He runs a business sure he knows how to price knowing he will get talked down and still have some to cover his business expenses.

You answer a pinball for sale ad.
The seller tells you it might not work and hasn't been turned on in years. The price is cheap.
Are you really going to see if you can get it running at the sellers place to raise the price, or load it up and check later?

Now say you want to flip the game. Post it the same way for a few bucks more, or add some valuable hours to it?

Sure you can.. I paid X, if I sell it for Y I make Z profit. If I have to start going through it and check to make sure things work, replace parts, clean things, the price goes up.

Ding ding ding, someone understands. Some people don't realize that large sellers just don't care about some machines. I'm not a fan of em, do when traded in, I know what value I gave them, so I'll gladly sell it instantly to not deal with it.

Selling a dukes of hazard lunchbox. Paint coming off and little rusty. Not sure if it has lunch still in it or not. $40.

That’s certainly possible. In the end, it’s what you’re willing to pay for it so does it really matter?

Selling a dukes of hazard lunchbox. Paint coming off and little rusty. Not sure if it has lunch still in it or not. $40.</blockquote

Please post in the market place. I’d love to see some photos.

Wish I was hungrier!

Hope all are well. I just dropped price on my friends routed Met pro to 4450 if anyone wants to come out and take a look .Its in St John IN for now at his home but if doesn’t sell this week I’ll take it home in Crown Point and put some work into it .It really is in nice shape .Just wax,rubbers,plastics and possibly LEDs is all I’m seeing .Thanks be safe !!Ad is up on pinside I’m Kkoss24 .

Yes, and he is a retailer so his price tends to be higher. On the other hand he is asking the estimated price and didn't bother to turn it on. This isn't a cheap project. He is asking going rate for a total unknown.

In my experience he wants premium prices for everything. I just pick another business to purchase from and everyone's happy.

Some of you need to own a brick & mortor business to understand what it really takes to be a retail business. I will tell you this, if Mike took it in, you can bet your ass it's a nice looking machine. He doesn't waste his time with garbage. A non working Freddy in great shape isn't worth $2500? A rough one is 1500 all day long. I don't remember reading $2500 firm either?

Dude.... stop. It doesn't work and is beat up. The seller didn't say it is great shape. You did. If it was a nice looking machine it would be able to be turned on to see if it is working and have pics up already. Wear near the flippers? I'm not sure what you call nice, but for me that isn't it.

Looking to buy an IMDN LE. Let me know if you may be selling. Hope all is well.

Dan

Look, this is a SELLERS CLUB on a forum. Business ads should be in another thread titled "Chicago Pre-Shopped *Retail* Games For Sale".

Do you know how much easier it would be to find the games being sold by retailers? A lot easier than the (what are basically free ads because theyre under 3k) spam posts in here. Always high prices. Never any deals. Never.

$2500 is not a good deal at all for a game you know NOTHING about. No matter what the game. You guys are totally bonkers.

This forum isn't just for businesses to spam us with their overpriced stuff. We dont need this to become craigslist.

Dont list a game blindly with a premium price tag. Its not much to ask.

I also just think the biz ads need to get out of this thread. This is a club. We are hanging out. Take a hike businesses.

Just found this as well. I guess Freddy collected $800 worth of dust in a year.

/rant

Sorry I didnt have better news for you. Good luck on your search, its a great game!

good perspective. GAP is like an annoying pop-up add that you can't cancel from a favorite thread.
I have asked for years that when you ignore a user, you also dont see any of their adverts in the market.
I mean the guy has almost 600 adverts and I dont think I have ever been interested in a single one of his games/prices.

The crazy thing to me is that the guy puts substantial effort into advertising games and parts on here. It is the vast majority of his posts and he contributes very little to the community in any other way.
Yet of all his documented FS posts, 92% of them dont sell on here. Seems like a super small return rate on the effort and puts a bad tastes in many collectors mouths form him spamming the site.

https://pinside.com/pinball/community/pinsiders/gap/market

I don’t look at it as spamming, nor does it leave a bad taste in my mouth. The dude is running a store and is a distributor for Stern as well as JJP and Chicago Gaming. Have you ever been to his store? He gets a lot of really nice stuff. What about all the other distributors and businesses on this site? Why not bash them? Also, a lot of these “annoying” businesses contribute funds that keep this site up and online. I suppose Pinside could survive with no business advertising and only users like you and I? Lol ??:How would you run your pinball business? No advertising and only word of mouth?

We do. If someone has something stupid for sale, people speak up. Look at automated services lately.

Pretty sure pinside would run just fine with donations from members and the cut they get from sales, but its extra money and the cost to robin is probably minimal. To most end users its some level of annoyance, but unless it was driving people away from the site (which does not seem to be the case) it most likely won't change.

Based on what data? Do you know how much it cost to run this site? I don't. I'm sure it's expensive. I guess Pinside should be just a giant garage sale with pinball deals and rare finds for everyone. Huzzah!

I sort of get your point. However, he (GAP) takes in a lot of stuff on trade and doesn't have time to give everything a once over. I'm not sure about you, but I personally have made a trade or had a throw in for a pin I had zero interest in and simply want to move it along to someone else that cares. Freddy has some appeal to certain collectors (not me btw). If it were a Shaq Attack for Barbarella I'm sure he would have just parted it out. Why not get it out there instead of it sitting in the shop for months or years? If you don't like the price, just make an offer.

First post in this thread says

It also says

so it's pretty funny when a Wisconsin resident starts chirping about the rules.

LOL, I own interests in IL also... unless this is strictly the Chicago thread? IN which case, I dont think West Dundee opinion matters.

Really? I've asked him about this $980 volcano on offer up multiple times and he will not budge to anything reasonable. Its been up for over a year.

I "own interests" in Missouri. Should I tell them how to run their thread?

I didn't start the club, so I'm not sure my opinion matters regardless. But the guy who created it and I both live in Chicagoland.

can we rename this to the 1hr radius of Chicago proper trader/seller club

i dont seem to have much interest in anything these days...

I agree...People that don't think he is reasonable have obviously never dealt with him personally. Probably making assumptions based on zero data or real world interaction. BTW negotiable does not mean he has to accept every offer.

He has a wide variety of games for sale . I have bought several games ( projects) from Mike no problem whatsoever. Postings don't bother me. If you see the avatar , just scroll by quickly and pay no attention.....

Geez I thought there might be some games for sale with all the action on this thread..... leave GAP alone! I've done more transactions with GAP than any other individual on this thread and I have no complaints... Not sure why all the fuss... not sure much has changed on here from GAP since thread started.

Obviously you have never dealt with the man and you have of course ignored the fact that you have never owned a business. Offering an "as is" machine is not spamming anything. I have gotten several good deals with Mike, both in purchases and selling him machines. So unless you can speak from actual experiences, you are just blowing a bunch of jealous hot air. He ignored you on offer-up? What did you offer $500 like every other whore mongering pinball cheap ass? I would ignore you too. But see, that was an assumption. Just like you are doing to the man's business credibility because you have no other insight than what you have perceived, but not actually been involved with. Once again, you cannot stand that a guy has made a living with pinball and it doesn't fit with your hobbyist agenda.

This site? No, company websites run off either internal serves or hosted in the cloud like say AWS? Yes, its part of what I do every day.

Cool, so I'll list my shadow at 5k, one pic of the game from far away, and say "plays great, no issues".

When I get flamed for it, I will cite "Running a family is hard work, that you dont understand". I mean, isnt that the same thing? We are all trying to save money.

Im sure you guys are sniping games from this thread that could go to otherwise regular pin collector dudes not looking to make a buck on a flip (or just a hold for a long ass time at a ridiculous price).

I offered him $650. Thats not a bad offer for a game that also, you know nothing about, because all its done is sit. No response.

Also, didnt want to bring this up, but I spoke to Mike about 5 years ago about restoring multiple games for my boss. We had money ready to roll and he decided it wouldnt make him enough money for the work. Thats when I knew I was done with retail. He still posts "restoration services" on his site. OK, what are we restoring? He recommended a crappy company that did shotty work for me on multiple games. I've discussed that here before.

I guess I need to know where the secret forum is that these guys dont know about. This used to be that place, and now its flooded with big business. Great. American. Pinball?

The BEST experiences in my pinball career have been only with non-retail outlets. I'll give a shout out to Hemisphere's because Kurt has always been very honest with me about everything. He sold us 3 NIB games and moved games for me multiple times. Great dude. Would I buy his used games? No. Too much usually. Sorry.

Is there any interest in a non-business thread for trading and selling? My vote is YES.

Chitown.

We are giving you permission to post the email thread where we recommend Kurt from Hemispheres to do the restorations for you at that time that we were too busy. We sent the entire email thread to you. We give you permission to post it! We were polite and nice and tried to help you out. Then when you said Kurt was backed up, you asked for another person in the area and we mentioned Rich Huff, a guy who does restorations in the area. I don't know Rich's work, but he was another guy in the area. As for the Volcano, you offered $650.00 and I probably declined the offer. We do appreciate offers, but we did not accept your offer, because of what we had into the game. Sometimes we can sometimes we can't.

At this time, We appreciate the Chicago pinball community, but will not be posting in the Chicago sellers forum anymore for unshopped games. Those that are looking for unshopped games send me a pm and I will put you on a list. We should be getting in 20 unshopped in the next month and I will not be able to get to all of them. There should be b and c titles in there that I do not want.

If anyone wants to check out our feedback rating and how we treat people it can be found here.

https://pinside.com/pinball/community/pinsiders/gap/feedback

We wish the Chicago Pinball Community the best and see most of your around the shows, at the shop or at our parties.

Thanks and have fun playing pinball.

GAP

Way to go, whiners.

I’m debating getting another pin. Either LOTR or TMNT but not sure which one. Anyone thinking about selling a LOTR with upgrades? You can pm me if you would like

I have both but I’m not selling either. They actually sit next to each other. Completely different playing pins but that’s a tough call. I really love them both. Tmnt is definitely a fast and super fun pin. Lotr is such a great experience and fun to play. Good luck!

What an unusual group? Mike has committed more of his time and life to pinball then most of this group combined yet for that he needs to be crapped on because someone didn’t get a smoking deal? He’s not selling out of a garage it’s a business, why is that so horrible to appreciate. From his local contributions, group events, gameplay videos, parts stocking, accessories, custom pieces, and a place to actually Try these expensive toys before you buy I am amazed by the disrespect he gets. I would bet he works more hours on this hobby in a week then most do in a month with minimal reward. Actually baffled by why he makes the effort as his and his family’s time are basically a hobby donation. Really sad to see the hate for someone like Mike that is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet in this hobby (except maybe Yancy...) Even if your not buying a thing from him. When we are all shopping blind on Amazon we will remember the ones we cast out for trying.

You just demonstrated your true colors.

I have nothing more to say other than GAP is one of the best in the business and you have been called to the floor.

I will agree 100% that Kurt is just as awesome.

I agree. I have had several dealings with Mike over the years and he has always been tops. Willing to work with you on price, mods etc... One of the good guys in the hobby. Maybe those that complain can buy their games site unseen and then deal with all the nightmares that come along with that scenario.

The fact that you think that means we haven't hung out enough. I'm a prick! Thanks though.

Not gonna jump in the debate about fair pricing etc., I have bought from Mike before and if he had the right machine at the right price again, I would buy from him again. That being said, I am not sure how anyone gets a free pass selling on here and not expected to be called to the table for no pics and never plugging it in. The amount of time it takes to plug in a machine and snap a few pics isn't much longer than it takes to post a for sale post saying you have a machine for sale, which he did (twice it looks like, with a price increase between postings).

For anyone feeling annoyed by GAP's prices, I would encourage you to visit https://www.orangecountypinballs.com/pre-owned

Let me get this straight, you offered $650 on something he was asking $980 for? His "no response" was all the answer you needed. Seems like your the one playing the "craigslist lowballer game".

One thing not understood by the typical collector who says "retail is bad, they snipe games that would otherwise go to hobbyists" is that there are many more games that would never be available to collectors if it weren't for retailers. I used to help at a local shop and know of dozens of cold calls they received to come pick up a game because they didn't want to deal with the general public--the no-show's, low-balling, time-wasting, etc. that a Facebook or Craigslist ad would draw. Did the retailer get an amazing price? Sure. Did they pass along a reasonable price to a collector? As much as I could reasonably expect them to, once all overhead associated with the trip to pick up the game was figured. I know of a few of the games that ended up being owned by Pinsiders, so to that extent, everyone was happy.

I’ve bought 2 machines from Mike in the past 12 months.
One was used, Hot Doggin’, and I paid what he was asking. I had it clear coated and it came out gorgeous. The other was a new Stern Elvira. Also a very nice game.
I actually had an issue with one of the machines and Mike actually walked me through fixing it over the phone on a Saturday night.
This is all factual.
If I was Mike I honestly wouldn’t give a shit what some of the few whiners on this thread think. They can go pound sand imo. (Although some of these whiners are good pinball people too).
You don’t like the fact that he didn’t post photos? Good for you.
You don’t like that he didn’t accept your offer? Good for you.
You don’t like him posting so many ads? Then complain to a moderator or Robin.
Until they change the rules...tough. Mike is just working by the pinside rules. It’s not his fault.

If you haven’t met Mike and hung out with him, that’s cool but he is a good egg and you should take the time to get to know him.
I’m guessing some of these reactions would be different because you would understand a little better how he’s running his business. Anyone who runs a pinball business in particular, I have a lot of respect for because I feel there are low profit margins and a lot of inventory constantly moving in and out. The main reason for running this business has got got to be for the love of the hobby. So I think everybody should cut the man some slack.

Wow, this hobby has...changed.

I wont argue with your “solid logic” any more. Have a nice day.

He can be nice as pie. People tend to be very nice when they are screwing you over. This was a 2500 dollar freddy aka pinside estimated price that he didn't even bother to plug in. Just about anyone on here will bend over backwards if you are going to pay going rate for an average game (not mint, just average) while receiving a total unknown project. So who cares how nice he is.