No problems at all with my ACNC playfield. The game is fantastic and super fun!
(Topic ID: 249870)
Linked Games
AC/DC (Pro Vault Edition)
Stern, 2017-
Batman 66 (LE)
Stern, 2016
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Batman 66 (Premium)
Stern, 2016
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Batman 66 (Super LE)
Stern, 2016
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Black Knight Sword of Rage (LE)
Stern, 2019
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Guardians of the Galaxy (LE)
Stern, 2017
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Guardians of the Galaxy (Premium)
Stern, 2017
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Guardians of the Galaxy (Pro)
Stern, 2017
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4 weeks later
Quoted from Who-Dey:Spooky, it will take you a year to get your game, IF you can even get one and their games arent as fun as Sterns games either.
Well, I absolutely Love my ACNC. I think it's the funnest game I have! Yes, I waited 18 months because I ordered right away. But I knew that going in. Spooky customer service is great! I was going to buy a NIB JP pro, but decided to grab a used Hobbit instead. It's built like a tank and as heavy as hell. I know J.J. has had some C.C. issues as well, but they are sending me a free Hobbit upgrade kit (because of build date) even though I'm the 3rd owner and warranty is long worn off. So apparently they care somewhat.
1 week later
4 months later
Quoted from JY64:The most recent pic of a chipping playfield is over 2 months old is this because of a fix or a lack of buyers
Well, when this pandemic started, I watched the market for used pins. There's been plenty available. So instead of NIB, a lot of people are probably buying used. Myself included.
I never planned to buy a NIB Stern Spike because of the CC issues and the uncertainty about node board availability down the road. But I did just pick up a used DP pro. But only because a NIB playfield was included with it. The owner also had a Batman 66 for sale with a NIB playfield. So in each case the existing playfields has CC chips. Two locations on the DP, one behind a guide rail (not visible) and one at the left bottom in-lane post. So Stern does ship out unpopulated playfieds anyway. I was looking for a winter project and have done PF swaps before, but it's not for the meek! So to each their own, but buyer beware. What burns my ass is how they keep cost cutting and still raise prices every year. People need to start voting with their wallets. But Stern does know how to make a fun pin.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Well the good news for the haters?
Stern - and everyone else - are producing zero pinball machines for now. So for the time being you won’t have to worry about any playfield issues.
Maybe they'll focus on code updates and solving their QC issues for now.
1 month later
OK, I bought a used DP pro with a NIB unpopulated playfield. There are currently two locations on the installed playfield with chipping. I did the finger test today on the installed playfield and the new one both, and noticed that on the new one, I can feel the inserts raised more. So definitely thinner C.C. on new replacement playfield.
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:New from Stern, The Find. Warped playfields, raised inserts, chipping clear coats and pooling art, See what you can "Find" on your new Stern.
You forgot shit coil stops among other things.
Quoted from koops:How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.
What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?
I bought this in part because I was looking for another project. I enjoy these projects during the winter months to stay occupied. But the PF in the machine is fine. One of the areas that is chipped is hidden from view behind a ball guide. The other is visible at the lower left sling post. But it doesn't bother me at all and people don't notice it. It would be easy to repair anyway. I may or may not swap the playfield down the road. But ideally, this new PF should get another coat of clear first. But I don't do that so it'll just look nice on my wall for now. I've heard Stern no longer does populated PF's.
Quoted from gblack:For those with newer "less clear" playfields and slightly raised inserts has anyone reached out to Stern? You can feel they are raised and can hear when a ball rolls over. I assume this will lead to increased insert wear not being a smooth surface. It sounds 50/50 if Stern will do anything.
I thought about it, but I bought it second hand. Hell, if I was going to keep Deapool for ever, I'd just cover the whole PF with Mylar and cut out the holes with Exacto knife before swapping it. But I don't want to try selling it this way. And not worth it to pay someone to cc it more. And not worth it to swap it when the replacement has thinner cc than the one in there. Best to repair the chips and sell the new PF as is. 
Also, I hate PF protectors. Had one on an F-14 and dirt kept getting under it and it scratched on the under side and really looked like ass! So I removed it.
Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:Thin clearcoat isn't a bad thing. The first clearcoated games only had a couple coats and they've lasted nearly 30 years. Most diamondplated Williams games clean up great and so do Sterns, save for the pooling and chipping issues.
I am wondering about the inserts not being flush. How will this weather over time? I'm not worried about this in the time I will own and play it, just about how these will hold up long term? I'm mostly just curious.
F-14 was an example of a playfield with only one coat of clear. They didn't hold up well. But I don't know if the clear back then was as good or better than what Stern is using now. And I also don't know how many coats of clear are being applied to these new PF's either.
Quoted from C0untDeM0net:My f-14 doesn't have any clear at all. The mylar was destroyed and had to be real careful removing it. I have the newer thin protector on now and it plays so much better than the mylar that was on it before. I do see dust under it but using compressed air to clear it has worked well so far. I'm happy with it.
Yes, compressed air is how I got the particles out as well. I had the early thicker protector. Less user friendly for sure. But I did a full restore with PPS repro playfield. It was an early run with no light boards. What a PITA! Deadpool would be a walk in the park by comparison. I would imagine that protector on your F-14 is providing a smooth surface over the raised inserts. Unless you clamped them back down and epoxied them from underneath?
Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:The inserts aren't raised, but the screening is and it isn't completely flat because there isn't mounds of clear on top.
This is an interesting point you bring up. I can't say the inserts are raised now that you mention it. Maybe it is just the screening. But my ACNC is mirror smooth by comparison. I wonder how much ball is affected by this. Probably not enough to matter. But IDK.
It most definitely seems that it's dependent on the title as to how performance is affected. I thought F-14 played really well with the protector on. Other games seem to be altered much more according to what I've read from others here over the years. A lot of guys on the Hardtop thread are asking for F-14. It may get made given the sheer numbers that were manufactured and the fact that they all have beat playfields. 
1 week later
All I can say is that my ACNC playfield is glass smooth and has no dimples after 2000 plays. The wood looks thicker and looks of better quality than the used Deadpool Pro I just bought which came with a NIB playfield included because of pooling and chipping. The surface of the NIB playfield is rough (can feel the screening everywhere under the clear even more than the existing chipped playfield. So thinner CC is a fact. But like I said, the playfield is glass smooth on my Spooky ACNC. Nowhere do I feel any raised screening. And no pooling and chipping either! It's the same with my 2016 Star Trek Pro. Also, no problems with my Hobbit.
I will NOT buy another Spike game used or new unless this changes.
Quoted from Who-Dey:Also there have been lots of insert issues popping up lately.
Quoted from o-din:[quoted image]
When you get old, your insert Not popping up becomes the issue ..
3 weeks later
Quoted from seenev:I'm really only upset about the playfield... But I do think it's a cheaper build quality overall.
I can tell you this from personal observation.. My Deadpool playfield is thinner and has less plies than my Spooky ACNC. Also the CC on ACNC is glass smooth and the NIB Deadpool Playfield that I got with the used game (because of CC chipping) is so thin you can feel the paint screening. Also, Deadpool has dimples. ACNC dimples are non existent after well over a thousand plays. So Stern's new playfields are definitely cheaper than Spooky's.
1 week later
Quoted from PtownPin:Just buy a nice HUO game....all u need is a little patience...no reason to roll the dice with Stern
That's what I did with Deadpool pro. Also got it with NIB playfield for $4700.00. I may do it again with a JP3 pro.
1 month later
Quoted from Fytr:Yep. Did that and added my usual protections to the shooter lane, outhole areas before ball 1 was played.
I use these to add protection anywhere mylar would be used. They are easy to cut and apply, and can be readily removed later if needed or get dirty, etc: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Avery-Self-Adhesive-Laminating-Sheets-9-x-12-10-Sheets-73603/29815043
Also turned down the trough power to 180 (lowest setting).
I also installed springs over the flipper solenoid plungers to tame them down some because you can't adjust the flipper power in settings. I think the flipper power is too much as it is. I think it shoots better now. I bought mine used and it had two cracked plastics, the one over the scoop and the one over li'l Deadpool at upper right.
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Quoted from Fytr:I see that there is a metal protector under the plastic above the drop targets in front of Lil' Deadpool. Are you referring to the clear plastic over the open section behind the drop targets being cracked on your game?
See post #6373
2 months later
Quoted from RipleYYY:the Houdini i've just bought is perfect, very similar to OF i owned before, and very far from what STERN is providing on their pins
but than, what is strange is that for OF it was a "Bader" playfield, and while i was thinking same manufacturer for Houdini, i'm surprised its from... "Mirco" !
Yes, I am really considering a Hot Wheels now! My ACNC is still flawless as well after 14 months.
1 month later
Well, I just ordered an American HotWheels. So now I can compare the build quality of it along side my Spooky ACNC, JJ Hobbit LE, Stern SAM and Stern Spike LOL!
Quoted from Yelobird:Admittedly I was never a Treky fan but this game just shoots Amazing. Played a Premium (I think) and was really impressed. Some day.
If you can't find a Prem/LE, the pro plays just as good! Mod it up and it can be beautiful!
Quoted from Doctor6:I'm the opposite. I bought the pro, and now that I have a premium, I would hate to go backwards. But, they Do play the same. The light show is almost like a JJP on the premium.
The clear inserts on the Prem/LE look more washed out. The pro has RGB LEDS in all the inserts and the colored inserts look more vivid. The light show is still excellent even without the fancy color washes etc.
I noticed how it's gotten much harder to find used Stern SAM games for sale in Michigan where I look. Is it that people are waking up to the quality issues of Spike and more reluctant to sell their SAM games? Or is it Covid lockdown? Probably both. 
Quoted from chuckwurt:Found two SAM games in the past couple months and looked for a day each. Covid has only increased pinball sales. Everyone was at home with lots of free time and most pinball people are essential workers. So little to no effect. Plus, all these companies, while yes under restrictions, cannot keep up with all the orders they are getting.
I can't find titles I want and I watch every day! More people are getting into pinball though.
Quoted from Nysbadmk8:You'll be pleasantly surprised. My HW was my first American... I rank it above my R&M and AIQ/Elvira
Yes! Glad to hear it...Again!!! 
I've been hearing about American's build quality since Houdini. It's one of the main reasons I bought one! I'm voting with my wallet.
1 week later
Quoted from C0untDeM0net:Thanks for that. Yeah it's uniform over the entire playfield. Seems too uniform to be wood grain but it's easier to see in person than through a phone picture.
For ST it's the same. Much more noticeable in person as it covers the playfield.
My Stern Star Trek pro has super small dimpling after thousands of plays. It's real hard to even see.
Quoted from John_I:Ghostbusters was the first SPIKE 1 game and had a ton of issues.
WWE Wrestlemania was the first Spike 1 game followed by Kiss followed by Game of Thrones followed by Ghost Busters. Then Spike 2 Batman 66.
Quoted from Chuckwebster:actually i believe the first Spike game was one of their homepins. Transformers? Spiderman? I remember seeing a one off TWD at a show somewhere that was powered by Spike too.
Are you thinking of the 2015 Stern version of WhizBang Pinball's, 2012 Whoa Nellie Big Juicy Melons? It was Spike.
1 week later
Quoted from Doctor6:Wonderful. So back to the question at hand. Do I wait to play it?
When I replaced my F-14 playfield with the PPS repro, I waited 6 months to install it. It was very solid and the dimples that I got were very very tiny. So I would wait at least the 3 months if I were you. I know it sucks, but I am convinced that this problem is mostly just CC not cured enough. I could be wrong.
7 months later
Quoted from Huggers:Hi guys. Has anyone used the hot iron technique to flatten pooling under a guide rail before applying Mylar and a washer? If so, how did you get on? Was it easy enough to do? Also, what size washer did you use?
I haven't done it, but the word is, be careful with the heat as the hot iron tool has no temp control and it can get too hot. One guy used a small metal measuring cup to do it. See post #192 in this thread..
9 months later
Well, my ACNC never even had a dimple after 18 months of play! Was smooth as glass and flawless unlike my Stern Spike games. My American HotWheels is also flawless although it has some normal dimpling.
BTW, I just installed a Hard Top on my Gorgar and it looks and plays awesome. Smooth as glass. Maybe it's time to switch to that tech and forget the clear coat since it's obviously a problem now for various reasons. Check out what Haggis Pinball is doing..
Haggis Pinball offering 3 options for playfield -
1- Traditional Plywood/Clear Coat (@1:10 "additional cost because it's much more laborious").
2- Plywood/Acrylic with scratch resistant coating (standard).
3- Plywood/Acrylic without scratch resistant coating, but clear coated instead (for those who want clear coat feel).
** Personally, I don't notice any difference between clear coated playfields and my Hard Top.
-
** Link to additional videos... https://www.youtube.com/c/HaggisPinball/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=0
Quoted from JodyG:Stern Playfields from the Roller Coaster Tycoon and Ripley's eras had excellent durability.
Yes, Stern Whitestar and Sam system games. My Stern Star Trek (Sam) has an awesome playfield. It wasn't until Spike that the real problems started. Mirco as well.
Quoted from PanzerFreak:This, as prices have risen so have expectations of quality (plus what is being included in games).
Ya, with Stern Spike quality went down as prices increased. Also, it's a f**king disgrace IMO that a rock pin (especially a premium) has cheap speakers and a cheap amp that requires you to upgrade for quality sound!! WTF? 
Quoted from chuckwurt:The printing on some of the whitestar games is awful. Not sure if it’s the source file, or the printing process, but looks really bad on some games.
At least they weren't pooling and chipping.
Stern had a reason to cut corners in the lean years!
Quoted from chuckwurt:Eh. I’ll take a chip here and there with beautiful artwork if i have to choose.
Eh. Let us know how that works out for you on your next 8K purchase.
Quoted from chuckwurt:Sold my last two games that had chipping on multiple inserts for more than I paid for them NIB. One of them was thousands more. I’m good.
Glad you enjoy your chipping!
Remind me not to buy a game from you!
Quoted from greatwichjohn:We had one of those bad Star Trek here on location. The owners got a free blank playfield from Stern.
Ya, when I bought my used Deadpool, it came with a NIB playfield. It's hanging on my wall. What I have noticed is that the original playfield has thicker clear coat than the replacement one. All you have to do is run your finger over the playfield. On the new ones, you can feel nearly every insert and paint edge. So, they are putting the clear on thinner now. My Spooky ACNC and Star Trek for example, are like glass smooth. Make of it what you will. I too am sick of this argument which is why I like to see companies like Outside Edge and Haggis bringing new options to the industry.
4 weeks later
Quoted from Rum-Z:Just an FYI on this ghosting in the black key line areas. I've noticed it on my new TMNT Pro and IMDN in a few spots. You can go under the insert and inject some water thin super glue between the insert and the routed pocket in the playfield wood with a syringe, and a lot of times the water thin super glue wicks into the ghosted area and makes the ghosting disappear. YMMV. Why this happens, I dunno. Is stern using some type of soft glue to bond inserts into the routed pockets allowing for some movement?
Here's another thing that might be a decent sign: Even though this ghosting appears in the black key line area, it may be quite stable, and it might not extend into the colored area of the insert very often. Why do I say this? I recently bought a Stranger Things with 26,000+ plays. Yeah... 26,000+. Quite a few inserts have ghosting in the black key line areas like your photos, but not one of them has extended into the colored area of any insert (yet anyways). I still plan on going under the affected inserts and "locking them down" with the water thin super glue injection whether the ghosting is stable or not, just to be safe. Oh, and all the inserts in the Stranger Things playfield are still nice and level with the well dimpled and pounded flat playfield surface. None are floating up despite the ghosting being evidence that something there is moving, shifting, or "breathing" a little bit.
I wish Stern would change the gluing method to somehow prevent this, as the ghosting is evidence of some movement as noted above. Stronger glue, less flexible glue, whatever. Does anyone from Stern see this?
Are you sure that super glue will cure in an enclosed area like that? I would think that you would need something like 2Pac for that? Super glue is an air dry chemical.
Quoted from Rum-Z:It seems to wick in there and work judging from the results I've experienced (the ghosting appears to be stabilized as it doesn't spread any further). I guess the only way to really verify would be to cut through the clear and into the void from the topside and check to see if the super glue is truly cured in the previously ghosted areas. I won't be doing that test unless I have way too much to drink and for some reason think about this subject and get very brave and curious with an exacto knife or a Dremel. If that happens, I will report back with the results (and I'm sure much regret) when I'm sober.
LOL!
I do hate the idea of buying 2 Pac just for a small project like this. Also not sure if it's even thin enough to inject? I wonder if there is another option for a very thin, clear, 2 part epoxy like material for this? But, if thin CA works... So be it. Does it have to be the thin??
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