If I ever have a HUO or NIB, they are getting a Cliffy, no questions asked. You mentioned the reason in your post 'protect against further deterioration'. Deterioration starts the first time you plunge a ball. Might as well stop it before it starts.

I was pondering the same thing. I have 2 HUO pins, and I'm doing a playfield swap on my Funhouse. I may leave the protectors off the Funhouse as I can't see the new ramps and holes taking the abuse in a home environment.

I too like the product, but I think of it like putting vinyl over your furniture so that the upholstery looks great when you throw it out in the future.

It depends. Anyone who doesn't get the IM ramp protector is just courting disaster, IMHO. I also think any eject scoop needs a Cliffy, and I wish there was one for CSI. OTOH, I've never Cliffy'ed my NIB LOTR, and it's doing fine. I plan to reuse my cellar door Cliffys when I do my WW playfield swap.

Yep! Cliffys look good unlike those nasty vinyl sofa covers. And Cliffys don't make your shirt get all sweaty and stick to your back either.

better to be safe that sorry, put them on alll my pins, cheap costs overall.

Why wait for something to happen.
Prevent it now,never have to worry about the playfield.

Eventually it will happen,HUO or not.
They all get played.

New or old,I cover them all.

I must be doing it wrong

You MUST get a protector for every playfield hole. Even in a home use environment, holes get beat to shit. I have a good friend with a BBB that has hole damage due to no protector.

I love Cliffy's products and have used them on all of my older pins; except for my NIB Tron. When and if damage does occur then I know that I can buy a Cliffy protector at that time to resolve the issue. Until then I like the look of a fresh playfield. We are talking about a HUO and it only gets a fraction of playtime than it would at an arcade.

Also, once I add a Cliffy I know I'll never take it off. It's a permanent fixture to help cover any preexisting pf damage. It a shame to permanently cover a pf before you even get to enjoy the newnest of it all.

cliffy's are to pinball machines just like vinyl protectors are to couches.

if you don't use a cliffy on your machine, it could end up like this (metaphorically speaking)

jheri-curl-stain1.jpg

My wife won't let me sit on our bedroom furniture naked. I think there's a metaphor in there somewhere. Oh yeah, Cliffys are underpants for your pin!

I have never heard of a game going for less because of a cliffy protector. If it is that much of a worry, take the cliffy off before you sell it.

My AC/DC is a HUO and might get 20 plays a week. The eject hole behind the bell already has damage. Cliffy's are like insurance, you don't need it until you need it.

Just Do It

(Am I going to get sued by Nike now?)

I have the plastic protectors on my Dr Who. Maybe I should look into this Chris Hutchins method. Does he have a web page?

I like the mantis type hole protectors on new pins. Once there even starts to show wear on the lip though, its time for cliffy.

BBB will develop wear in the "Darts" scoop fairly quickly if not covered. Absolutely, get a full set of protectors for any game you own.

The pinball environment is a violent one with physics in full effect. I recomment Cliffy protectors as much as keeping the playfield waxed.

No amount of wax will stop the damage of a steel ball versus wood/paint/clear over time. I always cliffy every one of my pins when I shop or restore them. I'd rather be safe than sorry in the long run and to me Cliffys look good

As others have said, it depends. First off, you never want to install any scoop protector on a game straight out of the box. Play at least 50 games first to both check for issues and to play the game as the designer intended. Scoop protectors always make the shot harder (smaller). No denying that. You may not notice it, but it does. Switching to white rubbers right out of the box is also a bad idea. You're completely changing the game without experiencing what the designer intended.

If the game is new to you, but has been out for a few months, try to find one on location to see how it's holding up. Places like the PHOF, PPM, PAPA, and others are great places to do research. If it's the latest and greatest, play a few games and keep a close eye on areas that might need protection. With older games, it can vary greatly. The scoop on an original AFM playfield absolutely needs a protector. Every last one of them. The slot machine scoop on TZ often doesn't need one. The rat hole on BSD is another that tends to hold up well over the years. Again, check a location machine before plastering the game with protectors.

Whether you use them or not, putting them on right out of the box is a bad idea. A few dozen plays without protection won't destroy your game. Sort out the bugs and get a feel for which areas might need protection before you decide. For the record, I use Cliffy's products on some of my location games. They are an invaluable tool when used judiciously.

Mantis type hole protectors on new pins. No way put cliffys on new pin. Who are you saving it for?

The cliffy is moving around scratching what you are trying to save on a new pin.

Myself

It maybe scratching it but I'm not getting my scoop beat up and I'll never see it nor neither will the next owner. The cliffy is permanent on my pins

That is assuming the Cliffy is covering wear on the pf. If the Cliffy was installed on the machine when it was NIB or shortly after, the Cliffy machine may have less wear. In that case I would choose the Cliffy machine. If a machine does not have a Cliffy, there may not be wear visible but there is wear. If I were going to spend 8-10k on a pin, the seller will remove the Cliffy for me to inspect or I walk unless the price allows for unknown condition under the Cliffy.

I agree on the large leg protectors, I am not a fan. I have a few and they are not what I like to see. Will not get more.

It modifies game play quite a bit but it is yours so I say protect it as you see fit.

I go back and forth on that. My TZ doesnt make any diff. RBION maybe a little. Brothers JP big amount.

Mantis for scoops. Cliffy for everything else

+1

I'd be more interested in Neutral Zone than the mode/EB hole.

My hole looks like that as well but my NZ was beat to hell but I covered it with a cliffy

the one with the cliff will also have no wear.

I think Mantis is a better option for NIB pins because it's more hidden. If there is any damage, then Cliffy is the way to go.

The Cliffy shouldn't move around at all unless you don't tighten the screws. I've had people tell me they've removed a Cliffy after years of use and there was absolutely no sign that it was ever installed.

You can barely see mine on the right but it looks fine... I wish I had a before on that NZ

STTNG.png

It would be hard to put Cliffys on a NIB game and keep it NIB

But seriously, I guess it depends on how much you play your game. Some games with high wear spots can start showing wear after 200 games or less. Others may never show. I play my games like crazy, so if there is a spot that is known for getting worn, I'm going to put a protector on there.

Cliffys and Mantis Protectors both have their pros and cons. In generally, I like the Cliffy ones for games with any amount of wear, and Mantis ones for brand new games. I play the stuffing out of my games though, so it probably is a bigger deal for someone like me.

To be honest for what these things cost to actually produce, I'm not sure why they don't come in a goody bag, or even as a 50$ add on (for all) option when buying NIB. Operator or collector it would be a no brainer at that price point.

Oh and I'm in no way knocking the current price of these things or those that provide them as an after market option. Thankful to those that do.

What would you guys think about an extremely thin and clear protector? Something that was virtually invisible and didn't take away from the look of a NIB/minty playfield, was thin enough to not impact game play, and could always be removed in the event someone didn't like it?

If you are talking about a thin stip of clear plastic; I would imagine that it would crack from constant hitting from the ball.

Any time you add anything, even .002 mylar, you impact gameplay. You might not notice it, but it does. It's simple physics. Cliffy does the best he can to balance protection with proper gameplay. It's a fine line. Most players usually don't notice the difference. Especially when they install one right out of the box.

And that's why I stopped using soul glow on my pins!

Any sign of wear would warrant the use of cliffy

Even HUO need cliffy protection.

Tron - ramps - eventually could chip really badly without cliffys - see other posts/threads.

SM - my HUO/NIB right ramp on SM had a crack from HUO use - protected.

I was thinking of something more stiff and durable than mylar and no more thick than a standard metal protector in order to minimize impact on game play. Mylar would probably work well in terms of minimal visibility, but I'm not sure how long it would last on the lip of a hole? There are definitely some hard plastics around that would wear well and be pretty resistant to breakage while keeping as thin as metal.

I agree phishrace, there would definitely still be some level of ball impact just like metal. It sounds like some of the concern here is the look of a minty game when you cover the lip around a scoop or other hole with shiny steel. Obviously some people don't mind, but it seems like some do. ChadNC's STTNG scoop is good example of this. The look of a thin metal protector would certainly be visible but if it was a hard and mostly invisible plastic, it would probably be hard to tell it was there during game play.

Personally, there are some games where I think a metal cliffy looks awesome and blends right into the game perfectly, but there are others were I would prefer the original look of the playfield's hole border if possible. My TAF electric chair is a good example.