(Topic ID: 249870)

Continued playfield issues with JJP and Stern

By f3honda4me

2 years ago


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#5351 1 year ago

I also don’t believe it is a curing issue, I bought a NIB Metallica back in February of this year. The game was made August of 2018 so 1 1/2 years to cure and it still dimpled. My 2 Chicago gaming remakes also dimpled as bad as the sterns I have. I’am not really bothered by the dimples just wanted to share my experience with Metallica.

#5352 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

I’ll say it again. I don’t work for stern. Did you miss that last time?

Oh read it, I simply do not believe you lol

#5353 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

Oh read it, I simply do not believe you lol

Gotcha.

#5354 1 year ago

I was thinking about getting a JP2 but I was concerned about the t-Rex throwing the ball around and how that would affect the playfield over time. I would think it would cause some wicked dimples.

#5355 1 year ago
Quoted from RikeIsland:

I was thinking about getting a JP2 but I was concerned about the t-Rex throwing the ball around and how that would affect the playfield over time. I would think it would cause some wicked dimples.

Well, I believe that you can change the settings so that he drops the ball onto on the ramps instead. Or even doesn't swing at all I think. Could be wrong, I'm not an owner, but I'm pretty sure there's an adjustment that does that.

#5356 1 year ago

On the JP the new playfields 2020 builds are good. Mine has minimal dimpling after 4 months. I’m shocked to be honest. Maybe the wood is harder. Who knows. I can’t say the same for all my other past Stern, JJ or Spooky playfields! They all have one issue or another, chipping, bubbling, dimpling etc.

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#5357 1 year ago

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.

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#5358 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

Damn, that looks like shit.

#5359 1 year ago
Quoted from pingod:

Damn, that looks like shit.

Yeah.... based on the pic it looks like a pro version. I wonder if premiums are better?

#5360 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

Yeah.... based on the pic it looks like a pro version. I wonder if premiums are better?

Nope, grain lines and chipping do not discriminate...happens to all models.

#5361 1 year ago
Quoted from Aquapin:

Nope, grain lines and chipping do not discriminate...happens to all models.

Ugh wtf

#5362 1 year ago
Quoted from ABE_FLIPS:

PF from Dec. 2019 with 1500 games so far.
What do you think? I am not amused.

All I see is a guy shining a light on a pinball playfield so you can see the dimples that you normally wouldn't be able to see without that bright light shining on it.

Play your game and have fun, it's not a big deal like chipping clearcoat or pooling is.

10
#5363 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

but are you POSITIVE you don't work for stern

I can confirm that Chuckwurt works for Stern. The drive from Kentucky to Chicago everyday and back sucks but other than that he really loves his job.

#5364 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

All I see is a guy shining a light on a pinball playfield so you can see the dimples that you normally wouldn't be able to see without that bright light shining on it.
Play your game and have fun, it's not a big deal like chipping clearcoat or pooling is.

so you didn't see my second image of the "players perspective?...
its clearly visible.

Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

holy sht, i wouldnt accept this at all and send it back! even without bubbles and chipping.

#5365 1 year ago

Well, at least things haved toned down a bit, we don’t have the Stevie Ritchie quoters saying something like “it’s metal against wood, playfields dimple, get over it”

Quoted from ABE_FLIPS:

PF from Dec. 2019 with 1500 games so far.
What do you think? I am not amused.

I think you are quite right to bring this up in this thread, it’s the purpose of the thread, right? And I agree, it’s unacceptable.

I’m still waiting for the definitive explanation, why some playfields dimple more than others - even among different examples of the same game. I’m not even sure we as Pinsiders have established if the dimples are caused by compacting in the paint, the wood or both. One of these days, somebody will cut through a dimpled playfield, do a cross-sectional analysis of a dimple, measure paint layer thicknesses and then we’ll be a lot wiser. I don’t think we even know how thick the paint is typically on a playfield, or in how many individual layers it is applied.

My take, however, based on how long folks have been complaining about it, is that some manufacturers are not taking the necessary quality control steps. And if you, as a manufacturer are not willing to do that, the best strategy is to blame the customer for exaggerated expectations. Which takes us back to my first statement in this post.

Quoted from chuckwurt:

If it’s something you don’t like, don’t buy new games.

I would agree, but I would not generalize and say new games, but I would say base your NIB purchases on those games and manufacturers which are much less likely to show this defect.

#5366 1 year ago

Plain and simple, it’s soft wood, not sure how many ply is it?

My TAFG, CFTBL & MM(W) don’t have anywhere near the amount of dimples.. and the dimples they do are shallow.

GBLE, GOTGLE, SWLE, MUNLE, BM66 all have dimples, a lot of them!

D.I - early LE with Ceramic Clear is really very good
WWCFCE - dimples!

Manufacturers putting clauses in their manuals that dimples, raised/ghosting inserts, pooling is a CHARACTERISTIC of a pinball machine.. and should be accepted BULLSHIT!

The clearing process is different from 15yrs ago, not allowed to use some of the chemicals used in Diamond Plate for example..

The dimples are due to the soft wood used..

Don’t CPR use hard wood.. Anyone have one
Of their playfields in a game to compare pictures of a game with say.. 400 plays on it?

#5367 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinhead1982:

Plain and simple, it’s soft wood, not sure how many ply is it?

At first I thought that, too, but I’m not sure anymore. If the clearcoat is being applied too thick to get that super sheen it could cause the dimples without going into the wood. It could be that the dimples are really shallow (maybe 1 micrometer) and simply because of the way light reflects, it makes the dimple appear larger than it really is.

#5368 1 year ago

Then we should ask kruzman

Ron, in my eyes is THE expert to get advice from.

Do Ron’s playfields dimple?

#5369 1 year ago

I think its a combination of changes rather than one thing. But ultimately the critical problem isn't wood or clear or chemicals - its the lack of maturity in this industry.

Some changes are related to cost, some related to regulations. What's clear (hoho) is that if the pinball companies would invest in more R&D and working out a proper solution or aligning as an industry on what is acceptable or not; it would save them money and drive more customer satisfaction across the market - pinball is too busy fighting for market share in a tiny market rather than figuring out how they collectively grow the market. I despair of the short sightedness of the pinball industries' attitude on this, which appears to be focused on who's fault is it in the supply chain rather than getting the supply chain together to fix it, so Stern working with JJP and Spooky and CGC and AP and all of their suppliers. It helps none of them that this problem exists. Pinball companies could agree to a set of playfield standards, then use those to build games, I think most people would pay $50 more to know they get a playfield with no issues. I certainly would.

An issue like this in any other manufacturing area would drive immediate response, if my industry behaved like this we'd be out of business or hauled in front of the government and told to fix it. Since I got back into pinball 4 years ago its been a constant drag on all of our enjoyment and if I may be so bold, I plead to all the pinball manufacturers - what you are doing isn't working for us, please work together to resolve this for the good of the industry.

Neil.

#5370 1 year ago

Considering people including myself rushed out to buy a ninja turtles I doubt Stern cares. My turtles LE will stay in a box until i can get a playfield protector on it.

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#5371 1 year ago
Quoted from Mrawesome44:

Considering people including myself rushed out to buy a ninja turtles I doubt Stern cares. My turtles LE will stay in a box until i can get a playfield protector on it.

Gonna be hard to install that with the game in the box. Heyo!!!

#5372 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

Wow, that is just unacceptable considering these prices. We now know that Stern gets their playfield wood from the same supplier as CPR but that CPR spends another $50 or so per playfield to make a higher quality product. Why can’t Stern offer the same quality as CPR after numerous price increases and all time record NIB prices? Greed.

I’ve shared this before but here’s the post of CPR talking about the wood they use for anyone that hasn’t seen it.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/cpr-playfield-preorders-are-meaningless?tq=&tu=CPR

"Guys;
I have to jump in here as well, on four issues. The first was the Xenon PFs that we ran out of last year. The Xenon's I cut were in no way shape or form ever going to satisfy the entire interest but at the time I had the wood and inserts for a very limited number of PFs. I decided that rather than idle the CNC and layoff the guys it made more since to actually make the PFs I had materials for at the time. The rest of the material had been ordered but the lead times on our materials can be HUGE! It just made since to keep everyone employed and the machines working while new supplies were on route.
The second point I have to comment on is our wood. I absolutely believe that our wood is by FAR the best in the world. We have had many suppliers over the years and in bad times have been forced to use the same wood as the other PF manufacturer uses all the time and let me tell you that doing so is our last resort. Playfield wood over the decades has often been whatever was available to the manufacturers. Many PFs especially in the 70s and 80s PFs used three layers of thick cheap filler wood with two thin layers of maple on the faces, something you could buy at your local building supply only with thicker face veneers. For decades most of the better playfield wood came from North American Plywood near Chicago. It used sweet gum as its filler cores and .040" face veneers. But in 2008 in the downturn they liquidated their custom plywood mill and everyone was scrambling to find wood, even Stern. We then shifted to Marion Plywood from Wisconsin who made two very good orders for us before they shifted their glues to a more green product that warped like crazy. We even tried a Russian Baltic Birch that had custom maple veneers glued to it. It was expensive and unsuitable for several reasons. Finally, the current supplier for Stern contacted us and offered to make our wood. This was several years ago now and we couldn't have been happier as they work directly with us to produce the very best CUSTOM wood you can buy ANYWHERE! Their standard wood for Stern is a good one side panel with 3 layers of white ash and a 0.048" face veneers. After many consultations with their tech guys we came up with what I know is the best playfield wood in the world. We use the same basic setup as Stern, 3 layers of white ash cores then we use 4 layers of maritime hard maple BUT we increased the thickness of the two face veneers by 64% to get a nominal face thickness of 0.075". These huge and thick ONE piece veneers are crazy expensive and we always get this top grade veneer on BOTH sides of your PF. This alone added $12 to the cost of each panel vs just using a second grade veneer on the bottom like Stern does. There's nothing wrong with the way Stern does it, as they just refuse any board they want and since they are so close to the mill, the mill just picks it up with the next load and credits them. We however are a $4000 freight bill away so that won't work. We pay a lot extra to get the very best wood they can produce right off the start. You get a much nicer product and a much denser and tougher PF. This wood is 25% heavier for the same size panel as our old wood and nearly a third heavier as Baltic Birch which some other playfield manufacturers use. I would love to use cheaper wood like some others do, after all why would I pay $12.50/sqft landed when I can get birch at less than $2.00sqft? We use the best densest hardest custom wood we can get because we think its worth it and we always try to make the very best product we can.
There are other point is that we intentionally make three levels of quality. Wow, really? We always try to make perfect playfields, every single time but in the past we ALWAYS did full spot color silkscreens which meant that each and every color layer is individually vectored with trapping layers built and silk screened one color at a time, one on top of the other. 14 colors means 14 trips through the screen press. 14! Even the slightest misalignment in any single layer of the normal 12-14 color process means the final product isn't a gold anymore. Its wood, a living surface so if the ink doesn't lay down into every nook and cranny of every square mm of the grain then its not a gold. If a single piece of dust get in the screen and makes its way into the print which is very hard to prevent then its really not a gold anymore. To screen press a playfield we could never do more than about 1 color a day just due to the logistics of cleaning the ink you just used out of the screen trying to save what you can, then removing the screen and washing it with cleaner and paper towels, then once the ink is out, rinsing and then using a stripper to remove the image from the screen, then rinsing, then bleaching the screen to remove all traces of the previous image, rinsing, then drying the screen. Then you have to coat the screen with a photosensitive liquid and let that dry. Then you lay on your full size and expensive direct contact positive and expose the whole thing to a powerful UV light, then immediately wash the screen once more to expose the image which means a third drying of the screen! Then mount it and align it precisely to the previous image on the screen press, which always involves a few trial and error hits on test prints. Add in a cleaned and sharpened squeegee and print your single color...... now repeat this process for each and every color on the playfield. Any misalignment at all, even as small as 1/64"in ANY layer and you may not have a gold, any mark from handing and small dropout of ink, and deep grain that the ink didn't get to and you may not have a gold anymore. Screen printing is many many times harder to do than printing it digitally. Producing artwork for screen printing is horrendously more difficult than prepping something for a digital print. We are very lucky that we have years worth of vectored artwork that can fairly easily be converted for digital use to be used on our big flatbed but you can't go the other way. If you printed 100 PFs and have 10 that are not perfect you had no choice but to sell them, hence silvers and bronze. It could take you as long as 2 weeks to reprint those 10 PFs. Now if you are doing these on a digital printer you have eliminated ANY chance of a misalignment because its a single flat image not 12-14 images laid on top of one another, the printer is spraying, so surface imperfections are easily covered and there is no screen to get contaminated. So for screen printing, since the artwork is many times more complex in comparison and the printing method is many times more complex its no wonder that we didn't always get 100% gold. Of course if you have something go sideways on a digital print it takes but minutes to sand the ink off and clean it up and run it through the printer once again, $8 in inks costs versus basically spending two weeks trying to rescreen a few seconds. But now that we have the same tech as others we can also fairly easily reprint an error so there will be much fewer silver and bronzes in our future.
Making the right number of PFs for everyone is more art than anything else. Playfields are crazy expensive to make and the production costs are all up front. In some cases royalties and licensing alone can cost as high as 25% of the full retail value of the PF, do some quick math and figure out the size of the check you'd have to write to cover that on 100 pfs!! Inserts can cost $25-$100 per PF due to minimum requirements of the molders. You can figure out our wood costs from above. Add in the costs of 2 CNCs, 2 laser cutters, a silk screen operation, a huge UV flatbed etc.... now figure that 50% of the guys who signed up don't buy!! In the case of Corvette PFs we had 75% of people who signed up didn't purchase as they promised! Have two or three of these happen in a row and anyone would become gun shy real quick or we risk losing our homes! I tried deposits when I first started this and it was a nightmare, lately we have on rare occasions used them again with much more success so maybe that's a possibility but truthfully making smaller numbers is the safest thing to do. Using the digital system instead of silk screening makes much more sense and having the ability to digitally reprint our screen printed seconds may get rid of them almost entirely.
Making PFs is complex, silk screening playfields is stoopid complex and expensive in the very small numbers we make but we do it because we love it.
Mike"

#5373 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

That’s horrendous. Stern should be embarrassed.

#5374 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

That is atrocious and pathetic of Stern. I feel really bad for you, especially when you try to sell it.
If I went to buy a game off of someone and it looked like that, I'd instantly decline.

#5375 1 year ago

I put a playfield protector on my BM66 before the first ball was played and I see no grain, dimples, or pooling. I wonder if anyone has taken a protector off and inspected to see if these really do prevent issues? I am leaving mine on

#5376 1 year ago

So this morning as I'm cleaning my machines, I figured I'd take a video of my Hobbit playfield with the glass off with the most likely angles o could do shoe any dumpling I possibly could. Out of the three machines, none of them have hardly any dimpling at all. Out of the three that would have them, it would be Hobbit (I play it the most and balls would go flying in this this most, if I had to guess).

This is why people bitch about dimples. There is like.... nothing here. Zero. And I play this thing a shit ton. Minimal dumpling isn't a miracle.

We've all one Bally William's here. We know what is possible.

#5377 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

So this morning as I'm cleaning my machines, I figured I'd take a video of my Hobbit playfield with the glass off with the most likely angles o could do shoe any dumpling I possibly could. Out of the three machines, none of them have hardly any dimpling at all. Out of the three that would have them, it would be Hobbit (I play it the most and balls would go flying in this this most, if I had to guess).
This is why people bitch about dimples. There is like.... nothing here. Zero. And I play this thing a shit ton. Minimal dumpling isn't a miracle.
We've all one Bally William's here. We know what is possible.

There are tons of dimples in that video, though admittedly hard to capture with the camera jerking around.
There are so many dimples that they have become more uniform in appearance.

Here are few outliers I was able to pick up off the blurry video.

Dimples (resized).png
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#5378 1 year ago

A slightly better shot.

Point being, there is no such thing as a magic playfield that never dimples. Try not to let them bug you and enjoy the fun the machine provides - that is what it's for!

Screen Shot 2020-06-21 at 9.15.26 AM.png
#5379 1 year ago

Well I will be damned. Thank you very much for proving me wrong. I certainly have nothing to hide. If this is what we are complaining about then I am confused. I'll gladly shut the fuck up now lol

#5380 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

We get our torches out against Stern’s “value” but i don’t think they sent that out...thats crazy...what i mean is moisture Content or humidity Changed that surface...

Also, they don’t need to work with anyone to make a better product, they know how. They have how many years of experience... Cheap ass products...

#5381 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.
[quoted image]

My Deadpool had the same across the entire playfield.

#5382 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

Well I will be damned. Thank you very much for proving me wrong. I certainly have nothing to hide. If this is what we are complaining about then I am confused. I'll gladly shut the fuck up now lol

Some games the art makes it very easy to see (my stranger things is super easy to catch them). But my GOT it my old AC/DC it was really hard to find them.

For the most part I think as a player yeah it’s unsightly but I’ve never seen it affect gameplay which is my biggest concern. Never see it lead to wear either.

So I’ll just keep not worrying about it until I have a reason to worry about it.

#5383 1 year ago

A drawback to going with thinner clear (in an apparent effort to combat blistering/pooling) is that any wood grain on the playfield will be much more visible in reflections on the surface of the thinner clear. I think we're all going to see this from here on out, at least with Sterns. Some buyers may get lucky and get a nice piece of wood with minimal grain on their playfields, but some may not.

I think as some have said, storage conditions such as excessive moisture may play a part after production. However, I inspected a BM66 recently which was made in April of 2019, and the playfield on that had thinner clear with minor grain noticeable on it, except for one raised grain in the middle of the playfield which was worse (taller) than the others. I wondered if this was due to storage moisture, but I could tell after further inspection that it was manufactured like that, as during the art printing process, this raised grain slightly distorted the art and picked up a little more ink than the rest of the playfield, making the raised grain a little darker due to the increased level of ink it picked up.

From here on out, if you really care about visible grain, it's obviously best to inspect a machine before you buy, but in order to that you're going to be looking for HUO or other out of box options, and if most of us do that and avoid NIB, there's gonna be less HOU and out of the box games to inspect. Kind of a catch 22.

#5384 1 year ago
Quoted from beefzap:

I put a playfield protector on my BM66 before the first ball was played and I see no grain, dimples, or pooling. I wonder if anyone has taken a protector off and inspected to see if these really do prevent issues? I am leaving mine on

Playfield protector will do zero if you have graining/ribbing.

Total luck of the draw if you do or don't get graining.

#5385 1 year ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

Playfield protector will do zero if you have graining/ribbing.
Total luck of the draw if you do or don't get graining.

Exactly. Makes it hard to want to buy a NIB Stern.

#5386 1 year ago
Quoted from KYLEDM5:

That is atrocious and pathetic of Stern. I feel really bad for you, especially when you try to sell it.
If I went to buy a game off of someone and it looked like that, I'd instantly decline.

Don’t worry, they sent me a medicine bottle of clear. Should fix the chipping, pooling, and heavy wood grain no problem.

#5387 1 year ago
Quoted from jorant:

So this morning as I'm cleaning my machines, I figured I'd take a video of my Hobbit playfield with the glass off with the most likely angles o could do shoe any dumpling I possibly could. Out of the three machines, none of them have hardly any dimpling at all. Out of the three that would have them, it would be Hobbit (I play it the most and balls would go flying in this this most, if I had to guess).
This is why people bitch about dimples. There is like.... nothing here. Zero. And I play this thing a shit ton. Minimal dumpling isn't a miracle.
We've all one Bally William's here. We know what is possible.

your game has dimples, but they are not everywhere and not at the whole surface. overall you have a quite clear reflection, not as my jp.
this makes the look of the game superior over a cratered game.

i have a DP Pro also Dec.2019 built and also with 1500 games like my JP Prem.
It has much less dimples, they are there but the PF just looks much better, not like its a wet destroyed, beaten to death- surface.

#5388 1 year ago

Hey guys - on the subjects of dimples. Only been into the hobby a few years but....
No bullsh*t
I have purchased 5 NIBs and they are all dimpled pretty much as expected.
They all have one thing in common. A very good clear-coat.
Now - the only pin I have purchased which was not NIB, relatively recently was a Tron LE.
It doesn’t have what I would say is a good clear coat applied, in fact very, very minimal to be honest. This pin probably has most plays being multi owner.
It has no dimples that I can see.... before you say, all the dimples have merged....absolutely no way. The play-field just looks different to all the others on how it’s finished. It has a dull like appearance.
I believe firmly, this is due to the lack of clear coat.
Hope this helps.

#5389 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Gonna be hard to install that with the game in the box. Heyo!!!

You got me there. Have an upvote my fine gentleman

#5390 1 year ago
Quoted from beefzap:

I put a playfield protector on my BM66 before the first ball was played and I see no grain, dimples, or pooling. I wonder if anyone has taken a protector off and inspected to see if these really do prevent issues? I am leaving mine on

I'd rather have dimples than endure a pf protector. They negatively affect game play and dimples don't. My 2 bits.

#5391 1 year ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

I'd rather have dimples than endure a pf protector. They negatively affect game play and dimples don't. My 2 bits.

+1

do we have a "anti PP" club on PINSIDE ?

#5392 1 year ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

I'd rather have dimples than endure a pf protector. They negatively affect game play and dimples don't. My 2 bits.

The older thicker ones, yes. The newer ones, no. I have protectors on Batman 66 and Elvira. No issues with game play. Not going to get “dimples” (which with newer Stern playfields means craters). Cheap insurance for your playfields.

#5393 1 year ago

Gents, Is a PP a bit like getting the latest Super AMOLED screen for your expensive smartphone then dulling it down with a crappy, cloudy film?
I know it offers protection but kinda looks grim.

#5394 1 year ago
Quoted from Sako-TRG:

Gents, Is a PP a bit like getting the latest Super AMOLED screen for your expensive smartphone then dulling it down with a crappy, cloudy film?
I know it offers protection but kinda looks grim.

If you play it enough it will definitely start to get cloudy. There are a couple games on location near me that are very cloudy from playfield protectors.

#5395 1 year ago
Quoted from Sako-TRG:

Gents, Is a PP a bit like getting the latest Super AMOLED screen for your expensive smartphone then dulling it down with a crappy, cloudy film?
I know it offers protection but kinda looks grim.

I don’t think they look grim at all. Both my games with them have a bright somewhat glossy look. If they look bad it’s probably because they weren’t cleaned properly during installation.

#5396 1 year ago

I played a friends Pirates by Stern the other day. It has over 15k plays. Looks good as shit. Not dimples, no wear, clear is holding, no waves. My point is it can be done.

#5397 1 year ago
Quoted from Sako-TRG:

Now - the only pin I have purchased which was not NIB, relatively recently was a Tron LE.
It doesn’t have what I would say is a good clear coat applied, in fact very, very minimal to be honest. This pin probably has most plays being multi owner.
It has no dimples that I can see.... before you say, all the dimples have merged....absolutely no way. The play-field just looks different to all the others on how it’s finished. It has a dull like appearance.
I believe firmly, this is due to the lack of clear coat.

Just a confirmation. Does your Tron LE pf have a silver boarder (LE) around the inserts or are they colored (PRO)? I ask this as the Tron LE PF's got a thicker clear than the pro's and it is possible your game had a PF swap done with a Pro PF. I'm just curious as my Tron LE PF is beautiful. I bought it from a collector that never played it (had less than 200 plays total) and with a nice clean, polish and wax it's pretty dang good. My friends LE was the same but the two pro's I've played diffidently have shown a much duller PF.

#5398 1 year ago
Quoted from branlon8:

At first I thought that, too, but I’m not sure anymore. If the clearcoat is being applied too thick to get that super sheen it could cause the dimples without going into the wood. It could be that the dimples are really shallow (maybe 1 micrometer) and simply because of the way light reflects, it makes the dimple appear larger than it really is.

87069807_3089970921013229_1789687072374652928_n (resized).jpg
#5399 1 year ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I would be thrilled to have just dimples. I have noticeable wood grain on majority of my playfield on top of some chipping and bubbling.

I hate when I see woodgrain....I like to see a smooth playing surface.

My WOZ has it somewhat and it bothers me, but my buddies say it looks good and that I'm over reacting so I'm somewhat fine with that.

If I had grain like yours I wouldn't be happy.

#5400 1 year ago

I have to say, my Hobbit, JJP POTC playfields look incredible. My Pirates is played by my wife daily and you really need to look hard to see dimples.

Yes they are there, but not noticeable, like on my GB that looked bad after 50 plays. I would guess I have over 500 games on Pirates and it looks Superb.

Even my MBR LE looks great. Dimples are a little more noticeable than Pirates, but not bad.

It's pinball, life is Short....Have Fun!

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