(Topic ID: 205521)

Classic Stern Magic Club (all are welcome)

By terrapinmark

6 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 88 posts
  • 24 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 months ago by Brewboy
  • Topic is favorited by 7 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

  • Magic Stern Electronics, 1979

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#21 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

This game also has a relay wired between the transformer and rectifier board. Any pictures or wiring diagrams are appreciated.

Can you post pictures of said relay? And also the wires you want info on?

Sounds like someone may have put a transformer/power board from a Stern Galaxy into your game which uses a relay to switch the general illumination. Magic has no such feature.

#24 3 years ago

That relay doesn't belong on Magic. Someone must have installed the power board from a later Stern game that uses that relay to flash the G.I. Magic does not support this feature.

BTW, on top of the transformer do you see it marked "16B-3" or "16B-6"?

Note the J1 pin header on your new rectifier board is 9 pins wide while the old rectifier board it was 8 pins wide. Make sure your J1 connector is keyed properly so you install it on the left 8 pins (the 9the pin on the right should be left exposed).

Also, the F2 fuse should be a 3/4 amp fast blow but your new one looks rather over fused. Confirm that it's the right rating fuse.
BTW, the fuses on the new rectifier board look like medium blow fuses, not fast blow. Care to post some pictures of the fuse markings?

1 week later
#26 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

quench The top of the transformer is 16B-6. The board came with a connector kit which has a 9-position for J1, so I should be okay. Thanks for mentioning that, and everything else. You noticed things I overlooked.
The fuse markings on the board do not match those of the original chart on top. I hope the new ones are an improvement and not a mistake. The actual fuses in there are marked with a 3xx code, instead of MDL/AGC. I had to google that, but I'm still not sure what ABC means - maybe medium? F3 is 4A (ignore my accidental decimal).
It does look like the new board markings are different from the fuses populating it. I need to have another look.

Oh sorry, somehow I missed your reply last week.
The 16B-6 transformer is from a later game, there's probably a few that would love to trade you with the transformer you're supposed to have. You might notice the flippers/solenoids have more power than the game was originally designed for.

312 = AGC = fast blow glass body
313 = MDL = slow blow glass body
314 = ABC = fast blow ceramic body

The F6 3 amp fuse should be slow blow, not fast blow.

The F4 fuse should be 5 amp fast blow for your game. Ignore the 7.5A slow blow on the card above the rectifier board - as I previously mentioned your transformer/rectifier board panel has come from a later game. The 7.5A slow blow fuse spec is for games with 4 flippers (Big Game, Seawitch, Cheetah, etc)

For safety, the F2 3/4 amp fuse would be better as a fast blow, not slow blow. If something goes wrong with the high voltage circuit on the solenoid driver board, the transistors always blow well before that rectifier board fuse does. A slow blow fuse at F2 isn't acting as a protection mechanism for the high voltage circuit on the solenoid driver board so it should be a fast blow fuse. Bally recognised this error and changed their F2 fuse spec accordingly.

#28 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

SB-100 sound board, but then realized I have no idea how that board is mounted inside the backbox. There are no visible screws. Anyone know?

The sound board is just held by four round plastic clips like the clips holding the other boards.

#35 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

I forgot to tell you, I took your advice on all of the fuses. Thanks much for giving it.

Cheers. For your sanity, PinWiki reflects the correct fuse ratings - your rectifier board matches the first in the list "AS-2518-18".
Only F6 is marked as "SB" for slow blow.

https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#Fuse_Values

3 weeks later
#43 3 years ago
Quoted from Bigbill:

However the questions I have is how many sounds should activate on test.

There are six sounds:
10 point tone
100 point tone
1000 point tone
10000 point tone
Add Bonus sound
Pop Bumper chirp

#45 3 years ago
Quoted from Bigbill:

Looks like I may have an issue with the 32 pin connector on the board so place to start.

Pay close attention to pins 3 and 4 on the 32 pin connector, those signals trigger your two missing sound effects.
I presume you have a newish 32 pin cable? What condition is the SB100 32 pin header in?

#47 3 years ago
Quoted from Bigbill:

Twice when I have just moved the cable slightly at sound board connection end I have had a mixture of all sounds at once.

You've got some bad connection issue.

The solder joints on the SB-100 32pin pin header often crack. Suggest you pull the board out and resolder any suspect pin header joints you see under a magnifying glass.

Quoted from Bigbill:

I’ve been looking at the newer, non ribbon, cables but they are either out of stock or about USD 200 including shipping

Both barakandl and Great Plains have the cables on their sites for under US$15 (before international shipping).
Scroll down to the SB-300 board and you'll see @barakandl's cable:
https://nvram.weebly.com/new-pcbs.html

The dual 16 pin cable is the one from Great Plains to suite the SB-100:
https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=57

#49 3 years ago
Quoted from Bigbill:

As both missing sounds go through U4, I think, could U4 be the problem?

They are both activated through U4. It can be checked with a logic probe if you have one.

2 months later
#53 3 years ago
Quoted from Grefla:

What’s up with the plastics on my magic. They don’t seem quite right, but I was told they are original to the machine.

Maybe it's a difference with the Australian Leisure and Allied Industries built Sterns (presuming yours is a local). There are some plastics pictures on IPDB matching your art, and other Magic playfields with different plastic art.

1 week later
#56 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

The game resets during gameplay, or sometimes instead of resetting just the scores reset and the ball in play continues from a score of zero. The other issue is an odd tilt with no shaking. I think when the tilt happens, all the displays and playfield inserts go dark too

Sounds like a switch matrix issue.
One you're getting the start button incorrectly activating and the other sounds like the slam tilt might be incorrectly activating (this one will cause the game to do a full reset like it's been powered off and back on). So if the displays come back on after 10 odd seconds into attract mode, this is the slam tilt. Not a 5V problem or HV problem.

How often is it happening?

#59 3 years ago
Quoted from Boise_D:

What do you think about HV at 158? Do you think it has been dialed down with the potentiometer to reduce stress on the displays?

Sorry I missed that bit. If the displays are not strobing then likely someone may have dialed down the voltage. Lower display voltage puts more stress on the high voltage transistors. Personally I dial it to around 180 volts - in a home environment you won't be burning out the displays.

Your switch matrix issues are likely to involve either the drop targets or coin door switches. Does the game report zero closed switches in switch test mode after you raise the drop targets and remove the ball from the game?

#61 3 years ago
Quoted from Joydivision:

Didn't realise a lower voltage like this added stress to the transistors, good to know, assumed a lower voltage was better overall. Mine are all at about 160v, will turn them up.

Power = voltage * current

There's about 0.2 amps current going to the displays.
240 volts input minus 190 volts output (Bally spec) = 50 volts across the HV 2N3440 transistor on the heatsink.
240 volts input minus 160 volts output = 80 volts across the HV 2N3440 transistor on the heatsink.

50V * 0.2A = 10 watts.
80V * 0.2A = 16 watts.

The heatsinked transistor has to dissipate more heat when the HV is dialed down because there's a greater voltage across it.

2 years later
#83 9 months ago
Quoted from Atari_Daze:

Can someone post pictures of your sound board connections?

For clarity, J2 is a 9 pin housing:

SB100_J2.jpgSB100_J2.jpg

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