Change that Art!

Quoted from swampfire:
Remember that this was 1979, before we turned into a nation of fitness freaks. I think the rolls are accurate, given her pose. My only problem is with the choice of model, who looks nothing like the real Mata Hari. But the backglass art is so damned good, it’s hard to get too upset about it.
[quoted image]

Quoted from ReadyPO:
Interesting enough - that photo has been modified by colorization - the original was in black and white. This is also controversial in some quarters. I had seen the original but not the colorized version - I like it. Found another one

I happen to love the artwork and the slightly rubenesque Mata Hari portrayed - but both my wife and I love the game play, especially the a b loop - appropriate for a "double spy" I think.
[quoted image]

the "Colorized photo looks almost photo realistic,
but in truth it isn't.

pasted_image (resized).png

As good as the colorized version looks, it's not real. We don't know what the real colors are, and the background is almost entirely removed.
This is just as bad as changing the existing art on a game.

#152 2 years ago

PUN

punkin

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Woolgoolga

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How can it be 'bad'?
It's in addition to the original art, not in substitution of it. So if you like to look at the original, do so, if you like to look at both do so.

Nothing 'bad' about it. It's new art made from old art in a non destructive fashion.

#153 2 years ago

POP

Nevus

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#154 2 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

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Ann Arbor, MI

12y 162K 48,060 19 30 1

Now THAT guy was an artist.

-1

#155 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

Quoted from punkin:
How can it be 'bad'?
It's in addition to the original art, not in substitution of it. So if you like to look at the original, do so, if you like to look at both do so.
Nothing 'bad' about it. It's new art made from old art in a non destructive fashion.

Read it again, I'm talking about replacement art.

-1

#156 2 years ago

PUN

punkin

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Woolgoolga

4y 109K 11,047 7

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
Read it again, I'm talking about replacement art.

No, my comprehension is fine. It's not a replacement, it's in addition as the original art still exists, you posted it yourself. So it's new art in addition to the old art.

How can you complain about more art being in the world?

Bear in mind i am not an artist, but i certainly seem to buy and commission a lot of original art. My house has no prints and is entirely covered on the front and sides with original murals, and in my warehouse are large murals as well.

#157 2 years ago

ZUM

Mr_Tantrum

Fort Worth, TX

8y 140K 12,536 3 6 75

Quoted from Garrett:
I have a candidate. Seriously.
[quoted image]

First of all you need to light it correctly. Here is one from a customer's game with a repro backglass where I did all of the art recreation (I also did the plastics). Looks perfect "as is" IMO.

pasted_image (resized).png

#158 2 years ago

PUN

punkin

Pinside+ Frequent

Woolgoolga

4y 109K 11,047 7

I really like that style of art, i think it looks great, but i would take a few of those spots out where they do nothing for the art.

See below, i reckon i could still take one or two of the spots out. this is all or few comparison. You'll see what i mean, shouldn't be 74 suns in the sky.

sr1 (resized).jpg

sr2 (resized).jpg

#159 2 years ago

GHL

Garrett

Pinside+ Frequent

Pinckney, MI

11y 92,300 3,259 3 45

Quoted from Mr_Tantrum:
First of all you need to light it correctly. Here is one from a customer's game with a repro backglass where I did all of the art recreation (I also did the plastics). Looks perfect "as is" IMO.
[quoted image]

Perfectly green.

Lots of plain green. And instead of adding more artwork they added…some more green. And topped it off with, yup…green.

I think Spanish Eyes is better than this.

My opinion.

#160 2 years ago

MAM

drypaint

Quoted from Garrett:
Perfectly green.
Lots of plain green. And instead of adding more artwork they added…some more green. And topped it off with, yup…green.
I think Spanish Eyes is better than this.
My opinion.

This is interesting from 1972, the year Olympic Hockey came out...

unnamed (resized).jpg

Green was HOT! Lol

Post last edited 2 years ago: “Less wordy”

#161 2 years ago

ZUM

Mr_Tantrum

Fort Worth, TX

8y 140K 12,536 3 6 75

Fixed it for you.

711ccb0e32d40280cf2f98c4b7c7b35bc0b1946d (resized).png

#162 2 years ago

GHL

Garrett

Pinside+ Frequent

Pinckney, MI

11y 92,300 3,259 3 45

Original;
Orginal Olympic Colors (resized).jpg

Added Color;
Olympic with added Colors (resized).jpg

#163 2 years ago

YBX

yancy

Pinside member

West Dundee, IL

11y 122K 7,204 25

Looks good! Added color brings a little balance to the overall composition. White bubbles in the middle look unfinished in comparison to yours. Definitely lives up to the OP's request:

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
Remember, you have to suggest what you think would have been a better solution,

Now if anyone has a problem with the actual linework/drawing on Olympic Hockey, you're out of your mind. That backglass belongs in a modern art museum.

#164 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from Garrett:
Added Color;

That's fun. Thanks for sharing the idea! I think it a good choice to reuse the existing palette. My own preferences for color (not for this one) usually fall around this idea: in the ranges of red-yellow-green-blue. Pick three at most. Also worth noting, there are "cool" shades of warm colors, and "warm" shades of cool colors. (some cool colors are green-blue-purple, while warm colors contain red, yellow and orange). Some work better with others, depending on your intention and goal.

yancy - yep, a very specific style in which the artist drew these, very intentional.

#165 2 years ago

JMS

swampfire

Pinside+ Addict

Lots of chatter about the middle of Rush’s playfield. I don’t think it’s that bad - it matches their early appearances pretty well. What would You have done differently, assuming you have creative control but needed the band’s blessing for their likenesses?

BDA1CE34-0DD2-45BE-8517-5441693432CC (resized).jpeg

#166 2 years ago

BJD

roffels

Pinside member

Minneapolis, MN

10y 85,300 1,993 3 20

Quoted from swampfire:
Lots of chatter about the middle of Rush’s playfield. I don’t think it’s that bad - it matches their early appearances pretty well. What would You have done differently, assuming you have creative control but needed the band’s blessing for their likenesses?
[quoted image]

Omit the band member's likenesses entirely.

Disclaimer: I know nothing of Rush, but I don't think band member's likenesses need to be included on most music pins.

#167 2 years ago

RAT

Medisinyl

Medisinyl Mods

Gainesville, FL

9y 142K 3,160 16 34

Quoted from swampfire:
Lots of chatter about the middle of Rush’s playfield. I don’t think it’s that bad - it matches their early appearances pretty well. What would You have done differently, assuming you have creative control but needed the band’s blessing for their likenesses?
[quoted image]

You mean those aren't the guys from Spinal Tap? Just missing the glasses and soul patch

Otherwise, the eyes on the guy in the center look alien compared to the guy on the left (sorry, I don't know Rush well enough for the names).

--------------------

I do wish playfield art had more depth and better conformed to the layout. A lost art on most pins. Swords of Fury is a good example of a pin that has depth and blends the art with shots, such as the staircase that becomes the ramp, and bridge mimicking the habitrail above.

As it stands, a lot of playfield art looks like a poster randomly slapped on a playfield.

The art itself is usually great, but lacks consideration of the layout, inserts, etc.

Something like Elvira's HOH makes good use of the inserts with the art.
ap00090103150-206ff569ebb4e283896ae5385f56b661c4ef9b6b (resized).jpgbc2b3848ffdba22481b821d5b55bb0d091dfe7e7 (resized).jpg

#168 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from swampfire:
Lots of chatter about the middle of Rush’s playfield. I don’t think it’s that bad - it matches their early appearances pretty well. What would You have done differently, assuming you have creative control but needed the band’s blessing for their likenesses?
[quoted image]

I think the issue for me is their softness - there's no detail, like an airbrush drawing at a fair. It's worse on the two on the right. Sorry, don't know Rush's lineup that well. Anyway, there's no clear linework. Maybe I just cannot see it in the pic. I included a random image off the web showing stronger line work in the face and hair.

Something I was thinking about, when we criticize artwork on a pin, it's not always a reflection on the artist, it can be the art director, the company, the constraints like time, money, parameters they have work within, etc..
pop-art-poster-advertising-a-cleaning-vector-13381591 (resized).jpg

#169 2 years ago

LKD

Luckydogg420

Pinside member

Kitchener, ON

11y 115K 5,861 14

Here’s one for me. I like D&D, it has a fun layout and I’d love to have another one some day. I like the back glass, and don’t mind the playfield. I just always thought that the playfield could have been done better.
A3021105-BBED-4962-A5F9-C58F9995BE47 (resized).png26A7DD27-2C04-49E6-B6A6-AAB9865BBCF0 (resized).jpeg

#170 2 years ago

JMS

swampfire

Pinside+ Addict

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
there's no detail, like an airbrush drawing at a fair.

That’s actually a pretty good summary. It’s not “bad” - certainly I don’t notice it while I’m playing. But would I put that on a t-shirt and wear it proudly? - nah. Fortunately all 3 backglasses are great (LE might be best ever), so it doesn’t detract from the game’s appearance too much.

#171 2 years ago

JMS

swampfire

Pinside+ Addict

Maybe Rush was an inspiration for Spinal Tap. The playfield does have good likenesses to 70’s Rush, though Geddy’s caricature looks more like he does now.

475F6814-E8A9-4DB3-B77E-DCE67E1908AB (resized).jpegF3BD90F4-5A91-4672-A196-6C01DE48EA94 (resized).jpeg

#172 2 years ago

YBX

yancy

Pinside member

West Dundee, IL

11y 122K 7,204 25

Quoted from swampfire:
What would You have done differently, assuming you have creative control but needed the band’s blessing for their likenesses?

Hire an artist with better line drawing / portraiture skills. Those faces look like airbrush caricatures you buy at the carnival.

edit: didn't see this before I replied, but yeah, exactly:

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
there's no detail, like an airbrush drawing at a fair. [...] there's no clear linework.

#173 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from Luckydogg420:
Here’s one for me. I like D&D, it has a fun layout and I’d love to have another one some day. I like the back glass, and don’t mind the playfield. I just always thought that the playfield could have been done better.

What sort of difference were you thinking? What would have made it more cool in your opinion? I'm curious. The colors are pretty. That well-muscled wizard made me laugh.

#174 2 years ago

YBX

yancy

Pinside member

West Dundee, IL

11y 122K 7,204 25

Quoted from Luckydogg420:
I just always thought that the playfield could have been done better.

Oh man, I love the D&D playfield. Strong line work, interesting composition, good contrast, bold colors, represents the theme well, and pulls off my favorite trick: incorporates inserts into the artwork. One giant fight scene from top to bottom.

I guess if it had anything approaching modes, you'd need the playfield real estate for something other than a giant dragon fire bonus meltdown, but given the code, I love the art. Imagine if GOT was done in this style.

#175 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
Careful, keep making references like that and he'll search out other back glasses to berate:
(...and, yeah, Gottlieb's Circus is one of those games that the back glass art doesn't match the playfield art, but I wouldn't change them. They both look fine.)

I really don't like clowns, so circus themes aren't my cup of tea. Having said that, I like these. They are well rendered. Gottlieb had some really amazing backglasses in this era. I don't think I understand your comment about the playfield though - they DID carry the artwork into it, married it to the backglass. Beautiful stuff.

#176 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
I really don't like clowns, so circus themes aren't my cup of tea. Having said that, I like these. They are well rendered. Gottlieb had some really amazing backglasses in this era. I don't think I understand your comment about the playfield though - they DID carry the artwork into it, married it to the backglass. Beautiful stuff.

You seriously think this artwork is done by the same artist and that it looks just like the art on the back glass?!?
pasted_image (resized).png
pasted_image (resized).png
pasted_image (resized).png
It's like Future Spa or Grand Lizard. The only difference is that the playfield and back glass both have GOOD artwork.

#177 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

... and my only question regarding the playfield is, has anyone ever seen a giraffe at a circus?

#178 2 years ago

MSL

SantaEatsCheese

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Crofton, MD

5y 209K 9,649 6 85 1

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
... and my only question regarding the playfield is, has anyone ever seen a giraffe at a circus?

Yes.

I'm 35. Saw a live one at the only circus I attended as a kid. My dad walked us right by the PETA chicks in cages to get in.

-1

#179 2 years ago

MSL

SantaEatsCheese

Pinside+ Pro!

Crofton, MD

5y 209K 9,649 6 85 1

I would like to nominate Last Action Hero as being... awesomely ugly in the art department.

LAH (resized).jpg

LAH2 (resized).png

#180 2 years ago

JMS

swampfire

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:
Saw a live one at the only circus I attended as a kid. My dad walked us right by the PETA chicks in cages to get in.

That’s hot.

#181 2 years ago

JMS

swampfire

Pinside+ Addict

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
You seriously think this artwork is done by the same artist and that it looks just like the art on the back glass?!?

Sure looks that way to me!

#182 2 years ago

LKD

Luckydogg420

Pinside member

Kitchener, ON

11y 115K 5,861 14

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
What sort of difference were you thinking? What would have made it more cool in your opinion? I'm curious. The colors are pretty. That well-muscled wizard made me laugh.

Quoted from yancy:
Oh man, I love the D&D playfield. Strong line work.

Don’t get me wrong. I love the game and like the playfield, but always thought it had too much black and blue. I like the art but thought some of the line work was a bit heavy. Some of the smaller details kinda look muddied to me like either side of the dragon head. In some areas like the black lines around the inserts in the flame, and the large black area in the foreground between the slings. Then the whole plastic set is blue stone, although it’s a different blue stone then what’s on the playfield beside it. I like the concept and design, but wonder what another artist would do with this scene.

-1

#183 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
You seriously think this artwork is done by the same artist and that it looks just like the art on the back glass?!?

Did I say that? Reading comprehension issues? Go back and read it again. Here's a hint. Nowhere did I say the same artist. Nor did I say it looks "just like" the backglass art. Go ahead, and then I'll take your apology. But you won't give one, will you?

Quoted from girloveswaffles:
The only difference is that the playfield and back glass both have GOOD artwork.

Yes, and I agree with you.

#184 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from Luckydogg420:
Don’t get me wrong. I love the game and like the playfield, but always thought it had too much black and blue. I like the art but thought some of the line work was a bit heavy. Some of the smaller details kinda look muddied to me like either side of the dragon head. In some areas like the black lines around the inserts in the flame, and the large black area in the foreground between the slings. Then the whole plastic set is blue stone, although it’s a different blue stone then what’s on the playfield beside it. I like the concept and design, but wonder what another artist would do with this scene.

Thank you for sharing! I want to spend some time looking at it now, I see what you mean about the plastic set.

#185 2 years ago

MtnFrost

Inactive member

Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:
I would like to nominate Last Action Hero as being... awesomely ugly in the art department.

That backglass is just lazy photoshop. Reminds me of one of my favorite poster artists, Drew Struzan. He remarked that he had to retire because the studios found it cheaper to make photoshop heads.

#186 2 years ago

SMK

TheLaw

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Ann Arbor, MI

12y 162K 48,060 19 30 1

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
That backglass is just lazy photoshop. ...

Hey now. That artist was kind of a big deal in the day

#187 2 years ago

LMS

Tranquilize

Pinside member

9y 84,550 3,780 35

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
Did I say that? Reading comprehension issues? Go back and read it again. Here's a hint. Nowhere did I say the same artist. Nor did I say it looks "just like" the backglass art. Go ahead, and then I'll take your apology. But you won't give one, will you?

Jeez Louise. Chill dude.

#188 2 years ago

GTX

gdonovan

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
That backglass is just lazy photoshop. Reminds me of one of my favorite poster artists, Drew Struzan. He remarked that he had to retire because the studios found it cheaper to make photoshop heads.

As much as I enjoy the gameplay, the backglass and playfield art is terrible on LAH. Ditto for LW3.

Not a fan of the whole "big head" school of Photoshop art.

What this video- hilarious.

#189 2 years ago

MAM

drypaint

I think the playfield art on LAH is great. It's 80's-90's comic book style, like many of the Data East titles at the time. The backglass however is TERRIBLE. I had to change that on mine. Straight up bad collage art. There was no Photoshop at that time.

#190 2 years ago

MAM

drypaint

Quoted from gdonovan:
As much as I enjoy the gameplay, the backglass and playfield art is terrible on LAH. Ditto for LW3.
Not a fan of the whole "big head" school of Photoshop art.
What this video- hilarious.

That video was awesome! I have never seen that, so glad you posted it.

#191 2 years ago

GTX

gdonovan

Pinside member

Quoted from drypaint:
There was no Photoshop at that time.

Photoshop started in 1987 was full commercial in 1990, Last Action Hero came out in 1993.

I'm still using PS 5.0 which came out in 1998.

#192 2 years ago

GTX

gdonovan

Pinside member

Quoted from drypaint:
That video was awesome! I have never seen that, so glad you posted it.

its HILARIOUSLY bad and funny as hell.

#193 2 years ago

MAM

drypaint

Quoted from gdonovan:
Photoshop started in 1987 was full commercial in 1990, Last Action Hero came out in 1993.
I'm still using PS 5.0 which came out in 1998.

Wow... I stand corrected.

Edit: The Wow is as much for the fact that photoshop came out that early, but equally that you are still using the version from 1998. LOL

#194 2 years ago

GTX

gdonovan

Pinside member

Quoted from drypaint:
Wow... I stand corrected.
Edit: The Wow is as much for the fact that photoshop came out that early, but equally that you are still using the version from 1998. LOL

It does what I need it to do, matter of fact there are still aspects I have not fully explored.

Swapping over to Ubuntu and Gimp this year, steep learning curve there!

#195 2 years ago

KJS

Pinside+ Frequent

7y 85,100 1,291

Quoted from Mr_Tantrum:
Fixed it for you.
[quoted image]

I like it

#196 2 years ago

KJS

Pinside+ Frequent

7y 85,100 1,291

I've never owned a DE game as I always cringed at the artwork on most of them. Thanks for the video now I know who was behind it all !!! Nice you guys over there have your very own Warwick Capper

Still would like a minty Time Machine though one day!

Those faces on Rush...wow. Reminds me I was super keen on Houdini as I loved the theme and wanted it alongside my Theatre of magic...then I saw that face on the playfield and was instantly turned off the game.

#197 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

https://www.cbr.com/the-entire-1982-dc-comics-style-guide-is-online-and-amazing/
https://www.coroflot.com/jsantomero/Marvel-Corporate-Style-Guide-Marvel

I do have to point out in, uh ... defense... of a lot of the movie, comic book and some other license properties. Most companies have "Style guides" that other companies that license out a product have to follow. you literally have art that's provided, and / or have to follow certain guidelines on what you can or cannot do with the graphic appearance of the license. That may unfortunately explain why a lot of Stern, JJ, etc. have Photoshopped playfields or Backglasses.

Not sure that explains The Last Action Hero though.

#198 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from MtnFrost:
That backglass is just lazy photoshop. Reminds me of one of my favorite poster artists, Drew Struzan. He remarked that he had to retire because the studios found it cheaper to make photoshop heads.

Quoted from TheLaw:
Hey now. That artist was kind of a big deal in the day

pasted_image (resized).png

#199 2 years ago

GIR

girloveswaffles

Pinside member

Richard Amsel:
pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

pasted_image (resized).png

#200 2 years ago

MAM

drypaint