(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

63 days ago



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There are 2722 posts in this topic. You are on page 28 of 55.
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#1351 40 days ago
Quoted from cpr9999:

All the cancelled orders probably got their attention.

Strern does not take orders or preorders. There are zero cancelled preorders with Stern. Distributors but from Stern, they buy every game before they sell them. You cancelling does not effect Stern selling to the distro. It just leaves the distro holding the game he already had on order. Strern is only effected if distros stop buying. Sisters don't want to stop because they don't want to not have games if a customer calls for one.

#1352 40 days ago

It is fascinating that nobody has been able to verify who makes the playfields for Stern yet their playfield clearcoat issues seem nearly identical to recent JJPs made by Mirco.

16
#1353 40 days ago
Quoted from Faustria:

Strern does not take orders or preorders. There are zero cancelled preorders with Stern. Distributors but from Stern, they buy every game before they sell them. You cancelling does not effect Stern selling to the distro. It just leaves the distro holding the game he already had on order. Strern is only effected if distros stop buying. Sisters don't want to stop because they don't want to not have games if a customer calls for one.

Um, not exactly. They buy them in batches. If they don’t sell they don’t buy more batches. For sure hurts Stern.

#1354 40 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

Um, not exactly. They buy them in batches. If they don’t sell they don’t buy more batches. For sure hurts Stern.

Yup, the volume of orders slows to distributors, thus the distributors don’t order. It has gotten Sterns attention, they stopped the line to scrutinize the LEs my distributor says.

#1355 40 days ago
Quoted from cpr9999:

Yup, the volume of orders slows to distributors, thus the distributors don’t order. It has gotten Sterns attention, they stopped the line to scrutinize the LEs my distributor says.

They should have been scrutinizing them to begin with!!

-wonka owner #08742206, play field #105, clear coat case #5107

17
#1356 40 days ago

I asked one of my distributors for a price/delivery quote on the new Dinosaur game from Stern (premium).....I then asked if they've solved the play field issues, and he was honest and said no. He said that Stern is aware of the pooling/chipping problem and working on a solution. Also said that sales have significantly slowed on JJP and Stern games....so yes its impacting the manufacturers.....lets hope they actually come out with a solution so we can talk about something else

10
#1357 40 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I asked one of my distributors for a price/delivery quote on the new Dinosaur game from Stern (premium).....I then asked if they've solved the play field issues, and he was honest and said no. He said that Stern is aware of the pooling/chipping problem and working on a solution. Also said that sales have significantly slowed on JJP and Stern games....so yes its impacting the manufacturers.....lets hope they actually come out with a solution so we can talk about something else

There are tons of people wanting to buy Jurassic Park right now if they had the confidence to do it and i am one of them. I think Stern would be wise to let it be known that the problem is resolved once they get it figured out. Of course the other problem is you got a bunch of bad games sitting in boxes at distributors right now and people will not want anything that is old stock so they wont buy because of that.

#1358 40 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

There are tons of people wanting to buy Jurassic Park right now if they had the confidence to do it. I think Stern would be wise to let it be known that the problem is resolved once they get it figured out. Of course the other problem is you got a bunch of bad games sitting in boxes at distributors right now and people will not want anything that is old stock so they wont buy because of that.

Yep - canceled my premium.

#1359 40 days ago

Still hanging onto my JP2 premium order, but I'm out in a heartbeat if the LEs aren't fixed.

#1360 40 days ago

It sucks, cancelled my JPLE.

#1361 40 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

There are tons of people wanting to buy Jurassic Park right now if they had the confidence to do it and i am one of them. I think Stern would be wise to let it be known that the problem is resolved once they get it figured out. Of course the other problem is you got a bunch of bad games sitting in boxes at distributors right now and people will not want anything that is old stock so they wont buy because of that.

In my opinion anyone willing to roll that dice should do so assuming nothing will be done. My guess is unless your game is chipping they won't do anything about it...I hope I'm wrong, but thats my guess

#1362 40 days ago

Other than Joe Newhart, has any other distributors chimed in for current owners with these issues. Not only should Stern and Jjp address it but the distributors should be beating down there doors with these defective pieces of shat, fighting for there customers.

#1363 40 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

One more thing...this isn't just about the clear. My IMDN has awful wood grain showing through the artwork.

I have the same thing on a game that was just purchased, there are a couple of places where it isn't flat and the lines are a little deeper. Along with some other tearing/bunching up of the artwork at two points
Thought it looked a little strange, because I've never seen it before now.

#1364 40 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I asked one of my distributors for a price/delivery quote on the new Dinosaur game from Stern (premium).....I then asked if they've solved the play field issues, and he was honest and said no. He said that Stern is aware of the pooling/chipping problem and working on a solution. Also said that sales have significantly slowed on JJP and Stern games....so yes its impacting the manufacturers.....lets hope they actually come out with a solution so we can talk about something else

& my distributor told me the issue has been fixed ............

12
#1365 40 days ago

I was also told the issue was fixed. But in just 3 weeks how? My guess is they are just throwing washers on and waiting longer to see what blisters up before boxing. Band aided but not fixed. So I cancelled my LE as without a statement and a guarantee I don’t think anything changed.

#1366 40 days ago
Quoted from BOBCADE:

I was also told the issue was fixed. But in just 3 weeks how? My guess is they are just throwing washers on and waiting longer to see what blisters up before boxing. Band aided but not fixed. So I cancelled my LE as without a statement and a guarantee I don’t think anything changed.

well we'll find out soon enough when the LE's start shipping....these distributors are in a tough position...sitting on inventory that they have no idea what the status is...

#1367 40 days ago

It’s been going on for over a year across multiple titles so that weighed heavy in my personal decision. I feel for the distributors with LE allotments but otherwise must have had a clue this has been the new norm that would eventually catch up with them.

Quoted from PtownPin:

well we'll find out soon enough when the LE's start shipping....these distributors are in a tough position...sitting on inventory that they have no idea what the status is...

#1368 40 days ago
Quoted from BOBCADE:

It’s been going on for over a year across multiple titles so that weighed heavy in my personal decision. I feel for the distributors with LE allotments but otherwise must have had a clue this has been the new norm that would eventually catch up with them.

This is the part I struggle with. How could it have possibly taken a over a year for Stern to realize there was a problem? Did they truly not know or did they ship machines despite knowing the playfield issues existed?

#1369 40 days ago
Quoted from Vinnie:

This is the part I struggle with. How could it have possibly taken a over a year for Stern to realize there was a problem? Did they truly not know or did they ship machines despite knowing the playfield issues existed?

90% of their customers (both Pinsiders and non-Pinsiders) will never see this on their playfield as an issue on their own. However, over the last 18-24 months It has now occurred long enough & often enough that a critical mass of complaints has been achieved.

11
#1370 40 days ago

It's only an issue when the money stops rolling in.

#1371 40 days ago

The other thing is that timing wise this couldn't have come at a worse time for Stern. Their last 2 cornerstone pins (Munsters & BKSOR) were not all they hoped to be in sales, and now that they have a very high possibility of a massive hit on their hands in Jurassic Park these playfield issues finally come to a boil.....

16
#1372 40 days ago
Quoted from GamerRick:

Jack called me tonight as well. He is sending me a new playfield for both my POTC and Wonka! They will be playfields from a new run. I’m very satisfied with a personal call and a free replacement playfield. I feel that is fair under the circumstances. Great touch to call customers personally. I’m impressed with that. We spoke for a few minutes and he was very genuine. He thanked me for my business and trust in his company as well and wanted to make sure I knew he valued me as a customer.
Is Gary Stern calling anyone?

still unacceptable. If they do not send populated playfields for swap it is crap move.

are you going to enjoy doing 2 playfield swaps on 2 brand new games that you paid $18,000 for?

#1373 40 days ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

& my distributor told me the issue has been fixed ............

name the distributor?

#1374 40 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

Still hanging onto my JP2 premium order, but I'm out in a heartbeat if the LEs aren't fixed.

Yancy - Smart decision. I'm already out on premium though bc I'm at the point where I need to see this over a period. I don't Stern is just going to junk all the pfs.... You'll see them slowly bring in the fixed pfs mixed in with older flawed pfs so I don't premiums will all be good and no question they aren't for LE hence the delay

#1375 40 days ago

Tilt Pinball Bar in Minneapolis was supposed to get a JP LE for today's launch party.

They got a 2nd pro. Playfield looks nice so far, washers under the posts. First pro they have does have some pooling, but this second one is looking good as of now.

Seems like LEs may actually be getting delayed a bit?! Possibly a good thing if so.
Screen Shot 2019-09-13 at 3.03.33 PM (resized).png

#1376 40 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

It's only an issue when the money stops rolling in.

Agreed, but surely by keeping your order you're helping them with their decision to not address this? Why not pull the order until you know it's resolved? The LE might come next but who knows what stock of questionable playfields are dribbled out after? I'd want to know that the manufacturer will support the distributor 100% on any pf issue and Stern have shown over the last few years that they would rather move the goalposts, or in this case put washers under them....

#1377 40 days ago
Quoted from JonCrox:

Agreed, so by keeping your order you're helping them with their decision to not give a shit. Why not hold off until you know it's resolved?

I believe in his previous post Yancy said he was holding out to see if the LE's are good to make his decision. Sounds like a sound decision to me.

#1378 40 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

I believe in his previous post Yancy said he was holding out to see if the LE's are good to make his decision. Sounds like a sound decision to me.

Yeah sorry re read that and edited my post accordingly.

#1379 40 days ago

New Elvira Teaser on FB and people have forgotten there is even a PF problem at all, $$$$$ in hand

#1380 40 days ago

Just played an early JP...no major pooling that I could see.

20190913_173242 (resized).jpg20190913_173259 (resized).jpg
#1381 40 days ago
Quoted from delt31:

I don't Stern is just going to junk all the pfs.... You'll see them slowly bring in the fixed pfs mixed in with older flawed pfs so I don't premiums will all be good and no question they aren't for LE hence the delay

My initial guess a couple weeks ago was that if Stern already made "bad" LE playfields, they could set them aside for premiums, and make a new run of "good" LE playfields. Take care of the highest-dollar customers. I have zero evidence of course, but there was a delay before building LEs.

10
#1382 40 days ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Just played an early JP...no major pooling that I could see.[quoted image][quoted image]

The top post is starting. You can see the reflection of the clear going up.

#1383 40 days ago
Quoted from flashinstinct:

The top post is starting. You can see the reflection of the clear going up.

That's what I was thinking

#1384 39 days ago

Sorry but adding a larger star post with a washer is only a coverup.

11
#1385 39 days ago
Quoted from woody76:

still unacceptable. If they do not send populated playfields for swap it is crap move.
are you going to enjoy doing 2 playfield swaps on 2 brand new games that you paid $18,000 for?

Well first off, my distributor is replacing my Wonka. It’s beyond repair. I expect that one to be fine. We’ll see. On the POTC, the playfield is fine for probably a while. Maybe I get ten years out of it. The playfield would not be in best shape by then anyway even if pristine now after heavy use of ten years. So instead of having to buy a new playfield, I already have a free one. So now let’s say I pay $1500 to have the playfield swapped and re-populated, it really only cost me $500 more because I already have a free playfield. Then I have a new machine ten years after purchase. Not that bad actually. I get your point of course, but I’m satisfied with this. Obviously there are people who aren’t.

15
#1386 39 days ago
Quoted from GamerRick:

Well first off, my distributor is replacing my Wonka. It’s beyond repair. I expect that one to be fine. We’ll see. On the POTC, the playfield is fine for probably a while. Maybe I get ten years out of it. The playfield would not be in best shape by then anyway even if pristine now after heavy use of ten years. So instead of having to buy a new playfield, I already have a free one. So now let’s say I pay $1500 to have the playfield swapped and re-populated, it really only cost me $500 more because I already have a free playfield. Then I have a new machine ten years after purchase. Not that bad actually. I get your point of course, but I’m satisfied with this. Obviously there are people who aren’t.

That's their hope. Sub-par quality product, price increase, and customers are ok with it.

Maybe we'll get to the point they remove fuses, fires break out, and customers are ok with parts of their house burning up - especially in all those basements.

Over-the-top silly, I know, and that's intentional. Never thought I'd see the day people pay $8K+ for a product, get a PF on the side with the eventual need for it to be swapped out on their less than 30 day old toy, and be ok with it.

#1387 39 days ago
Quoted from NPO:

Over-the-top silly, I know, and that's intentional. Never thought I'd see the day people pay $8K+ for a product, get a PF on the side with the eventual need for it to be swapped out on their less than 30 day old toy, and be ok with it.

Agreed, it’s absolute insanity.

20
#1388 39 days ago

Stern announced elvira 3 today and people are already throwing money at stern with no mention of poor quality playfields. It is hilarious.

15
#1389 39 days ago
Quoted from NPO:

That's their hope. Sub-par quality product, price increase, and customers are ok with it.
Maybe we'll get to the point they remove fuses, fires break out, and customers are ok with parts of their house burning up - especially in all those basements.
Over-the-top silly, I know, and that's intentional. Never thought I'd see the day people pay $8K+ for a product, get a PF on the side with the eventual need for it to be swapped out on their less than 30 day old toy, and be ok with it.

Rick is a good guy and I have other friends on here that share his same thoughts but I will never back down from saying a fully populated "quality" playfield is the only acceptable resolution to the problem. I'm not being so hardcore because I'm an asshole (ok maybe I am), I'm being hardcore because it's the right thing for these companies to do. 5-10k is a lot of money and you should get a great quality product at those prices.

#1390 39 days ago
Quoted from woody76:

Stern announced elvira 3 today and people are already throwing money at stern with no mention of poor quality playfields. It is hilarious.

They better throw some extra coil stops in their cart while they are at it! Maybe some mylar sheets... Super glue... Heat gun...

#1391 39 days ago

Seems the buzz is Elvira 3 will have BM66 type pricing. That puts me out an what would have been a wanted buy for me. Plus side is maybe that will put more time in between any future game purchases and hopefully resolution of current playfield clear problems.

Will Elvira 3 playfields have trouble free clear coat ?

Will there be washers under star posts ? Will that be the new norm for Stern going forward ? Wondering.

14
#1392 39 days ago

Just took my money to the bank. I'm going to pay off my mortgage completely now that the tax credit on mortgage interest is dunzo. Mortgage Free is my new "Lifestyle Brand"...

#1393 39 days ago
Quoted from Rondogg:

Just took my money to the bank. I'm going to pay off my mortgage completely now that the tax credit on mortgage interest is dunzo. Mortgage Free is my new "Lifestyle Brand"...

Unfortunately, buying a new boat, car, and Pinball machine with a home equity loan would make the interest paid non tax deductible.

You can still deduct interest on loans used to buy, construct or improve homes. There is a cap to that value that qualifies, and it did lower this year.

.... stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.

#1394 39 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

Um, not exactly. They buy them in batches. If they don’t sell they don’t buy more batches. For sure hurts Stern.

The original comment was Stern loses money when people cancel pre orders, that's wrong. Stern loses when distributors don't buy, but distros will buy, it's a question of if distros continue to buy after the first batch. Those aren't pre orders.

#1395 39 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

In my opinion anyone willing to roll that dice should do so assuming nothing will be done. My guess is unless your game is chipping they won't do anything about it...I hope I'm wrong, but thats my guess

I don’t make enough money to roll the dice like that. I’m out on NIBs until the issue is fixed. I suspect they won’t confirm any issue or resolution so I will probably continue to save money

#1396 39 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

fully populated "quality" playfield is the only acceptable resolution to the problem. I'm not being so hardcore because I'm an asshole

You're not.....I wouldn't have the faintest idea of how to do it....It takes me a lot of time to disassemble, clean and replace playfield parts during a shop. I guarantee I would screw up taking apart the bottom and transferring it to another!

#1397 39 days ago
Quoted from woody76:

Stern announced elvira 3 today and people are already throwing money at stern with no mention of poor quality playfields. It is hilarious.

Elvira with ripples is a 3d feature. They can charge extra.

#1398 39 days ago

I just bought my first NIB pin yesterday (Deadpool Pro). I have been following this thread and several others regarding issues with PFs, pooling, chipping, etc. I scoured the pf after I unboxed it and didn’t see any pooling, chipping, or issues with the playfield graphics. I ordered new coil stops a few days ago from Pinball Life and when I went to swap them last night, discovered the stern ones didn’t appear to be the bronze ones everyone has had issues with. My pin was made on Aug 22nd, 2019. I just thought I would share my experience with a recently built NIB pin.

#1399 39 days ago
Quoted from Faustria:

The original comment was Stern loses money when people cancel pre orders, that's wrong. Stern loses when distributors don't buy, but distros will buy, it's a question of if distros continue to buy after the first batch. Those aren't pre orders.

A lot of people lose the deduction because of the cap on state and local taxes. The cap causes people to not get past the standard deduction even when factoring in interest deductions.

#1400 39 days ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

It is fascinating that nobody has been able to verify who makes the playfields for Stern yet their playfield clearcoat issues seem nearly identical to recent JJPs made by Mirco.

Remember that thought as dozens of pinsiders tour the stern factory next month

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