AC/DC (Pro Vault Edition)
Stern, 2017
Batman 66 (LE)
Stern, 2016
Batman 66 (Premium)
Stern, 2016
Batman 66 (Super LE)
Stern, 2016
Black Knight Sword of Rage (LE)
Stern, 2019
Guardians of the Galaxy (LE)
Stern, 2017
Guardians of the Galaxy (Premium)
Stern, 2017
Guardians of the Galaxy (Pro)
Stern, 2017You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider lounge.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
The more I see the pictures of these issues the more I’m thinking it’s a hardware issue. I think the posts are too narrow and not set deep enough allowing the post to flex on ball impact.....
Notice the location of the pooling - always to the inside of the rubber. The chipping is just a side effect of pooling becoming brittle.
Quoted from yancy:Those posts have been used for years. Decades in the case of star posts, where it's the worst.
I understand that. I’m talking about the bolts that hold the posts to the playfield. And what if the wood is softer? What if the flippers are more powerful? What if they weren’t tightened down properly?
Quoted from pninja005:Do any CGC pinballs have these issues?
My MBrLE is fine but I’m watching this carefully. I would like to add a JP but I’m holding off until I see Stern making this right.
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:...Please present your evidence to support this accusation....
Re: the manufacturer/s knowing they have playfield issues.
I think the washers under the posts from the factory, where none were before, is a pretty good indication that the manufacturer knew something wasn’t quite right and tried to apply a bandaid rather than halt production and fix the real problem.
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:Great point. Washers have been applied.
Why did you chose the phrase "rather than halt production and fix the real problem"?
That implies that they know what the real problem is AND that halting production is one of the best ways to fix it........Another possibility: it's not even showing up at the factory. Tech support is getting calls and photos and the washers are a first attempt. Who knows at this point?
Shutting down the plant when you don't even know what the problem is, how severe, or how widespread? You're talking about putting hundreds of people out of work temporarily. No one wants that. You'll investigate while production continues and do your best to fix any issues that come up.
If you know the units are problematic - and they do, hence the **washers from the factory** - wouldn’t you want to find out why and fix the root cause before the units shipped? Seems like this would have saved them a lot pain where warranty work is concerned. Shutting down the line doesn’t mean shutting down the company. They are still making other pins.
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:How many units have a problem?
Every single one that has washers under the posts.
Stern should give you a raise.
Quoted from swampfire:Definitely not true.
If they didn’t think it was a problem then why would they add the washers?
Quoted from Ranhorton:Can any CGC owners confirm their playfields are free from significant issues like stern is dealing with?
MBr LE #449 no issues.
Quoted from Orko:In my experience (not in pinball), the manufacturer wants you to follow a chain of command through your distributors. Otherwise, why can’t we just buy the machines direct from the manufacturer and bypass the middleman.
This “chain of command” is a construct of the manufacturers to insulate themselves from this exact scenario. The manufacturers are out ZERO money and they leave the distributor holding the bag while dealing with disappointed customers.
Quoted from Sako-TRG:So you have a product that is under warranty.
Then you get a replacement playfield.
You now start swapping your components to your new playfield and screw your machine in the process.
You call your distributor.......
“Sorry Sir but you have now voided your warranty”!
Isn’t this a bit like opening up your VCR machine and peeling that label off that’s says warranty void if removed then tampering with all the internals Do me a favour.....
Take a look at Stern’s website.... what do you see regarding “warranty” / “warranties” .... please post any results you find.
Quoted from Sako-TRG:Consumer law different in UK
When we purchase a NIB pin we are covered for 2 years through our retailer / distributor. Our contract is with them, we don’t get into discussions with the manufacturer direct.
Unfortunately the retailer may end up with the rough end of the deal if the manufacturer- in this case Stern or JJP don’t do the right thing.
Which is why retailers here are rightly so getting a bit nervous over this whole issue.
Refreshing for the consumer - understandably frightening for the distributor.
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:.... I bet most won’t even repopulate the playfields it’s a ton of work.
That’s probably true but the new playfield salvages *some* of the resale value. Given the option of buying a used machine (with pooling, chipping, and dimpling) with a NOS playfield is much more appealing than just a used machine.
But I agree with most here - it seems like a half-measure for compensation on a very expensive machine. I think what a lot of people are forgetting - especially with the car analogies - is that for most home users, the art has value.
Quoted from Who-Dey:There are tons of people wanting to buy Jurassic Park right now if they had the confidence to do it. I think Stern would be wise to let it be known that the problem is resolved once they get it figured out. Of course the other problem is you got a bunch of bad games sitting in boxes at distributors right now and people will not want anything that is old stock so they wont buy because of that.
Yep - canceled my premium.
Quoted from DakotaMike:I seem to recall Charlie saying that Spooky has to pay something like $100 per playfield for the high-quality wood they use now, while companies like Stern only have to pay $10 per playfield for theirs. (due to the softer and lower-quality wood that they use)
Of course this leads to the question, why doesn't Stern just raise prices by another $100 and get rock-solid playfields? One easy explanation could be, that it's simply not how they think. Big companies would rather use the cheaper wood (since it's "good enough"), raise prices again anyway, and then pocket the difference. Another explanation could be that maybe Stern can't get the quantities of higher-quality playfield-wood that an operation like theirs would need. Since they're producing thousands where others are making hundreds.
I don't know, I'm not an expert on any of this stuff.
It probably comes down to the availability of the higher quality playfields.
Meaning, in the quantities Spooky needs, 500 playfields a year, is probably easier to source than 14,000 playfields a year for Stern. Just a guess.
Quoted from Extraballz:50 plays. Like new.[quoted image]
Laughing !!
0D776AF8-3029-4736-938E-3671FD4402FE (resized).jpegQuoted from Rager170:Look at all this mess all because of a lack of QC..
THIS is the bottom line.
Quoted from smalltownguy2:[quoted image]
How many layers is the ply?
Is is different from the one that’s installed?
Quoted from branlon8:Indeed, all problems of the world can be solved with modern chemistry. Oh wait, which „mess“ do you mean?
Or software.... Volkswagen TDI anyone??
Quoted from Jvspin:Shouldn't they also remove the artwork around that washer?
The ball guide doesn’t flex like a post - not necessary.
You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider lounge.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/continued-playfield-issues-with-jjp-and-stern?tu=lounge and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.
Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.
Los Angeles, CA