(Topic ID: 245544)

Captain Fantastic help needed


By timab2000

9 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 16 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 months ago by timab2000
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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    There have been 7 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

    Capt Fantastic Out Hole relay 2 (resized).jpg
    20190619_184949_001 (resized).jpg
    20190619_185014 (resized).jpg
    20190619_184933 (resized).jpg
    20190619_184908 (resized).jpg
    Bally Score Motor 3 (resized).jpg
    pasted_image (resized).png

    #1 9 months ago

    I've been working on restoring my Captain Fantastic and have it back together. I'm trying to get it working here's what's happening.

    When I turn on power switch, game lites up and the lock relay locks on.

    There are credits on the game but if I hit the credit button nothing happens.

    If I put a coin down the slot game will sometimes start, but not decrease or incease credits.

    When game is working it will score points but when ball drains nothing happens.

    There are a few other issues but I'll talk about those later.

    Any ideas would greatly appreciated

    #2 9 months ago

    There are 2 paths here:
    1. The (blue) path that contains the Credit Button
    2. The (green) path that starts the score motor

    check each path to see if any switches are not adjusted correctly.

    I cut out things you don't need to see from this image. Do you have a schematic?

    Since you mentioned the coin drop I would think the coin chute switches need scrutiny first. If the NC sides are not closed power cannot flow

    pasted_image (resized).png

    #3 9 months ago

    Yes I do have a schematic and have been using it.

    I did make some progress and was able to get the credit button working so the game starts. That was an adjustment on the first stack of switches on the score motor.

    I think I have the out hole figure it out maybe with another switch adjustment on the score motor so I'm making a little Headway thanks for your help.

    One other issue I'm having is the drop targets will not score individually but when they are all down they will score and reset I'm pretty sure they're supposed to score a hundred Points each time they're drop down one at a time.

    Somebody maybe can confirm that.
    I haven't played the game for a while can't remember thanks again

    #4 9 months ago

    I think what might be helpful to me is if I knew, on the score motor, the first switch stack which switches need to be open and which ones needed to be closed if anybody has that information I'd really appreciate it thanks

    I don't see that on the schematic anywhere unless I'm missing something

    #5 9 months ago
    Quoted from timab2000:

    I think what might be helpful to me is if I knew, on the score motor, the first switch stack which switches need to be open and which ones needed to be closed

    Williams schematics often have detailed drawings of each switch on the Score Motor that show their index (ie. Score Motor not turning) position but I'm not aware that Bally ever did. If you're concerned that something is out of adjustment on your Score Motor just turn the motor slowly when the power is off. Each switch has just two positions (open and closed), and should change from one position to the other as the pin or gap on the cam activates the switch stack.

    For example, if a switch is normally closed when the motor isn't turning, it should open when the pin or gap on the cam rolls by. If it doesn't open something isn't adjusted property.

    The Sequence chart on your schematic shows you when each cam on the Score Motor is active:
    Bally Score Motor 3 (resized).jpg
    and the annotation on each score motor switch tells you which cam the switch stack is activated by.

    So for example:
    The 8G Score Motor switch shown above is normally closed, and opens near the end of the Score Motor cycle (in position 6).
    The 9A Score Motor switch is normally open and closes several times in the Score Motor cycle (positions 1, 2, 4 & 5).

    To find the Score Motor switches on your Score Motor see:
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sky-kings-power-free-play-and-top-hole-issue#post-4457680

    /Mark

    #6 9 months ago

    Well thanks for the info, I have that chart on my schematic but makes little since to me.

    Are the stacks set up so A is at the bottom or top of the stack?

    And then when you look at a relay that has mulitpe switchs how do you know which one is supposed to be closed or open

    #7 9 months ago
    Quoted from timab2000:

    Well thanks for the info, I have that chart on my schematic but makes little since to me.

    The black dots show you when things are active. So for example cam 3 (or row 3) has a black dot in position 1 (or column 1). That means that when cam 3 is in position 1, all of its switches activate or change position. Note that there are 8 different positions on the chart (0-7) representing different amounts of rotation of the score motor cams.

    Think of the chart as showing when the pistons in an engine fire. In this case cam 3 fires before cam 4 which fires before cam 5, etc. The difference is that some cams fire more than once.

    Quoted from timab2000:

    Are the stacks set up so A is at the bottom or top of the stack?

    Yes, follow the link in reply #4 for details.

    Quoted from timab2000:

    And then when you look at a relay that has mulitpe switchs how do you know which one is supposed to be closed or open

    If you operate the relay manually (with the power off) by pushing the armature in so the switches activate, you should see every switch change position. That's all that really matters. If the switch is open it should close when you activate the relay; if it's closed activating the relay should open it.

    If you're looking for a specific switch from the schematic, you usually need to look for the wire colors shown on the schematic. There's a table of wire color abbreviations on the schematic too.

    #8 9 months ago

    Here is where l get confused how to translate this. The actual outhole relay looks nothing like the schematic symbol.
    20190619_184908 (resized).jpg20190619_184933 (resized).jpg

    Or the first switch stack on the score motor looks nothing like the diagram

    20190619_185014 (resized).jpg20190619_184949_001 (resized).jpg
    #10 9 months ago
    Quoted from timab2000:

    Here is where l get confused how to translate this. The actual outhole relay looks nothing like the schematic symbol

    The schematic isn't meant to look like the actual relay.
    Capt Fantastic Out Hole relay 2 (resized).jpg
    The (1) switch in the schematic above is just one switch (a switch with three leaves called a make/break switch) that is activated by the Out Hole relay. There's another normally open switch (2) driven by the Out Hole relay elsewhere on the schematic. They're not anywhere near each other on the schematic even though they might be right next to each other in the Out Hole relay switch stack.

    The (1) switch has three wires of different colors: green-yellow on one side, yellow in the middle and red-yellow on the other side. The (2) switch has two wire colors: white-black and blue-white.

    The actual Out Hole Relay coil is a coil (3) in the schematic. One of its wire colors is blue-white which you can barely make out in your photo above.

    #11 9 months ago

    Looks like at least one of your make/break switches may be out of adjustment in the picture of your score motor, though your best route through this is getting the hang of the schematic. I often find using a jumper wire handy to narrow down the location of an issue. Sometimes switches that are not making good enough contact cannot be diagnosed with the naked eye.

    Also, I believe the drop targets score 500 individually and 3000 upon completing the bank.

    #12 9 months ago

    Thanks for the info I made some progress today finally got game to start off the credit button.

    And when the ball drains it finally adds up the bonus scores where before when it drained it did nothing.

    Drop targets are now scoring but need to adjust switch on those for better reliability.

    Next issue is game wants to keep playing all four players rather than just one player. And sometimes it keeps replaying the same ball. Not sure what's up with that but I'll keep working on it and report back.

    Slowly going through the schematic to figure out which switches need to be opened and closed so good progress today thanks for all the help

    #13 9 months ago

    Got the game to finally stop playing all four players and just staying on player one which is what I wanted.

    Ball count sometimes does not change over and on the last ball when it drains it kicks out into the shooter lane and then ends the game so I have to figure that out

    #14 9 months ago
    Quoted from timab2000:

    Got the game to finally stop playing all four players and just staying on player one which is what I wanted.
    Ball count sometimes does not change over and on the last ball when it drains it kicks out into the shooter lane and then ends the game so I have to figure that out

    You're getting closer. Good work!

    #15 9 months ago
    Quoted from Cheddar:

    You're getting closer. Good work!

    I have you to thank for that. Thanks for your help!

    #16 9 months ago

    After a lot of long hours working on the game, it now plays thanks to "Cheddar" He helped me out quite a bit 1 switch stack was not correctly set once that was fixed game started to play.

    Thanks Cheddar!!

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