(Topic ID: 281363)

Choosing the correct replacement fuse

By RDBowers

3 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 6 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by RDBowers
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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    #1 3 years ago

    I am trying to get some specific guidance on how to correctly select fuses. Excuse me if this is newbie stuff, but I am new to pinball maintenance. What I have developed so far is based on the work I have been doing with four Bally and three Gottlieb machines from the mid to late 70's. Pointing out any errors would be appreciated and might save a few machines.

    A fuse is designed to be the weakest link in a circuit. When the load on a circuit increases, the fuse is designed to blow before damage is done to a more important, possibly irreplaceable, component like an IC, transistor, transformer, solenoid or relay.

    I always start by reading the documentation for the machine. I have come to rely on the schematic drawings as the primary source of info. Additional information in the user manual and other documents is used only to confirm details on the drawings. Typically the drawing will specify the required amps. Based on the circuit it is usually easy to figure out the voltage. Sometimes there will be a notation if a fuse should be slow blow or fast blow.

    Selection of a replacement fuse should be based on,
    1. Physical size and package - Choose fuses that are the same size and package. In all cases the fuses I have replaced are glass tube 1/4 x 1-1/4" (6.3 x 32 mm). These are AGC type fuses ("All Glass" with size C being 1/4 x 1-1/4"). I suspect newer or older machines might use different sizes or packages.

    2. Amps - the replacement fuse should equal the specified amps. In a pinch a slightly lower rated fuse could be used, but the greater the difference the more likely it will blow. i.e. putting a 7 amp fuse in where a 7.5 amp is specified won't damage the machine, but the fuse is more likely to blow. Never use a fuse rated for higher amps. This will make other components in the circuit the weakest link and cause them to burn and not the fuse.

    3. Voltage - the replacement fuse should be rated for a voltage equal to or greater than specified. i.e. using a fuse rated for 250V into a circuit carrying 6V is acceptable. But putting a fuse rated for 32V in a circuit carrying 60V is not good. I am not sure what would happen, but I guess the fuse would blow and the circuit would be safe.

    4. Fast vs Slow - the replacement fuse should match what is specified. Fast blow (fast acting) fuses are used in purely resistive circuits with no or few load spikes like circuits where IC and other sensitive components need to be protected. Fast acting fuses are suppose to be marked with an "F". Slow blow (time delayed) fuses are used in capacitive circuits where surges occur upon power-on/off and power input/output like circuits with solenoids, relays and transformers. Time delayed fuses are suppose to be marked with a "T".

    This is the limit of my knowledge.

    What should I select when fast or slow blow is not specified? In several instances the drawings don't indicate fast or slow blow and fuses aren't marked with an "F" or "T". Is there such a thing a a "normal" blow fuse whose time delay falls somewhere between a fast and slow blow fuse? Or is this a users choice and I can select either? Or is it whatever I have on hand? Or should I choose a fast blow fuse to be safe and see what happens?

    Some circuits it seems obvious they would benefit from a fast blow fuse, like a circuit including the MPU board. Other circuits containing a drop-target or flipper solenoids would probably benefit from a slow blow fuse. What about a circuit for general illumination? I would think load should be pretty constant, so I would guess a fast blow fuse should work well. What about controlled lighting? Several lights turning on and off would change the load, but the total load could be pretty small. Fast or slow blow? Or is load on any circuit in a pinball machine so varied that I should always select a slow blow fuse? Some group wisdom would be appreciated.

    #2 3 years ago

    You've done a really nice write-up on fuses here. Some additional notes:

    1. On EM machines virtually all fuses will be 1/4 x 1/4. It doesn't really matter if they are glass tube or not. Glass tube fuses supposedly make it easier to tell if a fuse is good, but in reality the fuse link inside the tube can fracture or detach in a way that is not visible. The only sure way to tell if a fuse is good is with an ohm meter.

    2. Under-fusing will not work very well on an EM. The fuse will eventually blow due to the repetitive stress of the current surges in the circuit.

    4a. I'm not aware of any special "super fast" fuses ever being used in any EM. In my experience, the term "regular fuse," "normal-blow," and "fast-blow" all refer to the same type of fuse in the EM universe. If any other pinsider has additional info on this, please pitch in.

    4b. If the schematic does not specify slow-blow, assume the fuse is a regular (fast-blow) fuse. You should never use a slow-blow fuse in a circuit unless it is specified either on the schematic or on the label next to the fuse holder. Similarly, you can't really use a fast-blow fuse when slow-blow is specified because the fuse will likely blow even though the circuit is fine, and is behaving as designed.

    - TimMe

    #3 3 years ago

    That vast majority of pins use the same size you're using. An AGC fuse is assumed to be a fast blow (regular) fuse. A slow blow fuse is labeled MDL (method detection limit). All pins use either AGC or MDL (F or T for smaller fuses), no middle ground. I keep a small magnifying glass in my tool bag to read them. The smaller fuses used on some games use the F and T.

    As mentioned above, the manual should tell you which type. SB for slow blow and nothing for fast. Many games also came with labels near the fuse holders. What fuses look like has changed. If you're not sure, always read the numbers and letters stamped on the side. Some slow blow fuses look like a fast blow. If you have trouble reading the numbers and letters on an older fuse with a magnifying glass, toss it whether it tests good or not. Fuse ends get oxidized over the years. The old fuses look cool with springs and whatever in there, but they're old and don't connect as good as they used to. Replace them.

    #4 3 years ago
    Quoted from TimMe:

    You've done a really nice write-up on fuses here. Some additional notes:
    1. On EM machines virtually all fuses will be 1/4 x 1/4. It doesn't really matter if they are glass tube or not. Glass tube fuses supposedly make it easier to tell if a fuse is good, but in reality the fuse link inside the tube can fracture or detach in a way that is not visible. The only sure way to tell if a fuse is good is with an ohm meter.

    I agree. The only way to check if a fuse and see if it still works is to pull it and use a ohm meter.

    Quoted from TimMe:

    2. Under-fusing will not work very well on an EM. The fuse will eventually blow due to the repetitive stress of the current surges in the circuit.

    Agree again. Use the specified fuse. But ... in a pinch at 3 am ... and I have blown all the specified fuses ... under-fusing could get me through a few critical tests.

    Quoted from TimMe:

    4a. I'm not aware of any special "super fast" fuses ever being used in any EM. In my experience, the term "regular fuse," "normal-blow," and "fast-blow" all refer to the same type of fuse in the EM universe. If any other pinsider has additional info on this, please pitch in.
    4b. If the schematic does not specify slow-blow, assume the fuse is a regular (fast-blow) fuse. You should never use a slow-blow fuse in a circuit unless it is specified either on the schematic or on the label next to the fuse holder. Similarly, you can't really use a fast-blow fuse when slow-blow is specified because the fuse will likely blow even though the circuit is fine, and is behaving as designed.
    - TimMe

    I will use this. If it is NOT specified, use fast blow. Thanks!

    #5 3 years ago

    One additional thought on this topic:

    In an EM, the purpose of the secondary supply rail fuses is to protect the cloth insulation of the game wiring from catching fire, and (to a lesser extent) to protect the transformer from getting fried. In other words, those fuses are not designed to protect the individual lamp or coil components, and they are far from the "weakest link" in the circuit. That's why a stuck coil in an EM game will fry itself to death before the coil supply fuse blows.

    In those circuits where a fuse is protecting a single component - such as a 120 VAC bank reset coil - then yes the fuse is indeed there to protect the coil as well as the machine. If that circuit should lock on for any reason, then the fuse will blow after just a few seconds, preventing the coil from burning up and also keeping the game from catching fire.

    - TimMe

    #6 3 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    That vast majority of pins use the same size you're using. An AGC fuse is assumed to be a fast blow (regular) fuse. A slow blow fuse is labeled MDL (method detection limit). All pins use either AGC or MDL (F or T for smaller fuses), no middle ground. I keep a small magnifying glass in my tool bag to read them. The smaller fuses used on some games use the F and T.

    Maybe I am getting too old, but a magnifying glass doesn't do it for me anymore. I use the camera on my cell phone and jack the magnification way up!

    Quoted from phishrace:

    As mentioned above, the manual should tell you which type. SB for slow blow and nothing for fast. Many games also came with labels near the fuse holders. What fuses look like has changed. If you're not sure, always read the numbers and letters stamped on the side. Some slow blow fuses look like a fast blow. If you have trouble reading the numbers and letters on an older fuse with a magnifying glass, toss it whether it tests good or not. Fuse ends get oxidized over the years. The old fuses look cool with springs and whatever in there, but they're old and don't connect as good as they used to. Replace them.

    Unfortunately, sometimes the label by the fuse goes missing. Put the advice is noted. Specified as slow blow gets slow blow, and if nothing it gets fast blow. Also good advice, if you can't read the stamp, throw it in the garbage.

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