With regards to pinball center, it's really "meh"... My CFTBL is fitted with one ( bought it at a retailer about two months ago, and he had it replaced), and the size seems odd, ie it seems small compared to the window size.

It does have a hologram effect though.

Brightness is a problem however, but that could be the lamp setup (I have not yet checked the light path, mirror, etc). For that matter, if anyone has a suggestion on what to check I'm interested.

I have one question: the right vertical ejector for letter "M" sometimes get stucks, ie the ball does not reach enough velocity to eject in the ramp and fall back in the ejector. And it does so in loop, quite annoying.

I checked the coil mechanism, and nothing seems out of the ordinary. So before I replace the coil completely, someone suggested that it might miss a small piece of rubber on top of the coil axis, where the ball sits, to increase slightly the height. Could someone send me a picture of this ejector so I can check whether it's missing on my unit ?

Also, if someone in Europe is parting with their snack bar v1 to v4, I would be interested.

On a sidenote, for those interested into ressurecting MikeD mod, it's actually available in some sort, see this thread here for those who might have missed it:
https://go-dmd.de/produkt/tiltaudio-cftbl-bundle/

Beware though... it's not for the faint of heart. It requires to replace the audio board with TiltAudio board (it does have the side benefit of allowing you to change the audio mix, just like Pinsound), which you need to solder yourself (and there are SMD components there...). And then you need to figure out the fixture mechanism, add all necessary components (secondary RPI for the display, etc). So be sure you know what you're getting into with this mod . There seems to be an alternative if you have a Pin2DMD, but I have not checked it yet.

As for me I'll make the jump. Just need to figure out how to mount the display.

regards

I cleaned the sleeve, but did not replace it yet (did not have one handy ^

That said... I'm pretty sure I don't have the cup outlined in your diagram. Thanks for the pointer!

I wish I had the 3d model as I could very easily print it using my resin printer (although I can pro ably recreate it if I can see how it's mounted on the coil axis)

May I have a pointer to this new rom, and what it's supposed to bring?

Regards

I would like to switch my CFTBL ROM to English (currently in French, horrendous translation as always), I have the ROM code, I have the programmer, but I would welcome the ROM chip reference (I could probably get it by opening the backbox and removing the sticker, but my wife keeps playing it )

Thanks !

Good morning,

Time to do a little bit of renovation on my CFTBL. The usual plastics are broken (snack bar and KISS plastic), but I realized taking a closer look that the scoop entries are "really" higher than the plastic. So much that I fail to see how it can even be mounted without breaking in the first place. Could someone please post pictures of these two area with the plastic mounted ? Did you have to bend the scoop entrance ?

Alternatively, I kind of wonder, I have access to a metal shop, I think it might be a good alternative to manufacture a metal plate and screw the plastic on top of it, thoughts on this ?

Regards

Well, this is a picture of my kiss scoop, as you can see it will take more than a washer or bending.... The previous owner did a nasty looking plastic fix (well sort of), but to be fair I fail to see how he could even install a plastic here in the first place

20201201_080815 (resized).jpg

Ah crap, my "Slide" VUK is not playing nice again. I had replaced the coil and the sleeve and it's been working very very smoothly for a few weeks, and yesterday the ball was again stuck in several occasions (ie the kicker does not propel the ball with enough velocity so that it can escape, and the ball falls back).

What should I know check ? Would the transistor powering that coil explain this behaviour (insuficcient amp) ?

So it resulted into the coil not getting enough amp ? I resoldered it about one month ago, I would hope that the lug would be fine (if by lug you mean the connection of the coil to the wire - I'm fluent in english but this one kind of eludes me)

Unfortunately not that. The first coil I replaced had perfect soldering. And so does the one I put in place.

Thanks for that link, super interesting read. Unfortunately it deals primarily with "no power at all" to the coil, which is not my case (since there is power, just not enough)

Ah that would have been possible before I changed the coil, since the issue was pretty much every time. More difficult now, the issue appears about one out of ten. But good idea, I'll look into it.

Indeed, that's me. At least I keep my alias consistent between websites

I'll perform this test next week. Thanks for the suggestion. That said, I checked on the schematics, there is a rectifier bridge (BR3) which is driving the high voltage. I've exchanged on Facebook on this subject with some other french enthusiasts, and one was saying that a bad rectifier bridge could result into a lower voltage, anyone seen this ?

Checked mechanically, nothing odd. I'll have to check the rectifier bridge. That said, I'd like a pointer that would explain how a defective diode in a rectifier bridge can lead to lower voltage.

Anyone would know where this wire should be connected (see picture, the dangling black wire from the connector, in front of the ribbon cable - not the best picture I admit). Since it's black I assume it's a ground trace, but where in the world should it be soldered?

For that matter, it's very odd that there would be such a connector with a single wire, I wonder if it was added by the previous owner and for what purpose

Thanks

20201216_174240 (resized).jpg

That's what I suspected, but just to clarify my very bad picture : this wire is currently disconnected , it's dangling in the air. It seems to have been torn, hence why I'm asking where it should be connected

Regards

Thanks !

Really an odd way to route a ground wire... Anyway, I'll plug it back in it's place

May I know the brand and reference of your board holder and your desoldering gun/pump? I've been struggling to choose one

Regards

ah crap, I would need advice (although I already made some progress, but if anyone has experience with the symptoms I have it would be nice)

My Creature is encountering multiple failures, at least partially. Sound is gone, so is Pin2DMD. Flashers/inserts/coils seem to work, at least partially.

What I checked:
- Voltage input on J501 should be 20VAC according to the schematics, straight from the transformer, I have 10V DC (!): I suppose I have something odd in my transformer ? How is it even possible to get 10V DC on a transformer 20V AC output (unless I misread my multimeter, but I checked a few times as I was super puzzled)
- Voltage output on J118 (which I use for powering Pin2DMD) should be 12V, I have zero. I have checked the fuses, they are all OK. I have yet to trace 12V generation (I suppose there is a regulator somewhere with a rectifier)

What is odd is that 20VAC failed first (ie sound was failing, so I started to look into it - I have a TiltAudio - and I noticed the TiltAudio board was not powering up, so I checked 20VAC input first, it was gone), but rest was functional. Then all of sudden 12V disappeared.

So:
- Has anyone experienced transformer failure, is this common ? I mean, to lose 20VAC is a pretty rare occurence I would think
- How is 12V generated ? I can check the schematics but if someone already has that info that would save me some time
- Would anyone has the pinout of the transformer connectors ? I can't find it in my Creech manual

Thanks and regards

I don't need it, but just love it when community folks step in and offer a solution which turns out to be super cheap... Thanks for that !

May I suggest an additionnal design that would be useful for afterglow users and WPC89 owners: an adapter board sitting on J501 (on the sound board) to draw power from the 20VAC and provide 18V DC (for afterglow) along with 12V (for PIN2DMD) and 5V (for anything else).

Requires a fuse, a bridge rectifier and a few big capacitors, and three voltage regulators, but that would be very useful IMO

Cheers

Oh well I'm sure he has a lot on his plate. Just making a suggestion (and yes I know stumblor , we are exchanging on other topics )

Electronics is definitely easy (SPI screens are cheap and easy to program with just a standard Arduino), but the anesthetics is another matter altogether.

I'm not an artist, so can't figure out what would look best. Electronics mods tend to look good on sci-fi themed pinball, but on a Creech it's slightly more difficult to integrate.

Conceptually you could have video trailers playing on a small size screen at the back, that would fit well (and I believe swinks has a nice manual on this), but the signs are more difficult aesthetically speaking

Nice overall design, but I have to ask... Why a 4D display ??? Given the amount of pixel change between each frame, an SPI screen would do just fine, no ? And they are way cheaper, and can be controlled by an Arduino. You can add to it one optocoupler, a few diodes and resistors for triggering on insert status.

Am I missing something ?

Thanks for the explanation, I was thinking there might be a technical reason (SPI screens framerate are limited because of the SPI speed interface for ex). Apologies if my question might have sounded rude, that was not the intent (lost in translation one would say). Indeed for a one-off 4G displays are rather a nice solution. But boy are they expensive. I managed to snag a uoled-128-g2 at 25 euros on ebay, but official price list is more in the range of 50 euros for that model (at least on Mouser in Europe).

Fortunately things have improved on the SPI side of things, with an atsamd51 at 120Mhz I'm able to achieve 8FPS for mjpg type video decoding at 240x240, I hope to be able to achieve 10FPS and more on ESP32 (80ms are taken for screen SPI update). That's for pure video content where each pixel in the frame is updated at each cycle. With content where a differential pixel update can take place (since SPI displays have their own frame buffer), I would assume you can achieve much higher frame rate (at the expense of engineering investment though).

Which size / resolution did you find was required for that sign ?

And it's back

My dreaded "damn ball won't exit the Slide VUK" issue

Here's a video:

I've cleaned up the sleeve, replaced the coil, checked all mechanics, and this issue appears once in a while. Sometimes it works fine for a few days, then fails on one launch, sometimes it fails consistently (as in the linked video, I had to remove the glass to catch the ball).

I'm starting to think the control circuitry is at fault. Checking on the schematics there is a control transistor, has anyone experienced a failure on a control transistor of that nature ?

I'll post pictures, but I did check the coil stop and also changed the sleeve (actually that was the first thing I did before even replacing the coil).
Can you define "mushrooming", not sure I've seen this term before

Thanks

Thanks ! I'll take a look

So I checked the plunger, nothing odd (plus I don't see how mushrooming can happen on this part)

The plastic cup is fine

I took a scope shoot of the coil (this is the pin that is driven to ground when activating), as you can see no specific issue (less than one micro second, 70v - there is an attenuation of 10 on my probe otherwise I exceed the max input of the scope so the scope shoot shows 7V)

I'm puzzled....

20210217_170917 (resized).jpg

20210217_193139 (resized).jpg

20210217_193223 (resized).jpg

CFTBL VUK (resized).jpg

As of now, it happens pretty much all the time, regardless of how long it has been on. I have a ball stuck in the vuk and left pinball off for a few hours, turned it on, and vuk cannot eject.

I realize that I should have taken a scope shoot of the other pin of the coil, in case there is a drop of voltage at the same time as other pin being driven to ground , I'll try that tomorrow

On the coil sleeve, I'm definitely not sure, I'll check.

At first look, would you say the plastic cup is at the correct height? When the ball is un the vuk, what should be it's default position?

I did test manually when I replaced the sleeve and the coil. There does not seem to be any resistance. I tried to look top down on the plastic cup when it tries to eject the ball, I did not see anything odd.

Only thing I can think off now is to check the opposite pin, check the sleeve, check the length of the plunger and the position of the plastic cup. Maybe add a washer?

What is odd is that if I reverse the sleeve, it sticks out at the bottom, thus actually creating a stop for the plunger and reducing it's movement range. I checked the PN provided, and it's supposed to be a 52mm sleeve, which is actually slightly longer than mine (51mm on paper, will check it's real lenght)

I'll try to adjust the wireform on top, although I did not see anything obvious when I checked the ejection of the ball

Man this issue is a real pain to debug

I checked the movement of the plunger, the way the sleeve is mounted on my original picture do not interfere at all with the movement (since the plunger is blocked by the metal plate at the rear anyway).

I disassembled, added a small 2.5mm thick (3D printer to the rescue) washer below the plastic cup, attempted to realign the wireform ramp (although impact was not obvious). So far so good, the ball ejected directly at power up.

That said it did work in the past, so i'll have to play quite a few games to determine if the issue is solved

[EDIT] And of course it did not solve it...
Man I'm getting crazy with this issue

Only option left now is measuring the voltage swing on the second pin (in case there is a drop), and measure current during power up of the coil. As a reference, would anyone have the coil resistance (in ohm) ?

At this stage I would be ready to grasp any straw, but in all honesty I would be surprised, since the opto essentially act as a trigger to energize the coil, and my problem is not that the coil does not start, it's that it does not have enough power

I've taken a oscilloscope shoot (above), and the transistor does switch. What I don't know however is the current draw, that was going to be my next step (need a current probe for my scope), and the reason why I was asking for the reference ohm resistance of the coil, if anyone has it. Should be around 3.5/3.7 ohms.

I must ask... What is this MRS switch?

Also, mine only does two or three rotations max, so I'm interested into guidance to improve.

Regards

Thanks, I'll try to adjust the bowl level. But I must say I'm interested into this MRS device, any pointer on how to install and where to find it?

Regards

Back on my VUK ejector coil issue after a two weeks break (reminder: my right ejector does not have sufficient power to eject the ball correctly in the wire ramp).

I've performed a few measurements:
- Measured resistance directly from the power board: 4.3 Ohms
- Measured resistance directly at the coil: 3.9 Ohms

Since the coil is new I have no reason to believe this would be incorrect, plus the value seems rather in line.

I measured simultaneously using a Picoscope the waveforms of both end of the coil, directly at the coil connections, here's what I get (I'm applying a ratio of 10 on the probe to match the scope input, so it's measuring 70V)

The very nice inversed square waveform is the drive signal
The not so nice signal is supposed to be the power line, which should be kept at 70V

So from that measurement, I would be tempted to think the issue is that the voltage drop of the 70V line is causing a drop of the voltage difference, especially after 5ms.

However I lack comparison points, and it could be that this is a perfectly normal curve, so I would welcome any feedbacks you can share

Thanks

Capture CFTBL (resized).jpg

I replaced BR3 rectifier and C8 capacitor, no luck, same measurement, same behavior.

This is driving me crazy...

Adding an external powered sub is the best thing you can do sound wise. I've done it on my Tron and my Star Trek, this is so much better than any speaker upgrade. And it's cheap, as in top of it you can use a single powered subwoofer for multiple pinball machines (with a mixer table)

So back to basics:
- Can someone share the part number of the coil for the VUK, so I can check if mine is identical ? After all, I reordered the same coil on the basis of what was installed, it could be that a different one is needed
- Can someone take a resistance measurement at the coil ? I'm getting 3.9 Ohms, this sounds in line, but even a .5 Ohms can yield a huge difference

Thanks

Just checked it, it's identical: AE-23-800, reference resistance according to the link above is 4.3 Ohms (I have 4.2 Ohms as measured from the power board).

I'm running out of ideas.

As it turns out, I did a simulation of the circuit. The voltage curve is actually pretty normal when taking into consideration the low value of the capacitor (150uF), and the very high current draw. I just did not expect it.

Now I'm back to square one, since it's not electrical it has to be mechanical, but can't figure out what. I did realign the wire ramp just above, kind of randomly since I have no way to determine the proper position, and it's working much better, but I have no clue why.

Just out of curiosty, on my CFTBL the "Move your car" ramp is a killer if the ball fails to go through it all the way to the bumpers, and goes back down, it's a guaranteed drain between the flippers.

Is this a normal behaviour ? Can I reduce it somehow ?

Regards

I would welcome a pointer on this, I'm not sure I quite figure out what this is exactly

Likewise, I'm not quite sure I understand what it looks like... any picture / pointer ?

Thanks

I must say many did not have high hopes of this mod seeing the light if the day, including me, we are proven wrong. His design is interesting, I bet he's using sound commands (he's hooked it to the ribbon cable between cpu board and sound board). In some respect, very similar in principe to what Tiltaudio could achieve, except that it's a PnP mod.

Does he provide SW update with new animated content?

Exactly my point, I'd be curious to see a video of the animations when multiball is available, when it starts, when the first ball of the multiball drains and you need to hit the snackbar, etc. I don't see how you can recreate the game logic with just switches/inserts (well maybe you can, but it's a lot of work, and I'm sure there are loopholes)

There is a gameplay synchronized mod, although it's full DIY... Use TiltAudio, and you can control the display according to gameplay event. Not really PnP though, needs a little bit of knowledge (soldering, etc)

Easy, don't ask her that's how I ended up with... 7

Could you confirm if the measurements were in line with the 3D model ?

I have Pinball Center holo. It does the job but that's it. It does not have the same depth than the original (the creature is taken from farther away, and the hands do not reach out to the player as I've seen in others machines). But it's much cheaper than the original, and most importantly... available...

But if I understand correctly, these 256x64 HD panels require a modified speaker panel, right ?

[EDIT] Of course they do, seen the message from stumblor
Oh well, guess I know what I have to do now...

Yeah the irony... We spend tons of money to upgrade our DMDs, whereas we actually seldom watch them during gameplay (and this is even more relevant on modern games with LCD screens and fancy animations, which I never get to see since I'm the only one playing and I never watch the screen except when it's quiet !!)

OK, I might be slightly exagerating, but you see my point

Few questions:
- Did you measure idle voltage at the coil (ie not energized)
- can you measure resistance of the entire circuit taken from the power board connector. There's almost nothing between the power board and the coils, you should see a value of a few ohms (careful with the direction, the flyback diode can affect the reading). A typical coil is about 3 to 4 ohms. A higher resistance will result into a lower current, thus reducing the magnetic effect. Likewise a lower voltage than expected (should be 70V) decrease current for a fixed resistance value

If your voltage level is too low, issue is likely the rectifier (but then all coils on the same power rail should exhibit the same behavior)

If your resistance is too high, there 's something in circuit raising resistance. Check solder connections and wiring, especially at the connectors

Control transistor might also be bad, although to be fair I'm not quite sure I understand how a transistor could' partially fail (ie switching, but limiting current)

Makes you wonder, why didn't they add black light then if they took the pain of printing it in BL sensitive ink ? Or is that a coincidence ?

Makes me want to actually add blacklight inside the cabinet itself, need to find the right trigger for it (and where to put it)

That's a super cool link, many thanks!

Shoot, no European reseller. It doubles the price because of shipping... For a small ROM that would fit in an enveloppe. Aren't they selling elsewhere ?

Not that it's a lot of money either way, just that in principle I'd rather pay the developer than ebay, post office and customs

By the way, how much different is this from the competition ROM that floated around a little while ago ?