(Topic ID: 220221)

CPR *WAVE FIVE OUT* - PLASTICS & GLASSES Releases


By KevinCPR

1 year ago



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#201 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

We'll get mirrored glasses, like SBM, rolling as soon as we get all this worked out. Working on getting all those legacy plastics sets out first.

Hey Kevin, how do we determine what backglasses might be available at some point? I see lots of people throwing titles out that they would like to see done. I think I read in one of your posts that for now you would only print stuff that you had already done. Given that the mirroring takes more time and effort which I equate to higher cost, would you consider two lines of backglasses, one mirrored and one non-mirrored? I know one restoration service does the mirroring in grey and it looks pretty good. I'm not sure how much of a price difference it would be or whether it would even be worth the effort for you but I'm sure that some guys would be happy to have a cheaper, fresh, new backglass with no mirroring in a budget restore project and save a few bucks for other parts (plastics, etc.).

Is a Black Knight backglass anywhere on a list or even on the radar?

#202 1 year ago

Or leave those sections blank and put mirror foils behind. Although on second thought it would never be an option for me. For me it's either / or. Nothing in between...

#204 1 year ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

I'm not sure how much of a price difference it would be or whether it would even be worth the effort for you but I'm sure that some guys would be happy to have a cheaper, fresh, new backglass with no mirroring in a budget restore project and save a few bucks for other parts (plastics, etc.).

While you're certainly not wrong about this, I for one am a huge fan of CPR's translite to mirrored backglass conversions. I can't imagine going back to a regular translite on my PinBot after putting in CPR's mirrored backglass. It just looks phenomenal (and this is coming from a purist who never mods anything original from factory). I hope CPR continues to do these conversions once the new model is in place and they have time to devote to it.

Either way, this new model is great news for the hobby and am excited to see where things go from here!

#205 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinwizkid:

While you're certainly not wrong about this, I for one am a huge fan of CPR's translite to mirrored backglass conversions. I can't imagine going back to a regular translite on my PinBot after putting in CPR's mirrored backglass. It just looks phenomenal (and this is coming from a purist who never mods anything original from factory). I hope CPR continues to do these conversions once the new model is in place and they have time to devote to it.
Either way, this new model is great news for the hobby and am excited to see where things go from here!

It's all about having more options at different price points. When I have a game that I've invested $1000 CDN in and it's nice but not collector condition and has an absolutely crap backglass, paying $500 CDN for a Mayfair replacement is painful. Especially when a backglass is basically eye candy. I think there are a lot of games out there that could benefit with some sprucing up but don't justify the high cost of a pristine backglass or a brand new playfield. It would be nice if there were other choices in line with the value of the game. We now have options for hardtops and overlays for budget conscious restores. New plastics, if available, are reasonable. It would be nice to have some choices for backglasses. Some games deserve a beautiful, mirrored backglass while others could get by with a reasonably priced translite.

Again, choices and cost are key here. Either way, what CPR is doing is definitely a bonus to all of us. The more options that Kevin and friends are willing to offer us the better off the hobby will be!

#206 1 year ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

It's all about having more options at different price points. When I have a game that I've invested $1000 CDN in and it's nice but not collector condition and has an absolutely crap backglass, paying $500 CDN for a Mayfair replacement is painful. Especially when a backglass is basically eye candy. I think there are a lot of games out there that could benefit with some sprucing up but don't justify the high cost of a pristine backglass or a brand new playfield. It would be nice if there were other choices in line with the value of the game. We now have options for hardtops and overlays for budget conscious restores. New plastics, if available, are reasonable. It would be nice to have some choices for backglasses. Some games deserve a beautiful, mirrored backglass while others could get by with a reasonably priced translite.
Again, choices and cost are key here. Either way, what CPR is doing is definitely a bonus to all of us. The more options that Kevin and friends are willing to offer us the better off the hobby will be!

Totally agree.

#207 1 year ago
Quoted from dzorbas:

I think I read in one of your posts that for now you would only print stuff that you had already done.

That is correct. Although "new" glass titles we've never run before (due to being scared not enough would sell) are going to come out eventually too. It was sad sitting on finished glass artwork all these years, with the worry that only a dozen would sell... so we just never ran them. Those will finally have their day to take their chance in the open market. If one sells, fine. If 20 sell, fine. The market can decide. At least they will finally be available. We're not tied to doing a run of 100 at a time anymore.

Quoted from dzorbas:

Given that the mirroring takes more time and effort which I equate to higher cost, would you consider two lines of backglasses, one mirrored and one non-mirrored?

Yes, we were thinking on doing that once each mirrored glass comes out. Offer the mirrored version, then a discounted non-mirror version. Again, let the market decide.

Mirrored isn't going to be charged more. We're going to maintain our traditional prices. But the non-mirrored version can be price-CUT, for exactly the budget reasons you cited. We can do the mirror layer in some kind of grey. We're working on it.

Quoted from dzorbas:

Is a Black Knight backglass anywhere on a list or even on the radar?

Yes. It's coming out in the next couple months.

#208 1 year ago

While you are reading-issuing old plastics, how about Sorcerer?

#209 1 year ago

** THIRD WAVE ** (Now available in the CPR Store at our web site):

Plastics sets:

GALAXY
FLASH
FIRE!
EMBRYON
BLACKOUT
PARAGON
MEDUSA
SOLAR CITY
TARGET ALPHA
BLACK KNIGHT 2000
EIGHT BALL
FUNHOUSE

KEVIN
Classic Playfield Reproductions
http://www.classicplayfields.com

#210 1 year ago

DAMN, keep it up!!!

Patiently waiting for Laser Ball to make the list

#211 1 year ago

Kevin are these new releases your old art files that produced your original runs? Or are they now printed from your scans of NOS examples?

#212 1 year ago

Did CPR do Jungle Lord plastics at one time?

#213 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinballer73:

Kevin are these new releases your old art files that produced your original runs? Or are they now printed from your scans of NOS examples?

It's always in-house vector-redrawn artwork. That applies to everything that was spot-color (blackline with multiple solid color fills). We never just printed scans. Ever.

In the case of the "oil painting" or "watercolor" original artwork - like on some of the backglasses - then yes, we are going back to our original NOS RGB scans and rebuilding new 2018 files, so we avoid the CMYK conversions and lab linescreening that had to be done to make silkscreen film sets for our past repro runs. Which due to technical reasons, had to be half the resolution of NOS, at best. Now those glasses, from this point forward, will be as detailed and sharp (and color-correct) as we can possibly do. Almost indistinguishable from an original NOS.

#214 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

It's always in-house vector-redrawn artwork. That applies to everything that was spot-color (blackline with multiple solid color fills). We never just printed scans. Ever.
In the case of the "oil painting" or "watercolor" original artwork - like on some of the backglasses - then yes, we are going back to our original NOS RGB scans and rebuilding new 2018 files, so we avoid the CMYK conversions and lab linescreening that had to be done to make silkscreen film sets for our past repro runs. Which due to technical reasons, had to be half the resolution of NOS, at best. Now those glasses, from this point forward, will be as detailed and sharp (and color-correct) as we can possibly do. Almost indistinguishable from an original NOS.

Thanks for clarifying Kevin. So as an example, the Medusa backglass that is now listed will be a very accurate copy of an NOS original both in terms of resolution/detail and the colors?

#215 1 year ago

Any chance Aztec by Williams will ever get plastics/backglass/play field?

#216 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinballer73:

So as an example, the Medusa backglass that is now listed will be a very accurate copy of an NOS original both in terms of resolution/detail and the colors?

Yes. You got it. The best that a repro of a Medusa glass is ever going to get. (Without going back in time and doing it using the exact original methods, and from original negatives).

#217 1 year ago

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.

Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

odyssey.jpg

#218 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.
Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

The one on the right has deeper blues. That's the one I would guess was silkscreened.

#219 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.
Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

I'd say the one on the right is the new digital printed one.

#220 1 year ago

If anyone’s curious on plastics timelines I placed an order for 2 sets on 7/9 and got shipping confirmation today. Expected delivery is 7/24. Will post pics when they get here. Excited!

#221 1 year ago

my guess: left = digital

#222 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Yes. You got it. The best that a repro of a Medusa glass is ever going to get. (Without going back in time and doing it using the exact original methods, and from original negatives).

pasted_image (resized).png
#223 1 year ago
Quoted from cabuford:

If anyone’s curious on plastics timelines I placed an order for 2 sets on 7/9 and got shipping confirmation today.

Just so it's clear for everybody, this was due to the recent swamping since launch. Our laser CNC has been severely backed up with cuts to do, for the plastics. Once things settle down to a stasis, we'll be back to the target 24-hour turnaround for order-to-shipping. That's the goal. Thx.

#224 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.
Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

So which is which? We all want to know.

#225 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Just so it's clear for everybody, this was due to the recent swamping since launch. Our laser CNC has been severely backed up with cuts to do, for the plastics. Once things settle down to a stasis, we'll be back to the target 24-hour turnaround for order-to-shipping. That's the goal. Thx.

Yeah, I'm complaining that I had to wait a week or so to receive my shipping notification! Are you kidding me Kevin? NO ONE should be complaining about turn around time given that we now have the ability to buy stuff any time we like! Kudos to your team on this.

Quoted from KevinCPR:

Yes, we were thinking on doing that once each mirrored glass comes out. Offer the mirrored version, then a discounted non-mirror version. Again, let the market decide.

Mirrored isn't going to be charged more. We're going to maintain our traditional prices. But the non-mirrored version can be price-CUT, for exactly the budget reasons you cited. We can do the mirror layer in some kind of grey. We're working on it.

This is awesome as well! This should make a lot of people happy!

#226 1 year ago
Quoted from uncivil_engineer:

While you are reading-issuing old plastics, how about Sorcerer?

I also would like some Sorcerer plastics, with two extra center plastics for the inevitable breakage

#227 1 year ago
Quoted from AMBoggs:

I also would like some Sorcerer plastics, with two extra center plastics for the inevitable breakage

They use better plastic don't they so it may not break.

#228 1 year ago
Quoted from Mitch:

So which is which? We all want to know.

I'm loving the guesses. So I was hoping for more people to guess. I'm trying to prove a point, basically - that put up next to silkscreening, results are so close that it doesn't even matter anymore. Nobody can pick out which is which, under normal conditions. I don't mean intentional hunting analysis at 4 inches away, I mean normal observational conditions with zero motives to seek tiny differences.

Any more guesses? A comment about "why" you believe your guess is correct, is also handy as well.

#229 1 year ago
Quoted from AMBoggs:

I also would like some Sorcerer plastics

A great idea. It's just we don't have any artwork for Sorcerer plastics. Never have, for some reason. We need to remedy that. Anybody have an old set pulled from a machine they can loan? We'll return then AND replace them for free with a new repro set, once the work is done.

#230 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.
Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

I think the digital is the one on the right. Maybe this is an intentional exercise to demonstrate how good the new digital prints will be?

#231 1 year ago

Kevin,

While you seem to have a solid plan and you guys would obviously strive for quality that's bang on and indistinguishable from NOS, do you have any concerns about digital printing diluting the repro market for pinball in the future? This has definitely happened on the vid side of things - guys doing solvent inkjet with quality all over the place. It becomes a problem when the buyers are happy because they a) don't have the eye to distinguish quality from crap or b) don't have anything to compare the new piece to so of course say it looks great.

*Also, I think my question earlier fell through the cracks - I'd like to get in line to have my original, stripped Space Invaders playfield rescreened rather than buy a complete new pf. Do I need to email the link at the site to indicate interest or is there a different queue for that. When do I ship my old pf to you? Thanks!!!

#232 1 year ago
Quoted from Joey_N:

...do you have any concerns about digital printing diluting the repro market for pinball in the future?

What does "diluting the repro market" mean in this context?

Quoted from Joey_N:

...with quality all over the place. It becomes a problem when the buyers are happy because ...

If the buyers are happy it's not much of a problem. If quality is all over the place buyers will go to the supplier that has acceptable quality. If Doris Dontcare sells her game to Penelope Perfectionist then Penelope can buy a higher quality piece for her machine.

#233 1 year ago

PM sent to provide Sorcerer donor plastics.

#234 1 year ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

They use better plastic don't they so it may not break.

Sadly my new Space Shuttle plastic cracked on a corner but I blame myself. I did a flipper bebuild and didn’t realize how much faster it would rebound. Hit at the right spot. I have since put in some protectors.

#235 1 year ago
Quoted from AMBoggs:

Sadly my new Space Shuttle plastic cracked on a corner but I blame myself. I did a flipper bebuild and didn’t realize how much faster it would rebound. Hit at the right spot. I have since put in some protectors.

Right or left, I have a right your welcome to.

#236 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

I'm gonna guess the one on the left is the digital press but not on the basis of the printing. I'm looking at the corners of the glass and they are rounded on the one on the right. It's cheaper to get a piece of without rounded corners so that's why I'm leaning that way.

I was also going to say that the printing of "Williams" seems to have a sharper outline on the glass on the left.

Maybe I'm completely off base in both cases...

#237 1 year ago

I’m guessing the left one is the digital print. Some of the fine detail seems a little sharper than I’d expect screen printing to cope with. But I could be wrong and I agree, the difference is inconsequential to me.

#238 1 year ago
Quoted from Joey_N:

do you have any concerns about digital printing diluting the repro market for pinball in the future?

If anything this will actually prevent dilution. In reality CPR has overproduced in the past with “runs” of product. People drop out and there’s extra product out there. An on demand model means people get exactly the right amount of product.

What it will do, however, is make life harder on playfield hoarders/flippers.

#239 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Just so it's clear for everybody, this was due to the recent swamping since launch. Our laser CNC has been severely backed up with cuts to do, for the plastics. Once things settle down to a stasis, we'll be back to the target 24-hour turnaround for order-to-shipping. That's the goal. Thx.

Sorry this might have sounded like a complaint, it certainly wasn't!!! It's my first order with CPR and I'm sure many people will be ordering as soon as the plastics they want are announced (like I did) and just wanted everyone to know what the timeline was like at the initial rush. I don't mind waiting a week and am certainly impressed that 24 hours is the normal time.

#240 1 year ago
Quoted from Joey_N:

that's bang on and indistinguishable from NOS

The stuff will be bang-on, but not 100% indistinguishable (say, a side-by-side forensic analysis with the motive to identify differences from 6 inches away). My earlier comment on nearly-indistinguishable refers especially to the "oil painting" or "watercolor" backglasses - which in our past were "OK" , but lacking in many areas due to the constraints of the dot-based silkscreening methodology for full-color backglasses (non-spot). Our digital releases will be a vast improvement over the past, for those glasses. As close to NOS as anybody is going to get, without going back to original processes in a time machine, with original negatives.

Quoted from Joey_N:

do you have any concerns about digital printing diluting the repro market

I don't entirely know what this means, forgive me. Dilution (in my mind of basic economics) would come with flooding out huge amounts of supply, and there's so much stuff, it's almost moot and worthless. Our model is the complete opposite of that. We wanted to end all this sitting unsold stock, which was the general outcome of doing "runs". Going forward, unless it gets ordered, it doesn't exist. We make on-demand. That means the population of each pinball part, going forward, from CPR, is exactly matched to the demand produced by the hobby. Glove fit.

Quoted from Joey_N:

a) don't have the eye to distinguish quality from crap or b) don't have anything to compare the new piece to

That is why WE take care of the distinguishing. My eyes. Our eyes. So it passes muster here, and the gatekeeper of what goes out from here will be me. Those who don't have the eye, won't need the eye - because I won't be shipping them anything that falls back into those past histories of "crap". After 14 years silkscreening everything we made here, I have let go of the romance of spot color silkscreening. The current tech kicked me in the butt. Things had changed so much in the last 3-5 years, that I had to concede. Reality trumped romantic voodoo. Either it looks great, or it doesn't. The process to create the final imagery need not be romanced over. Not anymore. Once the tech reached the acceptable level of solidity, thick density of the ink, scratch resistance, and non-banding... that was it. It wins. It wins enough that it justifies proudly bringing back 130+ legacy products that would otherwise have remained mothballed forever. Because we weren't ever again going to do a silkscreen run to sell 12 copies, and it go dead... after making 100.

Good questions. We might as well get these topics covered, now.

Quoted from Joey_N:

When do I ship my old pf to you?

Make contact once you see Space Invaders in "The Pipe" at our site, showing "CNC Cutting Now"

#241 1 year ago
Quoted from wdennie:

Right or left, I have a right your welcome to.

Wasn’t the sling. It was the big piece on the left.

What I figured happened was the ball richocheted off the ramp posts and hit that corner directly below the bottom pop bumper.

#242 1 year ago

Kevin, do you have any films for the Data east games? I'm assuming you have them for tommy/rocky/GNR/LW3. With your boutique abilities now, i'd take a time machine playfield.

#243 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

I don't entirely know what this means, forgive me. Dilution (in my mind of basic economics) would come with flooding out huge amounts of supply, and there's so much stuff, it's almost moot and worthless. Our model is the complete opposite of that. We wanted to end all this sitting unsold stock, which was the general outcome of doing "runs". Going forward, unless it gets ordered, it doesn't exist. We make on-demand. That means the population of each pinball part, going forward, from CPR, is exactly matched to the demand produced by the hobby. Glove fit.

Sorry, that probably wasn't clear. In the vid hobby, there are several top notch repro guys, incl This Old Game, Phoenixarcade, Arcadeshop, Quarterarcade... PA pretty much just does silkscreen stuff still. ThisOldGame has gotten more and more into solvent inkjet for small runs, odd stuff, uncommon. However, you can depend on his inkjet work looking like silkscreen quality, sized properly, die cut, etc. There have been several newcomers in the last few years, all inkjet repros, with quality all over the place. It ranges from fine to terrible. I suppose with what you're doing, the cost of the equipment/process will prevent lower quality competition. Best comparison I could think of is guys on Ebay selling crappy 'translite' versions of a backglass you'd sell. Thanks for the discussion though.

Going to start documenting and stripping my SI playfield. I'll keep an eye on your site. I assume that I need to level and reglue and inserts, and you run it through a wide drum sander to flatten it before screening. Thanks for offering this service. Gonna be buying a bunch more from you.

It would be amazing if you got into Gottlieb Sys 1 and 80 backglasses...and more early Stern

Last - the KISS playfield - I saw where you had in the pipe, yet there was another pinball parts guy a while back that mentioned that he'll be doing it, but I can't remember who. I'm going to need a KISS playfield - -still kicking myself for not buying it 15yrs ago when the IPB was $450....

#244 1 year ago

Quote "Last - the KISS playfield - I saw where you had in the pipe, yet there was another pinball parts guy a while back that mentioned that he'll be doing it, but I can't remember who. I'm going to need a KISS playfield - -still kicking myself for not buying it 15yrs ago when the IPB was $450...."

I sure hope they come out with it - sold my IPB a month ago to someone in the middle of a restore with the hopes I'd have a chance to get one in a couple years....when I might finally get around to MY restore.....

#245 1 year ago

I’d say the digital printing is on the left...the yellows look more refined and colors more succulent.

#246 1 year ago
Quoted from lordloss:

Kevin, do you have any films for the Data east games? I'm assuming you have them for tommy/rocky/GNR/LW3. With your boutique abilities now, i'd take a time machine playfield.

I’d love to know the answer to this question as well, I’d instantly buy a Data East Batman playfield, plastics and decal set to do a full restore.

#247 1 year ago

The EK plastics I ordered on 7-9 are scheduled for delivery Friday!

Quicker than I expected!

#248 1 year ago
Quoted from KevinCPR:

Since we're discussing quality & appearance, I just remembered I had a picture on my cell phone I took a couple weeks back. I was so excited by the first new print of a Space Odyssey glass, that I went and grabbed my repro from ~2011 and put them side by side. Here is the image below.
Who can identify which one is silkscreened, and which one is from the digital press? I also made some intentional color tweaks. So which is which

Hard to tell looking at these on a tablet, but I'd say the one on the left is the digital. The solid colors on that one don't look as solid as the one on the right.

#249 1 year ago

Is this were I ask for Black Rose Translite?

#250 1 year ago

+1 for Black Rose translite

I’m also looking for a Bram Stokers Dracula translite

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