(Topic ID: 182780)

Collecting and playing pinball - The rift has widened


By agodfrey

2 years ago



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#1 2 years ago

SO I was just thinking about how much I love pinball. And I DO love pinball. A lot. I know when I first got into the hobby about 3 years ago I was pretty heavily involved in fixing and 'restoring' machines. Not so much restoring but buying cheap broken dirty games and getting them up and running as best I could. That was an aspect I enjoyed a lot in the beginning. But slowly I started getting frustrated with always having a project game, always having something that needed cleaned or a game that didn't work. Now we all know pinball dictates that some time needs to be set aside for repair and cleaning. Things get dirty and break. But I want to be spending at least MOST of my pinball time ( and my time is limited...sigh) PLAYING pinball.

So when I start looking at the divide that exists between playing and collecting pinball it seemed while there was a divide that some what it was still a bridgeable gap.

That said with these $10K, $15K, and $30k machines popping up it seems like PLAYING has become less and less important to collectors. Just an observation. I will admit that early on I wasn't HUGE into the competitive scene. But more and more because I like playing more than I do collecting, modding, or fixing that scene has become the one I differ to.

I get how cool it is to have something few people have or to have the best one. But if you have a game that you can't play or can only play 4 times a year, are you even a pinball machine collector? Or are you just collecting life-sized pinball art?

(-Original topic title and content restored by moderator: please do not alter the complete content of a topic / opening post once a topic is actively being posted to-)

#2 2 years ago

There are different kinds of collectors.

There are people who are restorers who either refurbish or completely restore games.
There are collectors who like to own games to play, but don't restore them.
There are super collectors who collect the rarest and most expensive games, prototypes, and other rare memorabilia.
There are players who mainly focus on tournaments and collect games that appear in tournaments.
There are also collectors who specialize in certain things. Some focus on games from a certain manufacturer, theme (sports, horror, outer space, etc), era, designer, etc.

There are probably a few different categories as well.

That said....

Quoted from agodfrey:

That said with these $10K, $15K, and $30k machines popping up it seems like PLAYING has become less and less important to collectors.

This is not necessarily true for everyone. It depends upon the collector. $10-$30k machines just tend to be newsworthy and get talked about a lot.

Quoted from agodfrey:

But if you have a game that you can't play or can only play 4 times a year, are you even a pinball machine collector? Or are you just collecting life-sized pinball art?

Pinball machines are sometimes considered works of art. There are a few titles I would like to own that look fantastic, but the gameplay is awful.

Not everyone collects games in the same way. My approach to collecting and the games/items I collect is vastly different to someone else's approach to collecting.

#3 2 years ago

There is no be all and end all category for everyone I know. But I have felt that as someone who above all likes to PLAY when you start to talk playing, especially when you are on a podcast, people start to complain and say you are all tournament talk and give you grief.

10
#4 2 years ago

I like playing pinball, but i am just a hack, no desire to play deep games for 45 minutes
i can keep my games running, but no desire to restore BTN
i like seeing new releases, but cannot justify the price

#5 2 years ago
Quoted from agodfrey:

There is no be all and end all category for everyone I know. But I have felt that as someone who above all likes to PLAY when you start to talk playing, especially when you are on a podcast, people start to complain and say you are all tournament talk and give you grief.

Some players are goal-oriented, while others are points-oriented.

I'm goal-oriented where I like to progress through a game, completing objectives/modes, and "beating" the game.

Other players focus on maximizing their points, which tends to lead to "tournament talk".

#6 2 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Some players are goal-oriented, while others are points-oriented.
I'm goal-oriented where I like to progress through a game, completing objectives/modes, and "beating" the game.
Other players focus on maximizing their points, which tends to lead to "tournament talk".

They are different styles of play in some cases. I'm more or less completely ignoring the saucer in tournament play on AFM. I'm not gonna risk losing a ball - even in multiball - for no reason when there's better points to be had elsewhere. No EBs I'm not gonna sniff Rule the Universe so why bother. At home, I'm more cognizant of a RTW game and I'll spend multiballs on killing the saucer. Lots of different examples like that.

As far as "what type of hobbyist are you," everybody probably thinks they are the best. So naturally, so do I. I love playing, which is why I started buying games in the first place. Getting a game to play right is way more important to me than acquiring mint examples, and my eyes start to glaze over when I'm having a conversation with someone and they start out by telling me how "mint" their Whitewater is. I don't care dude. I think it's much more impressive that I bought a non-working, dirty Jungle Queen for 200 bucks and hauled it out of a basement, and now it's playing like brand new, looking nice, and I'll turn a nice profit on it when I sell it.

For others, that's ALL they care a about - how "nice" their example is, how many mods they have, blahblahblah. Doesn't interest me but it's the motivation for probably half the people here, and I'd bet the majority who have glommed on to pinball in the last five years.

Really, it takes all kinds, and there's room for everybody.

41
#7 2 years ago

This is going to ruffle feathers, but the "collector first, player second" type of hobbyist drives me crazy. They're the ones that drive up prices. They're the ones that stir up the drama over LE/SLE machines. They're the ones that make buying and selling much more of a hassle than it used to be. On the other hand, they've injected a TON of new revenue into the hobby, so they're worth tolerating.

Pinball is meant to be played though. And the more you play with other people, the better the hobby is. These guys that are selling HUO games that are 10 years old with under 200 plays...I just don't get it. Nobody plays your stuff, like ever? I hit well over 500 plays on Ghostbusters in the first week. How are people still selling Spider-Man with under 300 plays (I've seen more than one in recent months)? I just don't understand why they picked pinball to collect. Why not stamps, cards, or freaking Beanie Babies?

As for HOW people play their games, that's totally a non-issue...AS LONG AS THEY FREAKING PLAY THE THINGS.

#8 2 years ago

I am definitely an equal of both. I was probably more of a collector/fixer at one time (especially in the arcade scene as I played those less), but now with so many pinball machines it's nice when nothing is breaking and I definitely take advantage of that!

I actually had most of them taken apart in my garage gameroom, then when I got about the 6th pin or so I started to take advantage of my warm, heated basement and brought them all down in the same day one day. And that was amazing. Because all of these felt like brand new games again and some of them I hadn't even gotten the chance to set up and play yet! And putting them all in their rows together for the first time, etc., was a really great thing. I played them so much that day and that was probably the day my "player" amount went up.

Playing wise, I love the constant "battle" of keeping an EM in play which also really drew me to them after I entered the hobby looking to collect solid-state machines primarily. It took a little while but then I was hooked. I love the quick, fast games that usually don't last very long. You either kick its ass or it kicks yours - no waiting periods!

#9 2 years ago
Quoted from Otaku:

Playing wise, I love the constant "battle" of keeping an EM in play which also really drew me to them after I entered the hobby looking to collect solid-state machines primarily. It took a little while but then I was hooked. I love the quick, fast games that usually don't last very long. You either kick its ass or it kicks yours - no waiting periods!

I've come to really, really enjoy EMs. The longer I spend in the hobby, the more I appreciate them. My wife and I have talked about building an exterior building behind our house (we're on .53 acres) for pinball, and I would love to have a huge EM section in there. As it is now, I only ever have a few EMs due to visitors often preferring more modern games.

#10 2 years ago

This topic is great for me because I am in an interesting phase of my life. (An understatement.)

I think my list of pinball I want is pretty dang short. I do want my own private arcade of kick ass machines. I have 1. I'd like 3. I'm probably going to end up with 20-30. It's going to take the rest of my life.

I started playing pinball in south OC California a few years ago as I was getting divorced.

In south OC California there is almost no on location play. Only private collections mostly. I've been very fortunate to play a few of them.

I'd like to change the fact there is no pinball in OC but that is a problem to be looked at again once I can walk well again.

14
#11 2 years ago

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!

1. Players With Skills - just like me (shocker!). Yes, I am the best kind of hobbyist, of course - I started buying games because I love playing, I'm a good player, and I have the skills to refurbish both EM and Digital games, and I love both kinds. I'm not anal and I don't get off on how "mint" your cheesy cookie cutter collection is. Truly, I am the standard by which all other hobbyists should be judged. An interesting collection of games that play well is what I consider an impressive collection.

2. Restorers - I gotta admit, I have mad respect for those with the patience and skills to restore games to like new. It's just not something I could fathom doing.

2. Collectors with no money (or money and taste) and some skills - I respect these guys because they don't get caught up in the rat race, and realize that a collection with some EMs, a High Speed, and a Black Rose are just as good as anybody else's. You aren't afraid to get your hands dirty and work on a game. You can't play but hey we can't all be me.

4. Collectors with money and skills. Your collection is boring and cookie cutter but at least you can fix your own games. Maybe you can't play too well either but hey we can't all be me.

5. Collectors with money and no skills. Ok, we are getting lame territory here. Great, you are a newbie with money. You can't play for shit, you can't maintain or work on your own games. You are just buying games and basing your "taste" on the pinside 100. Consumption and showing off as a hobby, and very little curiosity about the game, its history, or a collection beyond the "big names."

There's plenty of room in between all these things but it's my basic holier-than-thou sliding scale.

How about you guys? Let's get pretentious up in here!

27
#12 2 years ago

I don't think there's any pretentiousness left in the world after that post, Levi.

#13 2 years ago

I guess im kinda both but do have my spending limits. . I buy the pins i enjoy playing the most but also want to make it the nicest example i am capable of doing . Most everything i have now is in really awesome condition but i play the shit out of them everyday lol. I love spending hours and hours tweaking the game so it plays smooth as butter and is very unforgiving. Not to crazy about lots of mods but the must haves for me are color dmd, leds, powered subwoofer and pdi glass.

#14 2 years ago
Quoted from Azmodeus:

I'd like to change the fact there is no pinball in OC but that is a problem to be looked at again once I can walk well again.

I said this to someone on FB and got scolded.... but compared to San Diego and Los Angeles, we're in a dead zone! Hopefully that will change soon though, there's a spot in Huntington Beach coming...

#15 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!
1. Players With Skills - just like me (shocker!).
How about you guys? Let's get pretentious up in here!

Hmmm...yeah that's pretty good although I'd put Players without Skills above restorers; I mean they're trying at least the poor bastards. Restoring might have been honest love of the game work in the old days; but it's just a cash cow now.

#16 2 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Hmmm...yeah that's pretty good although I'd put Players without Skills above restorers; I mean they're trying at least the poor bastards. Restoring might have been honest love of the game work in the old days; but it's just a cash cow now.

Not everybody who restores flips their games, a lot of them put TOO MUCH money into their restorations for their keeper machines... so yes, still a cash cow

#17 2 years ago
Quoted from Otaku:

Not everybody who restores flips their games, a lot of them put TOO MUCH money into their restorations for their keeper machines... so yes, still a cash cow

And they either enjoy them forever, or try to sell us $3500 T2

#18 2 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

And they either enjoy them forever, or try to sell us $3500 T2

Enjoying them forever vs. enjoying them forever

18
#19 2 years ago

for the most part all those types love the game, and whether they're in it for the restoration or the competition, who am i to judge. more power to em all.

the only kind of hobbyist i disdain are the ones who don't want their games to get played by friends, family, and children. yes, kids double-flip. yes, sometimes they leave the game running with a 2 balls left to play. yes, sometimes they start a 4-player game on every machine and walk away. big deal. none of those things will hurt a pinball machine, and it takes like one minute to reset a half dozen pins. i'm happy to do it. you know why? because also, sometimes, they get really into it and a girl might spend all night trying to get to the Final Frontier or Black Hole Multiball or rescue Dorothy, and have to be dragged away at the end of the evening by her parents, and even as they're walking out the door, she wants to know when they can come back...

#20 2 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

the only kind of hobbyist i disdain are the ones who don't want their games to get played by friends, family, and children

Take that a step further to the ones who will gladly show your their collection and THEN won't let them be played.

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#21 2 years ago

I'm usually not thrilled when there are people who:

1) Regularly flip games for profit (usually at high ridiculous prices) without putting any work into them.
2) Regularly part out games for profit, rather than restoring them or selling them as a project to someone who would restore them.

-1
#22 2 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

2) Regularly part out games for profit, rather than restoring them or selling them as a project to someone who would restore them.

*cough* GRC *cough*

#23 2 years ago

I have one single good game, but...

I am about get a little more room. I love to play and before my damn stroke and three brain surgeries I was ok. I think I'll be falling cleanly into the restorers category as soon as I can.

I only want a couple games including a project that I can and will make pop. I love this f ing game though. I love to play but I want to learn artisan pinball restoration.

24
#24 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!
1. Players With Skills - just like me (shocker!). Yes, I am the best kind of hobbyist, of course - I started buying games because I love playing, I'm a good player, and I have the skills to refurbish both EM and Digital games, and I love both kinds. I'm not anal and I don't get off on how "mint" your cheesy cookie cutter collection is. Truly, I am the standard by which all other hobbyists should be judged. An interesting collection of games that play well is what I consider an impressive collection.
2. Restorers - I gotta admit, I have mad respect for those with the patience and skills to restore games to like new. It's just not something I could fathom doing.
2. Collectors with no money (or money and taste) and some skills - I respect these guys because they don't get caught up in the rat race, and realize that a collection with some EMs, a High Speed, and a Black Rose are just as good as anybody else's. You aren't afraid to get your hands dirty and work on a game. You can't play but hey we can't all be me.
4. Collectors with money and skills. Your collection is boring and cookie cutter but at least you can fix your own games. Maybe you can't play too well either but hey we can't all be me.
5. Collectors with money and no skills. Ok, we are getting lame territory here. Great, you are a newbie with money. You can't play for shit, you can't maintain or work on your own games. You are just buying games and basing your "taste" on the pinside 100. Consumption and showing off as a hobby, and very little curiosity about the game, its history, or a collection beyond the "big names."
There's plenty of room in between all these things but it's my basic holier-than-thou sliding scale.
How about you guys? Let's get pretentious up in here!

You have left out one final category: (Likely a minority on Pinside, but a not-to-be forgotten few.)

6. Players with no money! Players who would like to afford their own machine (or working towards starting a collection), who just love to play. Since they do not yet have their own collection, they hunt around for machines on location. Whenever they travel, they always look for that pub, arcade or bowling alley that still has a sited pinball machine. It almost becomes an obsession in its own right; kind of like a fisherman trying to catch that prize fish. It can be frustrating and you are let down alot, but when you find a machine on location, you exclaim YES!, pump your fist in the air and raid that pinball piggy bank, eager to INSERT COIN.

#25 2 years ago

Thanks everyone for the discussion. This is the Pinside I love.

#26 2 years ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

You have left out one final category: (Likely a minority on Pinside, but a not-to-be forgotten few.)
6. Players with no money! Players who would like to afford their own machine (or working towards starting a collection), who just love to play. Since they do not yet have their own collection, they hunt around for machines on location. Whenever they travel, they always look for that pub, arcade or bowling alley that still has a sited pinball machine. It almost becomes an obsession in its own right; kind of like a fisherman trying to catch that prize fish. It can be frustrating and you are let down alot, but when you find a machine on location, you exclaim YES!, pump your fist in the air and raid that pinball piggy bank, eager to INSERT COIN.

Amen, brother. That's the category I fall into. Pinballmap is a godsend!

#27 2 years ago

I try to get out and play some pinball when I can. I have some machines that I should play more at my house that I love working on. I try to play a bit every day, but sometimes fail at that. I love this hobby for both playing and geeking out about machines. Also I need more playing skills.

#28 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Collectors with no money (or money and taste) and some skills - I respect these guys because they don't get caught up in the rat race, and realize that a collection with some EMs, a High Speed, and a Black Rose are just as good as anybody else's. You aren't afraid to get your hands dirty and work on a game. You can't play but hey we can't all be me.

Put the adjective KILLER in front of EMs (and more than some), lose the High Speed (boooooring) and replace with Cyclone, and gimme Space Shuttle over Black Rose any day (although I do like playing with the lady pirate now and then), and I am proudly in!

#29 2 years ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

Amen, brother. That's the category I fall into. Pinballmap is a godsend!

Indeed! If only there were more pins on the map near me.

#30 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!
1. Players With Skills - just like me (shocker!). Yes, I am the best kind of hobbyist, of course - I started buying games because I love playing, I'm a good player, and I have the skills to refurbish both EM and Digital games, and I love both kinds. I'm not anal and I don't get off on how "mint" your cheesy cookie cutter collection is. Truly, I am the standard by which all other hobbyists should be judged. An interesting collection of games that play well is what I consider an impressive collection.
2. Restorers - I gotta admit, I have mad respect for those with the patience and skills to restore games to like new. It's just not something I could fathom doing.
2. Collectors with no money (or money and taste) and some skills - I respect these guys because they don't get caught up in the rat race, and realize that a collection with some EMs, a High Speed, and a Black Rose are just as good as anybody else's. You aren't afraid to get your hands dirty and work on a game. You can't play but hey we can't all be me.
4. Collectors with money and skills. Your collection is boring and cookie cutter but at least you can fix your own games. Maybe you can't play too well either but hey we can't all be me.
5. Collectors with money and no skills. Ok, we are getting lame territory here. Great, you are a newbie with money. You can't play for shit, you can't maintain or work on your own games. You are just buying games and basing your "taste" on the pinside 100. Consumption and showing off as a hobby, and very little curiosity about the game, its history, or a collection beyond the "big names."
There's plenty of room in between all these things but it's my basic holier-than-thou sliding scale.
How about you guys? Let's get pretentious up in here!

You forgot to add 6. Collectors with some money some skills and NO time - those collectors end up with a garage full of project pins, some half disassembled, and lots of dreams about how good their collection will look once they fix it all up. In the more extreme version it's called hoarders

#31 2 years ago

I think the term "player" can mean a lot of different things. I, personally, am finding myself solidly falling in the casual/home player... more and more I find myself disagreeing with game assessments and recommendations coming from tournament players. These two kinds of players look at games so differently..

#32 2 years ago
Quoted from 27dnast:

These two kinds of players look at games so differently..

You think so? Interesting.

#33 2 years ago
Quoted from Cornelius:

...... Hopefully that will change soon though, there's a spot in Huntington Beach coming...

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#34 2 years ago
Quoted from 27dnast:

I think the term "player" can mean a lot of different things. I, personally, am finding myself solidly falling in the casual/home player... more and more I find myself disagreeing with game assessments and recommendations coming from tournament players. These two kinds of players look at games so differently..

Couldn't agree more. I once had a roommate who was an expert quadruple black diamond skier. When I was packing up for a ski trip with my rented/dented skis to go down some blue dot intermediate slopes he told me he was jealous. I asked why and he said that at his level of skiing he was down in less than 2 minutes and there were no challenges left other than those that might imperil him. For me though I could enjoy a lazy stroll down the mountain and have a great time. He eventually gave up downhill for cross country skiing. I figure if I ever got too good at actually playing pinball it would eventually become boring. So I enjoy my mediocrity and my mostly no ramp no DMD pins

#35 2 years ago
Quoted from pookycade:

I figure if I ever got too good at actually playing pinball it would eventually become boring.

Man you'd have to be super human good for that to happen

-4
#36 2 years ago
Quoted from agodfrey:

Things get dirty and break. But I want to be spending at least MOST of my pinball time ( and my time is limited...sigh) PLAYING pinball.

There are 168 hours in a week of which you probably only need 35-40 of for sleep. So that leaves over 120 hours.

If you are not lazy or waste too many hours at a job, that leaves plenty of time. This my time is limited sounds like a lame excuse to not get things done that you want done.

#37 2 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

There are 168 hours in a week of which you probably only need 35-40 of for sleep. So that leaves over 120 hours.
If you are not lazy or waste too many hours at a job, that leaves plenty of time. This my time is limited sounds like a lame excuse to not get things done that you want done.

Try being self employed woth yourself being one of three employees and having two kids and a grand child at home. I haven't played pinball in two years without a rugrat helping me in over a year.

#38 2 years ago
Quoted from zr11990:

Try being self employed woth yourself being one of three employees and having two kids and a grand child at home.

I'll pass. But thanks for the idea.

#39 2 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

There are 168 hours in a week of which you probably only need 35-40 of for sleep. So that leaves over 120 hours.
If you are not lazy or waste too many hours at a job, that leaves plenty of time. This my time is limited sounds like a lame excuse to not get things done that you want done.

Sorry 20-30 hours a week are spent on hold with AT&T

#40 2 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Sorry 20-30 hours a week are spent on hold with AT&T

It was today. But I've still got 4-5 hours of pinball playing left in me before I call it a night.

#41 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!

Adding a few categories:

1b. Players with (little or) No skill (or no time). They're not looking for CQ pins on the market, they just want a working game. Most can still fix basic things, change rubbers, fuses, check connections, send a board for repair... but prefer playing over trouble shooting. No interest in modding the game, except to correct design flaws (air balls, etc). They can live with an esthetic flaw... but can't stand a non working switch.

6. Hoarders. They simply can't resist getting more pins and end up renting a warehouse. They own multiple copies of the same pin. They hardly ever play. They justify their bahavior by rising prices - this is an investment (they tend to collect B/W)

I am in 1b.

#42 2 years ago

I certainly fell in love with the gameplay first. I built a virtual cabinet, then got a real game, and never looked back.
Second game was a project, I quicky became obsessed with fixing and shopping games out. Giving dirty busted old games the restoration they deserved. The time and money spent were all well worth it to get the game back to an optimal condition. Ten projects later, only four are still with me. It feels good knowing that they're in good condition being enjoyed in other collector's homes.

I love having projects to work on, but at the end of the day, it's all about the gameplay.
Enjoying the fruits of your labor makes enjoying the game that much better.

#43 2 years ago

Well. I have a really busy work schedule. Then I have two kids. One is 9 one is 18 months. So they require attention. Then I'm married so I have to keep that going. Then things break. So that needs fixed. Then things need cleaned.

And that's just the week. On the weekend we have activities and bigger projects.

So when that is all said and done I have about 2 hours a week to play or repair.

So yeah I'm short on time.

Quoted from o-din:

There are 168 hours in a week of which you probably only need 35-40 of for sleep. So that leaves over 120 hours.
If you are not lazy or waste too many hours at a job, that leaves plenty of time. This my time is limited sounds like a lame excuse to not get things done that you want done.

#44 2 years ago

Also I down voted your comment because you assumed that I have the whole 120 hours to play Pinball. I said my Pinball time is limited. Which is about 2 hours a week. So just because you have 114 hours open doesn't mean I do.

Quoted from o-din:

There are 168 hours in a week of which you probably only need 35-40 of for sleep. So that leaves over 120 hours.
If you are not lazy or waste too many hours at a job, that leaves plenty of time. This my time is limited sounds like a lame excuse to not get things done that you want done.

#45 2 years ago
Quoted from pookycade:

Couldn't agree more. I once had a roommate who was an expert quadruple black diamond skier. When I was packing up for a ski trip with my rented/dented skis to go down some blue dot intermediate slopes he told me he was jealous. I asked why and he said that at his level of skiing he was down in less than 2 minutes and there were no challenges left other than those that might imperil him. For me though I could enjoy a lazy stroll down the mountain and have a great time. He eventually gave up downhill for cross country skiing. I figure if I ever got too good at actually playing pinball it would eventually become boring. So I enjoy my mediocrity and my mostly no ramp no DMD pins

awesome story. I can relate with skiing. I have essentially stopped. I have been skiing since 4 years old. For the last 10 years I skied 40-50 times per year. Most of my skiing was off the trails by the end.This year I have been 3 times. Burned out and bored.
Love pinball. I am not a good player at all. Makes it fun to try and improve.

11
#46 2 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

You think so? Interesting.

I really do... not to sound all negative... but I'm starting to find that I generally disagree with tournament player assessments/reviews of games. I think they're overwhelming lens/filter is much more deeply interested in the particulars of scoring... where as, I love to sit back and marvel at other factors (factors that drive my enjoyment of how I interact with the machines), such as mechanical action, art, etc.

Kind of the reason I'm not that interested in going all-out and joining leagues. Because in competition, you strip the game down to a couple of key shots and goals. Truthfully, I enjoy hoping on a game and banging the ball around...exploring modes... things that would never allow me to place in a tournament.

#47 2 years ago

I agree. As the hobby and game grows the rift is widening all around.

Quoted from 27dnast:

I think the term "player" can mean a lot of different things. I, personally, am finding myself solidly falling in the casual/home player... more and more I find myself disagreeing with game assessments and recommendations coming from tournament players. These two kinds of players look at games so differently..

#48 2 years ago
Quoted from jar155:

This is going to ruffle feathers, but the "collector first, player second" type of hobbyist drives me crazy. They're the ones that drive up prices.

WRONG!

Companies that make LEs/Premiums instead of just making full production runs is what drives up prices.

Period...

#49 2 years ago
Quoted from Magic_Mike:

WRONG!
Companies that make LEs/Premiums instead of just making full production runs is what drives up prices.
Period...

if these guys really want to make money they should take a page from Harley Davidson.... Make a great base game and offer up the upgrades as extras. As an ex biker I know guys will spend anything they have to too make theirs a little different or special or shiny. Everything from powder coated legs to upgraded code is $$$$$.

#50 2 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

OK, let's rank the hobbyists!
1. Players With Skills - just like me (shocker!). Yes, I am the best kind of hobbyist, of course - I started buying games because I love playing, I'm a good player, and I have the skills to refurbish both EM and Digital games, and I love both kinds. I'm not anal and I don't get off on how "mint" your cheesy cookie cutter collection is. Truly, I am the standard by which all other hobbyists should be judged. An interesting collection of games that play well is what I consider an impressive collection.
2. Restorers - I gotta admit, I have mad respect for those with the patience and skills to restore games to like new. It's just not something I could fathom doing.
2. Collectors with no money (or money and taste) and some skills - I respect these guys because they don't get caught up in the rat race, and realize that a collection with some EMs, a High Speed, and a Black Rose are just as good as anybody else's. You aren't afraid to get your hands dirty and work on a game. You can't play but hey we can't all be me.
4. Collectors with money and skills. Your collection is boring and cookie cutter but at least you can fix your own games. Maybe you can't play too well either but hey we can't all be me.
5. Collectors with money and no skills. Ok, we are getting lame territory here. Great, you are a newbie with money. You can't play for shit, you can't maintain or work on your own games. You are just buying games and basing your "taste" on the pinside 100. Consumption and showing off as a hobby, and very little curiosity about the game, its history, or a collection beyond the "big names."
There's plenty of room in between all these things but it's my basic holier-than-thou sliding scale.
How about you guys? Let's get pretentious up in here!

You know, I'm not a fan or categorizing people into groups. It seems too highschoolish. Jocks stoners nerds ect. I thought these would end when I got older but I guess even older people do it too. I probably fit into the number 5 category but I'm trying and learning how to fix games myself so maybe not so much. Why do people like to put others in groups or catagories and make up descriptions of them? Seems childish...

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