cheating a bingo


By baldtwit

9 months ago


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  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 months ago by jrpinball
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    search relays (resized).png


    #1 9 months ago

    a previous thread talked about magnets and the point was made that the balls are non-magnetic. The addition of a CU switch that caused the game to tilt if the coin switch was down too long was also mentioned, as well as the metal side rails (inside and/or outside).  So put on your tin foil hats and ponder these:

    1] after the first few machines, why does the shutter not close when shooting the first ball if you reset the game with a ball in the runway?

    2] in the inside corners of the cabinets are metal braces...or are they?

    3] how did the design of the search relay bank change...and why?

    4] on some early machines, the replay counter and replay register used different step-up coils.  Did they change that just to reduce the number of unique coils?

    5] and cheating from the other side....2-in-blue or 3-in-blue for a fixed 300/600 payout didn't enable very often, yet some operators disabled it.  Were they just cheapskates, or can those machines be played to a larger player advantage, and if so, how?

    there's a few things you can do to the angle of the game, pushing the head against a wall, and blowing cigarette ash into the top of the playfield ... anyone do other things?
        

    #2 9 months ago

    1] after the first few machines, why does the shutter not close when shooting the first ball if you reset the game with a ball in the runway?

    Trough switches need to be satisfied all balls are accounted for.

    2] in the inside corners of the cabinets are metal braces...or are they?

    Don't recall 100% now ... but likely. - Thinking most know those were added to stop poking a wire through a removed leg bolt hole.

    3] how did the design of the search relay bank change...and why?

    No info from me on this

    4] on some early machines, the replay counter and replay register used different step-up coils. Did they change that just to reduce the number of unique coils?

    Different coils were used all through the games to defeat a cheater altering line voltage to remotely activate certain coils - just like slot machines do ... too much or too little and the game goes on strike.

    5] and cheating from the other side....2-in-blue or 3-in-blue for a fixed 300/600 payout didn't enable very often, yet some operators disabled it. Were they just cheapskates, or can those machines be played to a larger player advantage, and if so, how?

    Op's often defeated 2IB - also the score extra step unit - also peg the reflex from full reset. Seasoned players didn't go after these big features much, when they popped up as a gift was best. Several normal hits and 4 in a row were most common cash outs. Using house money to build a big game too.

    6) there's a few things you can do to the angle of the game, pushing the head against a wall, and blowing cigarette ash into the top of the playfield ... anyone do other things?

    We'd jam a coke can between the head & the wall and list the game port-side for easy numbers advantage.

    What will you be doing with this gleaned info anyway?

    #3 9 months ago
    Quoted from baldtwit:

    1] after the first few machines, why does the shutter not close when shooting the first ball if you reset the game with a ball in the runway?

    Free ball otherwise! Gonna have to test that on pre-Palm Springs machines...

    Quoted from baldtwit:

    2] in the inside corners of the cabinets are metal braces...or are they?

    I don't recall them having metal braces. There are metal leg plates to which the legs bolt. But those are for practical reasons and not ones of cheating. Games I've seen with metal plates around the leg area are pretty transparent about it - put it on the outside!

    Quoted from Pinball_Muggle:

    3] how did the design of the search relay bank change...and why?

    I'm gonna go out on a limb here... cause I don't really know. I paged through some of the older manuals and schematics, and one thing I didn't see was a resistor on the search relays. The oldest games don't have the search relays documented in the manual, so it's a bit hard to tell. My assumption is that they needed to add the resistor when they started filling up the search disc with winning combinations. Otherwise it would too quickly lose the hit before moving to the next wiper.

    Now my curiosity is piqued.

    Quoted from Pinball_Muggle:

    4] on some early machines, the replay counter and replay register used different step-up coils. Did they change that just to reduce the number of unique coils?

    To expand on what PM said - using a different coil would have different electrical and mechanical properties. The older games had very large replay counter steppers. I am guessing it was a reliability move, but also would prevent a reduction of available current to grant additional replays. It takes more current to drive a larger coil, leaving less for the rest of the game. If something just barely bled away current, it could make it so that the unit was 'stepping', but there wasn't enough power for a full stroke. Wire under the glass? No idea.

    Quoted from Pinball_Muggle:

    5] and cheating from the other side....2-in-blue or 3-in-blue for a fixed 300/600 payout didn't enable very often, yet some operators disabled it. Were they just cheapskates, or can those machines be played to a larger player advantage, and if so, how?

    Vertical wins (espcially 4 in a row) can win in multiple colors if before 5th or after 5th lights. I think all of the blue section games with fixed payouts were also OK games, so I figure that played a part in it.

    Quoted from Pinball_Muggle:

    6) there's a few things you can do to the angle of the game, pushing the head against a wall, and blowing cigarette ash into the top of the playfield ... anyone do other things?

    I play too straight to know myself (and I've never seen a game on location), but I am also fascinated by player stories. One of my interviews talked about shoring up the front of the game, lessening the incline.

    #4 9 months ago

    for the ones that have more-or-less the answer I was looking for:

    1] it can be better than one free ball.  Partially shooting a ball up the runway and using the manual lift button can get you multiple balls in the runway...then reset the game and see how many balls you wind up getting onto the playfield without needing to play for extra balls

    2] yup - take out a leg bolt and you have a nice hole into the cabinet. Imagine how much practice it took to make use of that hole, then someone comes along and sticks a metal plate behind it.

    3] hmm ... maybe a hint. The change I'm thinking about has to do with the way the search relays are mounted.

    4] increasing the line voltage wouldn't make coils activate, but lowering it just enough that the replay register step up coil works but the replay counter step-up coil doesn't sounds profitable ... and didn't everyone carry a variac into a bar in those days? Apparently the technique was to play until the game started registering credits, then dial down the voltage until the replay register barely stepped up.

    5] from a purely statistical and financial viewpoint, the best way to play a bingo is one coin. You get at least a 4 for 1 return on your investment. At no other time is the return for a standard inline/section 3 win guaranteed to be that good.  For the sake of argument, assume that intentionally making any hole on the playfield is equally hard ... in reality some numbers like 16 are harder, but some players are also good.  

    If you are playing a game that has 300/600 payouts for the blue section, you can beat the 4 for 1 return if you can enable the blue feature in 75/150 coins. The odds of lighting the blue for 300/600 is better than that, and was so much better that bally had to adjust things....

    you got 3-in-blue for 300 when enabling the screen to move to at least the F position. 3-in-blue for 600 needed the blue score booster relay to trip and 2-in-blue for 600 needed the super blue relay to power.

    ever notice a blue adjust plug and mixer #2 relay switches showing up in the super blue and blue score booster trip relay circuits on circus queen after game serial 1499?  Of course not...who looks for that kind of stuff, but it can be interesting to see the differences when multiple schematics are available and try to figure out why the changes are there. 

    I don't know if the number of spotting disc rivets changed before/after (I think I've only seen one manual revision). It's possible the adjust plug added more spotting rivets to compensate for the addition of mixer #2 relay, or they could have moved some of the original rivets to the plug-connectable path. In any case, the addition of mixer #2 relay switches made it less likely for the blue relays to activate if the screen was already enabled or other features were lit.

    on lido and after, they moved the source of enabling the blue relays to a circuit that wasn't improved by the use of the green button, and made it so the blue relays couldn't enable unless the magic screen unit was on step 5,7,9 or 10 - those are unit steps in between D-E, E-F, F-G or when G is enabled.  On earlier machines - including bikini - the blue relays could power anytime that any feature could enable - even when the screen wasn't enabled. You could hear them power, but no visual confirmation until the screen was enabled to move to at least F.

    so in short, the best return was resetting the game, playing red button to get the green scores to 6 and then playing the green button (if it had one) to get the screen to at least F. If you happened to get the blue/super-blue relays to power along the way, even better.  

    why do green scores need to be >4 ... 'cause all the screen games disconnected the feature power until the green scores were at least 6.  

    note you can get features on the first cycle after reset if you use the red button. The scores will step to at least 6 guaranteed, and due to switch timing, features can enable after that step happens. If you reset and immediately use the green button, the scores won't step and mixer #4 relay is guaranteed to power and disconnect the feature advance circuit.

    an operator/bally field tech/bally slot designer would modify all his games so blue scored as 5-in-green.  He could not profitably operate the games with a 300/600 payout without making other mods or disabling the reflex unit to make the screen advance much harder.

    #5 9 months ago
    Quoted from baldtwit:

    an operator/bally field tech/bally slot designer would modify all his games so blue scored as 5-in-green.  He could not profitably operate the games with a 300/600 payout without making other mods or disabling the reflex unit to make the screen advance much harder.

    Makes perfect sense.

    Quoted from baldtwit:

    Of course not...who looks for that kind of stuff

    Hey...

    Quoted from baldtwit:

    3] hmm ... maybe a hint. The change I'm thinking about has to do with the way the search relays are mounted.

    Way out on a limb here: grommits added to absorb shock when someone thumps the back. Appears to have happened sometime before Bright Spot. Also a slam tilt added near the original mounting position of that bank. Tricksy!

    #6 9 months ago

    Soda cans wedged between the head and wall? Cigarette ashes blown through the top of the glass and onto the playfield? I thought these were Vic Camp inventions. Did you guys all have a network or something?

    #7 9 months ago
    Quoted from jrpinball:

    Soda cans wedged between the head and wall? Cigarette ashes blown through the top of the glass and onto the playfield? I thought these were Vic Camp inventions. Did you guys all have a network or something?

    hehe - the ash thing was probably Vic. Soda cans was just one way to make the game not sway when nudged hard - that led to pendulum tilt.  You could just push the game against the wall - some machines had rubber bumpers on the back - but some locations got annoyed if they saw the game too close to the wall. So fill in the gap with something small ... like a can.

    attached is a picture of the two search relay bank styles. Same location on the upper left of back door, same approximate size (allowing for the extra relay on the "new" bank).  Switch inspection/adjusting is easier on the new bank, but that's not the cheating issue. 

    search relays (resized).png

    #8 9 months ago

    Fishing a wire in would allow you to make contact with multiple switches... using the old style. In fact... it appears that you could thread a single wire in there and make contact with every relay?

    #9 9 months ago

    Here's something I found on Danny's site. Good stuff.
    http://danny.cdyn.com/Cheating%20101.htm

    JR if you read this article I sent into Danny's site years ago you will find where I talk about the soda can against the wall. It wasn't that easy to set the can up onto the back of the head, especially knowing that if one of the mean store owners saw you it might lead to an ass kicking.
    http://danny.cdyn.com/viccamp.htm

    #11 9 months ago
    Quoted from Vic_Camp:

    Here's something I found on Danny's site. Good stuff.
    http://danny.cdyn.com/Cheating%20101.htm
    JR if you read this article I sent into Danny's site years ago you will find where I talk about the soda can against the wall. It wasn't that easy to set the can up onto the back of the head, especially knowing that if one of the mean store owners saw you it might lead to an ass kicking.
    http://danny.cdyn.com/viccamp.htm

    Was this something you learned, or did you start doing it on your own?

    #12 9 months ago

    I started doing this on my own. A lot players didn't like the soda can trick and would loose their shirts just watching and letting the ball roll in numbered holes without a nudge. You got to remember the vendors were real greedy and didn't want anyone to beat the bingos for any replays. It was a must for me to install the soda can on between the game and the wall. Don't forget I would also level the game by putting cardboard or pieces of tile under the leg levers to get the ball rolling correctly throughout the playfield. Oh yeah, the ashes helped slow the ball down especially since the vendors were always waxing the playfields every chance they got lemon pledge which was very slippery substance.

    #13 9 months ago
    Quoted from bingopodcast:

    Fishing a wire in would allow you to make contact with multiple switches... using the old style. In fact... it appears that you could thread a single wire in there and make contact with every relay?

    remember that guy who carries a variac around in his pocket? In his other pocket, he has a big electromagnet.

    what happens when ya hold it up against the outside of the back door?

    #14 9 months ago
    Quoted from baldtwit:

    what happens when ya hold it up against the outside of the back door?

    Ha!

    #15 9 months ago
    Quoted from baldtwit:

    remember that guy who carries a variac around in his pocket? In his other pocket, he has a big electromagnet.
    what happens when ya hold it up against the outside of the back door?

    Last I heard, he was wearing cement shoes!

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