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(Topic ID: 273092)

Clear coat ghosting in cpr playfield


By Pinball50

3 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 22 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by yellowghost
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    #1 3 months ago

    Hi, I have been on pinside for a while but don't normally ask questions about pinball related problems. During the last run of the flight 2000 playfields from cpr i had purchased one and had just installed it a about a year ago, and since that time i have
    noticed severe ghosting in the clear coat on the bonus inserts and feel very disappointed about this. I know the playfield does have some age to it but feel this should not have happend. I just wanted to know if anybody else has experienced this on this run of flight 2000 playfields. I do realize this needs to be torn down and re clear coated but feel this should not have happened and presents a lot of work. I always appreciate cpr and fact that they make pinball restorations possible but still feel a bit let down over this.

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    #2 3 months ago

    Have you contacted CPR about the issue? They may work with you on resolving the issue.

    I think a number of restorers wait at least 6 months before installing freshly clear coated playfield in the game to let the coat harden and to monitor for issues.

    #3 3 months ago

    ooofffftttt

    that stinks. Should never happen. Appears that inserts have sunk and clean was not bonded well.

    kevincpr for info

    #4 3 months ago

    This could happen on any clear coated playfield (CPR, Mirco, original factory NOS, any restored playfield, or any clear coated playfield). There are a lot of variables that can make this happen. It could be an adhesion issue, temperature causes expansion/contraction issues(extreme heat/cold), humidity, wood twisted/flexed, glue issues on the inserts, clear coat too thick, clear coat shrinkage, etc). The problem is that your dealing with an automotive type of clear that was made for vehicles. Clear coat on a playfield takes differently to the wood areas and the plastic (insert) areas. I do not blame CPR. I believe they ran these about 10 years ago. Most likely the issue is how the playfield was stored.

    #5 3 months ago
    Quoted from Tommy-dog:

    The problem is that your dealing with an automotive type of clear that was made for vehicles. Clear coat on a playfield takes differently to the wood areas and the plastic (insert) areas.

    So what you're saying is, cpr used the wrong product for the job?

    #6 3 months ago
    Quoted from xamindar:

    So what you're saying is, cpr used the wrong product for the job?

    LMAO, yeah that's what he said verbatim.....LOL......CPR has been making playfields for 15 years now, they know what they are doing.
    They only made 1 run of Flight2000 playfields in 2010 ( yeah, 10 Years Ago ).

    Quoted from Whysnow:

    Appears that inserts have sunk and clean was not bonded well.

    No way for the inserts to "sink" as they actually Sit on a Lip ( unlike mirco's which is just a hole ).
    As for the 'bonding', CPR uses 2-Part Industrial Epoxy for gluing. Ever tried to remove an Insert from a CPR Playfield? It is bonded so well that it literately takes part of the wood with it when removed. Mike has told me that when they have to replace an insert they have to use a dremmel to remove so as not to destroy the wood.

    #7 3 months ago

    so what happened then?

    insert did not sink, but there is clearly a big air gap under the clear now.

    #8 3 months ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    insert did not sink, but there is clearly a big air gap under the clear now.

    A lot of things can happen....1 of the biggest is Temperature changes....Humidity is another huge factor ( Oregon has some very Cold/Damp winters ), Heat from incandescent bulbs can be a factor, The rate of Expansion/Contraction is different between Wood & Plastic & coiuld easily have caused this over a 10 year period......

    #9 3 months ago

    most likely the clear is separating from the insert. Eventually it'll probably chip off in those spots. I think on one of the old TOP videos, clay injected the area with superglue? Someone might recall or have a better repair tip than sanding and reshooting the pf in clear......

    #10 3 months ago
    Quoted from Cherries_Jubilee:

    A lot of things can happen....1 of the biggest is Temperature changes....Humidity is another huge factor ( Oregon has some very Cold/Damp winters ), Heat from incandescent bulbs can be a factor, The rate of Expansion/Contraction is different between Wood & Plastic & coiuld easily have caused this over a 10 year period......

    this is a 18month old pf? that was installed 1 year ago?

    I have NEVER had any reproduction pf do this to date. I dont see any acceptable way this happens in this short of time or we can place blame on the owners storage of the pf?

    #11 3 months ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    this is a 18month old pf?...

    Jubilee has stated it was from 2010

    #12 3 months ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    He's clearly stated it was from 2010

    I thought they just ran these 18months ago?

    #13 3 months ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    I thought they just ran these 18months ago?

    According to Jubilees they only made them once in 2010.

    #14 3 months ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    According to Jubilees they only made them once in 2010.

    ah

    ok

    I thought I saw them run a batch last year.

    Yeah... 10 years brings in some chance of storage issues. Also, process has likely improved greatly in past 10 years.

    #15 3 months ago

    Ooooof that's rough. At this point if it were me, I'd order a Kruzman repair kit. Use the smallest drill bit possible and inject the glue from syringe. I feel the solution is a better alternative than allow it to continue as is.

    #16 3 months ago
    Quoted from xamindar:

    So what you're saying is, cpr used the wrong product for the job?

    No, I am not saying that CPR used the wrong type of clear coat. Automotive clear coat is made for the automotive industry. It is not specially made for pinball playfields. You can tweak the clear coat formula to hold up better on wood but automotive clear was not really designed for pinball.

    #17 3 months ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    I thought they just ran these 18months ago?

    I thought so too. I seem to recall a message about the difficulty in sourcing the inserts.

    [edit]: Hm, maybe I was thinking of quicksilver? I dunno.

    #18 3 months ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    I seem to recall a message about the difficulty in sourcing the inserts.

    I believe you are thinking of the F14 Arrow Inserts, which was not made by cpr......

    #19 3 months ago
    Quoted from Cherries_Jubilee:

    I believe you are thinking of the F14 Arrow Inserts, which was not made by cpr......

    No, I'm definitely not thinking of F14. I seem to recall the issue with obtaining early stern style round inserts. I'm just not quite sure now if it was for F2k or another stern title.

    #20 3 months ago

    cherries_jubilee do you work for CPR?

    #21 3 months ago
    Quoted from mrm_4:

    cherries_jubilee do you work for CPR?

    No.....but I talk to them all the time.......

    #22 3 months ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    No, I'm definitely not thinking of F14. I seem to recall the issue with obtaining early stern style round inserts. I'm just not quite sure now if it was for F2k or another stern title.

    Maybe you are thinking of meteor.

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