Coin doors to cash doors in the future of Pinball?


By Yelobird

1 month ago


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  • 47 posts
  • 33 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 month ago by Coyote
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 44 days ago

Not sure if this was asked or I just couldn't find it? Do you believe in the not to distant future pinball manufacturers will move away from Coin mechs, a traditions coin door, etc. and move towards a dollar bill accepter? The days of .25 cent pinball are long behind us and it just seems like the natural transition in the world of cash, ticket dispensers, and god for bid even card readers. Pinball does seem to be on the rise again though I wonder if it negatively sways the younger (coin-less) crowd when they need to have $2.00 in quarters to play a game of pinball? Took the slot machine industry a long time to make the change, is Pinball next? What say you...

#2 44 days ago

Coins still predominate here in my area. There's still plenty of 25 cent video games on route here as well as 25 cent pinball. A local operator has Hobbit, Metallica, Ghostbusters, and Sopranos on 50 cents a play. It's all what the local market will pay. Around here, if a pin was set to a dollar a play, no one would play it.

#3 44 days ago

There is a TAF near me for 25 cents per game..

#4 44 days ago

Or the .gov moves to not using the antiquated $1 bill and starts minting $1 coins.

We have $1 and $2 coins. With mechs to match. Much cheaper than bill acceptors.

#5 44 days ago

I agree as the costs of games continusily increase the amount of money we need to charge to justify our investment unfortunately needs to be increased as well. Dollar Bill Acceptors has definitely made it easier for Operators/Vendors to receive payment for there games. However there are still a large amount of locations around the world that still operates of tokens. For this application a coin acceptor is needed. Card swipe system is being utilized in many of our locations. Bottom line times are a changing. Sit back and try to enjoy the ride.

#6 44 days ago

The USA might be one of the last countries with bills as small as $1. Most have coins for 1s and 2s, with 5 being the smallest bill.

#7 44 days ago

Most WPC games and newer have a slot available for installing bill acceptor.

If a game is on a random location somewhere with no change machines handy, people are more likely to stuff a dollar bill into the game, rather than run around to try to hunt down some change. At the same time, some people with random change jingling in their pocket may drop a few quarters in a game just because they have the loose change and a few minutes to kill.

It's good to have both coin mechs and bill acceptors so an operator can make it as easy as possible for someone to put money into a game.

#8 44 days ago

We do have $1 coins, for the record. They're just not 'widely' distributed. Vending owners, Routers can request them from their bank for change, and 'collectors' can order bags of them from the US Mint - for an upcharge.

#9 44 days ago

I would like to see more vending and pinball machines accept Apple Pay and equivalent. More people have there phones with them than they do change.

Mike V

#10 44 days ago

Local place here uses pay range, as well as tokens. Pay range is nice cause it's 10 cent cheaper and earns you free games where I play. When I'm out of money, just reload through the app.

#11 44 days ago

I've used PayRange at a few locations (edit to clarify: as a player - I'm not an operator) and really like that system. The app does a fantastic job at figuring out what machine you're standing in front of, it's super convenient, and in some locations you even get a small discount for using it vs cash! Plus the app supports Apple Pay for re-filling your account!

#12 44 days ago
Quoted from smokedog:

Or the .gov moves to not using the antiquated $1 bill and starts minting $1 coins.
We have $1 and $2 coins. With mechs to match. Much cheaper than bill acceptors.

We have $1 coins already but nobody want's to use them. The only time I get them is from some vending machines for change. It's up to vendors and operators to start the push to use $1 coins. I personally would like that. Bill validators don't work so well.

#13 44 days ago
Quoted from RacingPin:

I would like to see more vending and pinball machines accept Apple Pay and equivalent. More people have there phones with them than they do change.
Mike V

With the newer doors available, that support full-face DBV's, an operator could put on one of the CC/NFC/Bill acceptor faceplates (for Mars/MEI) and accept ApplePay, Google Pay, and NFC-enabled (and regulat stripe) cards as well now.

#14 44 days ago

First the government needs to cancel the $1 bill. That's what is stopping adoption of the $1 coin.

Phase it out. Then get rid of the penny, too.

15
#15 44 days ago
Quoted from jwilson:

First the government needs to cancel the $1 bill. That's what is stopping adoption of the $1 coin.
Phase it out. Then get rid of the penny, too.

I'd rather use bills than coins. I don't like carrying around change in my pockets.

#16 44 days ago
Quoted from andre060:

I've used PayRange at a few locations (edit to clarify: as a player - I'm not an operator) and really like that system. The app does a fantastic job at figuring out what machine you're standing in front of, it's super convenient, and in some locations you even get a small discount for using it vs cash! Plus the app supports Apple Pay for re-filling your account!

I really like PayRange too, BUT.... the first time I encountered it was at the Minnesota State Fair, and in the building where the pins were, the reception wasn't very good so I wasn't able to use it. So there is a negative, depending on location.

#17 44 days ago

Bitcoin. That's the future. . . . .

Seriously though, I don't foresee any actual physical currency replacing coins. E-commerce only for upgrading.

#18 44 days ago

The future is already here
Homepin has designed his cabinets so an operator can install a note acceptor

#19 44 days ago

Coins are king when it comes to pinball. If you only have quarters in your pocket they still want them.

#20 44 days ago

The future is credit cards, just like you see being used in modern vending machines. I enjoyed slot machines much more when they cashed out in coins. Hate that stupid piece of paper you get today. Maybe that's why I don't want to go back to Vegas.

#21 44 days ago

On a side note:

Last month I was checking my change, and there was a Sacagawea Dollar in with my Canadian coins. I had briefly thought that some one gave me a Car Wash Token, instead of a Dollar (Loonie).

If a Bill acceptor is on a pin, it could be set for 4 or 2 plays per Dollar, Right?

#22 44 days ago
Quoted from Electrocute:

The future is credit cards, just like you see being used in modern vending machines. I enjoyed slot machines much more when they cashed out in coins. Hate that stupid piece of paper you get today. Maybe that's why I don't want to go back to Vegas.

I've seen a few redemption arcades switch over to swipe card systems. Pay at a kiosk, and get a swipe card loaded with whatever you paid in.

So, you're not feeding money into games or getting bundles of tickets. Just a boring swipe card.

Personally, I see kids get a lot more excited over a game spitting out 200 tickets than I do with just getting the ticket count loaded onto the swipe card.

#23 44 days ago
Quoted from Darcy:

On a side note:
Last month I was checking my change, and there was a Sacagawea Dollar in with my Canadian coins. I had briefly thought that some one gave me a Car Wash Token, instead of a Dollar (Loonie).
If a Bill acceptor is on a pin, it could be set for 4 or 2 plays per Dollar, Right?

Yeah, you can.

#24 44 days ago

I think those NFC enabled "tap to pay" will be the next big leap for pinball, assuming manufacturers can be bothered to give them wifi capability and they're vended in wifi enabled locations (which is pretty much everywhere these days). Put the NFC receiver on the lockdown bar with a small logo so people can just tap their phones to it to enable Apple or Android Pay. Might as well add a credit/debit card swiper too. That can go on the coin door though.

No coin drop, no bill validators, and instant money transactions. The Op wouldn't have to run around town collecting money from a cash box. I imagine a lot of people wanting to play a game or two, don't, because they don't have any change in their pocket. That's been me more than a couple of times.

#25 44 days ago

I doubt any manufacturer will equip games with anything but coin mechs and holes for other things like bill validators.

Too many ops use too many different things and makes of validators, payrange, credit card, etc.

Up to the op to put in what they use.

LTG : )

#26 44 days ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

I've seen a few redemption arcades switch over to swipe card systems. Pay at a kiosk, and get a swipe card loaded with whatever you paid in.
So, you're not feeding money into games or getting bundles of tickets. Just a boring swipe card.
Personally, I see kids get a lot more excited over a game spitting out 200 tickets than I do with just getting the ticket count loaded onto the swipe card.

We've got a few outfits using those, including two Dave and Buster's locations. They do odd things with credit values (it's never shown in dollars when you check the balance), and you don't have a good sense for how much value you're actually getting because the card effectively divorces what you're paying per game from the number of plays unless you're paying very close attention. Plus, it ensures you have an effective "minimum" buy-in to even play.

I have mixed feelings about them. On the one hand, no need to carry a roll of quarters. On the other, the aforementioned divorcing of value you loaded on the card versus what you're playing per game.

#27 44 days ago
Quoted from jwilson:

First the government needs to cancel the $1 bill. That's what is stopping adoption of the $1 coin.
Phase it out. Then get rid of the penny, too.

People don’t like the dollar coins because they are the same size as a quarter and you can’t tell the difference in your pocket. Or so I read.

#28 44 days ago

Totally depends on the market and location. Around here, coins are going to be used for a long time. People seem to want to drop quarters rather than use bills.

#29 44 days ago

Coins, bills who cares?! Money is made with alcohol.

#30 44 days ago

Great points and interesting comments. For the record I am in No way wanting them or I to make a "change" from the current norm I was just curious if with the popularity of pinball on the rise vendors, OEMS, etc would push for this change to generate more interest and revenue. Think slots back in the day. Sitting there with a heavy bucket of quarters (or dollar coins) gave you pause to keep spending. With the currency less paper units of today you don't think about spinning again or playing another 20 games. Plus as someone mentioned, carrying a Wallet now days is almost as rare as carrying Coins for most of the younger generation. Heck I can't even find a place to get Rid of my coins but thats a completely different post!!

#31 44 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

Think slots back in the day. Sitting there with a heavy bucket of quarters (or dollar coins) gave you pause to keep spending.

Casinos didn't get away from coins or tokens because of spending.

With the proliferation of bright LED lights on pens, key chains, etc. It was found you could shine it up where the coins or tokens dropped and mess with the optos counting and they'd keep dispensing until empty.

LTG : )

#32 44 days ago
Quoted from LTG:

Casinos didn't get away from coins or tokens because of spending.
With the proliferation of bright LED lights on pens, key chains, etc. It was found you could shine it up where the coins or tokens dropped and mess with the optos counting and they'd keep dispensing until empty.
LTG : )

Thanks for the Tip Llyod! Need to go find me a truck stop old slot machine now! You never fail to impress me with your knowledge. I will solute you when my coffee mug arrives if my wife lets me hold it! lol

#33 44 days ago
Quoted from zr11990:

People don’t like the dollar coins because they are the same size as a quarter and you can’t tell the difference in your pocket. Or so I read.

Dollar coins are slightly larger in diameter, thicker, and have no ridges on the sides (but do have the date etched into the side but it's so small you can't really feel it). You'd be just as likely or more likely to mistake a dime for a penny, or a nickel for a quarter.

#34 43 days ago

I never seem to “spend” my change. Each night when I get home I just throw it in a 5 gallon empty water jug. I now have two of them almost full of “spare” change. Probably should roll all of that at some point and take it to the bank. Lol. Would probably pay for a vacation.

Now on the other hand when I go to an arcade I do buy a roll of quarters and love to “drop some coin” into the machine!!

I’m with others on not liking the card swipe systems or coinless slot machines in Vegas!!! Booooooo hissssss!!!

Just my .02. (That will go in the water jug bank!) lol. See what I did there? Haha.

#35 43 days ago

Dollar coin mechs have been around since the late 70's. Many classic Bally pins had them from the factory. But just like the metric system we Americans never took to accepting it. Personally I'd rather have ten ones in my wallet then ten coins in my pocket.
Ps my SBA dollar coin mechs are for sale in the marketplace.

IMG_4400 (resized).JPG

#36 43 days ago
Quoted from PopBumperPete:

The future is already here
Homepin has designed his cabinets so an operator can install a note acceptor

The real future would be a paywave swipe debit/credit system directly from your phone.

No cash kept in the coinbox = no risk of having the coin door jimmied on an onsite machine.

Quoted from ForceFlow:

I'd rather use bills than coins. I don't like carrying around change in my pockets.

Quoted from zr11990:

People don’t like the dollar coins because they are the same size as a quarter and you can’t tell the difference in your pocket. Or so I read.

That's why you need to adopt cash denominations that look like Monopoly money. It's the only way us dumb Aussies can tell the difference with ours.

Australian-Cash (resized).jpg

#37 43 days ago
Quoted from pinsanity:

That's why you need to adopt cash denominations that look like Monopoly money. It's the only way us dumb Aussies can tell the difference with ours.

Out of curiosity, can you tell them apart with your eyes closed, or are the bills impossible to tell apart without looking at them?

Quoted from pinsanity:

No cash kept in the coinbox = no risk of having the coin door jimmied on an onsite machine.

And no coin jams in the coin slots, mechs, or bill acceptor.

There is probably a lot less labor involved when using a swipe card system rather than a traditional coin mech system. An arcade attendant would be far less busy (or not necessary). So, a location could potentially save money on staffing by going to swipe cards.

#38 43 days ago
Quoted from RacingPin:

I would like to see more vending and pinball machines accept Apple Pay and equivalent. More people have there phones with them than they do change.
Mike V

and they the Operators will have to pay the CC fees + maybe even internet / networking fees.

#39 43 days ago

They are all a slightly different size length wise but would be basically impossible to tell them apart with eyes closed.

New notes are now gradually being issued with raised braille on the surface of them (they are a polymer plastic and cannot be physically ripped in half) for the visually impaired.

#40 43 days ago
Quoted from Electrocute:

The future is credit cards, just like you see being used in modern vending machines. I enjoyed slot machines much more when they cashed out in coins. Hate that stupid piece of paper you get today. Maybe that's why I don't want to go back to Vegas.

sigma derby is still there and is still paying out coins.

#41 43 days ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Out of curiosity, can you tell them apart with your eyes closed, or are the bills impossible to tell apart without looking at them?

And no coin jams in the coin slots, mechs, or bill acceptor.
There is probably a lot less labor involved when using a swipe card system rather than a traditional coin mech system. An arcade attendant would be far less busy (or not necessary). So, a location could potentially save money on staffing by going to swipe cards.

the card systems do cost a lot and you do need wifi or running network cable to each game as well.

#42 43 days ago

For on location machines, card readers are what I would see being the next progression. Not many people carry cash these days.

#43 40 days ago

i would like to see more payrange like systems, maybe even google pay so its cheap or free for the operator. in asian countries most payments are digital. its more secure, trackable, and you can do things like remotely adjust pricing on the fly (happy hour), and there are no coin mechs to jam. heck at some point id like to see pinballs have diagnostics that can be sent to an operator, and if a ball goes missing the operator can send a digital refund.

#44 40 days ago

There is a 1958 Williams Gusher on route near me. Getting 5 balls for a quarter has a certain charm about it.

Quoted from mbaumle:

... The Op wouldn't have to run around town collecting money from a cash box. ....

Great, one more reason for an Op to not visit the game to see if it needs a cleaning or bulbs replaced. I want them to take a look once and a while. And if the cashbox has less than usual maybe check to see if there is something not working.

#45 40 days ago
Quoted from Electrocute:

Hate that stupid piece of paper you get today. Maybe that's why I don't want to go back to Vegas.

Downtown Vegas has many places that still take coins. (Better odds than on the strip too.)

#46 40 days ago
Quoted from LTG:

Casinos didn't get away from coins or tokens because of spending.
With the proliferation of bright LED lights on pens, key chains, etc. It was found you could shine it up where the coins or tokens dropped and mess with the optos counting and they'd keep dispensing until empty.

I always thought it was because it left the opportunity for people to neglect to cash the ticket, lose it, or even just let it expire. Also the amount of saving in staffing the hard count room and staff emptying/moving all the coins around as well as space likely adds up to a pretty penny.

#47 40 days ago
Quoted from Dr_Smith:

I always thought it was because it left the opportunity for people to neglect to cash the ticket, lose it, or even just let it expire. Also the amount of saving in staffing the hard count room and staff emptying/moving all the coins around as well as space likely adds up to a pretty penny.

Yeah - this is probably a HUGE benefit.
With cash, the casino doesn't own it until put it in. With the ticket system, they have all your money as soon as you give it to them.

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