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(Topic ID: 136750)

Can this System 11B be repaired (alkaline damage)


By Cheddar

5 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 23 posts
  • 10 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by barakandl
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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    #1 5 years ago

    Ok this system 11b board is pretty nasty. Looking at the front there are several dozen components to be replaced. The back looks ok at first but the connectors at the bottom, ugh!
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    To top it off a couple of previous repairs were not finished (looks nasty)
    IMAG1093.jpg

    Opinions appreciated.

    #2 5 years ago

    That's pretty severe corrosion. Your board is too far gone IMO and you should buy a replacement.

    #3 5 years ago

    The flux not cleanef off is nothing. That battery damage is super bad. One of the worse I have seen. If you can repair yourself ?? If you need to send to get repaired not worth it. Look for a new board.

    #4 5 years ago

    So used or refurbished original or rottendog. Any other options or opinions?

    #5 5 years ago
    Quoted from Cheddar:

    Any other options or opinions?

    I like your shoes.

    #6 5 years ago
    Quoted from RCA1:

    I like your shoes.

    Lol, I thought I had my junk out. What a day to actually be zipped!

    #7 5 years ago

    For what it's worth I bought a rottendog board for my Fish Tales and have been very happy with it.

    G

    #8 5 years ago

    The corrosion looks like it's limited to the parts and didn't invade the traces. I've never seen a board with so much corrosion limited to parts only.

    Still...if it were my board, I'd take a shot at it. But, I repair boards all the time, and if I don't get all the corrosion and it comes back, not big deal for a board in my game. I wouldn't take it on for a customer. Too much time, cost, and risk of corrosion returning.

    PS - I like your shoes too.
    --
    Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
    http://www.Team-EM.com
    http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
    http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

    #9 5 years ago

    And thanks for all the love for my "Air Jesus" shoes!

    #10 5 years ago
    Quoted from ChrisHibler:

    The corrosion looks like it's limited to the parts and didn't invade the traces. I've never seen a board with so much corrosion limited to parts only.
    Still...if it were my board, I'd take a shot at it. But, I repair boards all the time, and if I don't get all the corrosion and it comes back, not big deal for a board in my game. I wouldn't take it on for a customer. Too much time, cost, and risk of corrosion returning.
    PS - I like your shoes too.
    --
    Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
    http://www.Team-EM.com
    http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
    http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

    I think this means the corrosion happened recently. I have seen some leaks caught within a month or so of the puke end up looking worse than it is. More typically the battery damage happened years ago and the corrosion goes deep down.

    I would pass on fixing that board. Hard to say how it is going to look once you pull those PIAs on components. SYS 11 boards seem to be a nightmare if the batteries leak. They dont hold up to an abrasive cleaning like the earlier generations did.

    #11 5 years ago

    Ok anybody got a refurbished or used board?

    #12 5 years ago

    Update: I was able to install the board and while it did not boot by itself I was able to complete a boot using the cpu button. I got sound, coils, buttons and displays. I was unable to get very far into the service menu. I think the connector under the worst of the damage had the service buttons on it so that would explain it.

    I put my ES board into it and was able to boot completely. same issues with the service buttons.

    Next steps:
    I want to test out the power supply and test points before I put any real load on the ES Board.
    I'll repin the affected connectors and see where that gets me.

    Anything you guys think I should check?

    I think this machine can keep the ES board. If I buy a RD replacement I'll put it in my ES

    #13 5 years ago

    Update 2:

    I removed the affected connectors, the pia nearest the battery holder, the ceramic resistors and the relay. The board looks pretty good underneath it all. The mask has lifted under the resistors but that is probably heat damage.

    I think this board can be saved. Time for the wash and some continuity checking.

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    #14 5 years ago

    Replace the connectors that were attached to the corroded headers. The correcion will be in them and you will just transfer it back to your new or repaired board.

    #15 5 years ago

    Update 3: rinsed with white vinegar, scrubbed worst areas with toothbrush. Soaked 15 minutes

    Rinsed with distilled water, blew dry with compressor

    Rinsed with 91% alcohol, blew dry with compressor

    Looks much better. I'll probably replace the resistor network above the big resistors but everything else looks pretty good.

    IMAG1126.jpgIMAG1127.jpgIMAG1128.jpg

    #16 5 years ago

    I'm putting together an order for replacement parts. I already have Pia's and connectors, plenty of crimp ends and an external battery pack.

    I am ordering the 2 watt resistors, male header pins. Can anybody recommend other components to have on hand while repairing this?

    Thanks

    #17 5 years ago

    See the area I circled in red (in addition to several areas I did not circle). If the trace is bubbled up from the board the damaged area needs to be removed since the alkaline damage has gotten under it and will continue to destroy the trace. After removal you will need to flush the board again. It can then be repaired with copper foil or jumpers.

    445510.jpg

    #18 5 years ago

    I'll check that out. I am thinking about pulling a couple more chips too.

    #19 5 years ago

    Ok I inspected that area.no bubbling happening.I think this is uneven oxidation from the lifted mask.

    I'll see if I can track down a better camera and get some better picks.

    Should I try and remove the oxidation in some manner?

    Update: looks like I can clean up the oxidation with a fiberglass pen

    #20 5 years ago

    Magic eraser may also work.

    #21 5 years ago
    Quoted from Cheddar:

    Should I try and remove the oxidation in some manner?

    Yes, the traces should all be nice and smooth like the lower (parallel) ones in the photo are. If there is damage under the traces those rough areas should come up pretty quickly w/o damaging the surrounding trace (will still need to be jumpered/repaired).

    Micro-bead blaster, Dremel tool with emery paper or an abrasive buff, electric pencil eraser, scotch-brite pad, fiberglass pen or fine grit sandpaper.

    #22 5 years ago

    I tried magic eraser without much effect. I think it's too fine for the job. I'll pick up a fiberglass pen at radioshack now that they are back.

    #23 5 years ago

    If the solder readily sticks to the trace, you have removed the corrosion. If the solder does not want to stick to spots and the area turns dark colored, it needs an abrasive cleaning.

    I abrasively clean the traces down to clean solder or clean copper. If the battery damage is severe, it is possible it has corroded all the way through. I always solder tin abrasively cleaned traces.

    If a trace is blown out and the gap is small, i use a resistor lead or something appropriately sizes to bridge the gap and tack it down to the trace. Other times a fine wire appropriate. I try to avoid using long wire runs if all possible.

    Your work is looking pretty good so far.

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