I just ordered my first pin, NIB in box Stern AIQ and I think I am hoping I do not run into any big issues, I am kind of OCD with my stuff but a part of me expects a playfield to get scuffed?

With that said, I see that some people got their pf replaced (as per this thread) and I was wondering what is the policy about this? I am in Canada.

Case by case basis on replacement. Check the ball guides first thing. There have been many case of them digging into the playfield from being over tightened. I believe the pooling issue around posts is taken care of, but can't be 100% certain. Your playfield will dimple and get normal wear. That isn't a problem. Congrats.

For the very few complaints there are Hundreds that had absolutely NO issues. Its a great game don't be OCD feared by a few individual complaints.

No, what's really sad is that people like you think that every pinball owner should care as much about minor pf quality issues as you. No offense. Plenty of owners just play the damn game, and don't give a crap about barely perceptible issues that you can only spot if you hunch down in just the right way, in just the right light.

There are legitimate issues to be concerned about, but the number of times I've seen owners in this thread ring their hands at some tiny imperfection that you can barely see, looking at a photo with a 20x zoom, from some crazy angle that you'd never be in while playing, is ridiculous. It's like sometimes people are doing everything they can to try and make a flaw appear. If you have to have the perfect light and perfect angle to spot the flaw, then it's not really a big deal. IMO.

Lot's of us don't care about tiny imperfections, and so we are happy to buy new/modern Sterns. I obviously buy new Stern's with the understanding that there could be minor cosmetic issues. So far I haven't had any, but if I did, I wouldn't whine about it, since I knew what I was getting into. People are lining up to buy more Stern's because they make some amazing and fun games. Ala' Jurassic Park, ala' Elvira, ect. ect.

I follow this thread because occasionally there have been big issues that are worth knowing about. Such as chunks of the pf and clear ripping out, or inserts crazing and things like that. I don't follow it to worry about barely/non-visible issues. But hey, to each their own, and if you wanna get out the magnifying glass and play "hunt-for-the-flaw" then knock yourself out. Just don't expect all of us to join in the insanity. Again, no offense.

Sorry for Highjacking, but maybe this is of interest.
Here we are showing that our Digital Printed Playfields have Balls.
In this video we show that it is possible to digital print playfields without pooling, cracking and chipping.
In this video we tried extremly to achive pooling, chipping and cracking.
The only thing we could destroy is our solid work bench.
Enjoy the video.
Leon and Peter
Buthamburg Team

Yup. That's some good adhesion you got going there. I'll also send you a shiny nickel if you promise not to have that machine running in the background in future videos

I apologize that you have seemingly confused me with someone who actually cares about how you or anyone else spends their money. I personally have no horse in this race, I am completely priced out of the new game market as well as most of the used market. Consider me as an outside observer who sees this thread in the same kind of light as a car crash with a kind of morbid curiosity. So if anyone is of a income tax bracket that they can go blow $8k-$10k on a whim in Vegas or on the Stern lottery more power to them; just don't get all uppity when some of us point out the seemingly masochistic relationship many on here have with Stern.

so, you do not own any machines but spend time in a pinball forum? I think you should aim at getting one and maybe you'll change your mind.

If you would've looked at my profile you would see that I do have two machines at this time. Ignoring last year, I have been going to MGC and the Chicago Expo for quite some time so I have had plenty of opportunity to play all of "the new hotness." With the exception of a few titles, there is nothing produced in the last decade that is worth it to me from a fun to dollar ratio.

Yeah, the constant price increases from Stern are getting old. But the sad thing is, no can beat Stern on price. No one. They're the cheapest mass-market manufacturer by a lot. So until someone can put out an equivalent product at a cheaper price, Stern can keep raising prices all they want.

I wish it wasn't the case, but it is.

Here we show over tightened lane guide cutting through. You can clearly see the ridge that the metal left in the clear coat. On the sides of the ridge you cannot see any pooling. We tested this before, in a long term test, no difference, no pooling. You can see with what force we tightened the guide,
the metal post totally bent under the force and even snapped.

Here is the proof of our promise to not let the machine run in the back ground, hihihi, we are happy to have earned a shiny nickel.
Regards from Hamburg
Leon and Peter
Buthamburg Team

Sold! Now start making all Stern's and JJPs playfields, please.

What would you say is the viability of making playfields of this quality large scale? Trying to understand why the bigger manufacturers can’t seem to shake this issue. Simply that to do the direct print properly the cost goes up a decent amount?

Thanks for the info!

Welt a pinball on a hammer.
Then hammer the playfield softly 1000 times on a few inches just like airballs that hitting the playfield everytime they bounce from a target.
If the clear is to hard it chips just like it happend on my highway FT.
That's what I want to see.

We cant answer your question. We dont know what proceedure the others have and what materials they use. It would just be speculation
and thats no good.
Leon and Peter
Buthamburg Team.

But you know what it costs to make one of your playfields and how long it takes. So say you had to make 3000 of these playfields in 6 months. Is that possible?

Sure it would be possible if we stock up on capacity

Buthamburg is handcrafted playfields with superb quality. Stern and jjp would have to spend a lot more for these playfields. They should offer an premium playfield option on their pins.

It’s should be standard. They’ve done it before. Just do it again. Fix it. No premium features, just fix it.

Thanks again for the info! I hope stern and JJP press their current vendors to adopt this process or pay a tad more to ensure that their direct print playfields are this type of quality. It will most likely save them tons of money on warranty expenses, offsetting the additional cost.

...

They already are saving tons of money on warranties, they don’t address them.

I laughed. I shouldn't have laughed, but I laughed.

interesting (that level is not warped FYI)

LZ_right (resized).jpg

Ahhh ...come on ... you did not order a levelled playfield. Next time better watch out what you order !

It is an impudence !!!

looks like this piece of plywood is cupped? have you contacted Stern and your distributor about this?

that should be funny... but its not !!!
good luck to you

It's a........ feature?

Yup. I am pretty confident Stern will make good of this. At least I can play the game, but tilt is turned off for some massive nudging to keep it from draining.

I don't see the problem here. Stern games were like this in the 80s too.

orbitor1_plexi (resized).jpg

I was wrong... will not replace. No pop playfield, I need to deal with it

"Stern Pinball has inspected each game element to ensure it meets stringent quality and playability standards". I'd call it hard to play when the game is warped towards the outlanes...

Maybe it's time for folks with defective merchandise to initiate credit card charge-backs; unfortunate for the distributors, but pressure on them is the only way Stern is going to change their tune.

The fact that you people are still purchasing NIB machines just boggles my mind.

I don't understand how they can not "make good" on this. I wouldn't even consider this warranty it is simple defective out of the box. Did you buy this as a demo or floor model in as is condition or something? I'm not American but I can't imagine how they would have a leg to stand on legally.

We're having fun while you're angrily ranting on Pinside.

I would call them back and respectfully ask for a manager and make sure they have seen the pictures. That one really should be replaced with a populated playfield or the whole machine returned and replaced with another. A little pooling here or there is one thing. This will have major affect on the play and should not be tolerated.

Curious about your thoughts in post #7474's picture of the warped Zep playfield...??

Yeah, if the Distro and Stern won't help you. Then name and shame them, and make some noise. Reach out to Jack Danger, reach out to other big names in the hobby and get some attention. Reach out to George Gomez if you can, or at least try to get his contact info from someone like Franchii. Because a pf that's warped so bad it ruins the gameplay is beyond unacceptable. I hate when people whine and moan over the littlest pf defects, but when something this serious really is wrong, then that's another story entirely. If they gave Jack Danger a game with a pf like that to stream, he'd get a replacement from them asap. Maybe post in his thread too, get some more eyes.

Don't settle on this, if the game is basically ruined you NEED to be made whole. Don't settle and don't give up. Do a chargeback if you have to, do whatever it takes. This is the kind of problem that this thread was made for. And you're lucky because you're actually still in the warranty period too. Not that it should matter with a case like this, but it does. This is waaay worse than pooling or chipping by a long shot.

Ok, but remember, you ASKED for my opinion. I don't want to hear any more bullshit attacks for sharing it.

My thoughts are the same as always with regard to defects.
Give the manufacturer (any manufacturer) a chance to make defects right.

You're going to get more response being reasonable with them offline than mounting pitchfork campaigns online.

And remember this stuff is supposed to be fun. If the angst outweighs the fun, why bother?

Then why does Stern insist on taking the fun out, when ignoring clear issues.

Not looking for a Pinside fight, just your opinion from the other side of the coin. In post #7481 he states that he will not receive a populated playfield.
Maybe they will send him a unpopulated one, who knows??? If you had just dropped major coinage for the Zep pin and received one with a playfield like that, would you be OK with it? If not, how would you feel if neither the distributor or Stern was going to help you with a warped playfield brand new out of the box?
I agree with you you that this is supposed to be "FUN" and I have trashed Sterns QC and customer service department and yet in the near future I will have my own choice to be made: See my Avatar, I've had it for over 6 years waiting for it to be made. As I sit here, I think I will wait for a second hand one because the "angst" as you stated will take the fun out of it for me and I won't come on here complaining because when I do buy a second hand one, I will know 100% what I'm getting into. Maybe I will send it to HEP first And I also agree with you about handling it behind the scenes first and giving them a chance to help solve the issue.

If feasible I'd drop the game off at the distro and issue a charge-back on my CC. Let them have their garbage back.

I'm of the opinion that Stern won't make the PF issues a priority until it becomes more convenient to do so than it is to not. Let the distros feel the pain, they have Stern's ear and leverage.

The owner all ready contacted Stern and his Distro quietly behind the scenes, and was completely snubbed. Sometimes making noise is the only way to get businesses to actually do the right thing. How many times have you seen companies only do the right thing once something starts rolling on social media.

That's the point isn't it, the owner's PF is so warped that it's affecting the ball physics. It's causing abnormal drains. That doesn't sound very fun at all. He bought the game for fun, not for the headache. So it sounds like your on his side then.

I wonder...playfields do flex a bit. Is the left side rail mounted slightly higher than the left or something? Maybe it's a fixable issue?

And for the record I don't have a dog in this hunt nor do I want to have one.

I'm hopeful all parties are able to work things out to mutual satisfaction.

Does Stern send out instructions to check this upon delivery, and that buyers should expect significant issues out of the box? Dont answer, we already know the answer.

Pay with a credit card so you can file a chargeback.

These machines are much too expensive to deal with this bullshit.

No. But I will be checking

The distributor is fighting for the playfield (we can now opt for an unpopulated). Stern has since contacted me for info as well. Might be light at the end of the tunnel but who knows. Now worst case scenario is unpopulated and fun times switching stuff over.