(Topic ID: 48888)

Centaur Club.....Members Only!

By vster23

10 years ago


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There are 2,314 posts in this topic. You are on page 31 of 47.
#1501 2 years ago
Quoted from ghostbc:

If you go back to the Bally flipper mech just before Centaur (Strikes and Spares era ) game plays way better. You can also hit the chamber ball easier and harder to get to the top. Change them and you wont look back or have a stuck flipper ever again.

Thanks for that tip. Exact part # ? Where to order it ?

[And I have to note once more that the "very softly gliding / almost floating" ball travel on this game is quite unlike that of most other pins, from most eras. It takes some getting used to. If the ball just bounces off a flipper -- as when you may have been attempting to trap and cradle it -- there is an excellent chance that it will drain.]

#1502 2 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

Thanks for that tip. Exact part # ? Where to order it ?
[And I have to note once more that the "very softly gliding / almost floating" ball travel on this game is quite unlike that of most other pins, from most eras. It takes some getting used to. If the ball just bounces off a flipper -- as when you may have been attempting to trap and cradle it -- there is an excellent chance that it will drain.]

Two thoughts. One, in regards to your flipper sticking upwards, it might be a magnetized coil stop. If your flipper plunger and sleeve are clean (if not, clean your mech and replace your sleeve) and you can freely move the plunger in and out, then take 2 pieces of clear scotch tape and tape the coil stop. This will break any magnetic attraction between the stop and the flipper plunger.

Second thought is, I'm Team Linear Flipper mech. I don't have the same issues that other people do, probably because I always rebuild them unless they've been rebuilt prior to me getting the game. IMO, the flippers are an integral part of the game and if anything should get money, it's that.

I guess thoughts 3 and 4 , in regards to your floatiness, clean and wax your playfield. That'll go a long ways. If you rear leg levelers are the 2" ones, put 3" ones back there and put them up higher. It'll take care of any floatiness.

#1503 2 years ago

Alright finally join this club. Picked up a decent player condition machine recently. Any tips would be helpful... Right now I am just trying to get the game to boot. The MPU flashes 6 times and on the 7 it dims. Displays turn on but they flicker.. Online I was reading its a 43-+ volts and they said F4 fuse might be blown but mine isn't. I ordered a new Bridge rectifier today because the original looks trashed hopefully that will fix it..

FDB960CA-87EB-4628-BAA8-F8A4BE2C7F83 (resized).jpegFDB960CA-87EB-4628-BAA8-F8A4BE2C7F83 (resized).jpeg
#1504 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Right now I am just trying to get the game to boot. The MPU flashes 6 times and on the 7 it dims. Displays turn on but they flicker..

The game wants to see all the balls on power-up before going into proper attract mode, otherwise the displays will all flicker "0000000". So make sure there's 5 balls in the outhole area.

#1505 2 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

The game wants to see all the balls on power-up before going into proper attract mode, otherwise the displays will all flicker "0000000". So make sure there's 5 balls in the outhole area.

Okay thanks, I’ll make sure all 5 balls are in the trough. Didn’t even think about that..

#1506 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Okay thanks, I’ll make sure all 5 balls are in the trough. Didn’t even think about that..

Or you could manually trip the 4th ball trough switch.

#1507 2 years ago
Quoted from ghostbc:

If you go back to the Bally flipper mech just before Centaur (Strikes and Spares era ) game plays way better. You can also hit the chamber ball easier and harder to get to the top. Change them and you wont look back or have a stuck flipper ever again.

I downloaded the Strikes and Spares manual for reference. All I'm seeing in the Parts List re flippers are a mention of the coils, AQ-25-500/34-5050. Is that what you were referring to ? Or something else ? And would these still be available somewhere ?

#1508 2 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

Is that what you were referring to ? Or something else ? And would these still be available somewhere ?

Post 520 of Vid's Guide to Rebuilding Flippers. Its a keypost

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-upgradingrebuilding-flippers/page/11#post-1855100

#1509 2 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

I downloaded the Strikes and Spares manual for reference. All I'm seeing in the Parts List re flippers are a mention of the coils, AQ-25-500/34-5050. Is that what you were referring to ? Or something else ? And would these still be available somewhere ?

The Bally game manuals do not illustrate the playfield parts.

#1510 2 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

The game wants to see all the balls on power-up before going into proper attract mode, otherwise the displays will all flicker "0000000". So make sure there's 5 balls in the outhole area.

Alright game is booting now by adding 5 balls, but I've got no solenoids or sound.. When I push the start button the game starts a game but doesn't kick the ball out and I started touching the slingshots and they don't work either. Seems like all solenoids aren't working..

#1511 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Alright game is booting now by adding 5 balls, but I've got no solenoids or sound.. When I push the start button the game starts a game but doesn't kick the ball out and I started touching the slingshots and they don't work either. Seems like all solenoids aren't working..

Check the 1amp slow-blow fuse on the playfield underside.

#1512 2 years ago

Aright replaced the 1amp fuse under playfield and still no solenoids. Game boots and when I push start game starts but doesn’t kick out ball and immediately says tilt. I checked all tilts and all seem fine. Any other thoughts?

#1513 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Aright replaced the 1amp fuse under playfield and still no solenoids. Game boots and when I push start game starts but doesn’t kick out ball and immediately says tilt. I checked all tilts and all seem fine. Any other thoughts?

1) put game in solenoid test mode. does anything work?
1a) knocker, coin lockout, flipper relay?
2) if starting a game does the flippers work?
3) check schematics... flippers get wired first for +45 volts...brown wire.
3a) from playfield fuse...yellow wire is daisy-chained to each main solenoid.
3b) +45 volts present to kickers, thumper bumpers, drop targets?
4) data lines from CPU to solenoid voltage regulator board.
4a) check continuity, cold solder joints, broken wires, bad connectors...
4b) check +5 volt jumper wire from input connector to solenoid transistor circuitry.
4c) can you jump temporally from GND to tips of the SE9302 transistors.
--- do solenoids fire?

#1514 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

1) put game in solenoid test mode. does anything work?
1a) knocker, coin lockout, flipper relay?
2) if starting a game does the flippers work?
3) check schematics... flippers get wired first for +45 volts...brown wire.
3a) from playfield fuse...yellow wire is daisy-chained to each main solenoid.
3b) +45 volts present to kickers, thumper bumpers, drop targets?
4) data lines from CPU to solenoid voltage regulator board.
4a) check continuity, cold solder joints, broken wires, bad connectors...
4b) check +5 volt jumper wire from input connector to solenoid transistor circuitry.
4c) can you jump temporally from GND to tips of the SE9302 transistors.
--- do solenoids fire?

Okay thanks, found a shorted tilt switch disconnected it and now game doesn't tilt. Next problem is solenoids aren't working period. Checked all fuses and they are all good. I ordered a new power supply so should be here soon.

#1515 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

I ordered a new power supply so should be here soon.

The game requires the solenoid voltage to be working in order to boot which your game is doing. The power-supply board is unlikely to be the issue.

Give vec-tor some feedback to his diagnosis points in post #1513 to help narrow down the problem. If you're not sure on an item let us know and we will go into further detail.

#1516 2 years ago

Could someone be so kind to take a close up picture of the playfield power connector from the solenoid driver board J2 connector? I'm trying to find a replacement, the harness I have someone cut it out. A quick measurement would be ideal too! Thanks!

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#1517 2 years ago

Between each connector I have approx 26 inches.

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#1518 2 years ago

What is the approximate width of the connector?

#1519 2 years ago

3/4". Does this help?

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#1520 2 years ago

Interesting, thank you!

#1521 2 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

The game requires the solenoid voltage to be working in order to boot which your game is doing. The power-supply board is unlikely to be the issue.
Give vec-tor some feedback to his diagnosis points in post #1513 to help narrow down the problem. If you're not sure on an item let us know and we will go into further detail.

Alright thanks, I'll just keep the new power supply as a back up then. Here's the update- I had an extra driver board laying around so I swap it out and now the solenoids are all working. Only issue I am having is one switch issue switch 17 trough switch isn't working.. switch 16 is the slam tilt switch, which is probably one of the tilt switches I disconnected. The manual online doesn't show what switch 16 is I assuming its the coin door one, right? White/red wire..

#1522 2 years ago
Quoted from sunnRAT:

3/4". Does this help?
[quoted image]

And one of the connector has a point on it right?

#1523 2 years ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

And one of the connector has a point on it right?

Yes

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#1524 2 years ago
Quoted from sunnRAT:

Yes[quoted image]

Found these on Ebay, Chinese no doubt but what were rolling with it!

Thank you again!

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#1525 2 years ago

Can anyone tell me what switch 8 is, in the manual it says outhole.. What switch is the out hole? When in switch test mode it registers as the first trough switch..

#1526 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

switch 16 is the slam tilt switch, which is probably one of the tilt switches I disconnected.

Switch #16 (Slam) is different to the Tilt switches at #15
If a player slam tilts the machine the consequence is the game resets as a punishment for excessively rough behavior.
If a player just tilts the machine they lose their ball in play.

There are two slam switches and they're weighted.
One is on the back of the coin door to sense when someone kicks the door.
The other is near the tilt plumbob that senses when someone lifts the game then drops it.

Quoted from pacman11:

Can anyone tell me what switch 8 is, in the manual it says outhole.. What switch is the out hole? When in switch test mode it registers as the first trough switch..

The outhole is where the ball goes when you lose the ball in play.

Centaur_Outhole.pngCentaur_Outhole.png

#1527 2 years ago

Question Quench- what does the last trough switch do? I'm assuming it's for indication of broken ball diverter as it's in a "5th ball" location.

#1528 2 years ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Question Quench- what does the last trough switch do? I'm assuming it's for indication of broken ball diverter as it's in a "5th ball" location.

I do not know if you want me to answer that question.
But..... If in multi-ball and the last two balls "drain stack" and get fed into
the underground trough.... well, kick a ball out...
Proper game operations is;
four balls underground, one ball on top.

#1529 2 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

Switch #16 (Slam) is different to the Tilt switches at #15
If a player slam tilts the machine the consequence is the game resets as a punishment for excessively rough behavior.
If a player just tilts the machine they lose their ball in play.
There are two slam switches and they're weighted.
One is on the back of the coin door to sense when someone kicks the door.
The other is near the tilt plumbob that senses when someone lifts the game then drops it.

The outhole is where the ball goes when you lose the ball in play.
[quoted image]

Thanks for the switch map, I didn't see this on IPDB.

#1530 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

But..... If in multi-ball and the last two balls "drain stack" and get fed into
the underground trough.... well, kick a ball out...

Awesome explanation, thanks @vec-tor!

Quoted from pacman11:

Thanks for the switch map, I didn't see this on IPDB.

It's in the manual on IPDB - page 24 of 44. Numbers in circles are switch test mode numbers, numbers in square boxes are solenoid test mode numbers.

#1531 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

But..... If in multi-ball and the last two balls "drain stack" and get fed into
the underground trough.... well, kick a ball out...

I just had this happen to me yesterday for the first time in a while but it didn't kick out. I had to run solenoid test to fire it out to start a game. Don't ever remember having to do that before.

I'll have to see what was going on with that last switch.

Thanks

#1532 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

I do not know if you want me to answer that question.
But..... If in multi-ball and the last two balls "drain stack" and get fed into
the underground trough.... well, kick a ball out...
Proper game operations is;
four balls underground, one ball on top.

That is what I figured, in theory you should only have 4 in trough due to the mechanical diverter. One at the "5th ball" location makes no sense unless there is a mechanical failure of the diverter or as you say a quick ball stackup.

#1533 2 years ago

FWIW: I'm having to rebuild a Centaur from a CPR playfield.
1st pix, is how off the trap-flap registration holes are.
I like to test fit every component to make sure that each piece has the
best outcome from being fitted into a new surface.
IMG_0004[1] (resized).JPGIMG_0004[1] (resized).JPG
2nd pix are of the holes that are dowel filled in.
IMG_0005[1] (resized).JPGIMG_0005[1] (resized).JPG
Finally, the 3rd pix of the under playfield bottom shot.
IMG_0006[1] (resized).JPGIMG_0006[1] (resized).JPG
Cheers.

#1534 2 years ago
Quoted from vec-tor:FWIW: I'm having to rebuild a Centaur from a CPR playfield.
1st pix, is how off the trap-flap registration holes are.
I like to test fit every component to make sure that each piece has the
best outcome from being fitted into a new surface.
[quoted image]
2nd pix are of the holes that are dowel filled in.
[quoted image]
Finally, the 3rd pix of the under playfield bottom shot.
[quoted image]
Cheers.

Definitely lots of fine tuning for things like this with the CPR playfields I've worked on too. You can certainly sink in a ton of time lining up mechs, rails, etc when doing a swap. Never take the dimples as they are!

#1535 2 years ago
Quoted from izzy:

Has anyone found a source for the pop bumper bodies? Everyone seems to be out of them, except European vendors.
thx

Found. Pinsider sold me some. A big thx to John Mohr.

#1536 2 years ago

Alright switch 8 is the only switch not working on my game and of course it’s the out hole switch. Dumb question but what makes a switch go bad?
B6394BA1-E57C-4EBF-9B38-727C96B21ECE (resized).jpegB6394BA1-E57C-4EBF-9B38-727C96B21ECE (resized).jpeg

#1537 2 years ago

dirty contacts, bad capacitors, broken wires, bad diodes, cold solder joints, bad crimp contacts, there's more I'm sure.

#1538 2 years ago

Switch 8 outhole is the white/red wire. I found it on the MPU which is the top right connector and repined it and it still doesn't work. If I disconnect the switch and touch the wires will that activate the switch. Just trying to figure out if its the switch or something else.. All the other switches are working except switch 8

#1539 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Switch 8 outhole is the white/red wire. I found it on the MPU which is the top right connector and repined it and it still doesn't work. If I disconnect the switch and touch the wires will that activate the switch. Just trying to figure out if its the switch or something else..

Does your switch have a random solder blob on it? Is it normally open? Did you check the contacts to make sure they're clean and are making contact when manually pressed together?

#1540 2 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Does your switch have a random solder blob on it? Is it normally open? Did you check the contacts to make sure they're clean and are making contact when manually pressed together?

See the picture of it above? It's normally open, yes I cleaned the contacts too and manually pressed them together and nothing. I was looking for a new one and everyone is out of stock for it.

#1541 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

See the picture of it above? It's normally open, yes I cleaned the contacts too and manually pressed them together and nothing. I was looking for a new one and everyone is out of stock for it.

Yes, I see it, but you can physically inspect it. I can't tell if there's any random solder on it or if it's clean. Use DMM and test continuity on the switch.

#1542 2 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Yes, I see it, but you can physically inspect it. I can't tell if there's any random solder on it or if it's clean. Use DMM and test continuity on the switch.

Okay just tested it and yes there is continuity on the switch..

#1543 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Okay just tested it and yes there is continuity on the switch..

ok, next I would check the diode. Clip one leg, use your DMM in diode mode and see what the readings are.

#1544 2 years ago

Out hole switch 8 has continuity from switch to the MPU - Connector J2 white/red wire

#1545 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Out hole switch 8 has continuity from switch to the MPU - Connector J2 white/red wire

Check continuity between the 2 contacts (leaves) on the switch IE hold the probes to either tab, and manually squeeze the the switch together.

#1546 2 years ago
Quoted from izzy:

Found. Pinsider sold me some. A big thx to John Mohr.

Bodies ? Not sure what was meant by that. I recently bought a couple spares of the pop bumper *caps* from a seller on eBay, and they looked brand new. Even though I acquired a preponderance of mine that way, buying entire games on eBay became a rather dicey proposition (for multiple reasons) some years ago, as well as generally very over-priced, I have found it to be a good source for parts, though. Have replaced some difficult-to-find pf plastics and other things that way. But sometimes you just have to get lucky on the timing of your search.

#1547 2 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Check continuity between the 2 contacts (leaves) on the switch IE hold the probes to either tab, and manually squeeze the the switch together.

Yes, it works for the continuity test.. What's the point of the diode on the switch? If it's bad what happens? shorted switch?

#1548 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Yes, it works for the continuity test.. What's the point of the diode on the switch? If it's bad what happens? shorted switch?

Have you checked the diode like FatPanda asked? From the results you have reported back it seems it could only be a bad diode. They do fail.

#1549 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Yes, it works for the continuity test.. What's the point of the diode on the switch? If it's bad what happens? shorted switch?

I don't know why it works, I just know that I've had to replace diodes before when a switch isn't working I'm sure someone like Quench or vec-tor would know.

That would be my next step. You can sub a 1N4004 if you have it on-hand. But you can test it by clipping a leg and checking with a DMM on diode mode.
Should read 0L one way and some kind of voltage the other way.

From Fluke's website:
A bad (opened) diode does not allow current to flow in either direction. A multimeter will display OL in both directions when the diode is opened.
A shorted diode has the same voltage drop reading (approximately 0.4 V) in both directions.

#1550 2 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Yes, it works for the continuity test.. What's the point of the diode on the switch? If it's bad what happens? shorted switch?

The diode isolates that switch to a single point in the matrix. Without it, the switch closing will falsely cause other switches in the matrix to appear as closed at the same time.

You haven't mentioned if the game is not detecting the switch 08 closure or if it's always detecting switch 08 is stuck closed (stuck switches are put on the ignore list to prevent the game repeatedly scoring because of it).
So what is switch test mode telling you about the outhole? Stuck or never detecting it closing?

BTW when you start a game, the ball should be kicked to the shooter lane regardless of the state of the outhole switch. It's only when you lose the first ball that it won't respond.

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