(Topic ID: 25981)

Can a bad TIP36C cause a fuse to blow?

By Foz

11 years ago


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  • 20 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by BenMielke
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#1 11 years ago

On my JP, the fuse F5 on the PPB keeps blowing.
At the same time, a TIP36C (Q3) transistor on the PPB measures at 0v.
Will replacing the transistor keep the fuse from blowing?
Or is the transistor behind the fuse in the electrical path,
which would mean something else is shorted?

Thanks

#2 11 years ago

The answer is yes. A shorted transistor will cause a coil to lock on until the fuse blows. But there's not enough data here to tell you if that will fix your problem. Transistor shorts are checked with impedance not voltage. If you replace the fuse, does the coil lock on as soon as you power on the machine?

#3 11 years ago

I can't see a coil locking, but then again, it only takes like half a second for the fuse to blow.
The fuse powers several coils, the flippers but also a couple of upkickers, which are hidden underneath the playfield. It's difficult to check all of 'm at once.

All coils have the right resistance, so I don't think any of those are shorted.

When checking Q3 to ground, Q3 makes a buz, the others don't.
Does that mean it's bad?

I used this website on how to test this specific transistor; http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/desega/index2.htm#replace
"TIP36c: Put the red lead of the DMM on the center lead or on the metal tab of the transistor. Put the black lead of the DMM on each of the two outside legs of the transistor. The DMM should show a reading of .4 to .6 volts. Any other value, and the transistor is bad and will need to be replaced."

#4 11 years ago

That's probably right. The meter beeps on continuity not volts. So it sounds like you tested it right. And coils locking up. You hear them instantly. It's not something you have to check each one. Think of how loud a flipper is when it fires. It would sound like that. Now the Q3, what does that control? It will be only one coil. You can look in the manual to find out. You can download the manual at ipdb if you don't have it.

#5 11 years ago

It's important you find the coil driven by q3 and test that one. A shorted coil or a bad coil diode will cause the transistor to short. Would suck to replace q3 and have it immediately fry again.

#6 11 years ago

It's important you find the coil driven by q3 and test that one. A shorted coil or a bad coil diode will cause the transistor to short. Would suck to replace q3 and have it immediately fry again.

#7 11 years ago

I'm not 100% sure what Q3 does
The manual says "tip sec". Not sure what that means

But in the end it seems to control the right vuk (that's a coil) and the upper left corner (not sure what that means).

Time to put in another fuse, turn down the radio, and check which coil fires.

q3.pngq3.png

#8 11 years ago

lol, nevermind, that says tip 36c of course

#9 11 years ago

Looks like your coil will have vio-green and yellow-violet wires according to the manual. That can help you track it down.

#10 11 years ago

If the coil has already shorted it will not "fire" and you will not hear anything. The RIGHT VUK is the one that puts into the right habitrail (over by the birds).

#11 11 years ago

You were right, one coil does fire, and as expected, it's the right VUK coil.
It does measure 2.3 ohm.
What does that mean, is the coil bad, or the transistor?
I'm not sure which part to replace.

#12 11 years ago

The coil fires so it's not burnt up. 2.3 ohm is a bit low but not a direct short. Do you have other 23-800 coils (or whatever it is) in the game that you can compare with? The low reading could just be your meter.

If you're good with board work swap the transistor out and see. Worst case it blows again and you have to replace it and the coil together. If you're not good with board work, you could just replace them both. I might be concerned with the diode on the coil being shorted. But there's not a good way to test that without just replacing the diode. If you do that make sure you don't get the band backwards. Doing that guarantees a shorted transistor. This assumes the coil has a diode....

At this point the transistor is bad. Only question is whether or not something else in the circuit is causing it to have gone bad of not.

#13 11 years ago

I'll check if there's another coil just like it, and compare it.

#14 11 years ago

Unfortunately this coil is unique in my machine, it's a 22-600 and measures 2.3 ohm
Just about all other kickers are 23-800 coils and measure at 3.8 ohm
So it looks like the meter is okay, and this 22-600 has a slightly lower resistance.

In any case, replacing both the coil and the transistor should work for sure?
Tomorrow I"ll replace the transistor, and it that doesn't work, i'll replace the coil as well.
Have to order a new coil first.

Thanks a mil for your help so far!

#15 11 years ago
Quoted from Foz:

Unfortunately this coil is unique in my machine, it's a 22-600 and measures 2.3 ohm
Just about all other kickers are 23-800 coils and measure at 3.8 ohm
So it looks like the meter is okay, and this 22-600 has a slightly lower resistance.
In any case, replacing both the coil and the transistor should work for sure?
Tomorrow I"ll replace the transistor, and it that doesn't work, i'll replace the coil as well.
Have to order a new coil first.
Thanks a mil for your help so far!

Replace the transistor. That should probably take care of it. If the coil diode caused the issue then you'll be replacing both - the coil and the new transistor because the coil diode would have fried the new transistor. If you're comfortable replacing a tip36, I'd just swap it and see. Probably is enough.

And based in your relative measurements of the other coils that are working, the 2.3 ohms does not sound alarming. A 22-600 should have lower resistance than a 23-800.

#16 11 years ago

Excellent. I was planning indeed on replacing the transistor first.
Will let you know if that fixes the problem.
Though I have a feeling that it will

#17 11 years ago

One last thing... Coil transistors usually have pre drivers. You may need to replace these as well or at least test them. I think on data east those are tip122's on your CPU board. I know it's recommended to always replace both but I'll admit I usually don't. Did you at least unplug and isolate the ppb board while testing the tip 36? If not do that before desoldering it...

#18 11 years ago

I didn't remove any connectors, but I did first test all tip122s, and none of them were shorted.
Do you recommend unplugging every cable from the ppb? Because that would disconnect it from the CPU board as well.

#19 11 years ago

Basically, what i do, is cut off the shorted TIP36C, replace the fuse and power on the machine. If no more fuse blows out, then install a new TIP36C. Also then check the coil that the transistor goes to and make sure it is not burnt out before turning the game back on.

7 years later
#20 3 years ago

My LAH was working great until I went to play and the ball would not launch. (And a few other coils. F5 on the PPB was blowing instantly. Ended up that the bridge rectifier BR1 was shorted. Had it replaced and works great again.

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