(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

1 year ago

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There are 8232 posts in this topic. You are on page 163 of 165.
#8101 19 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

I’ve bought all the recent Stern games. No issues with any. No chipping. No pooling, No (very minimal) dimpling. I’d say they solved the secret sauce. I have a GnR LE on the way soon, hopeful that playfield is rock solid too.

Still having issues with guide rails digging into the pf, and now they're having problems with pf warping / bowing. And that's a far more serious problem.

-1
#8102 19 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Still having issues with guide rails digging into the pf, and now they're having problems with pf warping / bowing. And that's a far more serious problem.

No issues here

19
#8103 19 days ago

This will blow your fucking mind: just because you don't have cancer doesnt mean cancer isn't a serious issue.

-10
#8104 19 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

This will blow your fucking mind: just because you don't have cancer doesnt mean cancer isn't a serious issue.

Or MAYBE the issues are being blown out of proportion

#8105 19 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

Or MAYBE the issues are being blown out of proportion

No. Wtf, you're like a cartoon ostrich that has its head in the sand. I've had two machines that had the playfield replaced. The warping issue is real and it is horrible.

#8106 19 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

No. Wtf, you're like a cartoon ostrich that has its head in the sand. I've had two machines that had the playfield replaced. The warping issue is real and it is horrible.

Ok. Bye

#8107 19 days ago

I think everyone just fears being that one in a hundred recipients of a bum playfield. Is it one in 50, 100, or one in 500 or 1000? I don't know, but it is not ZERO to be sure. Are they major defects that leave the factory or minor ones? All over the board I am sure. Problems with paint, Clearcoat, warping and mechanics seem pretty obvious to be caught....

IMHO, at these prices, anything that leaves the factory should be thoroughly QC'd visually and functionally, and sent to re-work/repair if any problems are found BEFORE the machines are shipped. This deep detailed QC may not be happening or may not be as critical as we all are. Very frustrating, but as others have said for the past few years, how the manufacturer resolves quality problems is one of the biggest measures for customer satisfaction. And while some large percentage of the machines that make it into the wild are fine, no one wants to be THE LUCKY ONE to get the bum playfield.

I have purchased just three NIB machines in the past 2 years and although I keep writing the checks, I cringe at at the thought of opening the box and seeing the playfield lottery (mentioned earlier) in real life! I have a JP Premium landing in California in the next two weeks or so, and already have my fingers crossed!

#8108 19 days ago
Quoted from Markharris2000:

IMHO, at these prices, anything that leaves the factory should be thoroughly QC'd visually and functionally, and sent to re-work/repair if any problems are found BEFORE the machines are shipped.

That would be great for us but I just don't see the factory doing that as long as they have plenty of buyers.

Lets say 100 playfields have problems. Hmmm...what's the factory going to do?
1) Bare the cost to replace and rework all 100 playfields before shipping (which may not work for things like chipping or pooling if they haven't fixed the cause).
2) Wait until someone who cares about it complains, in which case you send them a blank playfield and let them replace it.
3) For the few really bad playfields or most persistent complainers, send out a populated playfield.

#8109 19 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

Or MAYBE the issues are being blown out of proportion

Well, a warped pf can literally make a game unplayable if it's bad enough. So it's a big deal to the owner. And while cc/pf cosmetic issues don't ruin the game, they certainly aren't ideal.

It's hard to gauge how many pins coming out of Stern have these issues, but they are still happening. So the QC/pf issues aren't solved.

In fact, I'd say I've probably heard of more issues since LZ was released than in the previous 6 months. So if anything, the problems are getting worse/more frequent.

#8110 19 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Well, a warped pf can literally make a game unplayable if it's bad enough. So it's a big deal to the owner. And while cc/pf cosmetic issues don't ruin the game, they certainly aren't ideal.
It's hard to gauge how many pins coming out of Stern have these issues, but they are still happening. So the QC/pf issues aren't solved.
In fact, I'd say I've probably heard of more issues since LZ was released than in the previous 6 months. So if anything, the problems are getting worse/more frequent.

All the more reason to stop buying NIB and just wait for machines to hit the secondary market. Why take on the risk as a NIB buyer? LEs and CEs are just marketing ploys to get people to have FOMO. It’s the same game as the Premium and LE for JJP but with more flair. Just wait for a used machine to hit the market after these NIB buyers complain that a “game is too hard” or “the rule set is too complex”.

We spend $9k+ on these toys that don’t have any real QC... the thought of it is just plain ridiculous. And now JJP won’t even send a replacement PF?? What kind of customer service is that? Are they really hurting for money so bad that they can’t send customers a $200 PF? I’m done buying NIB from stern and JJP.

Spooky and American are the only companies that seem to have the PF situation figured out.

#8111 19 days ago
Quoted from dancosta:

All the more reason to stop buying NIB and just wait for machines to hit the secondary market. Why take on the risk as a NIB buyer? LEs and CEs are just marketing ploys to get people to have FOMO. It’s the same game as the Premium and LE for JJP but with more flair. Just wait for a used machine to hit the market after these NIB buyers complain that a “game is too hard” or “the rule set is too complex”.
We spend $9k+ on these toys that don’t have any real QC... the thought of it is just plain ridiculous. And now JJP won’t even send a replacement PF?? What kind of customer service is that? Are they really hurting for money so bad that they can’t send customers a $200 PF? I’m done buying NIB from stern and JJP.
Spooky and American are the only companies that seem to have the PF situation figured out.

Yeah, so far I've been hearing that Stern will send a populated replacement if your pf is actually bowed/warped. They seem to be taking that a lot more seriously than the chipping stuff.

#8112 18 days ago
Quoted from Markharris2000:

I think everyone just fears being that one in a hundred recipients of a bum playfield. Is it one in 50, 100, or one in 500 or 1000? I don't know, but it is not ZERO to be sure. Are they major defects that leave the factory or minor ones? All over the board I am sure. Problems with paint, Clearcoat, warping and mechanics seem pretty obvious to be caught....

Correct, and the fear is amplified due to manufacturer lack of support.
I don't have this fear with any other consumer product because I know I can easily get it exchanged at no cost or repaired at no cost by someone else (that is not me)

#8113 18 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Yeah, so far I've been hearing that Stern will send a populated replacement if your pf is actually bowed/warped. They seem to be taking that a lot more seriously than the chipping stuff.

Not mine. Got a playfield only. Of course mine was replacing a final voyage star trek, so I had to replace the playfield myself.

#8114 18 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Yeah, so far I've been hearing that Stern will send a populated replacement if your pf is actually bowed/warped. They seem to be taking that a lot more seriously than the chipping stuff.

Correct. Warpy my LZ playfield was replaced by Stern with a fully populated one. New one is flat as can be, no chipping, no pooling, and considering how much the ball flies around, minimal dimples.

#8115 18 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Yeah, so far I've been hearing that Stern will send a populated replacement if your pf is actually bowed/warped. They seem to be taking that a lot more seriously than the chipping stuff.

The key to having Stern approve a populated PF swap is the ball and gameplay must be affected by the flaw. A sunken insert or a warped PF seems to be a shoe-in for this. Cosmetic issues alone seem to be a tougher road to take.

#8116 18 days ago
Quoted from Markharris2000:

Is it (bad playfields) one in 50, 100, or one in 500 or 1000? Are they major defects or minor ones?

Quoted from DakotaMike:

Stern seems to be taking bowed/warped playfields a lot more seriously than the chipping stuff.

Any reputable company should be able to take care of product warranty issues when the complaints/claims are a very small percentage of production, such as warped playfields seem to be in Stern games. From the numerous posts we all see, clearcoat pooling is far more widespread. Pinsiders unbox new games and immediately inspect the playfield closely for any sign of pooling around posts or guides. It looks like Stern has decided they cannot afford to supply populated replacement playfields for just pooling. Some unpopulated playfields have been sent on a case-to-case basis for games with pooling and chipping.

#8117 16 days ago
Quoted from Max_Badazz:

Correct. Warpy my LZ playfield was replaced by Stern with a fully populated one. New one is flat as can be, no chipping, no pooling, and considering how much the ball flies around, minimal dimples.

My replacement is the same, the playfield looks perfect- big thumbs up for Stern and my distributor Betson for taking care of the problem in a timely manner. I won't think twice next time I'm interested in a NIB Stern title.

#8118 16 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

It randomly went away like other playfield issues. When will it occur again? Who knows! That's the joy of spending $6k - $9k+ for a pinball machine from Stern or JJP in 2021, you have no idea what the playfield quality will be. Best bet is to buy a Stern LE (to avoid issues found on pros, Jurassic Park for example) and if buying a JJP wait 6 months to let the early issues be identified (first batch GNR's with chipping playfields).
By the way I played a GNR LE on location last week. Incredible game but the playfield was chipped at the sling posts, it's from the first batch of games shipped.

My buddies early GnR LE on route looks great. Just played a bunch of games a few days ago and its got some dimpling, which is expected. The ramp switch was out of its hole and the ball got hung up on the guitar head diverter though. Ramp switch easily fixed(had to pull glass). Not sure how many points I lost on the
2,300,000 score I ended up with though. I know it wasn't registering shots.

Amazing next level pin and considering an LE.

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#8119 14 days ago
Quoted from Max_Badazz:

Correct. Warpy my LZ playfield was replaced by Stern with a fully populated one. New one is flat as can be, no chipping, no pooling, and considering how much the ball flies around, minimal dimples.

Quoted from Chuckwebster:

My replacement is the same, the playfield looks perfect- big thumbs up for Stern and my distributor Betson for taking care of the problem in a timely manner. I won't think twice next time I'm interested in a NIB Stern title.

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".

I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

#8120 14 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".
I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

Sounds like you should spill the beans and tell us who it is.

16
#8121 14 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".
I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

This is the best lesson for everyone.

If you don't get your $9k game repaired before 90 or 120 days (depending on your credit card), you need to file your chargeback - fast.

Don't let them make excuses to stall, and thus run out the clock

#8122 14 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".
I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

People need to know who these distributors are. There are some distributors out there who have little legions of fans that will smack people down for bringing their poor service to light. I don't get it. They are always fast to answer the phone/email for a sales call, but miraculously the warranty emails seem to get "lost".

#8123 14 days ago
Quoted from JodyG:

People need to know who these distributors are. There are some distributors out there who have little legions of fans that will smack people down for bringing their poor service to light. I don't get it. They are always fast to answer the phone/email for a sales call, but miraculously the warranty emails seem to get "lost".

Stern won’t help the distributors so, in turn, the distributors won’t help their customers.
Your only weapon in this battle is the chargeback.

#8124 14 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".
I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

whats your issue and did you reach out to stern directly?

#8125 14 days ago
Quoted from vid1900:

This is the best lesson for everyone.
If you don't get your $9k game repaired before 90 or 180 days (depending on your credit card), you need to file your chargeback - fast.
Don't let them make excuses to stall and run out the clock

Quoted from Mike_J:

Stern won’t help the distributors so, in turn, the distributors won’t help their customers.
Your only weapon in this battle is the chargeback.

Exactly...

Quoted from Fytr:

If feasible I'd drop the game off at the distro and issue a charge-back on my CC. Let them have their garbage back.
I'm of the opinion that Stern won't make the PF issues a priority until it becomes more convenient to do so than it is to not. Let the distros feel the pain, they have Stern's ear and leverage.

#8126 14 days ago

The credit card companies give the seller a chance to arrange return shipping.

If they don't respond or make arrangements in a certain number of days, you get to keep the defective item.

#8127 14 days ago

I made a mistake, you only have 120 days to file chargeback on Discover, AE, MC or Visa,

#8128 14 days ago
Quoted from JodyG:

People need to know who these distributors are. There are some distributors out there who have little legions of fans that will smack people down for bringing their poor service to light. I don't get it. They are always fast to answer the phone/email for a sales call, but miraculously the warranty emails seem to get "lost".

They are also quick to bully the victims of poor service or no service, never quick to respond to an issue.

#8129 14 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Still having issues with guide rails digging into the pf, and now they're having problems with pf warping / bowing. And that's a far more serious problem.

3 NIB stern games in the past year. ALL 3 HAVE HAD ISSUES!!! To the guy who said he has had no issues, then he did not examine the machine very well. I know someone with a NIB JP and they swore the machine was perfect. Went to their place, inspected the machine and found chipping/pooling. They had no idea where to even look, so they assumed the game was perfect. It's either decals coming off, split cabinets, pooling, chipping, playfields that are not level, or some mechanical defect but they all have issues.

#8130 14 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

3 NIB stern games in the past year. ALL 3 HAVE HAD ISSUES!!! To the guy who said he has had no issues, then he did not examine the machine very well. I know someone with a NIB JP and they swore the machine was perfect. Went to their place, inspected the machine and found chipping/pooling. They had no idea where to even look, so they assumed the game was perfect. It's either decals coming off, split cabinets, pooling, chipping, playfields that are not level, or some mechanical defect but they all have issues.

No they don’t. It’s crazy to say every game has issues. THE SKY IS FALLING. No it’s not. I inspect my games. I know what I am looking for. NIB JP, STh, TMNT, AIQ, Maiden. No issues.

#8131 14 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

No they don’t. It’s crazy to say every game has issues. THE SKY IS FALLING. No it’s not. I inspect my games. I know what I am looking for. NIB JP, STh, TMNT, AIQ, Maiden. No issues.

So you have never had any issues with any NIB machine?

#8132 14 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

So you have never had any issues with any NIB machine?

His farsighted reading is like +5 so everything looks great. Sees what he only needs to see.

#8133 14 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

So you have never had any issues with any NIB machine?

Yes, I had a torn decal on my GoT. It’s was in an inconspicuous spot but my distributor got me a replacement set anyways. Never installed em.

Oh shit, I almost forgot. On my AIQ there was an issue with the magnet in the tower. The thread was busted on the bolt that holds the magnet in place. Stern sent me a replacement right away. Ya know, shit happens kind of issue.

#8134 14 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

Yes, I had a torn decal on my GoT. It’s was in an inconspicuous spot but my distributor got me a replacement set anyways. Never installed em.
Oh shit, I almost forgot. On my AIQ there was an issue with the magnet in the tower. The thread was busted on the bolt that holds the magnet in place. Stern sent me a replacement right away. Ya know, shit happens kind of issue.

Just because you never got the flu, doesnt mean flu doesnt exist. This is typical, i was like you , im very experienced small shit easy for me and i never mentioned, always thought others were just negative crybabies, but then i got my dose, not one game but 4 different games. Last one was GNRLE , sold it , no worries, but im a HUO , out of box buyer only now.

#8135 9 days ago

I found this today when i was going to change a coilstop. A nice piece of art, about 15x4mm.
But I do not care at the moment, the playfield is already fucked anyway.

Chip (resized).JPG

#8136 9 days ago
Quoted from JohnTTwo:

Thanks it is a JJP CE machine.
I should have said that in my post, seems JJP has great customer service so I was wondering what they will do?

Great customer service? I finally got a reply after my second email. It reads in whole "We communicated with your distributor, who should be in touch with you. We no longer deal directly with customers regarding playfield issues."
Then my distributor offered me a replacement playfield for $1000... Fingers crossed my GnR coming this week is ok. I'm never buying a JJP again. I'll stick with honorable companies. Even Stern righted their wrong. Spooky's superior customer service and flawless playfields go a long way, in my book.

#8137 9 days ago
Quoted from megalo17:

Great customer service? I finally got a reply after my second email. It reads in whole "We communicated with your distributor, who should be in touch with you. We no longer deal directly with customers regarding playfield issues."
Then my distributor offered me a replacement playfield for $1000... Fingers crossed my GnR coming this week is ok. I'm never buying a JJP again. I'll stick with honorable companies. Even Stern righted their wrong. Spooky's superior customer service and flawless playfields go a long way, in my book.

That's not good, i've been offered a spot for GNR LE, but I hesitate.

Stern has ignored me regarding two bad playfields in the past. Last time I bought from one of Europe's biggest distributors who can put more pressure on Stern (Maiden Premium and JP2 Premium)
The Iron Maiden that chipped (the post above), has already had the playfield replaced once. Have been waiting for another replacement playfield 14-15 months now.

#8138 9 days ago
Quoted from megalo17:

Great customer service? I finally got a reply after my second email. It reads in whole "We communicated with your distributor, who should be in touch with you. We no longer deal directly with customers regarding playfield issues."
Then my distributor offered me a replacement playfield for $1000... Fingers crossed my GnR coming this week is ok. I'm never buying a JJP again. I'll stick with honorable companies. Even Stern righted their wrong. Spooky's superior customer service and flawless playfields go a long way, in my book.

Typical

#8139 8 days ago

Im not surprised, im so glad i sold my GNRLE with chipping Playfield right away. Also something that doesn’t come out much is the game also has tons of mechanical issues.

#8140 7 days ago

..moved to GnR Thread

#8141 7 days ago

moved to GnR thread

#8142 5 days ago

Per Kaneda, a fresh pic of a GNR CE. If I'm not mistaken all the CE's got the "quality assurance" post under the apron, plus the "bad batch" issue was sorted for CE as well, right? Looks like the issue remains. BTW no PF replacement for this poor soul

182759508_2831283587133660_970935555457537883_n (resized).jpg
#8143 5 days ago
Quoted from Haymaker:

Per Kaneda, a fresh pic of a GNR CE. If I'm not mistaken all the CE's got the "quality assurance" post under the apron, plus the "bad batch" issue was sorted for CE as well, right? Looks like the issue remains. BTW no PF replacement for this poor soul[quoted image]

Wish i was in Illinois, i would have drove my game over to them in person. It would have been very unpleasant for them.

#8144 5 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Wish i was in Illinois, i would have drove my game over to them in person. It would have been very unpleasant for them.

lol I love that idea. Is that your game in the picture?

#8145 5 days ago

That's exactly where my issue started as well. I had problems all around the axl posts before anything showed at the slings.

#8146 5 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I've been fighting with my distributor for almost 2 years and haven't gotten anywhere. I told them about the issue about 45 days after receiving the game. It's always "I'll check with Stern and get back to you". Then I wait a few weeks, email them again and I get the "I'll check with Stern and let you know".
I'm really pissed off and half tempted to throw them under the bus because they appear to have hung me out to dry. I've bought 3 games from them and would have bought a JP Premium shortly after they were released, but since no one has stepped up to fix my issue, I'm not buying shit.

Call them out. 2 years? C’mon man. Results may vary but you’ll get friggen results.

Which distributor?

Which game?

#8147 5 days ago
Quoted from Haymaker:

Per Kaneda, a fresh pic of a GNR CE. If I'm not mistaken all the CE's got the "quality assurance" post under the apron, plus the "bad batch" issue was sorted for CE as well, right? Looks like the issue remains. BTW no PF replacement for this poor soul[quoted image]

Christ on a cracker man. I know it’s a closer shot of a single post but that’s torn up the artwork.

If I was to buy a Stern or JJP NIB, and that’s a miracle-IF, I’d pay with a credit card. Don’t wanna fix it? Talk to Morgan Chase.

#8148 5 days ago
Quoted from Haymaker:

Per Kaneda, a fresh pic of a GNR CE. If I'm not mistaken all the CE's got the "quality assurance" post under the apron, plus the "bad batch" issue was sorted for CE as well, right? Looks like the issue remains. BTW no PF replacement for this poor soul[quoted image]

That image is from the GNR owners thread

Did anybody really think the quality assurance post was worth anything?

#8149 5 days ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

Did anybody really think the quality assurance post was worth anything?

No. Placebo to stop rep damage.

#8150 5 days ago

Why anyone is buying NIB at this point is beyond me. WTF

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