Quoted from bigd1979:Unfortunately this is a lot of the hobby now apparently.... how sad
Only on Pinside, most of the hobby isn’t on here
(Topic ID: 298998)
Linked Games
Cactus Canyon (Remake - LE)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2021-
Cactus Canyon (Remake - Special Edition Plus)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2021
-
Cactus Canyon (Remake - Special Edition)
Chicago Gaming Co., 2021
Topic Gallery
Quoted from Manic:Of course they're gonna add as much bling as they can to try to make it desirable but people saying "the topper makes the game" should give you pause. A model with a motor spinning its arms is not going to make or break the gameplay. Looks nice up there but that's about it.
.
It certainly appears that there is much more to the Topper than merely “spinning its arms”. The window in the Topper Buildings are also animated and interactive. If there was ever a Topper that was worth it from both a gameplay and appearance aspect, this is it!
That said, I don’t think it’s too far fetched to imagine a Lyman Kit that comes with the Topper for $1,500 down the road for SE owners, and only $500 for LE owners (sans Topper). 
Prospect Heights, IL
Quoted from jfh:The game play of both editions is identical except for a minor mode for the topper that a number of folks have said is interesting but gets old quickly. Other than the extended warranty the other differences are small cosmetic ones that don’t impact game plan in any way
Quoted from bigd1979:it hasn't diminished my love for playing pinball as i was still able to get other models. I especially can't see the issue when it comes to cgc pins as they still offer a full game minis some cosmetic stuff unlike stern and jjp. Sounds like a bunch of entitled people missed out on the le this time and are now being babies.
Quoted from Concretehardt:Many of those who got LE’s were not somehow special or well connected, they simply took 30 seconds to send Sara at PPS an email or reach out to their favorite distributor a couple months ago
For $1K more you get 12 extra months on electronics, 6 extra months on mechanical, and another mode in the game - oh yeah and the topper. You can trivialize all you want to make your point but it falls on deaf ears. The LE is the better buy period.
No one is saying it diminishes love for playing pinball. I'll still play it when I see it and enjoy it because Lyman is the man on the keyboard code. Will I buy an SE for $1K less without the extended warranty, whistles, etc - nope. I also don't like the sales model of buy before announce. Been in this hobby a long time, won't preorder ever again. So entitled babies - lol. I guess all the new hobbyists are as well by your definition. Lighten up Francis.
A couple months ago reached out to disti. Expo was the unveiling. Agree to disagree. I feel the model is broken. Add more LE's to the announce date and to owners who want to play and enjoy - not flip for $4K profit and never open the box. New people to the hobby don't sit on pinside and preorder with PPS.
Quoted from Freakyguy666:It certainly appears that there is much more to the Topper than merely “spinning its arms”. The window in the Topper Buildings are also animated and interactive. If there was ever a Topper that was worth it from both a gameplay and appearance aspect, this is it!
That said, I don’t think it’s too far fetched to imagine a Lyman Kit that comes with the Topper for $1,500 down the road for SE owners, and only $500 for LE owners (sans Topper).
Ah yeah the windows light up... lol. I'm sure when I'm aiming for the bad guy drop target I'll take the time to appreciate the proper window lighting up and maybe displaying an X.
That's just me though... I've never seen a "topper" (usually overpriced cheap junk) that I couldn't happily live without. I like the classic lines of the machine itself but I know I'm in the minority. Hell there's an entire cottage industry built around people demanding to spend 500 to 1500 bucks for backbox decorations.
Anything with Lyman included I can get behind though 
.
I don't understand why the difference in warranty between models ?
Essentially they are the same product ?
The warranty period for a new CCr is very fair and reasonable even at the SE level.
Not complaining but why extra for LEs ? This longer warranty doesn't appear to be built into the price? I don't get it ? Both versions should have the same warranty.
The LE warranty period is fantastic.
A great warranty is something CGC should be proud of and kudos to them.
Its unfortunate that other manufacturers don't care to stand behind their products as well as CGC does.
Screenshot_20211102-165241_Chrome (resized).jpgQuoted from RA77:I don't understand why the difference in warranty between models ?
Essentially they are the same product ?
The warranty period for a new CCr is very fair and reasonable even at the SE level.
Not complaining but why extra for LEs ? This longer warranty doesn't appear to be built into the price? I don't get it ? Both versions should have the same warranty.
The LE warranty period is fantastic.
A great warranty is something CGC should be proud of and kudos to them.
Its unfortunate that other manufacturers don't care to stand behind their products as well as CGC does.
[quoted image]
You already know the answer to this. As in any business the goal is to get the customer to buy the most expensive product in the lineup as that is where they will usually have their highest margins.
Sure they could offer a one year warranty to the base model but why should they? You save that as a "value added" extra for the top of the line.
To be fair it's not like any other mfr. offers anything better... officially. Usually behind the scenes most of them try to take care of the customer. To... show good will (and hopefully stop online complaints more realistically).
So they're not exactly getting any pressure in the warranty dept. that's for sure.
Quoted from badbilly27:For $1K more you get 12 extra months on electronics, 6 extra months on mechanical, and another mode in the game - oh yeah and the topper. You can trivialize all you want to make your point but it falls on deaf ears. The LE is the better buy period.
I agree the LE is a better value if the extra $1250 doesn’t bother you. But that doesn’t make the SE a bad value. And you imply that a huge part of the hobby is excluded because not everyone can get an LE - that’s nuts.
Those that buy *any* NIB game are a tiny fraction of the hobby as it is. There will be many who want the game who can’t justify the cost difference for the LE (or the cost of the SE for that matter) no matter what “value” others may assign to it.
It would be simpler if the industry just went back to the basics - no multiple models, trim lines or limited editions. See/play the game before you buy. Run them as long as there is demand during a set period of time and move to the next title - pretty much how selling new games was for 70 years or so. But going back would create just as many problems as it would solve and upset just as many people that feel the current industry model is unfair.
I simply don't get the limited run business model, the only thing it creates are drama and upset people.
Every business goal is to earn money, so why refuse to take all that money from us customers? Wouldn't it be better to sell a shitload of LE and SE for a mountain of money instead of limited their runs? What do they as a business earn from this, it baffles me...
Let's take the infamous cargument: lets say Volvo is releasing their new family car model but limits
the run to 20k instead of the usual 400k that they easily could sell worldwide. Isn't popularity, big sales and happy customers good? Don't say pins are a Ferrari and therefore should be limited, pins only exist because operators wanted to earn money, they weren't limiting them to a exclusive few bowling alleys back in the days but wanted as many as possible to get access to them.
If everyone could get the pin they wanted then everyone would be happy, scalpers would have 0 business, no FOMO whatsoever and manufacturers would swim in money. I don't see any downside with this model at all.
The few hundred collectors that would be disappointed they can't have an exclusive pin will buy the darn pin anyway if the game is good enough and if they don't, all the other people out there will but it in droves anyway.
Copenhagen
Quoted from Lhyrgoif:I simply don't get the limited run business model, the only thing it creates are drama and upset people.
Plus you would assume that the extra LE stuff they have to order is cheaper per game if the volume goes up. Why not say that pre-ordering of the deluxe edition is open for four weeks. On expiry, this is the limitation of the model run. You know how much stuff to order. And can asses what the interest for the standard model will be after this.
Eatons Hill
Quoted from soren:Plus you would assume that the extra LE stuff they have to order is cheaper per game if the volume goes up. Why not say that pre-ordering of the deluxe edition is open for four weeks. On expiry, this is the limitation of the model run. You know how much stuff to order. And can asses what the interest for the standard model will be after this.
What he said
Man, this thread has turned from hype into page after page of bitching about toppers. Wtf? I guarantee someone over at CGC has muttered the phrase "bunch of ungrateful crybabies". The topper does not "make the game" for God's sake. And as far as the warranty, how many of you will actually keep the damn game that long before moving on to next shiny blinged out game with a fancy topper? I think I'll step aside now and wait for my final payment invoice to show up. Holy shit! Where's the Tylenol!
Quoted from badbilly27:For $1K more you get 12 extra months on electronics, 6 extra months on mechanical
This. I bought the AFMrLE and did have a few things go wrong throughout the warranty period and it was really nice to be able to reach out and get things corrected. As usual on Pinside if you have a different option than the other side you gotta be wrong - Stern v the field now LE v SE.
Quoted from Concretehardt:I’m guessing the LE guys are gonna want an answer on this before they lay their money down as some will want to switch to the SE if they can buy the topper later.
If they allow SE owners to buy the topper separately, presumably at a price of about $1000, then the total cost of the SE is only $250 less than the LE. That means they are basically one in the same at that point and that doesn’t make any sense. The only things that make the LE different at that point are a bit of wood and a plaque. The LE plaque at that point would be a bit of a joke.
Quoted from RA77:I can't figure out CCr price structure for Australia .
Distributers can charge what ever they want I guess.
A Stern LE at $10500 USD is retailing for $15500 AUD here
Seems fair with our dollar now at .75
Shipping games from the us has gone from $2,000 US to $10,000 US now and even more if you don't want to wait 9 weeks, also LE have a topper which means less games fit in a container than a SE, 33 SE and about 24 LE.
And all our allocation is Australia are already SOLD Out regardless
Quoted from Pinballemporium:Strange that the distributor I deal with has not been given any allocation numbers yet.
We only got our allocation today, so i am sure other Distributors will know soon
How many of the LE’s did the distributors get? I’ve was on a list for months and still did not make the cut.Does half of the LE’s still go overseas?I just can’t believe how many more people are in the hobby!.I’ve been in and out for 20 plus years and never seen LE Pins sell out this quickly
Quoted from badbilly27:I think CGC screwed up on the LEs and the model is upside down. It's insane to announce a game and the LE's are already sold out. This shouldn't be an elitist hobby, inside circle group, or buy every new title from disti so you automatically get it thing. I met so many new to hobbyists Expo weekend that were generally interested in an LE to be told - already sold out. Not the way to embrace the new blood pumping life into this hobby.
How is this different then trying to buy a Stern LE? Actually was easier to get CCr with Planetary offering them since Aug with a guarantee you could get one. All you had to do was say you were interested. No money needed. I haven't seen any Stern dealer do the same. I was on my dealers interested list since April. But if I wasn't it would have been easy to get on Planetary's.
Quoted from bmegar:I’ve been in and out for 20 plus years and never seen LE Pins sell out this quickly
Seriously? Every Stern LE has sold out in the same way for years now.
Quoted from Pinballemporium:Strange that the distributor I deal with has not been given any allocation numbers yet.
We only got our allocation today, so i am sure other Distributors will know soon
Quoted from bmegar:How many of the LE’s did the distributors get? I’ve was on a list for months and still did not make the cut.Does half of the LE’s still go overseas?I just can’t believe how many more people are in the hobby!.I’ve been in and out for 20 plus years and never seen LE Pins sell out this quickly
It depends on how many SE or CE they sold in the past, if they sold 25 se or CE they will get 25 LE, they can't just buy LE
I would think they feel most LE's will be in peoples game rooms barely getting play, so doubling the warranty for collectors is a nice bump. On route games should show issues faster.
I know my HOU metallica had pf had paint flaking off 2 yrs in with 250 plays....it got replaced but probably because of the distro and known issue.. So I can totally see them covering LE's long since they'll most likely have low plays.
I wonder what percentage of buyers only became interested after the enhanced code announcement? I know I’m one of them.
If this is the standard going forward, I just got a lot more excited about TOTANr.
Quoted from Only_Pinball:Seriously? Every Stern LE has sold out in the same way for years now.
I wouldn’t say years… you could buy a stranger things le nearly a year after launch. I bought my jp le 3 months after launch for below msrp.
Quoted from gprotein:You missed the sick looking armor and the apron, which is a beauty. Arguably the best looking one as of today. SE is still a great value, but LE is clearly better value with all the extras added up
Watch out, I said early it was clearly a better value and I was corrected that it wasn't..lol
Quoted from NC_Pin:I wouldn’t say years… you could buy a stranger things le nearly a year after launch. I bought my jp le 3 months after launch for below msrp.
At this point those days are gone.
Quoted from Only_Pinball:Wow, thats awesome!
It just shows this is kinda a new thing. I swore off buying le’s sight-unseen after Munsters. Then we played jp in September of 2019 (it was launched in July) and we bought it in early October. At the time the distributor still had 2 more left.
I think all of this is cyclical… games are impossible to get … until they aren’t. It may take another year or two, but at some point things will even out.
Quoted from Only_Pinball:Wow, thats awesome!
well stranger things at launch was a turd...same with metallica
Quoted from NC_Pin:It just shows this is kinda a new thing. I swore off buying le’s sight-unseen after Munsters. Then we played jp in September of 2019 (it was launched in July) and we bought it in early October. At the time the distributor still had 2 more left.
I think all of this is cyclical… games are impossible to get … until they aren’t. It may take another year or two, but at some point things will even out.
If only we could have a WWE caliber game come out, maybe it would poison the LE well for the flippers.
Does anyone know if art blades designed for the original cactus canyon will fit properly inside the remake? Are the cabinets made to the exact same dimensions? I ask because Tilt Graphics has some I like better than the LE version.
Quoted from Lhyrgoif:I simply don't get the limited run business model, the only thing it creates are drama and upset people.
Every business goal is to earn money, so why refuse to take all that money from us customers? Wouldn't it be better to sell a shitload of LE and SE for a mountain of money instead of limited their runs? What do they as a business earn from this, it baffles me...
Let's take the infamous cargument: lets say Volvo is releasing their new family car model but limits
the run to 20k instead of the usual 400k that they easily could sell worldwide. Isn't popularity, big sales and happy customers good? Don't say pins are a Ferrari and therefore should be limited, pins only exist because operators wanted to earn money, they weren't limiting them to a exclusive few bowling alleys back in the days but wanted as many as possible to get access to them.
If everyone could get the pin they wanted then everyone would be happy, scalpers would have 0 business, no FOMO whatsoever and manufacturers would swim in money. I don't see any downside with this model at all.
The few hundred collectors that would be disappointed they can't have an exclusive pin will buy the darn pin anyway if the game is good enough and if they don't, all the other people out there will but it in droves anyway.
Totally agree, stop calling the loaded one "Limited", and just go with Deluxe or something else like that. Sell as many as there are orders for and when it stops, move on to the next title. I'm sure making a "Limited" number makes ordering the parts needed easier and of course creates the FOMO, but it really does suck having to fight to get something you want AND at a huge price. Stopping the game flippers would be the best thing that would come of it IMO, giving anyone with the finances the chance to get the top model without giving extra money to someone simply because they got on a list before you did
Quoted from CoolCatPinball:Does anyone know if art blades designed for the original cactus canyon will fit properly inside the remake? Are the cabinets made to the exact same dimensions? I ask because Tilt Graphics has some I like better than the LE version.
Yes, should be fine.
Keep the wallet handy for options that may roll out over the next few months too.
Good luck!
Quoted from Damonator:If only we could have a WWE caliber game come out, maybe it would poison the LE well for the flippers.
I don't think WWE was fooling anyone..but Godzilla would have been a good gotcha theme.
Quoted from Vino:Yes, should be fine.
Keep the wallet handy for options that may roll out over the next few months too.
Good luck!
I have some old WMS wpc mirror blades I was going to put into MMr...but then "I thought" I heard there was a slight difference in the CGC mirror blades? I haven't test fitted them yet... Maybe I should....
Quoted from mrclean:I think it’ll cause some Lootin’ & Shootin’ if you’ve already got a “CCR LE”.
Didn’t stop them from releasing another “Limiteder Edition” on top of MMR LE so… :shrug:
Edmonton, AB
why not just make one model ?
make as many that are ordered and be done with it ...
sorry for you guys that cant get an LE sure spaces will free up... then there will be the secondary used market !
Quoted from transprtr4u:why not just make one model ?
make as many that are ordered and be done with it ...
sorry for you guys that cant get an LE sure spaces will free up... then there will be the secondary used market !
Because people have different price points and priorities. Some people are limited on space and want the nicest version of a game with all the bells and whistles. Some want a game as cheap as possible for locations and others want a good value. I think the 3 tier model like Stern does is perfect. If you are unable to get an LE the premium is unlimited and has all of the gameplay features. I am sure this also benefits the manufacturer.
Quoted from CoolCatPinball:Does anyone know if art blades designed for the original cactus canyon will fit properly inside the remake? Are the cabinets made to the exact same dimensions? I ask because Tilt Graphics has some I like better than the LE version.
Yes I believe so. The mirror blades I bought for my 3 remakes also said they fit the older Bally / Williams games as well.
Quoted from Gotfrogs:If you are unable to get an LE
if there is no LE and one model then nobody left behind on the bandwagon...
Quoted from gunstarhero:Didn’t stop them from releasing another “Limiteder Edition” on top of MMR LE
As has been pointed out several times now, the large screen and color changing LED's did not exist when the original MMr LE was built. CGC not only built new ones to match the current upgrades that the others (AFM and MB) had but also sold kits so those of us who bought the earlier ones could upgrade. They didnt make new "LE type" games of AFM or MB.
Quoted from Soulrider911:I can not believe it after calling 20 distributors I got my deposit down on a LE
That’s how you do it. Congrats!
Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
Reply
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!
Donate to PinsideGreat to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
