN22.
Finally, replaced U_9B with a MC6821 PIA and DMD works... displays player 1 fonts are now present.
Just passing this frustrating hair pulling info along.
Cheers.

Is that the new Western Design Center PIA chips? Those are supposed to be solid chips and have only heard good things about those. Haven't heard of any issues with those before? Did you identify just a bad batch of them? If so did you e-mail Rottendig support about it? I had heard they switched over to the Western Design Center chips specifically to improve quality. If you ran into a bad batch you should let them know about it.

If it is just the PIA for the display section then perhaps there is just something in that part of the circuit that doesn't play well with the Western Design Center PIA chips.

#2771 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Keep in mind that this is a Rottendog MPU with the new Western Digital W65C21N6TPG-14 PIA. This is yet another example/reason I don't like repairing or owning Rottendog MPU boards, compatibility issues.
The Western Digital W65C21N6TPG-14 PIA work fine on the ORIGINAL MPU boards.

Well it is too early to tell. The WDC chip may work perfectly fine in the Rottendog boards too. Could just be a bad batch of those chips. Until the root cause is determined it is just speculation.

2 months later
#2790 1 year ago
Quoted from polyacanthus:

Has anyone had any success with weakening their flippers? My Simpsons is totally ridiculous, I find myself avoiding playing it because I'm afraid of breaking stuff. Everything has been rebuilt and the playfield clearcoated so think it's more noticeable. I had 090-5020-30 (23-900) coils that it calls for. I just tried 090-5030-OT (23-1100) which didn't seem to make much difference.
For that matter, all coils in the machine seem too powerful even though I have set the software coil strength to soft. My voltages seem really high but I'm told that's normal.

Is the game a reimport? If so someone may have mis-wired the transformer. It happens often.

8 months later
#2904 4 months ago
Quoted from PinballHaven:

Recently was buying a pin off FB locally and the owner also had a DE Playboy that wasn’t working. He replaced the power board with a rottondog and same result. Nothing looked smoked on any of the boards and all fuses appeared good, he said he checked all with a meter. Board had two solid lights as pictured, game would power up and GI lit along with a couple insert lights. It gave an audio call out at startup but no display and seemed to not boot. Looking for suggestions to help him out, I’m not familiar with these boards/games but told him I would research here.
Thanks!
[quoted image][quoted image]

Did you look over that MPU board carefully? Did the batteries leak in the past and is there corrosion? It will often get into the CPU socket and eat away at the pins.

1 month later
#2968 69 days ago
Quoted from Garrett:

It is fun. Picked it up yesterday.[quoted image]

With all the dinosaur

Quoted from RGarriott:

Hey guys looking for a apron for my Hook. Let me know if ya have an extra. Thanks

Is it the same as the one used on Lethal Weapon? If so I may have one.

#2971 66 days ago
Quoted from RGarriott:

Pretty sure it is can i get a picture pls?

I just dug I out. Will get pictures.

#2973 66 days ago

This is the spare I have.

FF97E3A1-2106-44E7-A9B7-9199EC0D12F5 (resized).jpegFF97E3A1-2106-44E7-A9B7-9199EC0D12F5 (resized).jpeg
3 weeks later
#3004 43 days ago
Quoted from cp1610:

If you can fix the de power supply It will be the best long term. They are pushing 30+ years old and will need some work. Also check fuse holders they were junk and time has only made it worse. The same goes for board headers. I have rebuilt some of my supplies and shipped some out to. Probably by the time i go to the big show in the sky or pinball is dead the fully rebuilt will still be going 30 years again.
The Xp one works great but a switch mode supply many not be as robust over the long term. (I hear the pitch forks coming) There seems to be love for rotten dog and just as many that despise them. They are also switch mode. But some claim i'm some old crab ass that's dumb. Probably has to i played to much pinball. lol

I am in the camp that a clean rebuilt original power supply is the best power option for the Data East. Would take that over any of the aftermarket power boards.

As far as Rottendog (or other manufacturer) they make lots of different boards. Some are excellent and others are a pass. Some of the Rottendog boards are solid but I am not a fan of their DE power supply. The latest version of the DE MPU seems to work well as do some of the WPC boards and the Gottlieb System 80 driver. Haven't used all the boards they make but some are ok. I've seen several posts where people had issues and in several cases they set the DIP switch backwards. They set the switch to ON for 1 when they should follow the silkscreen printed on the board which shows it should be off.

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