(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

3 months ago



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There are 3273 posts in this topic. You are on page 45 of 66.
#2201 71 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

If the process has changed due to the toxic chemicals then why hasn't it affected the car makers?

Car makers don't cut and paste their artwork using the easiest and cheapest method possible?

#2202 71 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

If the process has changed due to the toxic chemicals then why hasn't it affected the car makers?

Exactly this.

#2203 71 days ago
Quoted from o-din:

Car makers don't cut and paste their artwork using the easiest and cheapest method possible?

But the clear is soft even in places with no artwork.
Not like a new car.

16
#2204 71 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

But the clear is soft even in places with no artwork.
Not like a new car.

Exactly. Automotive clearcoat has to be flexible but tough. It does it's job for the most part in all kinds of extreme weather and in most cases for years. And some how they figured out a way to make the paint stick.

With pinball it is clearly a case of being cheap, and or not doing the proper research with whatever they are doing now.

If this was the automotive industry, there would be no screwing around. A recall would be ordered or possible class action lawsuits would be filed.

#2205 71 days ago
Quoted from o-din:

Exactly. Automotive clearcoat has to be flexible but tough. It does it's job for the most part in all kinds of extreme weather and in most cases for years. And some how they figured out a way to make the paint stick.
With pinball it is clearly a case of being cheap, and or not doing the proper research with whatever they are doing now.
If this was the automotive industry, there would be no screwing around. A recall would be ordered or possible class action lawsuits would be filed.

Yep...spot on....I wouldn't be surprised if someone doesn't hold Sterns feet to the fire....they should be held accountable

#2206 71 days ago

Cars aren’t wood anymore though...wood is a mysterious substance that no manufacturer has been able to figure out. I can’t come up with any industry that has tried to paint graphics on wood. Nope.

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#2207 71 days ago
Quoted from Wickerman2:

I can’t come up with any industry that has tried to paint graphics on wood. Nope.

Well, there's skateboards.

jim (resized).jpg
#2208 71 days ago
Quoted from Rum-Z:

Well, there's skateboards.

Maybe tennis rackets, hockey sticks...

#2209 71 days ago

All it took for me was buying one new game with a crappy cratored playfield. Did I start a thread about it? No. I was already a little embarrassed that I bought it in the first place because of the theme, which after a couple weeks I realized what I had done.

So I sold it for a loss, like I have every NIB I bought, and chalked it up to a learning experience.

How people can have multiple games with playfield issues and still complain is beyond me.

#2210 71 days ago

Nope. Not one. The code has yet to be cracked

#2211 71 days ago
Quoted from Rum-Z:

there's skateboards

Brainstorm. Stern could release a Tony Hawk LE and the playfield could be built by a skateboard company. Just spitballing

#2212 71 days ago

From what people are saying here the clear coat is soft because it's sprayed on wood with a digital print over it.
I'm not buying that theory.
I can understand the print lifting with clear coat on it but to me that doesn't explain the soft clear.

#2213 71 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Yep...spot on....I wouldn't be surprised if someone doesn't hold Sterns feet to the fire....they should be held accountable

Has Stern refused any returns? (Honest question)
Curious to know if anyone has been refused a return and if so, what condition their playfield was in.
It’s my impression that they are replacing these defects, despite not being listed in the warranty.
Interested in hearing if that’s not accurate.

#2214 71 days ago
Quoted from Wickerman2:

Cars aren’t wood anymore though...wood is a mysterious substance that no manufacturer has been able to figure out. I can’t come up with any industry that has tried to paint graphics on wood. Nope.

Hand painted art on harpsichords has been around for centuries. Pianos have high quality clear over paint that is tough but flexible. Guitars use clear over paint, stain, graphics, and raw wood.

#2215 71 days ago
Quoted from Chambahz:

Has Stern refused any returns? (Honest question)
Curious to know if anyone has been refused a return and if so, what condition their playfield was in.
It’s my impression that they are replacing these defects, despite not being listed in the warranty.
Interested in hearing if that’s not accurate.

I'll let you know. I sent them photos of the paint peeling on my new LE. They've been reviewing them. But it's only been a week, so I don't have an answer yet.

#2216 71 days ago

Or Chicago Gaming's playfields. Haven't heard many complaints or clear issues with their remakes.

#2217 71 days ago

My MBr has a FLAWLESS play-field and it was manufactured June 04 2019. It is the standard I expect from every NIB I buy.

#2218 71 days ago

I will say this...I just started buying NIB. My first was a CGC MBr. Not one issue or complaint with it. It is exactly what I expected when I bought it. Nothing has stopped working or broken in the first few months I have owned it.

Now...I have just bought a Stern and a Jersey Jack pinball machine. Both have yet to arrive at my home. CGC has set the standard for me in regards to quality and reliability. I am going to be curious to see what issues I have with either of them and how either company is going to handle any issues I have going forward.

#2219 71 days ago
Quoted from Izzy24:

Yeah Catwoman edition

Thanks.

#2220 71 days ago
Quoted from Chambahz:

Has Stern refused any returns? (Honest question)
Curious to know if anyone has been refused a return and if so, what condition their playfield was in.
It’s my impression that they are replacing these defects, despite not being listed in the warranty.
Interested in hearing if that’s not accurate.

really? so Stern has started replacing JP play fields? I haven't heard that

#2221 71 days ago
Quoted from hawkmoon77:

I sent them photos of the paint peeling on my new LE. They've been reviewing them. But it's only been a week, so I don't have an answer yet.

2 or 3 years ago I called Stern about a rivet in the lock down bar breaking and the handle was just hanging. They told me to email a picture. The next afternoon they were calling me on the phone apologizing and offering to not only send the part but to also pay someone to install it.

Has anyone had decent luck with Stern like this? Do they still tend to other issues and only drag their feet with the clear coat issues or do drag their feet with all problems now?

#2222 71 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

really? so Stern has started replacing JP play fields? I haven't heard that

I specifically asked if anyone had been REFUSED.
Still waiting is not the same as refused.

#2223 71 days ago
Quoted from Chambahz:

I specifically asked if anyone had been REFUSED.
Still waiting is not the same as refused.

I'm more interested in action....to date there has been ZERO....maybe that will change, but I doubt it....

#2224 71 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I'm more interested in action....to date there has been ZERO....maybe that will change, but I doubt it....

Stern also took quite a while to swap ghostbusters playfields but in the end, I think they got them all.

#2225 71 days ago
Quoted from ArcadiusMaximus:

Not really a head scratcher. You had different processes, different materials, and a whole slew of toxic chemicals that are now considered unsafe.
#gimmebackmyVOCs

So cars, hockeysticks, industrial floorings etc are not having The same environmental restrictions that pinball has.
Have to call Bull on that one.
Incompetence is the Word. Environmental is just a really bad excuse.

#2226 71 days ago
Quoted from Dr-pin:

So cars, hockeysticks, industrial floorings etc are not having The same environmental restrictions that pinball has.
Have to call Bull on that one.
Incompetence is the Word. Environmental is just a really bad excuse.

Odin hit the nail on the head....its just another example of Stern being really cheap....having play field issues is inexcusable for a company of that size....they simply went to a cheaper supplier and they got what they paid for....shitty play fields...

#2227 71 days ago
Quoted from JohnnyPinball007:

2 or 3 years ago I called Stern about a rivet in the lock down bar breaking and the handle was just hanging. They told me to email a picture. The next afternoon they were calling me on the phone apologizing and offering to not only send the part but to also pay someone to install it.
Has anyone had decent luck with Stern like this? Do they still tend to other issues and only drag their feet with the clear coat issues or do drag their feet with all problems now?

When my LE arrived, there were a few parts that they forgot to install on the playfield, and one of the plastics was chipped. They were quick to apologize and seemed a bit embarrassed about the missing parts. They immediately put in an order to have them sent to me. That was only a week ago and I already got a notification from UPS that it shipped.

The peeling paint is currently being reviewed by their QC people. That seems to be taking a bit longer.

13
#2228 71 days ago

I bought my first NIB 3years ago, Met Prem and when I received it, I lifted the playfield and I saw a giant 2 gouges about 5 inches long right next each other. Some dumbass installed the bracket little to the right and it must have gouged it when they tried to move the playfield. I'm certain this is how i got my cabinet looking like wolverine went to town because there was a extra drilled hole next to where the bracket was screwed in. And my sparky had a giant chip top of his cap also.

So I called my distributor and sent the pictures and he said I'll be getting a new sparky and just wait for the word on the cabinet. It's been 3 fucking years and I haven't received jack from Stern. I sold it a year ago and took a giant loss on it due to the wolverine gouges. Haven't fucked with any stern since and never going to and if I do, it will be used. The price they are charging are beyond retarded for what they put in the game to start with but if you are paying $6-15g for a item, it should come damn near perfect.

#2229 71 days ago
Quoted from Wickerman2:

Cars aren’t wood anymore

Unknown (resized).jpg
#2230 71 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

From what people are saying here the clear coat is soft because it's sprayed on wood with a digital print over it.
I'm not buying that theory.
I can understand the print lifting with clear coat on it but to me that doesn't explain the soft clear.

The clear Stern use has been "soft" for many years, even on CGC playfields done for Stern in 2014 and 2015. Formulas in the clear coat can be changed to suit, giving plasticity (Soft clear) while still maintaining wear resistance. There is no issues with the clear, the formula has not changed much for Stern over the last 5 years. I am not sure before that.
The clear is not the issue with pooling.

12
#2231 71 days ago
Quoted from Rum-Z:

Well, there's skateboards.[quoted image]

Yeah but similarly screen printed is way better than the heat wrap they use now

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#2232 71 days ago
Quoted from Izzy24:

Yeah but similarly screen printed is way better than the heat wrap they use now[quoted image]

Those are some cool looking boards! Nice

#2233 71 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

If the process has changed due to the toxic chemicals then why hasn't it affected the car makers?

Because prepping metal for paint and clear vs prepping art work covered new growth plywood wood is like comparing apples to walruses.

11
#2234 71 days ago
Quoted from ArcadiusMaximus:

Because prepping metal for paint and clear vs prepping art work covered new growth plywood wood is like comparing apples to walruses.

Yea it sure seems Hard, since only the three smaller companies are able to do it right.

It's an embarrassing fucking joke. That's what it is, and what makes it even worse are all the useful idiots making excuses.

#2235 71 days ago

Stern's site has a contact page, has anyone ever received a reply from it and if so how was the reply received was it via email or a call?

#2236 71 days ago
Quoted from extendo:

email or a call?

Both, back when I called them on the phone first about a broken lock down bar.

#2237 70 days ago

And this plus Spike are the reasons Im not buying any new pins from them at this time.

#2238 70 days ago
Quoted from Izzy24:

Yeah but similarly screen printed is way better than the heat wrap they use now[quoted image]

Jeff, is that you?!?

#2239 70 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

The clear is not the issue with pooling.

I'm not sure I follow. If the clear is soft, and I clamp a washer down on it, why wouldn't that result in being displaced into a pool next to the washer?

#2240 70 days ago
Quoted from Toads:

If the process has changed due to the toxic chemicals then why hasn't it affected the car makers?

Last time I checked Cars don't have Digital Printed Panels made of Wood

#2241 70 days ago
Quoted from Dr-pin:

Yea it sure seems Hard, since only the three smaller companies are able to do it right.
It's an embarrassing fucking joke. That's what it is, and what makes it even worse are all the useful idiots making excuses.

No one is making excuses as much as they are trying to identify a root cause. Either way to your point if I was a large manufacturer and I had boutique game companies showing me up in the quality department ( especially for what these things cost), I'd be stepping it up a notch.

#2242 70 days ago
Quoted from o-din:

No, they seem to use a tried and true method with quality paint.

They also have squadrons of chemist and engineers on staff

#2243 70 days ago
Quoted from DanDanDAN:They also have squadrons of chemist and engineers on staff

And I’m sure there are technical service reps from the clear coat suppliers available to help Stern, JJP and Micro resolve the issues.

#2244 70 days ago
Quoted from luckymoey:

And I’m sure there are technical service reps from the clear coat suppliers available to help Stern, JJP and Micro resolve the issues.

Yes, but a rep is not nearly as good as having a dedicated staff on call. Besides the car industry is not totally immune. There are plenty of car manufacturers who have issues with soft and easily damaged paint, whether its applied too thin (modified process) or an EPA regulation issue (less durable compositions).

#2245 70 days ago
Quoted from LukyDuck:

I just started buying NIB. My first was a CGC MBr. Now I have just bought a Stern and a Jersey Jack pinball NIB.

You can afford NIB games from all three manufacturers? You are a lucky duck!

#2246 70 days ago
Quoted from Utesichiban:

Does anyone know if any of Stern's recent playfield issues (pooling, chipping, etc) affected Guardians of the Galaxy pins as well? I played one recently and liked it a lot more then I expected. I am now thinking about looking for a premium on the used market if one pops up in my region.
Any insight is very appreciated.

Do not buy a premium of GOTG. There is not nearly enough over the pro to justify the cost. Spinners, extra magnet, Groot hands. Not worth it. Go pro.

#2247 70 days ago
Quoted from hawkmoon77:

I'm not sure I follow. If the clear is soft, and I clamp a washer down on it, why wouldn't that result in being displaced into a pool next to the washer?

When the clear is fully adhered to the wood (no artwork), that does not happen. Tighten them down as hard as you like, this will only chip the clear out eventually as it is completely adhered to the wood.

Issue is when there is artwork, and clear before the wood. The artwork is not adhering to the wood. The clear is adhering to the artwork. When you tighten the posts down it is making the artwork bunch up taking the clear with it.

Simple issue, difficult solution as I am sure the playfield manufacturer has spent a shit ton of money on the UV set computer printed artwork that does not stick to the wood properly.

#2248 70 days ago
Quoted from extendo:

Stern's site has a contact page, has anyone ever received a reply from it and if so how was the reply received was it via email or a call?

Many times with a good result. If you get stuck, please let us know.

#2249 70 days ago

I know this isn't a paint related issue, but with regard to playfield quality...Along with peeled paint and missing parts that were never installed on the playfield, I just discovered what appears to be the wrong colored insert installed on my LE playfield. All RESCUE targets are supposed to be red/orange. Somehow, a clear one got into my playfield. Do they make orange bulbs?

INSERT Problem (resized).jpg
#2250 70 days ago
Quoted from hawkmoon77:

appears to be the wrong colored insert installed

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