(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

1 year ago



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There are 7631 posts in this topic. You are on page 146 of 153.
#7251 67 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

The last thing Stern should be doing is screwing around with this pointless solution of avoiding anything touching the playfield. The need to figure out how to make a surface look good that can that can meet the specifications required.

Agree that fixing the real problem is the way to go, but Stern seems to be happy with bandaid. They get less complains with the removed art around posts and if they had washers under the ballguides even less....

#7252 67 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

The last thing Stern should be doing is screwing around with this pointless solution of avoiding anything touching the playfield. The need to figure out how to make a surface look good that can that can meet the specifications required.

"anything touching the playfield"

what about the ball ?

#7253 67 days ago
Quoted from Returner:

AIQ is chipping at ballguides the same way as DeadPool does, if Stern just had put a washer under the spadebolt it woulden't happen...

I'm hearing that they started doing that...? Here's a pic

14f64a468f6bdf47c2afa1015c16980c7a794588.jpeg (resized).jpg
#7254 67 days ago
Quoted from m00nmuppet:

I'm hearing that they started doing that...? Here's a pic[quoted image]

Shouldn't they also remove the artwork around that washer?

#7255 67 days ago
Quoted from RipleYYY:

"anything touching the playfield"
what about the ball ?

That is the whole point. Clearly we can see that objects touching the playfield are causing issues. The fact that Stern even considered just removing the art anywhere an object touches as a solution and disregarding the ball is an epic level of stupid. It's too early to tell but I will not be surprised if over time, high traffic, high dimpled areas with art start chipping and lifting. Shooter lanes already are chipping and there is no art there. Maybe it is just cure time and it can cure enough before the ball makes an impact but it's still incredible short sighted.

#7256 66 days ago
Quoted from John_I:

I was just restoring a Black Hole from 1981 and interestingly about half of the posts have indents in the coat and chipping under the posts...

Yes, but there was no clear coat in the era of BH. The process was improved upon since then.

#7257 66 days ago

Yikes ....thanks for bringing up bad memories LOL

I can't believe I bought that 11 months ago (that went fast)

#7258 66 days ago
Quoted from RipleYYY:

"anything touching the playfield"
what about the ball ?

The ball doesn't dig into one spot :p

#7259 66 days ago
Quoted from Betelgeuse:

Yes, but there was no clear coat in the era of BH. The process was improved upon since then.

Actually there was a thin clear on BH and even on EMs. It was more of a varnish and not like a modern clear, but it was there and used for the same purpose - to protect the art.

10
#7260 66 days ago
Quoted from John_I:

Not so fast there. Removing artwork from around the post doesn't stop pooling it just minimizes the chipping damage. The AIQs and TMNTs I have seen have no pooling (or chipping). So Stern have done the smart thing by removing the art from under posts and based on all the GnR issues, they also seem to be ahead of JJP on fixing the clearcoat formula issues. Stern does have to go back to pinball design 101 when it comes to the metal guides (and aprons) cutting into playfields.
I was just restoring a Black Hole from 1981 and interestingly about half of the posts have indents in the coat and chipping under the posts...

Stern still has playfield issues with metal guides digging to playfields that results in chipping. That never used to happen. This is a manufacture defect.

Another AIQ...

36b377ddee6a2fcf67a37f9691f5ee1cedb860f0 (resized).jpg

#7261 66 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Stern still has playfield issues with metal guides digging to playfields that results in chipping. That never used to happen.
Another...
[quoted image]

Why isn’t there a washer under that spade bolt?

14
#7262 66 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Stern still has playfield issues with metal guides digging to playfields that results in chipping. That never used to happen.
Another...
[quoted image]

Nothing to see here or worry about. Get in line for the next LE

-1
#7263 66 days ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

Shouldn't they also remove the artwork around that washer?

The artwork in that area is already removed. As if it were designed to have a washer (perhaps slightly smaller), there in the first place..

#7264 66 days ago

This thread has convinced me to get a Playfield Protector for my yet-to-arrive NIB TMNT. Looks like I'll be taking the entire playfield apart before I even shoot the first ball.

#7265 66 days ago
Quoted from plasticbugs:

This thread has convinced me to get a Playfield Protector for my yet-to-arrive NIB TMNT. Looks like I'll be taking the entire playfield apart before I even shoot the first ball.

How is that going to help against pooling and chipping around the posts?

#7266 66 days ago
Quoted from ViperVS:

How is that going to help against pooling and chipping around the posts?

It probably won't. However, I will have to remove so many things from the playfield that the process may have a side-effect of me adding washers and other preventatives in places where they should exist but don't.

12
#7267 66 days ago

Stern and JJP's answer to playfield issues

4n2pvi (resized).jpg

#7268 66 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Stern still has playfield issues with metal guides digging to playfields that results in chipping. That never used to happen. This is a manufacture defect.
Another AIQ...
[quoted image]

So you quote my post just to repeat something that was already in my post? Must not have read past the part where I was talking about JJP to get to the Stern part huh?

14
#7269 65 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Stern still has playfield issues with metal guides digging to playfields that results in chipping. That never used to happen. This is a manufacture defect.
Another AIQ...
[quoted image]

STOP BUYING THESE GAMES NIB!!! For these outrageous prices there should be no issues.

#7270 65 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

STOP BUYING THESE GAMES NIB!!! For these outrageous prices there should be no issues.

I can’t wait to buy my next NIB.

#7271 65 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

I can’t wait to buy my next NIB.

Get ready for all the issues posted.

#7272 65 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

Get ready for all the issues posted.

BE37DD26-AAC7-4B0E-8A2D-28D4A140124D.gif
#7273 65 days ago

and the price increase

#7274 65 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

and the price increase

Price increase. Definitely. Adding washers at ball guides an easy 100 in parts and labor.

#7275 65 days ago
Quoted from newpinbin:

and the price increase

As long as it’s not 50k for a pro I’m good. Got my pennies saved up!

#7276 65 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

As long as it’s not 50k for a pro I’m good. Got my pennies saved up!

The bittie economy.

#7277 65 days ago

One game I don't think i have seen issues on is Star Wars. Can anyone confirm? It is my first NIB and is still waiting to be built...bought it back in August. SW Pro. It looks like art has been pulled back some on newer builds for this one even though I personally haven't read about issues with Star Wars. Does stern use different types/shapes/styles of ball guides in its newer pins?

#7278 65 days ago

Thought I better resurrect this chestnut as it’s the answer to all Playfield pooling issues......Playfield art is overrated anyway.....

220F0392-D19F-47B4-89D5-5B199F1F851C (resized).jpeg
#7279 65 days ago
Quoted from crujones4life:

Does stern use different types/shapes/styles of ball guides in its newer pins?

Yes.

-1
#7280 65 days ago
Quoted from crujones4life:

One game I don't think i have seen issues on is Star Wars. Can anyone confirm? It is my first NIB and is still waiting to be built...bought it back in August. SW Pro. It looks like art has been pulled back some on newer builds for this one even though I personally haven't read about issues with Star Wars. Does stern use different types/shapes/styles of ball guides in its newer pins?

As it´s mostly totally barren, there really isnt much that can pool/chip.

#7281 65 days ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Thought I better resurrect this chestnut as it’s the answer to all Playfield pooling issues......Playfield art is overrated anyway.....
[quoted image]

Honestly i´m seeing a bit of pooling near the left inlane.

#7282 65 days ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Thought I better resurrect this chestnut as it’s the answer to all Playfield pooling issues......Playfield art is overrated anyway.....
[quoted image]

Looks like the fastest Stern game ever made! FLOW FLOW FLOW. $6k - $9k+

#7283 65 days ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

Shouldn't they also remove the artwork around that washer?

The ball guide doesn’t flex like a post - not necessary.

#7284 65 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Looks like the fastest Stern game ever made! FLOW FLOW FLOW. $6k - $9k+

Wide open Playfield.

#7285 65 days ago

You need to be like Chuck or just save your money. Why the hell would you buy a game that you know you have to strip the PF?? To me, that is insane. There are HUNDREDS of great titles out there with no issues for less money. Why the obsession with NIB? Either buy it and play it without worries, or hit the vibrant used market. When I got in, it was almost impossible to find a POS project for sale near me. Now I can have the pick of the litter, HUO, projects etc. any day.

12
#7286 65 days ago

I can't stand when someone tries to tell me "what to" or "not to" spend my money on. You have the money, god bless and go for it. What kills me are the ones that read this thread and or other threads, buy NIB and then come on here complaining about QC and the other things screwed up with their playfields after full well knowing the gamble they are undertaking. Reminds me of when trouble starts brewing in a foreign country or a storm is approaching and the USA starts sending out "warnings" to evacuate ASAP, we've been warned.
Most leave, some stay, shit hits the fan, help I need to be rescued. You were warned, tough luck. Same with these NIB's, you've read the problems but still take the gamble, suck it up. Until the masses stand up and stop buying NIB, this will continue. Remember the reason of insanity, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. I hope everyone with NIB playfield issues gets some sort of satisfactory resolution because it is just a disgrace on some of the craftsmanship of these playfields.

#7287 64 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

The issues with chipping playfields around ball guides shows that Stern never corrected their playfield problems but rather just applied a bandaid (removing artwork around posts). I just looked at my Family Guy which has ball guides right up against the artwork and there's no issues.
Neither Stern or JJP has told customers the cause of their playfield quality issues and what they are doing to resolve it. As a result customers are left to speculate and hope to be one of the lucky ones that receives a perfect game. After multiple price increases leading to all time record high prices the risk just doesn't seem worth it.

The ball guide/chipping issue looks like it may be a build problem...not simply a PF issue. If these guides aren't installed properly (or too tight), it is likely to result in damage. With low wage workers being asked to crank these games out, I've seen many more build issues. The NIB crap shoot continues. I'm taking delivery of a Rick and Morty tonight...fingers crossed!

#7288 64 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

With low wage workers being asked to crank these games out, I've seen many more build issues.

Doubt it. The playfield process has changed. It’s been explained a lot. The companies not having the issues are using a different vendor with a different process than the others.

You’re in luck. Spooky is one of those companies without these issues. But you’ll most likely have to make physical adjustments to get it playing well.

#7289 64 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

The ball guide/chipping issue looks like it may be a build problem...not simply a PF issue. If these guides aren't installed properly (or too tight), it is likely to result in damage. With low wage workers being asked to crank these games out, I've seen many more build issues.

Nah... that is still a design/materials issue that you create this dynamic. The rail as spec’d is laying on the PF... and the guide can deflect and move.

#7290 62 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Doubt it. The playfield process has changed. It’s been explained a lot. The companies not having the issues are using a different vendor with a different process than the others.
You’re in luck. Spooky is one of those companies without these issues. But you’ll most likely have to make physical adjustments to get it playing well.

The Spooky cabinet and PF are simply stunning. The clearcoat is gorgeous...it's better than I had on my HEP AFM (which was a Mirco PF). The butter cabinet is also amazing. Don't really know why anyone would opt for the Kruzman clearcoat...Ron's awesome, but I just don't know how anyone could do better than what's in my game.

I spent today dialing in the audio (https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/aw-jeez-official-rick-and-morty-club/page/159#post-5975793). Spooky's audio BOM is much more generous than Stern, but the out-of-the-box audio experience wasn't great. No big deal, since it only cost $10 to fix

I'm sure some of the shots will get tweaked over time. At the moment, nothing really awful in terms of shots.

#7291 62 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

The Spooky cabinet and PF are simply stunning.

Is it just me or do the Spooky plastics look washed out when they are lit underneath? I noticed that on both TNA and R&M. Its like the white layer is too thick or the colors just don't have enough pop to them.

#7292 62 days ago
Quoted from John_I:

Is it just me or do the Spooky plastics look washed out when they are lit underneath? I noticed that on both TNA and R&M. Its like the white layer is too thick or the colors just don't have enough pop to them.

Part of it could be that a lot of Spooky plastics don't have as much artwork on them compared to Stern and JJP plastics. Even if they are a bit washed out I rather deal with slightly less vibrant plastics then playfields that chip and pool.

#7293 62 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

I much rather deal with slightly less vibrant plastics then playfields that chip and pool.

Sheesh. I guess that means that you have noticed.

#7294 62 days ago
Quoted from John_I:

Is it just me or do the Spooky plastics look washed out when they are lit underneath? I noticed that on both TNA and R&M. Its like the white layer is too thick or the colors just don't have enough pop to them.

Hi John, the plastics look fine to me (just turned the game on to see if I notice anything).

#7295 62 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

Hi John, the plastics look fine to me (just turned the game on to see if I notice anything).

Thanks Steve. I guess it is just me. The playfields do look great in the Spooky games. The R&M at the Pinball Lounge looks great and it gets the heck played out of it.

1 week later
#7296 54 days ago

Is someone here who has received a replacement playfield for chipping clear coat in the shooter lane?
I need help for a friend. He has ordered almost 15Nib games in the past 5 years. Now he is having playfield issues for the first time with his TMNT.
The shooter lane has chipped with just under 100 games. Stern is only willing to send a clear coat touch-up kit.
But this is not acceptable for a game which cost 6000€ and more.

If someone has had a similar situation it would be nice if he could contact me via PM

Thanks in advance!

#7297 54 days ago
Quoted from Midway-Man:

Is someone here who has received a replacement playfield for chipping clear coat in the shooter lane?
I need help for a friend. He has ordered almost 15Nib games in the past 5 years. Now he is having playfield issues for the first time with his TMNT.
The shooter lane has chipped with just under 100 games. Stern is only willing to send a clear coat touch-up kit.
But this is not acceptable for a game which cost 6000€ and more.
If someone has had a similar situation it would be nice if he could contact me via PM
Thanks in advance!

I have issues with my playfield. Stern told me I'd get a replacement in mid October. I still haven't gotten it. Last I heard they said they couldn't give me an estimate on when they would have it. I tried following up but they haven't responded in over a week. I'm finding that even if Stern says they'll give you a replacement, actually getting it is another matter entirely.

#7298 54 days ago
Quoted from Midway-Man:

Is someone here who has received a replacement playfield for chipping clear coat in the shooter lane?
I need help for a friend. He has ordered almost 15Nib games in the past 5 years. Now he is having playfield issues for the first time with his TMNT.
The shooter lane has chipped with just under 100 games. Stern is only willing to send a clear coat touch-up kit.
But this is not acceptable for a game which cost 6000€ and more.
If someone has had a similar situation it would be nice if he could contact me via PM
Thanks in advance!

Stern handles playfield issues on a case by case basis and the solution they offer generally changes based on the severity of the problem. I have not seen replacement playfields offered for just some shooter lane wear. Doesn't mean it has not happened, but I have never seen it.

#7299 54 days ago
Quoted from seenev:

I have issues with my playfield. Stern told me I'd get a replacement in mid October. I still haven't gotten it. Last I heard they said they couldn't give me an estimate on when they would have it. I tried following up but they haven't responded in over a week. I'm finding that even if Stern says they'll give you a replacement, actually getting it is another matter entirely.

I'm in a similar boat. What we have to also remember is that Stern has a ton of backorders and if they ran a title until they were out of parts, then there won't be replacement PF's of a given title until its' next run. So if they ran TMNT until they couldn't any more, sent out whatever remaining PF's they had as replacements (if any), and then ran AIQ and whatever other title, then it's reasonable to think TMNT replacements won't go out until the next run of TMNT when they both order and receive a massive amount of PF's. I don't know if that's 100% the case, but it's entirely logical that large game-specific parts (that are uncommonly ordered as aftermarket spares) are ordered in bulk in line with their production runs.

#7300 54 days ago

I have a new tmnt pro and a 2020 build date star wars pro. Both about 750 plays now. Both still mint no playfield issues at all.

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