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(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

1 year ago



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#6501 36 days ago
Quoted from Kawydud:

Pull that metal guide off in the center before playing a game and get some washers between the studs and the guide, so it doesn't cut into the playfield.

Yep. Did that and added my usual protections to the shooter lane, outhole areas before ball 1 was played.

I use these to add protection anywhere mylar would be used. They are easy to cut and apply, and can be readily removed later if needed or get dirty, etc: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Avery-Self-Adhesive-Laminating-Sheets-9-x-12-10-Sheets-73603/29815043

Also turned down the trough power to 180 (lowest setting).

#6502 36 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

Oh yes. I agree with that. About 4 months ago in this thread I said the very same thing about jjp playfield quality being now fixed. But on the stern side, chipping and pooling is still very much happening to this day.

I tend to agree, but do we really know this? Although it appears JJP it making a few Wonka's they haven't really made any new games where as Stern has been pumping out thousands of games. I think the jury is still out on JJP. My hope is they've addressed their play field issues.

#6503 36 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I tend to agree, but do we really know this? Although it appears JJP it making a few Wonka's they haven't really made any new games where as Stern has been pumping out thousands of games. I think the jury is still out on JJP. My hope is they've addressed their play field issues.

I can't really speak to JJP as I don't own any and they are harder to spot in the wild, esp. these days, but for Stern there is no "past these issues", they have had them on and off again over the last 4 years at least. I see games on location or at friends houses that look perfect, beautiful smooth clearcoat, no pooling or chipping, crystal clear inserts, but I've never received one that nice myself. These always still have visible dimpling of course, comes with the territory.

In fact, a friend of mine owns the IMDN LE exactly one number before mine and mine has CC pooling issues and crazed inserts, and his is perfect and beautiful. *sigh*.

You just take your chances with every purchase from Stern, which is why I strongly recommend you buy a nice used or demo unit that you can inspect prior to purchase if these issues matter to you.

#6504 36 days ago

I may be trading for a Jurassic Park machine that has a small chip in the playfield. Luckily there is now mylar over top of it to prevent future damage, but I'm wondering if others have done anything to repair chips? I know it's basically printed artwork, but I thought it was worth asking anyway.

#6505 36 days ago
Quoted from Fytr:

Yep. Did that and added my usual protections to the shooter lane, outhole areas before ball 1 was played.
I use these to add protection anywhere mylar would be used. They are easy to cut and apply, and can be readily removed later if needed or get dirty, etc: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Avery-Self-Adhesive-Laminating-Sheets-9-x-12-10-Sheets-73603/29815043
Also turned down the trough power to 180 (lowest setting).

I also installed springs over the flipper solenoid plungers to tame them down some because you can't adjust the flipper power in settings. I think the flipper power is too much as it is. I think it shoots better now. I bought mine used and it had two cracked plastics, the one over the scoop and the one over li'l Deadpool at upper right.

#6506 36 days ago
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

The bad printing on the tmnt games is such a screw up. Now they are giving unpopulated playfields for them.

How long is Stern going to be able to get away with sending out unpopulated playfields? Does anyone know how many machines they have had to do this for, it feels like all of the last several have had one issue or another. There bottom line has to be taking a hit and they still appear to have done nothing to improve quality control.

#6507 36 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

How long is Stern going to be able to get away with sending out unpopulated playfields?...

Apparently it's the cheapest wood known to man and the clear is horrible ...so my guess is the bottom line isn't taking much of a hit.

#6508 36 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

How long is Stern going to be able to get away with sending out unpopulated playfields? Does anyone know how many machines they have had to do this for, it feels like all of the last several have had one issue or another. There bottom line has to be taking a hit and they still appear to have done nothing to improve quality control.

If you haven't figured it out yet Stern doesn't care...its business as usual, and until sales drop off they won't change how they run their business.

#6509 36 days ago
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:

I also installed springs over the flipper solenoid plungers to tame them down some because you can't adjust the flipper power in settings. I think the flipper power is too much as it is. I think it shoots better now. I bought mine used and it had two cracked plastics, the one over the scoop and the one over li'l Deadpool at upper right.

Interesting idea. Yeah, the flippers are super loud on this thing.

#6510 36 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

If you haven't figured it out yet Stern doesn't care...its business as usual, and until sales drop off they won't change how they run their business.

I'm honestly shocked there is not a class action.

#6511 36 days ago
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

The bad printing on the tmnt games is such a screw up. Now they are giving unpopulated playfields for them.

The art thing blew my mind. It kept me from buying turtles to be honest, and I normally dont mind taking chances. Chipping / pooling I can ALMOST see happening, assuming you are just rushing things out. The art looked like shit from the get go, and managed to make it through manufacturing, which is absurd.

Not saying pooling / chipping isnt an issue, just saying that the art mishap on Turtles is (in my mind) an even bigger blunder, as it stands out like a sore thumb.

#6512 36 days ago
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:

I also installed springs over the flipper solenoid plungers to tame them down some because you can't adjust the flipper power in settings. I think the flipper power is too much as it is. I think it shoots better now. I bought mine used and it had two cracked plastics, the one over the scoop and the one over li'l Deadpool at upper right.

I see that there is a metal protector under the plastic above the drop targets in front of Lil' Deadpool. Are you referring to the clear plastic over the open section behind the drop targets being cracked on your game?

#6513 35 days ago
Quoted from cconway84:

I got a NIB CGC AFM SE yesterday. Opened it up and immediately saw a flaw in the paint at the three bank motorized target area by the saucer. It looks like it was touched up poorly by hand then cleared. Feels smooth so definitely under the clear.
Saucer also has a chip in the front like from a ball hit. New in box game with 0 plays.
What would be a reasonable expectation for addressing these issues?
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Not trying to be a jerk or anything here, but honestly you can't even really see the paint flaw in that top picture, and it's barely noticeable in that second picture, and that's waaaaay zoomed in. Even the top picture is a closer view than you would have from the playing position. I know you want perfection, but honestly it's really not bad at all in my opinion and anyone that wouldn't want to buy the game because of that is far too anal-retentive in my opinion.

But then again, I'm a used buyer and I don't really mind cosmetic issues. I had a Mousin' Around that played awesome, but looked like crap and I still loved it. The only reason I really care about cosmetic issues is because I know so many other buyers seem too, and so it can make it harder on the resale. But luckily, there seem to be plenty of buyers like me out there too.

But hey, it takes all kinds to make a world, so if it bothers you then do what you think is right. I just personally think it's not too big a deal compared to other issues that you could have.

#6514 35 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

I'm honestly shocked there is not a class action.

Do you have a Stern or JJP game that has a playfield issue? I think many owners are happy with the unpopulated playfield replacement. What would you start the class action over?

#6515 35 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Do you have a Stern or JJP game that has a playfield issue? I think many owners are happy with the unpopulated playfield replacement. What would you start the class action over?

No I don't personally. I'm surprised there isn't a law firm actively soliciting clients, this is exactly the type of case class action firms focus on. I'm not arguing that plenty of people are happy with the replacement and Stern is clearly getting away with it. Legally Stern is in very precarious position and could easily be held liable for the cost involved in replacing a playfield. I guess Stern is not a big enough fish to attract the sharks but they can only push their luck so far.

#6516 35 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

No I don't personally. I'm surprised there isn't a law firm actively soliciting clients, this is exactly the type of case class action firms focus on. I'm not arguing that plenty of people are happy with the replacement and Stern is clearly getting away with it. Legally Stern is in very precarious position and could easily be held liable for the cost involved in replacing a playfield. I guess Stern is not a big enough fish to attract the sharks but they can only push their luck so far.

I understand what you are saying and that is why I asked if you have a game that has a shitty playfield. I cannot see a class action as once a person has accepted the unpopulated playfield, that person is unlikely to lodge another warranty claim. Legally the issue is resolved.

I think giving away an unpopulated playfield is appeasing people enough to keep most of them reasonably happy. Stern and JJP are not giving them away to be a good manufacturer I am sure of that. If they thought they could get away without giving playfields out, they would.

It is not that big of a deal to us anymore. A few chips and a bit of pooling is not really that hard to touch up or learn to live with. Games are really easy to sell with brand new replacement playfields too.

#6517 35 days ago
Quoted from Fytr:

I see that there is a metal protector under the plastic above the drop targets in front of Lil' Deadpool. Are you referring to the clear plastic over the open section behind the drop targets being cracked on your game?

See post #6373

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/deadpool-owners-club-free-chimichangas-for-all/page/128#post-5692013

#6518 35 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Do you have a Stern or JJP game that has a playfield issue? I think many owners are happy with the unpopulated playfield replacement. What would you start the class action over?

I have one and I would definitely not be happy with an unpopulated play field. As for the lawsuit, I wouldn't go class action, but I'm currently exploring how to go about suing an out of state company.

#6519 35 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Do you have a Stern or JJP game that has a playfield issue? I think many owners are happy with the unpopulated playfield replacement. What would you start the class action over?

Are they? I'm sure some are satisfied, but my guess is most are not happy with just a play field.

#6520 33 days ago
Quoted from Spyderturbo007:

I have one and I would definitely not be happy with an unpopulated play field. As for the lawsuit, I wouldn't go class action, but I'm currently exploring how to go about suing an out of state company.

I am not sure what you can sue them for?

#6521 33 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

I am not sure what you can sue them for?

quick hint, look at the title of the thread you are posting in...

#6522 33 days ago
Quoted from DerGoetz:

quick hint, look at the title of the thread you are posting in...

Quick tip.

You have to be specific to sue a person or company. Sueing people or companies costs a lot of money. That is why people talk and think about it but never do it.

-1
#6523 33 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Quick tip.
You have to be specific to sue a person or company. Sueing people or companies costs a lot of money. That is why people talk and think about it but never do it.

This is in the running for the weakest retort I have ever seen posted on the internet. That is really something. CrazyLevi has been using the same retort towards me for several years and this is worse than that. Touché

#6524 32 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

This is in the running for the weakest retort I have ever seen posted on the internet. That is really something. CrazyLevi has been using the same retort towards me for several years and this is worse than that. Touché

Nothing wrong with CrazyLevi. I would love to meet him someday and share some pinball stories. I am sure that his money and his mouth are in the same place. Putting other pinsiders down is really poor form.

#6525 31 days ago

A:IQ Pro, day two on location:
Post fell out mid game

Dimpling doesn't seem to be as deep as JP, though. More what I would typically expect and way less noticable:
Typical dimples, look near Thanos' mode light on the upper left

#6526 31 days ago
Quoted from Caviel:

A:IQ Pro, day two on location:
[quoted image]
Dimpling doesn't seem to be as deep as JP, though. More what I would typically expect and way less noticable:
[quoted image]

Post allready break off the dr strange mech?

#6527 31 days ago
Quoted from Caviel:

A:IQ Pro, day two on location:

That mech does not look like it will last, wait until the LEs and Prems get into owners hands and on site

#6528 31 days ago
Quoted from Caviel:

A:IQ Pro, day two on location:
[quoted image]
Dimpling doesn't seem to be as deep as JP, though. More what I would typically expect and way less noticable:
[quoted image]

With the speed of nowadays machines, that post is going to be a real issue.

Is it just me or does the playfield seems to be "ribbled" just under the Thor Multi Ball" insert?

#6529 31 days ago
Quoted from Caviel:

A:IQ Pro, day two on location:
[quoted image]
Dimpling doesn't seem to be as deep as JP, though. More what I would typically expect and way less noticable:
[quoted image]

Lmao. Got to buy that LE though then defend my purchase. What will it take for people? Just got too much money to spend on a hobby. Quality continues to decline. The Tmnt playfield art printing and all the issues with premium/le just another example.

#6530 31 days ago
Quoted from Fytr:

My stated policy has been no NIB purchases going forward, I'd always strive to find a game I could lay eyes on before purchase...
So... I just picked up a DP Pro, NIB, but took the extreme step of paying my distro (who is 1000kms away from me) to unbox and setup the game and send me high quality pics of the playfield prior to sending me the game, just so I could eliminate the risk of at least some of the issues on my game (mis-printed art, clearcoat pooling, extreme unevenness of clear coat finish, extreme insert crazing, etc).
To be completely honest, I'm still not thrilled with the level of insert crazing and the overall smoothness of clearcoat for this price, but it still looks good, and it was that or no Deadpool (couldn't find a nice used one), so I sucked it up, no regrets so far, but entirely sad that I have to pay someone to make sure my new Stern isn't completely defective out of the box.
(EDIT->I've had 3 previous NIB Sterns over the last 4 years that all had defective playfields of one variety or another).

Well, even though I took what some would consider extreme steps to ensure a decent pf on my game, and installed mylar over the shooter lane and dropped the trough kickout power to 180 (min. it will go) prior to plunging ball #1, this is what I see after 45 games...

IMG_8923 (resized).JPG

IMG_8924 (resized).JPG

I had thought/hoped/expected Stern's new thinner, uneven finish clear-coat to at least be more resilient to chipping. I was wrong.

Apparently Li'l Deadpool was so distraught over it he killed himself not 20 games later...

IMG_8936 (resized).JPG

So yeah, Stern's got this kwality thing nailed.

#6531 31 days ago
Quoted from Fytr:

Well, even though I took what some would consider extreme steps to ensure a decent pf on my game, and installed mylar over the shooter lane and dropped the trough kickout power to 180 (min. it will go) prior to plunging ball #1, this is what I see after 45 games...
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
I had thought/hoped/expected Stern's new thinner, uneven finish clear-coat to at least be more resilient to chipping. I was wrong.
Apparently Li'l Deadpool was so distraught over it he killed himself not 20 games later...
[quoted image]
So yeah, Stern's got this kwality thing nailed.

13
#6532 31 days ago

I think we're about 3 years away from $14,000 games with cardboard playfields.

#6533 31 days ago
Quoted from bigd1979:

Post allready break off the dr strange mech?

It didn't break, it just came loose when I was playing so I shut it off and let the folks running the place know. Apparently it's the second time it happened on this machine in two days. The screw comes up from the underside of the spinner plastic and the nylon locking nut is up top.

Underside of AIQ Pro spinner mech

Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

That mech does not look like it will last, wait until the LEs and Prems get into owners hands and on site

The screw head is already difficult to hold in place on the Pro without dismantling the whole assembly. Apparently it's a bigger PITA to fix on Prem/LE models because the lift mech makes it even harder to get to the post screwhead.

Quoted from Pinballnewb01:

With the speed of nowadays machines, that post is going to be a real issue.
Is it just me or does the playfield seems to be "ribbled" just under the Thor Multi Ball" insert?

The upper flipper is right next to the spinner which is the easiest way to rip the spinner to charge up the portal.

You can't tell as easily from this pic, but there are sunken lighted inserts on the Pro. They don't look bad at all playing, this is just weird lighting angles from the backglass.

#6534 30 days ago
Quoted from seenev:

I think we're about 3 years away from $14,000 games with cardboard playfields.

We are already there with the garbage they are producing now. Fun games but 0 quality.

#6535 30 days ago
Quoted from Caviel:

...so I shut it off and let the folks running the place know....

Oh boy, here we go again

Do they have software to make the strange target count as spinner? Cause when that thing us out you're screwed

#6536 30 days ago

Seems like a hard thing to compensate for. Like the AC/DC bell. Played a premium on location that had it removed. That was a horrible experience.

#6537 30 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Seems like a hard thing to compensate for.

What does the target behind the spinner do? Couldn't figure it out the couple times I played it.
When the spinner didn't work I didn't feel like the stand up was doing much, but avain I didn't know the rules or anything.

#6538 30 days ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

What does the target behind the spinner do? Couldn't figure it out the couple times I played it.
When the spinner didn't work I didn't feel like the stand up was doing much, but avain I didn't know the rules or anything.

I believe it can spell I-R-O-N, add-a-ball or the extraball

#6539 28 days ago

Ive received a JP2 Stern from 24 August, ive put it already around 30 games, im waiting for a playfield protector, im trying to not play it a lot, hard to do

Star posts on the slings look very nice, not sinked into the clear, also they have already put some washers on some points of the playfield, dont know if this is normal...
Playfield looks very nice and still no dimples, but im sure i will have them, if i play with no playfield protector.

Other areas that i should look closer? Thanks

pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
#6540 28 days ago
Quoted from RGAires:

Ive received a JP2 Stern from 24 August, ive put it already around 30 games, im waiting for a playfield protector, im trying to not play it a lot, hard to do
Star posts on the slings look very nice, not sinked into the clear, also they have already put some washers on some points of the playfield, dont know if this is normal...
Playfield looks very nice and still no dimples, but im sure i will have them, if i play with no playfield protector.
Other areas that i should look closer? Thanks[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Shooter lane. Turn the trough eject power right down and fit some Cliffys. Just my opinion.

#6541 28 days ago
Quoted from pinballaddicted:

Shooter lane. Turn the trough eject power right down and fit some Cliffys. Just my opinion.

Thanks, i would love to see more inputs.
Regards

#6542 28 days ago
Quoted from RGAires:

Ive received a JP2 Stern from 24 August, ive put it already around 30 games, im waiting for a playfield protector, im trying to not play it a lot, hard to do
Star posts on the slings look very nice, not sinked into the clear, also they have already put some washers on some points of the playfield, dont know if this is normal...
Playfield looks very nice and still no dimples, but im sure i will have them, if i play with no playfield protector.
Other areas that i should look closer? Thanks[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Looks like the rail guides may be updated on your game, so they don't dig into the clear as much as previous. Can't be sure though.

#6543 28 days ago
Quoted from RC_like_the_cola:

Looks like the rail guides may be updated on your game, so they don't dig into the clear as much as previous. Can't be sure though.

Any way that we can confirm that? Maybe is hope that Stern is starting to make something about it

#6544 28 days ago
Quoted from RGAires:

Any way that we can confirm that? Maybe is hope that Stern is starting to make something about it

You can see it on avengers too and on streams it was softly acknowledged that they did take actions... the base of the guides have flat tabs on them...albeit there is some chipping on one game in the shooter lane but nowhere remotely on the main playfield. It could have been missed

#6545 27 days ago
Quoted from RGAires:

Any way that we can confirm that? Maybe is hope that Stern is starting to make something about it

Harrison Drake mentioned in a podcast or stream that on Avengers, the ball guides are modified so they block less light from the GI. So maybe not in response to the playfield issues but a nice side benefit?

#6546 27 days ago

Also you can see the diference on the design of the palyfield art

pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
1 week later
#6547 19 days ago

Any suggestion on how to cover up post pooling? I have a Willy Wonka LE I just bought from someone they assured me there wasn't anything that bad and most of the pics it looked like reflections. Well pretty much every star post has them and all the metal posts too. Can anyone show me what they did to help either stop it from getting worse or hide it?

#6548 19 days ago
Quoted from IronMan8Bit:

Any suggestion on how to cover up post pooling? I have a Willy Wonka LE I just bought from someone they assured me there wasn't anything that bad and most of the pics it looked like reflections. Well pretty much every star post has them and all the metal posts too. Can anyone show me what they did to help either stop it from getting worse or hide it?

heu... i dont understand... the deal !!!
why did you take the pin than ?

#6549 19 days ago
Quoted from RipleYYY:

heu... i dont understand... the deal !!!
why did you take the pin than ?

I mean, that was a rough bunch of words put together, but I agree with the sentiment.

Why the heck did you take it IronMan8Bit ? This and pirates are known to have issues. I'm sorry this happened, but I would have looked at it in person closer before buying.

#6550 19 days ago
Quoted from IronMan8Bit:

Any suggestion on how to cover up post pooling? I have a Willy Wonka LE I just bought from someone they assured me there wasn't anything that bad and most of the pics it looked like reflections. Well pretty much every star post has them and all the metal posts too. Can anyone show me what they did to help either stop it from getting worse or hide it?

Sorry to hear about your Wonka. You need to read the thread by Yelobird at the link below. His repair method involving the little vinyl repair iron really does work, I tried it myself on a Batman 66. I wish you luck. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/diy-playfield-post-repair-and-chip-proofing-how-to-all-brands

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