Not yet

Great now that’s quality. They resolved the issues. Face palm.

This pic looks familiar we need to reveal playfield numbers for validation

I think the first it has done all the damage it will do in that area, it is visible maybe goes 1 mm from the guide.I will likely leave it as that rail is very secure, I hopefully it will go no further.

The second picture, the outer Thor guide if that chips off will be much more visible, this one bubble on both sides of the post and looks like it would chip much further into the field. Here I am very concerned pulling it up will indeed cause that paint to pop off, perhaps even more than just leaving it will..

The inner thor rail, paint is missing but 95% is under the rail itself, barely visible..

Ive found several paint flecks on the field and in the cab, so it is likely there are even more chips elsewhere, not normally visible when playing..

Man this sucks I’m really sorry you got to go though this.

Game is still super fun tho .. Will see what my distributor / stern will do..

Is this your game? Have you lodged a ticket? I am interested in JJPs response.

Stopped me.
I was full in on a GNR LE - but now I'm just going to wait it out or buy a used game I can inspect
Already have games I love, so I don't feel I am missing out

Me too. I finally have disposable income to spend on these games. My first NIB purchase was Wonka. And it'll be my last. I'll never buy a NIB pin again, ever.

I have moved on to Golden Tee equipment now.

And yet you still hang out here to tell us about it every 10 minutes.

And yet you continue to diminish my experience every time I mention it. I really don't care what you think. JJP screwed the pooch with this issue, and I'm not letting them off the hook.

Why torture us about it though?

Sounds good, But people who always say that they will not buy machine until fixed, are the first to place an order the next latest LE release!
Until people actually stop, things are not going to change.

I'm always curious of this statement, but how does that matter in this situation. We've seen playfield look perfect out of the box, then for some reason at play 250 (hypothetical) things fall apart. How does buying used grant some sort of immunity or insurance against this sudden playfield destuction phenomena? Unless you're talking about waiting years and have thousands of plays under a games belt. I don't buy used cars for the same reason (Cargument warning) - I don't want to inheret someone elses problems or hidden issues of neglect.

Golden Tee for the win!

For the exact reason you outlined in your hypothetical.

These issues appear within a short amount of time. They don't take years to reveal themselves... so buying second hand you have the opportunity to see a game that has already had miles put on it for when you'd expect the issues in question to have appeared if they are going to at all.

Fair enough, so I assume some people will wait years to buy the GnR LE..I'm patient but not that patient

We both just said it won't take years to reveal itself... yet you come back with this?

This is really no different with any NIB purchase... there is no real value besides 'being first' and JJP trying to enforce non-transferable warranties. NIB is a safety blanket to some who are not comfortable with their games.. but for most others its just a luxury.

Well I think that is not true. It shouldn't have be all or nothing.

If enough public exposure and customer awareness is brought to these issues (with the consequence that yes, some people are not buying NIB as frequently as they might) the vendors should take notice.

Of course, "success" forgives many sins, so if Stern and JJP feel like they can barley keep up with demand as it is, they will be less likely to care about the issue enough to resolve it. That doesn't mean we all need to shut up and take it, just the opposite, we need to elevate the issue above the profit-fueled, socially-distanced cocaine parties they are having in the executive suite.

I'm starting to think that applying direct pressure to the distributors is the best path forward. Repeat buyers have a relationship with their distributors, what if a bunch of their best customers started telling them that they would only buy a NIB game from them if they will take it back full refund, shipping included if any PF issues arise in the first year (home use). Or pay by credit card, drop the game off at their shop when the PF issues appear, and do a charge-back on your card. Make the issue become expensive and inconvenient to them and the vendors.

Fortunately, recently several popular streamers and podcasters have raised the issue, this can only help.

The message is simple, customers want perfect playfields out of the box, and for a reasonable amount of plays (several thousand). The first volume supplier to make that happen will reap rewards.

I guess my thought wasn't communicated correctly, too much coffee. My point was that some people will wait years to see if all the issues have worked out regardless, others will trust that if they haven't seen anything in the first couple months used with no problems they will be good to go, me included for new pins based on online feedback but I'm admittedly rolling the dice on GnR (hoping for good rollout reports from here on in) . I just don't like the used idea though as I said before, I've had bad luck with other peoples hand-me-downs, irrespective of timelines. I guess you're right though, NIB, used, doesn't matter I guess it's your own comfort level. I'll admit, I like shiny new stuff.

The best thing about the explosion of the hobby with new buyers is the number of basically brand new games on the second hand market. People are not making bigger collections, they are buying and selling to buy the next game. What used to be like finding a 4 leaf clover is now the expected norm. People measure usage in hundreds of games, not 10k+, etc... Most flaws with a title or example will be flushed out within the first few months of a game being on the market. Or those with weak code, etc.. you can see where the game goes.. (like Batman66).

And add-in that manufacturers re-run games more commonly now... there is even less FOMO.

For those who know what they are capable of... it's easy to sit back and just pick the winners.. instead of playing the NIB lottery. Here's looking at you Munsters owners!

Gotcha, understand!

You might want to do a poll. The "us" in your statement is probably a much smaller group than you think. Pot meet kettle.

What he’s saying is to just go on an on about it and not saying anything new,especially when it’s the usual suspects who own nothing but Stern

It is only natural here. The subject of this thread is "continued playfield problems" having to do with pooling/chipping. In the last month, most or all of the playfield problems being reported having to do with pooling/chipping around posts on NEW games appears to be with GnR, so that is the main fuel for this thread at this point. Pinside is like sharks when blood is in the water and saying nothing new is...nothing new. AIQ has an inexcusable issue with the rails cutting into the playfield, but I really have not heard of many instances of pooling/chipping on AIQ or TMNT for that matter the way it appears to be affecting GnR. I personally inspected an AIQ and TMNT not too long ago with no pooling at all and the same day saw a GnR LE with pooling. Anecdotal at best; I know. There are enough flames to go around in this thread with all the issues on JP and IMDN and other Sterns so don't get all ruffled when people focus on JJP in a negative way for a bit.

I’m cool I was just explaining what I thought zaphX was meaning.

Correct. We all know he is disgruntled. We all know he won't ever buy a pinball machine again. Fine and good.
Stop telling us.

What a load of BS romulusx. zaphX was talking to smaltownguy2 who has never owned a Stern

Why don’t you be nice, maybe the song will cheer you up by Randy Newman of Toy Story fame

So you keep coming into a thread about playfield issues to tell people how they should discuss the issue? Or say don’t be negative about an issue that is only seen as negative to any sane person? This isn’t a fanboy thread. You and a couple others in here look foolish. You are in the minority by a lot with your playfield issues are no big deal garbage. Again this is a thread to discuss playfield issues and how they make you feel if that’s ok with you.

What I'm saying is that yeah, we know he's a broken record, but so are you about him being a broken record and so am I about you being a broken record. Let's fix the records and just let everyone speak their mind on the pinball forum. Don't like it? Go to another thread.

.

I only spoke up because of you trash talking a fellow pinsider without even knowing what you were speaking of next time get your facts straight

I grow weary of you wee man,goodbye!

Funny story... I went to the pinball hall of fame in Las Vegas today and asked if they had the new Guns n roses game. The person working there scoffed and went on a rant about the playfield issues... They do not have the game.

Lol the sad fact is you are the little man but do not even know it and I don't think you will ever understand sad

Playfield chip down to wood

2F6F7329-12C4-42A0-B579-273A8B0911D3 (resized).jpeg

EB101722-4221-4E5C-890C-CAD880E55D0C (resized).jpeg

Anyone purchasing a gnr getting a playfield protector? Or is getting one just part of fighting the good fight... but really not making a difference?

A Playfield protector would do nothing in regards to the current issue other then make the game play like crap also. The issue is at posts and rails which have nothing to do with a PP

Was thinking that. So a waste of a few hours and a lot of money.

The issues with chipping playfields around ball guides shows that Stern never corrected their playfield problems but rather just applied a bandaid (removing artwork around posts). I just looked at my Family Guy which has ball guides right up against the artwork and there's no issues.

Neither Stern or JJP has told customers the cause of their playfield quality issues and what they are doing to resolve it. As a result customers are left to speculate and hope to be one of the lucky ones that receives a perfect game. After multiple price increases leading to all time record high prices the risk just doesn't seem worth it.

I think the cause is the printing as I have not seen a picture of chipping in areas that have no printing

Post #3302

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/continued-playfield-issues-with-jjp-and-stern/page/67#post-5364679

Wow. Shameful

To bad good guy I bought a game from him years ago

Not so fast there. Removing artwork from around the post doesn't stop pooling it just minimizes the chipping damage. The AIQs and TMNTs I have seen have no pooling (or chipping). So Stern have done the smart thing by removing the art from under posts and based on all the GnR issues, they also seem to be ahead of JJP on fixing the clearcoat formula issues. Stern does have to go back to pinball design 101 when it comes to the metal guides (and aprons) cutting into playfields.

I was just restoring a Black Hole from 1981 and interestingly about half of the posts have indents in the coat and chipping under the posts...

AIQ is chipping at ballguides the same way as DeadPool does, if Stern just had put a washer under the spadebolt it woulden't happen...

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/continued-playfield-issues-with-jjp-and-stern/page/145#post-5963953

The last thing Stern should be doing is screwing around with this pointless solution of avoiding anything touching the playfield. The need to figure out how to make a surface look good that can that can meet the specifications required.

But those are 2 cents each in quantity. The Stern BOM could never survive such an extravagance.