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(Topic ID: 50078)

Cointaker's lack of professionalism


By judremy

7 years ago



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  • 112 posts
  • 54 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by teekee
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    #1 7 years ago

    I don't post much, but recently purchased some LEDs from Pinballbulbs.com. I thought they were great and it was nice to have another alternative to pinballlife and cointaker.com. Unfortunately, there were others who did NOT seem to think so. I am including some posts here from the pinballbulbs thread as to not derail it further.

    Several times, BLACK_ROSE came into the thread to insult pinballbulbs and accuse them of stealing the designs from cointaker. It is fine to support a company, but when that becomes accusations and CUSTOMER INFORMATION from cointaker starts coming out, that is when it has crossed the line:

    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857453

    Chris from Cointaker just told me -?- ordered 10 Premium Leds last-nite , Melissa sent -?- an Email back say-n " Call Chris Regarding this Order "

    You Gonna send those to China too , and have those Copied also , huh ?

    Melissa is Pissed , and She's Gonna be Pissed when she Reads this , but Chris said " Type it "
    4 Years of Research & Designing these Leds to have someone Buy & Copy ..

    Here's Ya Premium 2's

    People then became concerned about this sharing of customer information regarding who was ordering. BLACK_ROSE then replied:

    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857609

    Leak info ,,,,, I Have Stock in the CoinTaker Franchise .. Pinballbulbs you know yr<edited> , I'm Still wait-n to see what yr Flashers are gonna look like .. I haven't seen an Led from you that doesn't look like what I have in my Boxes on the Shelf..And to say Chris hasn't designed his Leds in BS .. China doesn't know what the PinHeads want .. Yr small business ,, Tyme will tell ..

    Later, a cointaker rep DID come into the thread and no reassurances were given and (IMO) the claims to copying a design continued:

    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857916

    Really guys...I just had a very good conversation with James at Pinballbulbs.com....we can co-exist....you have multiple vendors selling led bulbs... BR is not a representative of our company, however he is an extremely loyal customer/friend.... he really is a great guy just looking out for us. How do you get mad at that...(not how I would have handled it, but for any of you that personally know BR)...well enough said. BR considers Bulldog a compliment...lol...

    I will however point out that as one pinsider stated that all bulbs are just ordered from China....Let me clarify...they may all or most of them come from overseas...however we at CoinTaker do travel abroad and meet with our manufacturer's....we also have developed our product to our specifications....yes, that means actual designs, etc...it took us 1 1/2 years to get our premiums just the way we wanted them...

    Anyone that is in the business should understand that it is not easy when someone comes in and copies/duplicates/ or whatever you want to call it....even some going as far to call their bulbs the exact same name that we created for our bulbs...bring something new to the table...I am not going after the topper or mod business that some have created when I could very well do so...that is their niche and I respect that...all I ask is for the same respect/courtesy in the industry.

    It almost sounds like they do not want any competition which is ridiculous. If the designs were really that big of a deal and cost that much time and money then there would be patents on them. And IF that is the case, then why not sue pinballbulbs?

    Finally, another final post from cointaker stating that the information was NOT intended to be leaked. Yet, the moment you share it outside the company, YOU already leaked it.
    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-858073

    the information was not intended to be leaked...we were discussing it...never ever intended to be placed on this forum...if I wanted the name/info out here I would have posted the order myself and made a post about it...and no, I did not have BR do it for me....I have a mouth and mind of my own and I will use it when I want/need to....and I will and have apologized to markmon for this. I'm not very happy about this at all....I work too hard for my business to have this shit happen.

    I suggest people go and look at that thread and keep it in mind when you place orders at a business that "didn't leak, but discusses" your information.

    #2 7 years ago

    Do you REALLY have this much free time on your hands?

    #3 7 years ago

    To my understanding and not just limited to this area/hobby but others as well since I'm into flying rc heli's , rc cars etc... a great deal of duplicating occurs in China without consequences because China doesn't have a copyright law nor do they recognize any from foreign lands as well. It's just the nature of the beast.

    It's the land of the clones....

    However it really doesn't matter here all what does matter is how they handle their business to our hobby, and CT I found to be nothing short of professional in every aspect.

    #4 7 years ago

    Give him break joe. Better than mople tears.

    10
    #5 7 years ago

    We really need another sh&tstorm thread? Starting a thread titled "Cointaker's lack of professionalism" is just bad form regardless of who the vendor is. I buy from CT for the same reason I buy from the local hardware store, not because they are the cheapest across the board, but because they DO care. They are part of our community and have been for a long time.

    As a side, playing vendors off each other and pushing prices down to 0 margin may seem good, until the vendors start bailing out and you left with 1. Who then conveniently has 'supply' problems and the price start going double of what it was.

    Either support vendor or buy from someone else. But don't toss gas on them and light a match just to get a rise.

    #6 7 years ago

    If there leds are better they have nothing to worry about.

    12
    #7 7 years ago

    I can't believe I actually just read that whole thing. I feel like I just researched my grad school thesis, except instead of being about economic political platforms.... It was about led bulbs, and a dude who wears a Viking helmet.

    #9 7 years ago

    I can't believe I actually just read that whole thing. I feel like I just researched my grad school thesis, except instead of being about economic political platforms.... It was about led bulbs, and a dude who wears a Viking helmet.

    Now that's funny!!

    1240642768_lol_thats_funny_26882_1287.jpeg

    #10 7 years ago

    I have no comment on anything, escept we donate to Pinside

    #11 7 years ago

    Lot of people on the rag lately. WOW!

    #12 7 years ago
    Quoted from PinballBulbs:

    I have no comment on anything, escept we donate to Pinside

    Thanks for that insight. I can't seem to find your banner.

    #13 7 years ago

    I started this thread as the PinballBulbs one was being filled with this discussion and a moderator asked the discussion to be taken to another thread if people wanted to continue it. I personally found it unsettling that people were being called out on their orders from a company. You don't expect that kind of thing to happen as you EXPECT a company to keep the information to themselves and not share it with their friends who then come online and share it with the world. Sorry, if you are all OK with a company sharing YOUR info.

    -7
    #14 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    I don't post much, but recently purchased some LEDs from Pinballbulbs.com. I thought they were great and it was nice to have another alternative to pinballlife and cointaker.com. Unfortunately, there were others who did NOT seem to think so. I am including some posts here from the pinballbulbs thread as to not derail it further.
    Several times, BLACK_ROSE came into the thread to insult pinballbulbs and accuse them of stealing the designs from cointaker. It is fine to support a company, but when that becomes accusations and CUSTOMER INFORMATION from cointaker starts coming out, that is when it has crossed the line:
    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857453
    People then became concerned about this sharing of customer information regarding who was ordering. BLACK_ROSE then replied:
    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857609
    Later, a cointaker rep DID come into the thread and no reassurances were given and (IMO) the claims to copying a design continued:
    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-857916
    It almost sounds like they do not want any competition which is ridiculous. If the designs were really that big of a deal and cost that much time and money then there would be patents on them. And IF that is the case, then why not sue pinballbulbs?
    Finally, another final post from cointaker stating that the information was NOT intended to be leaked. Yet, the moment you share it outside the company, YOU already leaked it.http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/introducing-new-led-company-free-bulbs-pinside-discount/page/8#post-858073
    I suggest people go and look at that thread and keep it in mind when you place orders at a business that "didn't leak, but discusses" your information.

    Im glad you dont post here much because this post is garbage! Change you post title, that is rediculous! Cointaker is the best vendor to deal with as far as their professionalism, service and quality, find something better to do!

    #16 7 years ago

    I can tell you there's at least one difference....might be an older CT bulb, but for what it's worth...

    Pinballbulbs domed ones don't work in Future Spa controlled inserts. They strobe like crazy, as does every other LED...EXCEPT...wait for it...

    CT super (and PBL 1-leds, but that's not the point here..). So if they're the same bulb, copied....then why is there different behavior? One is able to cope with the 50hz lamp matrix, and the other isn't. Clearly there's at least SOME marginal difference. I wish I had a "current release" CT Super to try out in the game, just to see if they've changed something to where they no longer work in my game.

    Someone needs to come out with some Old-Bally-Certified LEDs, that's for sure. I ain't buying a 150 buck Alltek driver board just for LEDs.

    #17 7 years ago
    Quoted from Gnatty:

    Im glad you dont post here much because this post is garbage! Change you post title, that is rediculous! Cointaker is the best vendor to deal with as far as their professionalism, service and quality, find something better to do!

    You read my post, sounds like YOU need something better to do. If they didn't act they way they did, there would not have been a post to make. Sorry I knocked your gods off their pedestal, but I didn't make them share info and I didn't make them post the claims they did. Their bad, not mine.

    #18 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    I started this thread as the PinballBulbs one was being filled with this discussion and a moderator asked the discussion to be taken to another thread if people wanted to continue it. I personally found it unsettling that people were being called out on their orders from a company. You don't expect that kind of thing to happen as you EXPECT a company to keep the information to themselves and not share it with their friends who then come online and share it with the world. Sorry, if you are all OK with a company sharing YOUR info.

    It's a LED order who cares if you know what I bought or didn't. Here I'll help you out. I bought a CFTBL kit from CT in Allentown. Oh my please keep that under wraps I would hate for the FBI pinball division to find out. Please let it go!

    #19 7 years ago
    Quoted from wdpvideo:

    It's a LED order who cares if you know what I bought or didn't. Here I'll help you out. I bought a CFTBL kit from CT in Allentown. Oh my please keep that under wraps I would hate for the FBI pinball division to find out. Please let it go!

    It's the principle of it. I'm not the one keeping the thread alive, you are by posting in it. If you want it to die, don't bump it.

    Oh, and I'm not a slappy for pinballbulbs. I have LEDs from PinballLife, Cointaker, AND Pinballbulbs. They CAN all coexist.

    #20 7 years ago

    I'm still a bit confused by B_R's comment,

    "I Have Stock in the CoinTaker Franchise ..."

    Is he an investor/owner?

    #21 7 years ago
    Quoted from gweempose:

    I'm still a bit confused by B_R's comment,
    "I Have Stock in the CoinTaker Franchise ..."
    Is he an investor/owner?

    He said that as a joke as to why he knew about markmon's order information. I think B_R is a good guy, but he got out of line and started (IMO) attacking pinballbulbs as soon as they posted on pinside.

    #22 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    It's the principle of it. I'm not the one keeping the thread alive, you are by posting in it. If you want it to die, don't bump it.

    your missing the point man. noone's saying you're wrong, it's just that no one cares.

    #23 7 years ago
    Quoted from gweempose:

    I'm still a bit confused by B_R's comment,
    "I Have Stock in the CoinTaker Franchise ..."
    Is he an investor/owner?

    No he is not...He just a friend of theirs

    #24 7 years ago
    Quoted from bigehrl:

    your missing the point man. noone's saying you're wrong, it's just that no one cares.

    I care. Several people in the other thread cared, so I believe YOUR thesis is wrong.

    Oh, there is a difference between YOUR and YOU'RE.

    #25 7 years ago

    I've had nothing but good experiences from Cointaker, and they have the best selection of LED's around.

    #26 7 years ago

    B_R is loyal, that's for sure. I wouldn't want him to be my company spokesperson, however.

    Kudos to the O.P. for being able to read his posts long enough to translate them to English, but yea... It's not that big a sin (friends talk), and Cointaker is a great company, and I bet Pinballbulbs is as well.

    Can't we all just get along?

    -2
    #27 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    I care. Several people in the other thread cared, so I believe YOUR thesis is wrong.

    Have you eaten anything yet this morning? Ya know the brain functions better and becomes more productive when you give yourself some fuel as soon as you wake up. If you don't believe me, you can google it.

    #28 7 years ago

    What's missed here in the "I don't care" crowd, which I am certainly a member of, is that now there is something to beef about. Look at that crap fest. I can't believe CT would be a part of that. Well, I HAVE to believe it because now there is the evidence. IMHO OP started a troll thread, and then pointed out some real unprofessional behavior. Still a troll thread. I buy LEDs from all over, but have spent real $$ with CT and PL. If I am in town, Terry at PL is the way to go, but I am only in town once a year max so CT gets most of the rest anyway. 10% Pinsider discount

    #29 7 years ago

    Again, I say why? I like Pinside well enough, but these "declaratory" threads need to stop. They bring no "discussion" to a discussion forum, only arguments. If we want to argue/bitch/piss/moan that's fine, but it's really turning this "hobby" in to a headache instead of a fun diversion from everyday life...

    #30 7 years ago
    Quoted from rommy:

    What's missed here in the "I don't care" crowd, which I am certainly a member of,

    +1.

    -6
    #31 7 years ago

    OMG another bashing thread how lame. Esp. Cointaker i can say ive always had a pleasant experience with them.
    If you dont like them dont buy from them, better yet put in the time and design your own leds and put up the money to have them manufactured.
    Honestly so what if they confirmed someones orders? Just about everyone with leds has cointakers its no secret seems you have nothing better to do than split hairs.
    And as far as the copied leds well Cointaker is justified in being upset how would you like it if you had your designs copied and marked as your competition??
    In the end the new guy is guilty of theft. If anything perhaps Cointaker should call their attorney.

    And here you are talking smack about Cointaker being upset about someone stealing their designs, everyone her already knows Markmon and BR are Cointaker addicts even if Cointaker said nothing.

    Perhaps you should get over it and get a life.

    #32 7 years ago

    At this point I am done with this. I posted the thread to remove the discussion from the other thread as a mod had requested. I also didn't like how the Cointaker rep acted towards competition with claims of copying (get an F-ing patent). I will try to get my LED needs fulfilled elsewhere, but I'm sure Cointaker will let you or B_R know if I order from them again.

    #33 7 years ago
    Quoted from Hellfire:

    OMG another bashing thread how lame. Esp. Cointaker i can say ive always had a pleasant experience with them.
    If you dont like them dont buy from them, better yet put in the time and design your own leds and put up the money to have them manufactured.
    Honestly so what if they confirmed someones orders? Just about everyone with leds has cointakers its no secret seems you have nothing better to do than split hairs.
    And as far as the copied leds well Cointaker is justified in being upset how would you like it if you had your designs copied and marked as your competition??
    In the end the new guy is guilty of theft. If anything perhaps Cointaker should call their attorney.
    And here you are talking smack about Cointaker being upset about someone stealing their designs, everyone her already knows Markmon and BR are Cointaker addicts even if Cointaker said nothing.
    Perhaps you should get over it and get a life.

    How is it bashing? Of course, you are being completely unbiased in your opinion. Oh wait, you aren't.

    Everything posted is all based on fact and posted on the internet. This isn't a thread where I made crap up and flamed out anyone.

    The PinballBulbs LEDs are DIFFERENT from Cointaker. Sorry, they both look like LEDs. I DID buy from Cointaker, but their lack of professionalism has driven me away.

    Since you seem to have such a busy life, can you point me to where you got yours?

    #34 7 years ago

    Yeah I'm pretty surprised at the crap CoinTaker pulled there. They have lost me as a customer for life, and an entire FLEET of machines that would otherwise be getting their LEDs. James has been very calm and neutral on the issue. He didn't burst into a civil discussion thread guns a-blazin' throwing mud at CoinTaker's name. I wish I could support both companies, but what CT has done is inexcusable, especially with their failure to offer a good reason WHY the information was shared in the first place.

    Clearly some people will care, others will not. Thanks for starting this thread, as stated by a mod there was clearly a need to move the discussion elsewhere. I suppose people are just ok with the whole situation as long as they get their flashy lights. Man, this hobby really makes grown men look like a load of brainwashed children.

    #35 7 years ago

    Yeah, you're right Hellfire. Breaking laws by sharing information without having a publically available privacy policy probably shouldn't interest anyone here.

    I don't think anyone here is miffed enough to take legal action against Cointaker, but it's a little bit of a disturbing development for sure, and they need to understand that they DO have an obligation to keep CUSTOMER information private, and yes, that's NOT okay to talk about it with people that are not employees. If they want to tell BR about their upcoming product line, fine, that's their perogative, but they have no right, and no allowance to share order or personal information with people outside of the company.

    #36 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    At this point I am done with this. I posted the thread to remove the discussion from the other thread as a mod had requested. I also didn't like how the Cointaker rep acted towards competition with claims of copying (get an F-ing patent). I will try to get my LED needs fulfilled elsewhere, but I'm sure Cointaker will let you or B_R know if I order from them again.

    People are going to form opinions based on their personal experiences, a lot of people turn a blind eye to others when their own experience is good.

    We have seen it with MAD-Amusements and we are seeing it with Cointaker. There is nothing wrong with your post, and if anything, it will provide historical reference for those that are looking for opinions for different companies.

    It is up to the individual whether they decide to proceed with a company based on what they have read. I use MAD-Amusements a lot, and have always had an exceptional experience, I have bought Cointakers at shows before, but never online. Will I think twice about purchasing from CT based on this post (and the other one)...Absolutely.

    #37 7 years ago
    Quoted from tamoore:

    Can't we all just get along?

    Truth!!!!

    -1
    #38 7 years ago
    Quoted from Frax:

    If they want to tell BR about their upcoming product line, fine, that's their perogative, but they have no right, and no allowance to share order or personal information with people outside of the company.

    I always thought BR WAS part of the company. His "I JUST GOT ___ IN THE GARAGE TIME TO BLING IT WITH COINTAKER YADDA YADDA YADDA BULBS,,," always read as complete CoinTaker advertisements to me.

    #39 7 years ago

    CT supplies all our led needs, and yes we could go direct to a factory, but we partner and work together on new ideas and bulb types with them. Some coolness on the way! So we pay more but have the best people and engineers behind our products with a long track record.

    Anyone would be miffed, mee too, if someone comes in late and grabs a proven design or pings the source to compete. But that's America and it make's the marketplace stronger. It takes time and money to do all this stuff and Chris and Mellisa have made a positive impact on pinball, and our games for sure. As have many "behind-the-scenes" suppliers. It's not just only about money, you need to have some ethics and integrity. What do you call a pinball company with no integrity? Jpop

    -1
    #40 7 years ago
    Quoted from Fatsquatch:

    I always thought BR WAS part of the company. His "I JUST GOT __ IN THE GARAGE TIME TO BLING IT WITH COINTAKER YADDA YADDA YADDA BULBS,,," always read as complete CoinTaker advertisements to me.

    Yeah, just a spokesperson. And a pretty arrogant one at that.

    #41 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    I don't post much

    Thank you for sharing all that info, Everyone calm down meow. I like to attain as much knowledge as possible about any company that supply pinball goodies....Dont you?

    #42 7 years ago

    Clearly the only winner in these topics is Pinball Life.

    #43 7 years ago

    I don't want to bash anyone personally. They both have great products and different styles that I like. I think BR acted in poor taste. When I was in the Marine Corps we had a saying " good initiative. Bad judgement"

    #44 7 years ago

    According to Melissa he's not. I take her word over his. I've at least met her in person a few times. Honestly, I doubt this flub will stop me from ordering specific purpose bulbs from them, but like I said...it really needs to be impressed upon them that this kind of information sharing isn't acceptable.

    Fool me once.... shame on me. Give away personal information to outisders twice? I'm done. Permanently.

    I'm glad AC/DC Premium already has LEDS (given half of them are cointakers I think LOL...) and I don't have to deal with this too much at this point. Yeesh. I think the whole thing is overblown short of letting Melissa and Chris know that we expected better than this.

    #45 7 years ago
    Quoted from judremy:

    I will try to get my LED needs fulfilled elsewhere

    THAT may be the most hilarious thing i've ever heard said by anyone ever, either in person or on the internet. pure pinside gold!

    #46 7 years ago
    Quoted from centerflank:

    Thank you for sharing all that info, Everyone calm down meow. I like to attain as much knowledge as possible about any company that supply pinball goodies....Dont you?

    I'm sorry, did you just say 'meow?'

    12
    #47 7 years ago

    I found out that if you post anything negative about cointaker on pinside - you will be criticized and personally attacked. I posted something a while ago hoping to help other pinsiders avoid the mistake I made (ordering an F-14 Led kit from CT). The major theme to the responses was it was my fault for ordering a kit that they offered.

    #48 7 years ago
    Quoted from jpop:

    you need to have some ethics and integrity

    So you didn't read this post?

    Quoted from jpop:

    Anyone would be miffed, mee too, if someone comes in late and grabs a proven design or pings the source to compete.

    So YOU are saying the bulbs from Pinballbulbs were ripped off from Cointaker directly? Please elaborate.....

    #49 7 years ago
    Quoted from jpop:

    CT supplies all our led needs, and yes we could go direct to a factory, but we partner and work together on new ideas and bulb types with them. Some coolness on the way! So we pay more but have the best people and engineers behind our products with a long track record.
    Anyone would be miffed, mee too, if someone comes in late and grabs a proven design or pings the source to compete. But that's America and it make's the marketplace stronger. It takes time and money to do all this stuff and Chris and Mellisa have made a positive impact on pinball, and our games for sure. As have many "behind-the-scenes" suppliers. It's not just only about money, you need to have some ethics and integrity. What do you call a pinball company with no integrity? Jpop

    I have a LOT of Cointaker LEDs and think they are great, but shouldn't they have patents on their designs? And if they do, I would think they would file a lawsuit and NOT take it to a public forum. Now, I know B_R started the talk, but they (the Cointaker rep) certainly didn't help in their responses. I hoped to see them say that they should not have discussed the information with B_R and will be sure to keep a lid on it in the future. No, instead they start up with accusations on pinballbulbs too. Sue them or shut up.

    -2
    #50 7 years ago

    Read the thread BR posted the details Cointaker did not post the information BR did, He is not part of the Cointaker company, how he knew well thats a good question but for all everyone knows Markmon could have mentioned elsewhere.

    Dont be so eager to drag a companys name through the mud, Im not partial to any company but all the clowns here seem to be more woried about talking smack about a good company instead of their good reputation as business.

    And yes look at the new guys bulbs they are almost identical reproductions of CT leds oh wait they didnt glue in the cover thats innovation!!

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