(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern


By f3honda4me

10 months ago



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#5501 15 days ago
Quoted from 85vett:

I'd love for you to explain this logic on how any of that could make the center of a PF be higher than both outlanes. It's a convex surface. Your argument only makes sense if my problem is getting a game with a flat PF level.

I guess I could do that. That video was meant for Stern and I didn't want there to be concern with the quality or flatness of the surface of my level. Glass is level thus why I used it as my only goal was to show that my level has a flat surface.

I have a 100 year old house not even the floors are level as for the legs it is not hard to be off by .10 of an inch to know how the playfield sits all else must be true

-2
#5502 15 days ago
Quoted from 85vett:

Not to stir the pot but I'm just tired of being quite at this point thus why I added that particular one to the thread. I'll speak as professionally as possible to share what I'm seeing to anyone that ask to try and keep a cool line of communication but I'm just about fed up. Here is my brand me JP Prem that I waited 6 months for.
If I'm just being to picky, let me know your thoughts as it could just be my expectations. I can deal with a lot and feel like I have a lot of patience with minor defects but I'd much rather have a pooled PF or even wood graining than the warp PF since it does indeed make the game play different.
***Edited as this isn't really directed at anyone specifically. I just quoted what I did to maintain the train of thought on the warp PF conversation.***

You are being way to picky, that’s common on almost any game from any manufacture from any era.

#5503 14 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

You are being way to picky, that’s common on almost any game from any manufacture from any era.

No that is just modern crap quality - get used to the shit they are shoveling. Why because almost everyone is willing to forget (crap quality) when the next hyped title comes out....

Man I can’t tell you how many times I heard Iron Maiden was best machine and it was bolted to the floor. Then JP is the best modern machine (& tons of cheap Iron Maiden’s for sale). Now Turtles is the best (& JPLEs are for sale).

Be smart, don’t buy the hype and wait to get one of these cheap and best yet you can make sure it meets your quality standards (for a nice used price)!

#5504 14 days ago
Quoted from Prodoshi:

sorry to hear man, i can feel you.
i just measured my new DP and JP, both are nice and flat.
Did you already play the game and feel a difference? If so, tell your distributor and play the sht out of this game until your new PF arrives.
I'm really afraid of my TMNT arrival. . .

Yes, I can tell the difference. It's pretty noticeable to me.

Stern asked for pictures with coins under the level to identify the amount of warpage. Looks like about a dime thickness. Not huge but still effects game play. I'll keep the group advised on what is said.
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#5505 14 days ago
Quoted from WackyBrakke:

You are being way to picky, that’s common on almost any game from any manufacture from any era.

I can appreciate that. If I am I'm sure that will come out in the wash. I just know I've owned 20 games, 14 of which Stern, 1 JJP, 1 Bally, 2 Williams, 1 Sonic and 1 Data East and only 2 of them have had a convex playfield. Ironically both are Spike (so newer Sterns). Maybe I've been lucky up till late but my experience has been with flat PF's.

#5506 14 days ago
Quoted from 85vett:

Yes, I can tell the difference. It's pretty noticeable to me.
Stern asked for pictures with coins under the level to identify the amount of warpage. Looks like about a dime thickness. Not huge but still effects game play. I'll keep the group advised on what is said.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Appreciate keeping us in the loop. I reached out to my distrib on raised inserts so I’ll see what he says.

#5507 14 days ago
Quoted from 85vett:

Yes, I can tell the difference. It's pretty noticeable to me.
Stern asked for pictures with coins under the level to identify the amount of warpage. Looks like about a dime thickness. Not huge but still effects game play. I'll keep the group advised on what is said.
[quoted image][quoted image]

damn, but thats just one side. if you take something longer than your level, push it down at one side you can meassuer the gap on the other side.

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#5508 14 days ago

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

#5509 14 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

I am waiting too, but my distributor is in correspondence with stern.

#5510 14 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

I just received my Iron Maiden unpopulated playfield last week. It was about three weeks after I received a confirmation email. I don’t know if they had them in stock or what but they are definitely shipping playfields if they have them on hand.

-1
#5511 14 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Gonna be hard to install that with the game in the box. Heyo!!!

Its ninjas, they do things...

-1
#5512 14 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Yes those playfields look different but are also 100% normal.

Serious question, why is it normal? Why cant JP be as normal as DP? Why arent they doing whatever they did to DP, to all pins? Not being a smartass, what is different?

#5513 14 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

I think it's time for a new normal, I understand this is expected for the product they are selling. That is exactly why I am not buying. It's just Stern being Stern they won't do anything until they are on the verge of collapse. The least they could do is offer some kind of factory built in protector for an additional cost. Maybe acknowledge that they want to improve, tell us they are investigating new materials, technology, something, anything. It's just a complete crap shoot. I don't believe the issue is behind them at all, a couple machines down the line they are going to try some other cost reduction and start all over again.

Simple answer. Gary is getting ready to retire. He is doing the bare minimum to keep people happy, while padding retirement. People are still buying these games sight unseen, you know, cause dream theme. Why should anything change?

#5514 14 days ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Serious question, why is it normal? Why cant JP be as normal as DP? Why arent they doing whatever they did to DP, to all pins? Not being a smartass, what is different?

The gameplay I’d say. Ball flies around the game differently. Deadpool’s face is always the worst part of Deadpool for dimples. Same for stranger things and the whole area in front of the drops. Jurassic park seems pretty uniform on where the dimples are concentrating.

Also always remember stern has multiple vendors for art and clear coat. So that creates variation as well I’m sure.

#5515 14 days ago

Its really terrible that stern can sell a game and have no parts to support warranty. Yet they have no problem manufacturing parts to build new games to sell.

#5516 12 days ago

I just tried to call their technical support and they are not answering and will not call you back due to the coronavirus situation. How convenient.

#5517 12 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

It took about 6 months to get approved for an unpop Iron Maiden LE pf. It has been about 6 months since approval , I contacted Stern last week to be told it is still on back order.

#5518 12 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

I just tried to call their technical support and they are not answering and will not call you back due to the coronavirus situation. How convenient.

Just wow!

#5519 12 days ago
Quoted from ghostbc:

It took about 6 months to get approved for an unpop Iron Maiden LE pf. It has been about 6 months since approval , I contacted Stern last week to be told it is still on back order.

I have a DP one too on order and hopefully a JP (if my warped PF case gets approved). I'm betting none of us get them until they go out of production. My reasoning for this. I just got my JP Prem a couple weeks ago. The PF date is stamped as 2/20. That just tells me they have stock for production games but not for replacements. I'm not sure their policy but I'm making the assumption (and yes I know what that normally means) that they only set aside a small % of parts for warrantee/replacement per batch of product and the rest goes to new builds. Honestly, I wouldn't disagree with that approach anyways. With that assumption I just think most of the replacements will come as the demand for the games dwindle.

It may also be part of how bad the original is as well. Someone with cosmetic defects that warrantee a replacement may get put behind someone with physical issues with their PF.

Who really know. As much heat as Stern gets for their support (in a lot of cases rightfully slow) they do come through on their commitments, while sometimes taking a long time to do so. So, I'd say it's safe you'll get your PF but it may be a while.

#5520 12 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

I just tried to call their technical support and they are not answering and will not call you back due to the coronavirus situation. How convenient.

Really ? Didn't know Covid can be transmitted to others over the telephone line ! That's a new one. Maybe if you call them back with a mask on they will answer.

#5521 12 days ago
Quoted from ghostbc:

It took about 6 months to get approved for an unpop Iron Maiden LE pf. It has been about 6 months since approval , I contacted Stern last week to be told it is still on back order.

Yep, i pretty much assumed it would be never. So no trouble producing TMNT, no trouble producing heavy metal during covid. But no support for existing customers with issues. Btw it took almost exactly 6 months to get approval, and im about a month into the backorder excuses. Also im just hoping i can get a unpopulated playfield was trying to take the easy approach that if i wasnt too unreasonable they would be more willing to provide good customer service but that doesn’t exist, this shit happens with new air conditioning systems and then there is a class action lawsuit but the consumer always pays anyway for the manufacturers poor quality, this is typical big corporate treat the customer like shit because there is nothing the customer can do to us.

#5522 12 days ago
Quoted from NoQuarters:

Really ? Didn't know Covid can be transmitted to others over the telephone line ! That's a new one. Maybe if you call them back with a mask on they will answer.

Maybe. But you need to step back 6 feet first then and yell at the phone through your mask!

#5523 12 days ago
Quoted from cpr9999:

Maybe. But you need to step back 6 feet first then and yell at the phone through your mask!

I don't know - Terry is in Ohio and Stern is in Illinois so I'm sure that's "long distance" social distancing by telephone. What good is another 6' going to do ? As long as he puts a mask on I think he's good.

I'm still skeptical Stern can't answer the phone because of Covid concerns. I think they are safe.

Unless there is only 1 phone for the whole company - then I'm sure it's hard to keep it sanitized.

#5524 12 days ago

OK, I bought a used DP pro with a NIB unpopulated playfield. There are currently two locations on the installed playfield with chipping. I did the finger test today on the installed playfield and the new one both, and noticed that on the new one, I can feel the inserts raised more. So definitely thinner C.C. on new replacement playfield.

#5526 11 days ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

New from Stern, The Find. Warped playfields, raised inserts, chipping clear coats and pooling art, See what you can "Find" on your new Stern.
[quoted image]

Collect them all!

#5527 11 days ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

New from Stern, The Find. Warped playfields, raised inserts, chipping clear coats and pooling art, See what you can "Find" on your new Stern.

You forgot shit coil stops among other things.

#5528 11 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

The gameplay I’d say. Ball flies around the game differently. Deadpool’s face is always the worst part of Deadpool for dimples. Same for stranger things and the whole area in front of the drops. Jurassic park seems pretty uniform on where the dimples are concentrating.
Also always remember stern has multiple vendors for art and clear coat. So that creates variation as well I’m sure.

Thanks, that makes sense.

#5529 11 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

I’ve been waiting 6 months now

#5530 10 days ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

I just tried to call their technical support and they are not answering and will not call you back due to the coronavirus situation. How convenient.

I think you are required to have a mask on when you call.

#5531 10 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Is anyone else in this thread waiting for a jp warranty playfield? If so, how long have you been waiting. After almost 7 months i was approved for a unpopulated warranty. I sent my address and then received an email that playfields for Jp are on backorder. Just wondering if there are others waiting? Funny thing is in the email they claim covid is to blame, but they had no problem getting materials to produce TMNT OR Heavy Metal during the same covid.

How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.

What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?

To me it "seems" like its this :

unpopulated = shove under the machine until I sell it. Perhaps add it as a sweetener if they see the playfield condition or sell it later to make up for the difference.

populated = actually getting what I originally wanted and paid for.

#5532 10 days ago
Quoted from koops:

How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.
What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?
To me it "seems" like its this :
unpopulated = shove under the machine until I sell it. Perhaps add it as a sweetener if they see the playfield condition or sell it later to make up for the difference.
populated = actually getting what I originally wanted and paid for.

Without a dog in the fight, i believe most have gotten unpopulated pfs, which would irk me to no end.

#5533 10 days ago
Quoted from koops:

How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.
What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?

I bought this in part because I was looking for another project. I enjoy these projects during the winter months to stay occupied. But the PF in the machine is fine. One of the areas that is chipped is hidden from view behind a ball guide. The other is visible at the lower left sling post. But it doesn't bother me at all and people don't notice it. It would be easy to repair anyway. I may or may not swap the playfield down the road. But ideally, this new PF should get another coat of clear first. But I don't do that so it'll just look nice on my wall for now. I've heard Stern no longer does populated PF's.

#5534 10 days ago

A friend of mine received his populated JP playfield this week after nagging them since last October. I guess miracles can still happen? His original had an insert sunken in far enough to effect gameplay.

#5535 10 days ago
Quoted from koops:

How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.
What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?
To me it "seems" like its this :
unpopulated = shove under the machine until I sell it. Perhaps add it as a sweetener if they see the playfield condition or sell it later to make up for the difference.
populated = actually getting what I originally wanted and paid for.

In my case its unpopulated, i was also told stern wants the old one back. Im going to do the swap then send back the old one as long as they include a return receipt, they said they would. I think making customers wait 6-12 months or more is crappy, this kind of treatment is on purpose, starts at the top.

#5536 10 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

In my case its unpopulated, i was also told stern wants the old one back. Im going to do the swap then send back the old one as long as they include a return receipt, they said they would. I think making customers wait 6-12 months or more is crappy, this kind of treatment is on purpose, starts at the top.

Most people do sell their games earlier anyway?

#5537 10 days ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

In my case its unpopulated, i was also told stern wants the old one back. Im going to do the swap then send back the old one as long as they include a return receipt, they said they would. I think making customers wait 6-12 months or more is crappy, this kind of treatment is on purpose, starts at the top.

And what are they going to do if you don't send it back? Send Jared out to scowl at you until you set aside a week of your own time to do the swap? I would tell them to pound sand.

In the case of populated playfields being sent- once yours is ready to be shipped, they send you a box to pack your old one in. Once you send it back, they send you the new one.

#5538 10 days ago
Quoted from koops:

How many are getting unpopulated vs populated? Locally i've heard about people with bad pf's but havn't heard if they got populated ones or if that is a thing of the past now.
What are people that are getting unpopulated going to do with them? Would even 1/2 of them swap the pf's?
To me it "seems" like its this :
unpopulated = shove under the machine until I sell it. Perhaps add it as a sweetener if they see the playfield condition or sell it later to make up for the difference.
populated = actually getting what I originally wanted and paid for.

For my Deadpool I had 100% intention of doing the PF swap but the PF they sent me is worse than what is in the game now (minus the wear spots to the wood). They are supposed to be exchanging my replacement though for which I do plan to do the swap and hang the old one on my game room wall as art.

Quoted from Colehvac1:

In my case its unpopulated, i was also told stern wants the old one back. Im going to do the swap then send back the old one as long as they include a return receipt, they said they would. I think making customers wait 6-12 months or more is crappy, this kind of treatment is on purpose, starts at the top.

That's the first time I've heard this from anyone on an unpopulated PF. I sure hope they don't take this route with me on my replacement DP or JP PF (assuming they replace the defective one). If so, then they will have to either pay me to do the swap (at my hourly rate) or send a tech. I'm OK doing it myself if I keep the old one as the wall art feels like compensation for my time doing the swap. If I have to send it back then I'm working for free to fix a defective product in the first place, which I'm not OK with.

#5539 10 days ago
Quoted from JodyG:

In the case of populated playfields being sent- once yours is ready to be shipped, they send you a box to pack your old one in. Once you send it back, they send you the new one.

Agreed here. I'm actually really surprised that Stern hasn't taken advantage of this possible business opportunity here to just sell populated PF's for their new titles. Not sure how many of you have pulled a Spike PF but it's stupid easy. This could be a win/win for Stern. They have a stock of populated PF that they send for warrantee PF issues, when the old one comes back in they have an employee or two swap the PF and can then sell that assembly for a slight discount (remanufactured unity). Then they could also sell new populated PF's. Think of how many people want the latest and greatest but don't have the space for another game. You could easily store several Populated PF's in the same space as a machine or even just 1 under an existing game. Not to mention the accessories market for storage options.

#5540 10 days ago
Quoted from 85vett:

Agreed here. I'm actually really surprised that Stern hasn't taken advantage of this possible business opportunity here to just sell populated PF's for their new titles. Not sure how many of you have pulled a Spike PF but it's stupid easy. This could be a win/win for Stern. They have a stock of populated PF that they send for warrantee PF issues, when the old one comes back in they have an employee or two swap the PF and can then sell that assembly for a slight discount (remanufactured unity). Then they could also sell new populated PF's. Think of how many people want the latest and greatest but don't have the space for another game. You could easily store several Populated PF's in the same space as a machine or even just 1 under an existing game. Not to mention the accessories market for storage options.

While it sounds cool, it doesn't make sense to sell something like a populated playfield that would in turn dilute their NIB sales. Sold out $600 crappy toppers have proven to them that pinheads will just buy the whole game if they want it. Given Stern's price structure, the populated PF would probably run $4000 or $4500 alone. Might as well just wait a few months to buy a routed game and get the whole thing.

#5541 10 days ago

For those with newer "less clear" playfields and slightly raised inserts has anyone reached out to Stern? You can feel they are raised and can hear when a ball rolls over. I assume this will lead to increased insert wear not being a smooth surface. It sounds 50/50 if Stern will do anything.

#5542 10 days ago
Quoted from gblack:

For those with newer "less clear" playfields and slightly raised inserts has anyone reached out to Stern? You can feel they are raised and can hear when a ball rolls over. I assume this will lead to increased insert wear not being a smooth surface. It sounds 50/50 if Stern will do anything.

I thought about it, but I bought it second hand. Hell, if I was going to keep Deapool for ever, I'd just cover the whole PF with Mylar and cut out the holes with Exacto knife before swapping it. But I don't want to try selling it this way. And not worth it to pay someone to cc it more. And not worth it to swap it when the replacement has thinner cc than the one in there. Best to repair the chips and sell the new PF as is.
Also, I hate PF protectors. Had one on an F-14 and dirt kept getting under it and it scratched on the under side and really looked like ass! So I removed it.

#5543 10 days ago

Thin clearcoat isn't a bad thing. The first clearcoated games only had a couple coats and they've lasted nearly 30 years. Most diamondplated Williams games clean up great and so do Sterns, save for the pooling and chipping issues.

#5544 10 days ago
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:

I thought about it, but I bought it second hand. Hell, if I was going to keep Deapool for ever, I'd just cover the whole PF with Mylar and cut out the holes with Exacto knife before swapping it. But I don't want to try selling it this way. And not worth it to pay someone to cc it more. And not worth it to swap it when the replacement has thinner cc than the one in there. Best to repair the chips and sell the new PF as is.
Also, I hate PF protectors. Had one on an F-14 and dirt kept getting under it and it scratched on the under side and really looked like ass! So I removed it.

My question is around those that have the newer playfield that have less clear. Mine and some others have inserts that sit higher than the pf (guessing due to thinner clear?). Has anyone reached out to stern regarding the raised inserts? It seems stern fixed the chipping and pooling by a thinner clear but now inserts sit too high.

#5545 10 days ago

I'm curious for any new tmnt owners to post close ups of their playfields. I'm dying to see if stern got their heads out of their asses on this one.

#5546 9 days ago
Quoted from treborlicec:

Thin clearcoat isn't a bad thing. The first clearcoated games only had a couple coats and they've lasted nearly 30 years. Most diamondplated Williams games clean up great and so do Sterns, save for the pooling and chipping issues.

I am wondering about the inserts not being flush. How will this weather over time? I'm not worried about this in the time I will own and play it, just about how these will hold up long term? I'm mostly just curious.
F-14 was an example of a playfield with only one coat of clear. They didn't hold up well. But I don't know if the clear back then was as good or better than what Stern is using now. And I also don't know how many coats of clear are being applied to these new PF's either.

#5547 9 days ago

My f-14 doesn't have any clear at all. The mylar was destroyed and had to be real careful removing it. I have the newer thin protector on now and it plays so much better than the mylar that was on it before. I do see dust under it but using compressed air to clear it has worked well so far. I'm happy with it.

#5548 9 days ago
Quoted from C0untDeM0net:

My f-14 doesn't have any clear at all. The mylar was destroyed and had to be real careful removing it. I have the newer thin protector on now and it plays so much better than the mylar that was on it before. I do see dust under it but using compressed air to clear it has worked well so far. I'm happy with it.

Yes, compressed air is how I got the particles out as well. I had the early thicker protector. Less user friendly for sure. But I did a full restore with PPS repro playfield. It was an early run with no light boards. What a PITA! Deadpool would be a walk in the park by comparison. I would imagine that protector on your F-14 is providing a smooth surface over the raised inserts. Unless you clamped them back down and epoxied them from underneath?

#5549 9 days ago
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:

I am wondering about the inserts not being flush. How will this weather over time? I'm not worried about this in the time I will own and play it, just about how these will hold up long term? I'm mostly just curious.
F-14 was an example of a playfield with only one coat of clear. They didn't hold up well. But I don't know if the clear back then was as good or better than what Stern is using now either. And I also don't know how many coats of clear are being applied to these new PF's either.

I don't believe there will be any long term issues. I've owned alot of Sterns and some old WPCs. They all look that way if you look at the right angle. The inserts aren't raised, but the screening is and it isn't completely flat because there isn't mounds of clear on top. I put 9000 plays on my TSPP and it was gorgeous when I traded it (#regret).

#5550 9 days ago
Quoted from treborlicec:

The inserts aren't raised, but the screening is and it isn't completely flat because there isn't mounds of clear on top.

This is an interesting point you bring up. I can't say the inserts are raised now that you mention it. Maybe it is just the screening. But my ACNC is mirror smooth by comparison. I wonder how much ball is affected by this. Probably not enough to matter. But IDK.

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