Greenbrier, TN
I have bought from and sold to Dale..no problems on either transaction..
(Topic ID: 34202)
This topic is closed.
Quoted from blondetall:I'm at least glad that they got all the Christmas sales out so that the fire didn't ruin even more holidays than it did.
Hopefully the place was close to bare from all the machines that had been shipped off, with the building being, by far, the biggest loss.
Dale can just go back to working out of the old warehouse till either a new showroom is rebuilt, or a new one is found. Unless the insurance company finds a way to get out of paying anything (and you know they'll try their best to keep every cent), this disaster will surely just be a speed-bump more than anything.
It's plain and simple, you know that Dale is a retailer. I know back in the day Dale probably ticked off a TON of people but he has gone above and beyond to help make things right in the past few years.
Yes, he is out to make a profit.
Yes, he has a lot of expenses.
What does that have to do with "arson" and "karma" I have no idea. It's just really ridiculous to bring that up here and it makes Pinside (which already did not look so good to outsiders) even worse as a "welcoming" site because of the attitudes towards people on here posting prices.
PRICES. Seriously.
Some people on here get all up in arms about Dale's pricing but then flip out if someone else is offering supposedly lower money and then flip out again on someone selling something higher but have no plans on purchasing said machines anyway.
There is no way anyone should wish this upon anyone. Basically human sympathy. Wishing harm on someone, well, we do like to refer to those people as possible Sociopaths but that's a whole other discussion.
I have purchased from Dale, and sold to Dale. No issues. I know dealing with a retailer is just that, dealing with a retailer. If you don't like the price, don't purchase it, simple as that.
I sell games and give things away at times at super cheap prices. Sometimes I want more for my own stuff, but everyone who buys/sells will always have those 1-2 things that everyone else will remember as being "overpriced" and a stigma comes up.
I purchase a lot of video game and pinball machines and am very easy to work with and would never buy from people on this forum that wish illwill or talk trash about other people's pricing. Why there isn't a rule for that here I will never know but there is no way anyone should rip on Dale at this point.
We know not everyone thinks of him fondly, but the guy gives away a lot of stuff and donates his time and has a ton of kids he takes in (foster kids), there is a whole picture to this so all in all it is just in poor taste to wish this upon or think he "deserves" it in some way.
This was just posted on KLOV as well by Phoenix Arcade:
"Pretty sad that some of the pin guys posting negative crap have shady backgrounds. Including one who was in trouble with the law for messing with a clients funds. Talk about trying to kick a man when he is down for nothing more than complaining he charges retail prices as a retailer. Imagine that. Bottom line is you cant please everyone so its not worth the time and energy doing so."
Like I said, if anyone has an issue with Dale PERSONALLY over some deal years ago, I am pretty that could have or can be solved still, but this is just proof in the pudding unfortunately.
A retailer is a retailer. If you don't like his prices, don't pay them. Go to China and buy all that stuff Target sells as well, just buy everything wholesale. Not sure what people are trying to do here but it's pretty black and white to me.
Even with any past shenanigans, the fire wasn't deserved.
That's a heavy, heavy thing...and a sad state of affairs for all involved.
The good thing is that no one was hurt in any way, he was insured, and the old warehouse down the road is still standing.
Yeah, anyone who applauds that this man lost a huge chunk of his business (on Christmas, while handing out toys to the needy) is a f-n dope, pure and simple.
I'm sure if Dale was killed in the fire, some of you would actually applaud that too.
Sick.
I'm still yet to see someone say he deserved this. Okay, the Karma is a bitch statement, may be close, but not saying he's glad his building burned down.
I think many fires are fishy, especially in a tough economy. I've known people that have torched vehicles to get out of a loan. He has overpriced pins (12k TAF, 6K RCT ect.) and from his feedback has never sold one pin on Ebay, so it looks like business is pretty bad.
Quoted from Toasterdog:I'm still yet to see someone say he deserved this. Okay, the Karma is a bitch statement, may be close, but not saying he's glad his building burned down.
I think many fires are fishy, especially in a tough economy. I've known people that have torched vehicles to get out of a loan. He has overpriced pins (12k TAF, 6K RCT ect.) and from his feedback has never sold one pin on Ebay, so it looks like business is pretty bad.
Alright guys, finally the truth is out! This guy solved it! Case closed! He *knows people* that have torched vehicles! That's a wrap! Oh, and the profits of brick and mortar businesses are completely transparent from recent ebay feedback! Brilliant!
Quoted from pinlawyer:Karma's a bitch.
Stay classy Phoenix.
Quoted from Toasterdog:I'm still yet to see someone say he deserved this. Okay, the Karma is a bitch statement, may be close, but not saying he's glad his building burned down.
I think many fires are fishy, especially in a tough economy. I've known people that have torched vehicles to get out of a loan. He has overpriced pins (12k TAF, 6K RCT ect.) and from his feedback has never sold one pin on Ebay, so it looks like business is pretty bad.
OK I have to chim in. This has been our best year yet over 700k in sales and the last 2 months have broke records. Business is good. As for a Addams for 12k that is where it needs to be. Avg cost on a unshopped TAF is 6k now add new display,new MPU,new artwork,new ramps and plastics, LED's leg hardware and labor and tehm the cost of the game. We used to buy these for 1500.00 to 2500.00 and now we are at ove 4k just for the game plus shipping. We have to make a profit and cannot compete with the guys that sell out of their garage. 1 post said all these people we screwed line them up and I will fix it. I hate seeing any pinball sell I want to keep them all. I am very lucky to be able to make a living dooing this it is a labor of love. My karma is good and I do everthing I can to make that good karma.
Quoted from rlevin:OK I have to chim in.
I am sorry for your loss.
I can't imagine what you are going through or what it will take to get rolling again.
I hope you can get going again.
LTG : )
Quoted from pinlawyer:Karma's a bitch.
I'm not really sure what this statement is implying but I would love to find out.
Quoted from rlevin:OK I have to chim in. This has been our best year yet over 700k in sales and the last 2 months have broke records. Business is good. As for a Addams for 12k that is where it needs to be. Avg cost on a unshopped TAF is 6k now add new display,new MPU,new artwork,new ramps and plastics, LED's leg hardware and labor and tehm the cost of the game. We used to buy these for 1500.00 to 2500.00 and now we are at ove 4k just for the game plus shipping. We have to make a profit and cannot compete with the guys that sell out of their garage. 1 post said all these people we screwed line them up and I will fix it. I hate seeing any pinball sell I want to keep them all. I am very lucky to be able to make a living dooing this it is a labor of love. My karma is good and I do everthing I can to make that good karma.
I'm really sorry for your business loss, but please don't sell any Addams Family Pinballs for 12k. That is all.
Regina, SK
Quoted from rlevin:As for a Addams for 12k that is where it needs to be. Avg cost on a unshopped TAF is 6k now
Wow, are you buying? With a value system like that, you should post all your "avg" perceived values here on pinside, I bet you get a thousand people lining up to sell you more than you could ever dream of.
Quoted from exflexer:I'm not really sure what this statement is implying but I would love to find out.
Go to Google Groups and type in Chattanooga Pinball in the search bar.
Quoted from Firebaall:No pity for those that gouge at the 3x rate.
So sayth the T
You can't gouge on a luxury item. What's it going to take to get you guys to understand that.
Quoted from RustyLizard:You can't gouge on a luxury item. What's it going to take to get you guys to understand that.
Actually, you can price gouge on almost anything. Pinballs are a luxury item, but there is a limited supply, especially in certain areas. Taking advantage of the fact that you are the only retailer in a certain area and jacking your prices up is in fact gouging. Since it is a luxury item, it cannot be considered a crime but it doesn't make it any less price gouging.
The continued back-biting on PRICING on this forum to a retailer that just suffered a catastrophic loss is ridiculous. Many of you have the emotional maturity of a pouty six-year-old.
Those of you who speak ill regarding this situation could learn alot from this quote:
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt." Abraham Lincoln
I'm sorry to hear about your loss, Dale. Especially during the Holidays. Best of luck.
I don't know what to value things these days, but I'll tell you my experience and why I wasn't able to buy from your store. I went in on my birthday at the old location to see if by chance you had a Jurassic Park. There wasn't one there, and I was told DE games are crap and I didn't want one. Two weeks later I was still looking online and for info, and called the store just to see if you had one in stock by chance, since all your CL ads state you have thousands in a warehouse. Literally got "Do you have any Jurassic Park machines" out of my mouth when I was immediately told that it was a difficult machine to keep running and that I didn't want one. Another week passed and I found one on eBay that looked nice. We went that Saturday to your shop one last time because we really really wanted to buy local (to help local businesses and to be able to see the machine in person first since it was our first pinball) and was told that it would be $3500 to even start trying to find me a JP and that they couldn't guarantee it would work right. So I paid $2400 plus shipping to get mine sent in from Cali. The seller worked with me, sent me a part that got messed up in transit, and I was happy.
My mom got the pinball virus and wanted one of her own. She really wanted an Addams, and I knew you had two on your floor. She also was interested in the HUO Flintstones you had. We got there and the Flintstones didn't work properly but was being fixed, but you had one in fresh from a dentist office that she liked. But she really wanted the Addams. You had two, one with super bright LEDs and one that hadn't been changed over yet. Both were $9K, and had been that price since May. (This was late early July-ish.) The sales guy remembered me and told me that you had a JP in, but by then I already had mine. I told him we were looking for my mom, and that I was also there to re-look at the Medieval Madness that I had helped you sell by giving your info to a fellow Pinsider. Because I'd help make your store a big sale, they offered me/mom no tax and free delivery if she bought that day. We were told that they couldn't go lower than $8000 on the non-LED Addams, and no less than $8500 on the LED one because "it has $700 of LEDs in it." She couldn't pay that, so she went back to the Flintstones, and would have handed over $3000 cash right then but they wouldn't take less than $3500. Which is fine, because then we left for lunch to let her think about it, and she decided to see if I could find her an Addams from the guy I got my JP from. She really struggled with it because she also really wanted to buy local so she could see the machine ahead of time and have a warranty.
One email later, and one credit card transaction later, and for $5800 plus $275 shipping she got a minty mint HUO completely shopped Addams with LEDs, mods, original mint cabinet (no decals,) new legs, and a warranty. When she got it, it had been shipped cross country from Cali, and a few things needed adjusting. The seller sent a replacement part, offered to pay to have someone local fix it (which we didn't need because me/husband figured it out and did it,) and all the phone support she needed.
That Addams was still on your floor 2 weeks ago when we were in there, and it was marked up to $11,995. Everything was marked up for the holidays. I regularly check your eBay listings since I have yet to see most pinball machines in person (you know how pinball-lacking this area is) and occasionally stop by to see what's new and chat. I would love to be able to buy from you and local, but there's no way I can justify 2 or 3 times the going rate when I can get them shipped in much cheaper. I have gone from 0 pinballs to 4 within our 2 household family since June, and despite my best efforts have yet to have been able to buy anything from you because of prices. I know you have to make money and have overhead and costs, and I am extremely sorry for your current loss and hope you get up and running as soon as you can. I loved stopping by to check out the pins and say hi to the guys there, and have pointed a few people in your direction because I knew what your inventory was... and helped make at least one big sale for you. So I'm rooting for you, I really really am, but I just can't justify the costs to shop from you personally.
Quoted from rlevin:As for a Addams for 12k that is where it needs to be. .
You need a little education on supply and demand. You had two Addams in your shop for 9k since at least May and then decide that they should be at 12k. What is the reason for the extra 3k? Yes, Addams is an incredibly popular pin, but what makes you think that if they didn't sell at 9k they should then be priced at 12k?
From the experience of when we were in your store, your staff determines how much a pin should sell for by going onto to eBay to see what some are listed at, speaks badly about any pinball we ask about (that you don't have) and then spends an hour trying to push us into a pinball we stated multiple times that we did not want simply because you have it there.
I know you came on here to defend your store, but your prices and your staff is why my wife and I and my in-laws have bought four pinballs since June and not a single one from you. I am sorry for your loss in the fire, but that doesn't change the fact that you run a poor business.
Quoted from rlevin:OK what do you value a unshopped TAF and a shopped one
As someone who is seriously considering buying one in 2013, I'd go up to $4500 for one with no major issues. For one that needs significant work, I'd go $2000 - 2500, but there are a lot of variables there.
I'm not too concerned about shopped vs. unshopped since I'm capable of doing that stuff myself. I realize my price range may not be realistic, but I'm much more patient than when I first started buying pins earlier this year. I also realize there's something to be said for being able to walk into a store and buy a pin as opposed to spending months stalking Craigslist and Mr. Pinball, networking through friends/family, etc., but $12k is insane.
Quoted from floyd1977:As someone who is seriously considering buying one in 2013, I'd go up to $4500 for one with no major issues. For one that needs significant work, I'd go $2000 - 2500, but there are a lot of variables there.
I'm not too concerned about shopped vs. unshopped since I'm capable of doing that stuff myself. I realize my price range may not be realistic, but I'm much more patient than when I first started buying pins earlier this year. I also realize there's something to be said for being able to walk into a store and buy a pin as opposed to spending months stalking Craigslist and Mr. Pinball, networking through friends/family, etc., but $12k is insane.
I would rather not sell any of my pins and keep them all, sorry you did not like our store but come by the warehouse I have 210 pins there and we can pin chat. No hard feelings and I know a lot about pins and know what they sell for but I do not know everything and I am always open to suggestions
Quoted from rlevin:I would rather not sell any of my pins and keep them all, sorry you did not like our store but come by the warehouse I have 210 pins there and we can pin chat. No hard feelings and I know a lot about pins and know what they sell for but I do not know everything and I am always open to suggestions
I've never been to your store. I was just giving my opinion to your open question about what a TAF is worth, so no hard feelings at all.
Quoted from Wahchintonka:You need a little education on supply and demand. You had two Addams in your shop for 9k since at least May and then decide that they should be at 12k. What is the reason for the extra 3k? Yes, Addams is an incredibly popular pin, but what makes you think that if they didn't sell at 9k they should then be priced at 12k?
From the experience of when we were in your store, your staff determines how much a pin should sell for by going onto to eBay to see what some are listed at, speaks badly about any pinball we ask about (that you don't have) and then spends an hour trying to push us into a pinball we stated multiple times that we did not want simply because you have it there.
I know you came on here to defend your store, but your prices and your staff is why my wife and I and my in-laws have bought four pinballs since June and not a single one from you. I am sorry for your loss in the fire, but that doesn't change the fact that you run a poor business.
I would rather not sell any of my pins and keep them all, sorry you did not like our store but come by the warehouse I have 210 pins there and we can pin chat. No hard feelings and I know a lot about pins and know what they sell for but I do not know everything and I am always open to suggestions
Quoted from rlevin:I would rather not sell any of my pins and keep them all, sorry you did not like our store but come by the warehouse I have 210 pins there and we can pin chat. No hard feelings and I know a lot about pins and know what they sell for but I do not know everything and I am always open to suggestions
Quoted from rlevin:I would rather not sell any of my pins and keep them all, sorry you did not like our store but come by the warehouse I have 210 pins there and we can pin chat. No hard feelings and I know a lot about pins and know what they sell for but I do not know everything and I am always open to suggestions
Bottled replies? Not the greatest move.
Quoted from robotron911:"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt." Abraham Lincoln
Great quote. I'm sorry to learn of your fire and losses. I hope everything turns out well.
As for all the posts piling on this man's misery, please re-read the quote. Enough. While I don't like pin flipping ridiculous prices, stop buying and it solves the problem. A fool and his/her money are soon parted. If people will pay stupid prices why is he being vilified for charging it? Rhetorical I read the thread about the price gouging.
BTW...main point is this isn't a for sale thread. It's sharing bad news about a fire and assets lost. Slam him on another thread when he posts something for sale or you walk in his store in the future. Poor taste my friends. Wish this man best on his recovery from this and move on.
Quoted from the_pin_family:Bottled replies? Not the greatest move.
Ya... What's up with the bottled replies man. You got something else more important going on right now ? You should be paying pinside the attention and respect it deserves and the people responding to this thread that have no intention of buying from you and never will.
Most won't pay high prices, but there are some that will. I made a "high price" comment to a local retailer and they said "we don't sell to people like yourself". They were referring to the wealthy and not the hobbyist. These people with money pick up the phone, order a medieval madness for $15k and don't care, because they do not have the time to spend looking like we all do. They also want repair service warranty that hobbyist don't offer. People like Dale cater to people like this, so his price market differs from ours.
I just don't understand how this topic goes from his business burning to his business sucks to he's uneducated on his pricing?
(Actually I think it is less likely a bottled reply and more likely that he realized that he quoted the wrong person in his first reply and re-did.)
Wow, 210 pins hidden in a warehouse in town. I knew you had a lot per your CL ads, but didn't know your pin inventory was that high. I hope the insurance comes through for you properly and you are able to reopen pretty soon. I'd still love to have a local place to even see more pins, jukes, and arcade games. I know you are far too busy right now, but maybe if you got the right location you could open up a side-room arcade so that those that can't afford to buy could at least see them and help quarter by quarter with the overhead costs. Put the games out with a "50 cents per game, or take it home for $____ sign" and see how it works. If you ever want to consider it and need any marketing help, I've got a marketing degree and years of business experience, and am willing to work for pinball machines. 
Watched the video, truly sad. I don't know whether to feel sorry for the guy, or cry over 210 pins destroyed in a fire. Something to be said for all your eggs in one basket. It can happen to anyone, but at the same time, electrical issue sounds like something that could have been fixed and prevented this from happening.
Toyotaboy... not 210 lost. The 210 are in a warehouse down the road. The building that burnt was their sales showroom. From what I can remember that was there plus the video I'm going to say maybe 10-15 pins were at the fire, plus a lot of arcade games and jukes. But not 210. Those are safe down the road waiting for a new building so they can reopen with inventory ready to go.
Quoted from toyotaboy:Watched the video, truly sad. I don't know whether to feel sorry for the guy, or cry over 210 pins destroyed in a fire.
The 210 pins (and many, many videogames) are in his old location; the big warehouse where he did all of his business before getting the new showroom that burned down. The warehouse isn't next to the showroom, and is a-ok. (Well, except for being asbestos-ridden. 
)
Quoted from blondetall:(Actually I think it is less likely a bottled reply and more likely that he realized that he quoted the wrong person in his first reply and re-did.)
Wow, 210 pins hidden in a warehouse in town. I knew you had a lot per your CL ads, but didn't know your pin inventory was that high. I hope the insurance comes through for you properly and you are able to reopen pretty soon. I'd still love to have a local place to even see more pins, jukes, and arcade games. I know you are far too busy right now, but maybe if you got the right location you could open up a side-room arcade so that those that can't afford to buy could at least see them and help quarter by quarter with the overhead costs. Put the games out with a "50 cents per game, or take it home for $____ sign" and see how it works. If you ever want to consider it and need any marketing help, I've got a marketing degree and years of business experience, and am willing to work for pinball machines.
One of the local retailers in my area does something similar. They have there retail floor setup as an arcade that you can rent out for parties. Everything's on free play and can be bought. I believe it's $300 an hour for any number of people. Hugh 10 ft projection, arcades, pins, all kinds of cool stuff. Ajax is the name. He does well as far as I can tell.
Quoted from HELLODEADCITY:Reminds me when Reggie Jackson's muscle car collection went up in flames back in the late 80s -early 90s -if I remember right think he lost 50 cars mostly Chevies
And word on the street has long since been suspected as insurance fraud on that deal. But I never did hear anything more from it in the last 10 years. But I do recall there was a lot of suspiscous things that investigators found.
Quoted from blondetall:(Actually I think it is less likely a bottled reply and more likely that he realized that he quoted the wrong person in his first reply and re-did.)
Wow, 210 pins hidden in a warehouse in town. I knew you had a lot per your CL ads, but didn't know your pin inventory was that high. I hope the insurance comes through for you properly and you are able to reopen pretty soon. I'd still love to have a local place to even see more pins, jukes, and arcade games. I know you are far too busy right now, but maybe if you got the right location you could open up a side-room arcade so that those that can't afford to buy could at least see them and help quarter by quarter with the overhead costs. Put the games out with a "50 cents per game, or take it home for $____ sign" and see how it works. If you ever want to consider it and need any marketing help, I've got a marketing degree and years of business experience, and am willing to work for pinball machines.
Please come on in and I wll give you the nickel tour of the warehouse and we can talk pins.All our pins are on free play and people call all the time just looking for a place to play. We welcome them to come in a play. Some days you think we had a fire because the parking lot is full of firetruck and police cars but they are on our pin line playing. We also have parents bring their kids in who have never played and they play for hrs. Our show room is just not a place to sell pins but the only place to play them in Chattanooga. We give people the chance play titles that they would never be able to play out in the wild. Pins are a work of art and I want to keep them all but cannot. Yes my pin prices are high but they are getting costly to buy and restore and we fully restore them and warr, them no matter where they go. If you take the time to read our eBay feed back you will see we are not the Devil.
Quoted from pinlawyer:I've never heard of a happy customer of theirs. Only lots of unhappy ones. Hence the karma comment.
Here are a few happy ones
ebay.com link: ws
ebay.com link: ws
I have to be honest guys I bought a pin from Dale and it was in great Shape. Didn't have any issues.
Quoted from rlevin:Avg cost on a unshopped TAF is 6k now
Mine suddenly just became for sale... very good condition, no issues, 100%, color DMD. If you need to restock, I can sell TAF, TZ and TSPP at half of what you charge retail. I believe that would be $16,000 for all three. It may be worth a small road trip.
Quoted from rlevin:OK what do you value a unshopped TAF and a shopped one
sold one last summer for $4200 in an amazing shape and paid $3700 for it 3 months before (from a seller).
sorry but i don't care what condition or how many parts was in the one you are selling but no TAF is worth 12k... thats 3x the price and kind of ripping people off!
and why do you up your prices when it's x-mas time? shouldn't it be the other way around?
oh and e-pay is not the best example, we all know every pins are 2-3k too high.
with that being said, sorry for your lost, sad thing for sure.
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