(Topic ID: 112622)

Converting Got sys3 flippers to b/w


By Atomicboy

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 19 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by snyper2099
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 4 years ago

I have heard of people doing this with great results before, but not sure what coils people have gone with.

Any particular wpc system in particular that the flipper mechs were taken from, as the stops/plunger combos can be different?

#2 4 years ago

Several considerations here.

First, both Sys3 and late Williams are 50v flipper coils.

It is important to try and match the existing Gottlieb coil strength. The strongest Gottlieb coil (A-29876) is roughly matched by the Williams FL-11630. Not all Sys3 games used the A-29876 coil. Going with a higher strength coil can damage playfield parts. And for many Sys3 games where there are no replacements available, that's not a good thing.

You need a standard EOS (think pre-Fliptronic) switch as that's how Gottlieb did their EOS. Can't use Fliptronic switches that close when flipper goes full stroke. That will help you with your flipper mech choice.

viperrwk

#3 4 years ago

I have had good luck just replacing the Gottlieb bats with Williams bats and then putting grommets in the plunger stop to keep them from being 'catch all' flippers. The default strength is plenty strong. The only difference I can really tell is that they aren't as snappy about going back into the rest position as WPC flippers. The return spring doesn't seem to be as strong.

#4 4 years ago

Viper - I was thinking 11630s actually, but thought I'd ask, as I know people have done it. Lots of close shots, but the long ramp on the right is the kicker!

I was aware I would have to go with always closed EOS's as well.

#5 4 years ago

Which game is this for? More specifically which coil numbers are screened on the playfield as that will better help to match up the closest Williams coil (can't always go by the manual if the coil was updated in production).

viperrwk

#6 4 years ago

Oh sorry, Stargate. I linked the game, but forgot to mention.

#7 4 years ago

Sorry missed the link (always forget to look at that).

Go with the 11630s. It's a little more than the stock SG coil (25959) but less than the strongest Gottlieb coil. Problem is you'd have to go down to a 11722 which I think would be too little for SG.

BTW I have no problems whatsoever making the right ramp from the left flipper with the stock Gottlieb coils in SG if all the circuitry is working correctly (EOS, cab switch, new cap) and rebuilt mechs.

As an aside the 25959 coil info on Pinball Medic is wrong. It is a 24-720/33-3325. The 29876 info there is correct.

viperrwk

#8 4 years ago
Quoted from viperrwk:

BTW I have no problems whatsoever making the right ramp from the left flipper with the stock Gottlieb coils in SG if all the circuitry is working correctly (EOS, cab switch, new cap) and rebuilt mechs.

Ditto.

#9 4 years ago
Quoted from viperrwk:

BTW I have no problems whatsoever making the right ramp from the left flipper with the stock Gottlieb coils in SG if all the circuitry is working correctly (EOS, cab switch, new cap) and rebuilt mechs.

And either does my friend, we rebuilt his flippers. I just want to make sure whatever we pick still makes the ramps, as let's face it, the ramps in this game are sort of like IJ - the make it or break it for whether your flippers are ok or not.

#10 4 years ago

This is just goofy. All that is needed is to ask Steve young for the custom sys3 coil stops. They have a longer stop which limits the amount of flipper travel. Thus making the original sys3 flippers more Bally/Williams feeling. All for about $5 and without changing coils or assemblies.

#11 4 years ago
Quoted from cfh:

This is just goofy. All that is needed is to ask Steve young for the custom sys3 coil stops. They have a longer stop which limits the amount of flipper travel. Thus making the original sys3 flippers more Bally/Williams feeling. All for about $5 and without changing coils or assemblies.

It's not just for the bat travel but for the feel. I have heard people say the machines play better after. I guess I'm not sure really why that is, all I know is don't like the feel of sys3 flippers, and I don't think that is for the bat travel alone.

Does anyone know if the bats are the same length and size as Williams?

#12 4 years ago

i guess if you want to pretend that system3 games aren't really system3 games, you can do that flipper conversion. but to me it's a gottlieb, and it's not supposed to feel like a bally/williams game! if that's what i wanted, i would just buy bally/williams games.

the issue i have is the extreme travel of the system3 flippers. it makes the games too easy to drop catch. i've seen people that aren't good players get 15 minute balls on our system3 games with 'normal' system3 flippers.

#13 4 years ago
Quoted from cfh:

i guess if you want to pretend that system3 games aren't really system3 games, you can do that flipper conversion.

As far as the flippers, that's exactly what we want

I don't think it's just the travel. They just seem hard to aim with, strong still, but not as easy to pick your shots as with b/w or anything DE->stern, even early SS including system80 and 1.

My friend loves SG, as do I, and when I heard in the SG club thread people were doing this, or had done it, I thought great, an answer to the crappy flipper feel for this great game.

#14 4 years ago

just rebuilding the original sys3 flippers and the modified coil stops will get you what you want. without doing a wacky conversion. a new plunger/link and coil sleeve and the custom stops costs very little. the rest of the mech really isn't any different than bally/williams.

#15 4 years ago

It would be nice if they increase the length of the plunger in stead of increasing the length of the coilstop in order to shorten the travel of the bat. It would result in a flipper which has a little bit more power at the beginning of the stroke; as it will be better "picked up" by the coil as soon as it is energized. I modified Williams slingshot plungers with system 3 links in order to achieve that. Takes some work however. Just another tip

And 1 thought: i think the baseplates of system 11 flippermechs are physically bigger. Do they fit at Gottlieb system 3 playfields around the other mechs, lamps, wiring etc...??

/\/\arco

Post edited by MarAlb: thought added...

#16 4 years ago
Quoted from cfh:

just rebuilding the original sys3 flippers and the modified coil stops will get you what you want. without doing a wacky conversion. a new plunger/link and coil sleeve and the custom stops costs very little. the rest of the mech really isn't any different than bally/williams.

Have you done this? Again, I am only going by what I read, and people suggesting this replacement of the whole mech. I definitely like the coil stop idea the best, if it does cure the problem, as that's much cheap with much less work.

I'm almost scared to bring this up to Steve... Can anyone else hear the conversation in their head now ... "what the hell do you want to do that for??" lol. Steve's the best though, and best made parts out there.

Are there even coil stops that would fit that are longer? Has anyone actually done this then, replaced the coil stops alone?

#17 4 years ago

no, I would never bastardize one of the best GTB games by doing that. The flippers when rebuilt are perfect and also a unique part of the game. Less travel will completely change the geometry of the shots and make many no longer back handable. You owe it to the designer and the game to properly rebuild the flips using the spec parts before you opt to bastardize the original intent.

#18 4 years ago

Personally, I would never put the B/W mechs in a Sys3 game. I've been perfectly happy with the Gottlieb mechs in the machines I have/had.

But I also subscribe to this rule in pinball: "It's your game - you can do whatever you want with/to it."

viperrwk

#19 4 years ago

I am grateful that someone has longer Got. coil stops to reduce ball travel. I secretly hope all sys 3 PAPA games have the longer coil stops installed.

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