Maybe you should just go run Stern pinball vireland

And yet they sold 10k pins in 2017 and will sell more this year, despite all the doom and gloom. Some to you as well.

You have zero idea as to what their "main focus" is. I would say making great pinball machines is number one focus. And they are doing a pretty good F ing job at that.

If all they cared about was cost cutting was true they wouldn't have hired all the people that have come on board in the last year and a half.

Any business is going to attempt to be as cost effective as possible without trading off too much on the quality. Split cabinets good? Nope. Widespread? Nope.

Buy it or not? Your choice. A lot of people are voting with their wallets it appears.

So after reading this whole thread I went down to my arcade and checked the 3 games that I have after Kiss(i did not check Kiss le yet) Ghost Busters Prem is the oldest one I have and sure enough it is split on the right side . I don't go around checking the corners of cabs very often, in fact never. The Star Wars Pro is only a few weeks old and is fine but no angle brackets in the corners like Prem and LE. Just got Iron Maiden LE and will putting the B/W leg brackets and a corner brackets like the one shown in this thread . I found the bracket at Home Depo for half the price of the amazon add. I will be doing this to all games after and including Kiss. It is the best way to reassure stength. I have to thank the op for this thread or I would not have checked or noticed it and it would have eventually gotten real bad (it was already about 3/8 split). Check your games, then make them strong, this might be overkill but it sucks when it happens to you.

Ghostbc I'm in Denver about 3 times a year. I've always gone to 1Up Colfax, cause I love it, and I'm a creature of habit. Hilton's been telling me to go check out Lyons but I never have. Now that I see you have TWO Maidens, and you have two cause yer a huge fan, I'm switching it up. Lyons Pinball only for me from now on.
When you said (paraphrasing) "if you don't wanna hear Maiden at warp 20 then you might not wanna be here the next few days, it's gonna be LOUD!"
...man...that hit me right in the feels. I shed a single tear of happiness, and how it shone, in the sun.
Seriously, Lyons from now on....for life.

How do you know they sold close to 10K pins?

about damn time you came to your senses. You owe me a beer and a big joint when you finally visit and want to thank me again

Little Birdie that I have 100% confidence in

And for 2018 take a serial number from Jan and see where we end up in Dec

Come on everyone....

Ever time you have a split cabinet file a claim with Stern. They will get tired of sending out new replacement cabinets and work on a root cause solution.

If all we do is complain or worse yet fix these cabinets at home for them they never feel the pain!

PAIN = Change for Stern.

Until then business as usual and no need to change. Join the movement, make the call, send the email to Stern, make your voice heard!

I only have the one LE but I am a fan and It has a subwoofer and will be loud, introduce yourself next time your in town.

Coffee table books or pinball machines the maxim holds true.

True. But the materials being used now are no where near the grade they were using through KISS. I reinforced both my KISS and BM66 and you could feel how much better the screws bit into the wood on KISS. The wood was much denser. BM66 had much softer wood and the screws didn't bite nearly as well.

Repost over a year ago by me, understand the past. Don't try this with a modern Stern cabinet, it won't make through the first trial.

Well here is another one . I bought this for a client and the box was not damaged , so. Signed for it. . I opened it up and boom . It seems to me that the same side is having the same splitting issue. I will say Stern was great at Getting a new cabinet sent out to address the issue . I think Stern has really turned it around with games and coding and If they can get the cabinet issue and play fields corrected they will have an even more of an amazing product ! I really love Starwars and am looking forward to buying a gotg . Just wanted to post my two cents .

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Kiss Premium at our location split.

Wow. Split at the bottom as well. Doubt a corner bracket at the top would've prevented that.

You guys can speculate about Stern purposely "skimping to save a few bucks" as the cause of this, but I'm not buying it. Shipping out replacement cabs is costing them way more than any illusionary cost-cutting savings. I think there's simply an unplanned manufacturing flaw, just like with the playfield situation a couple years ago. And if they've got any sense they're probably all over trying to root out the problem.

That might have been the transition machine where part of them still had the older, sturdier wood until that was used up, then they transistioned to the crappy cabinet wood we have now.

Well, I bought a NIB Aerosmith Pro from JJ for my dad last week and was setting it up in his house tonight. All the split cab photos and reports had me nervous I would open the box up to a split cab and an undercarriage full of wood filler.

While there appeared to be some wood filler on the undercarriage (less than 2% of the undercarriage I would say...) the cab didn’t split in the box. The cab looks okay, this game won’t be played much so we will see how it holds up.

Anywho, some unboxing photos from tonight...because why not.

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So I’m contemplating trading/buying a GB Premium made in November 2016 from a local guy. He has had it for 1 1/2 years and it has just over 700 plays. While there doesn’t appear to be any major ghosting, there does appear to be two very small slivers of it at the jackpot and add-a-ball inserts near Tobins Spirit Guide.

I’ve been trying to convince myself that this is minor and won’t get much if any worse given the time and plays already passed. Now, however, I’m reading that not only do I have to worry about a possible flawed playfield but also the possibility that the cabinet will start splitting and falling apart as well? I’m having serious pause and considering avoiding any 2014-present Stern games altogether. Certainly wouldn’t buy anything NIB from them.

In what world is it okay to charge $6k-9k for a product and use such cheap materials and cause customers such angst and headaches? Who cares if Stern will replace these cabinets. They then make the owner figure out how to disassemble an entire machine and transfer everything on their own? Many like me would have to pay someone $300-$500 to come over and do that. Entirely unacceptable IMHO.

Stern needs to be held accountable for this. Apparently, they think they can get away with it because they are still mostly the only game in town and most will continue to buy their cheap stuff regardless of how shoddy their quality is. That company would almost be out of business in any remotely competitive industry.

Not World....mostly just us Americans...

Nothing apparent about it....they can and have been getting away with it for years...I've watched it happen my entire short time in this hobby (5 yrs).............Joey

So does anyone know if the GB cabs built in late 2016/early 2017 are prone to the splitting/ cracking issues? I'm assuming most of the stuff built in recent years may be prone but any insight is appreciated.

The people running Stern either aren't learning their lessons and/or aren't that bright. Cutting corners and costs on pf's and cabinets is likely costing them a lot more money in replacing, shipping, and damage to their reputation then if they had just built them with higher quality materials in the first place.

Good thing they aren't publicly traded or the CEO and a lot of upper management probably would have been sacked already.

GB came after Kiss and Kiss is when the issue started popping up, so yes.

Dude- just buy this machine! Like others have mentioned in other threads this is all minor. It’s a machine. If you buy a 2 - 3 yr old car it is going to have scratches and dents.

If you want perfect- than buy new in box. You get perfect but you will take depreciation hit like a new car. You buy and live with some imperfections you don’t take big depreciation hit.

Figure which way you lean, then invest and enjoy!!!

If you buy a NIB game and the cabinet splits they will send you a new cabinet. If you buy a NIB game and it has playfield problems, Stern will send you a brand new populated playfield so i think that they are being accountable for their mistakes.

Yes it sucks when these things happen for sure, but its not like they are sending out a terrible product and then telling their customers to F off. My GB is September 2016 and i have nearly 2k games on it and the cabinet hasnt fell apart yet and the playfield still looks beautiful.

You are seriously over thinking this way too much and i suggest that if you are as worried as you appear to be, that you buy a NIB game so you can get any issues that may arise taken care of by your distributor and Stern. This is pinball, its supposed to be fun so take a deep breath, relax and enjoy it. You will have to work on these games from time to time though so dont think you can buy a game and just play the hell out of it and never have any maintenance issues because thats not how pinball works.

My GOTGLE Doesn’t have the corner brackets like SWLE

Another expense to strengthen the cabinet-
I’m gonna email Chas/Patric at stern

Scratches and dings, yes. I would never buy a used car if the paint was bubbling or other glaring factory defects were starting or occurring. You’re excusing major structural and other issues away saying just buy NIB? Tell that to all those that have been buying NIB for the past 2-3 years having major playfield or cabinet issues with 6-12 months of purchase.

In the auto world, a manufacturer issues a major recall or has you take the flawed car to a dealer that fixes and switches out anything free of charge. Stern? Fight them for 6-12 months until they finally send the new part and let you deal with figuring out how to do everything. If you can’t or don’t have the time to figure it out on your own, hire a local pinball guy and and pay him $50-$75 an hour to fix the factory problems on your own dime.

Guys that think these type of problems are acceptable and just the same as some dings and scratches on a used car have pretty low expectations of what a product that costs 6-9k should be IMO.

My comments are more general then in respect to whether I buy a used recent make GB or other pin. I don’t think people buying new and paying what amounts to a very large sum of money for a product should have to put up with multiple and ongoing QC issues from a manufacturer that appear to largely be related to cost and corner cutting.

Like I said before, if there were 2 or 3 large competitors in the pinball market (rather then a few niched ones), Stern’s reputation and sales would be reeling. I think a lot of people in this community want to give them a pass because they feel like they kept pinball alive. That may be true, but why has their quality on all this stuff tanked in recent years while prices continue to rise?

I won’t give them a pass on some of this stuff. I’d rather wait on buy their products 2-3 years old to see if what I’m buying is holding up rather then falling apart but maybe that’s just me.

Buy and install the $5 w/b leg brackets from pinball life, install them, and be at peace your can will hold together.

Thanks. I am going to buy a used one next week and have already ordered Marco’s leg brackets for the cab. As long as the one I’m buying doesn’t have any cracking or splitting already, it won’t be a problem.

I just don’t understand why Stern doesn’t make them that way at the factory. On games shipped before they realized the issue, why not be proactive and send out brackets to those that bought games in the timeframe the issue started?

That would be the right thing to do by customers and for business. Waiting and trying to act like it isn’t a problem until it cracks and you have to replace an entire cab is probably more costly and also potentially more damaging to trust and your company’s brand.

Stern does not make them.

Stern buys them from CCC, the same company that made them for Williams and Bally 70 years ago.

While one split cabinet is too many, these cabinets are not falling apart in droves like you are being led to believe. I have 5 new/newer games GB, TWD, GOT, MET, and AS and they all have 1k to 2k plays on them and i haven't had a single issue with any of them and i do not think that i will.

I am however going to install the Bally/Williams brackets because its so easy and cheap to do just for added insurance but im definitely not in a panic situation to do it in fear of one of my cabinets exploding into toothpicks or anything like that. I'll get to it when i get to it and play the hell out of them until i do.

When you get your game just dont crank the leg bolts really hard and you will be fine. Just snug them up good and have fun and add the B/W brackets for your peace of mind sometime. I believe that the cabinets could be better and should be better probably but i also believe that some of these cabinets are being damaged during shipping and from the leg bolts being cranked down too tight and some even because of getting treated a little too rough maybe. Also the reality is, that there arent very many games having cabinet issues either. Yes there are some legitimate cab problems but there is also a few people on pinside that love to make people believe that things are far worse than what they really are too. I hope you enjoy your new game when you get it, good luck!

I disagree. Cabinet splits are dealt with on a case by case basis. Not everyone gets a replacement. And according to Stern ghosting inserts and shitty clear coat are now acceptable and considered normal.

I have the exact same minor ghosting inserts

Never got worse over time

I’d have zero concern but sounds like it bothers you so move on

Don’t stress - just buy NIB. Then you get your worries answered through warranty.

Enjoy pinball.

This is a hobby not an investment.

Well im definitely not going to argue about it but all i can say is i have never known anyone yet that Stern didn't take care of their problem. I also dont think Stern thinks bad playfield quality is normal, i dont care what their warranty states. They probably have that in place for the people who make a big deal out of nothing at all and yes there are definitely people who do that all the time. I have no doubt that if i get a bad playfield or a busted cabinet that Stern and my distributor both will take care of me. If i felt any different i damn sure wouldn't hand them 6 or 8 thiusanf dollars ever again.

I know its a hobby. However, I don't think is unreasonable to expect something you pay 6-9k not to have shoddy quality that leads to major issues within 3-12 months. That is why lemon laws were put in place.

I realize it isn't thr majority but it sounds lime it happens often enough it should have been addressed and better materials used a long time ago.

I'll agree with that. If you have to replace the pf or move the entire machine and electronics to a new cabinet, does Stern also pay for te labor costs you could incur?

No they do not. Pinball is a completely different animal than going and buying a new car. For alot of people, they may not even have anyone in their area that does pinball repair so you have to do it yourself.

Im not saying its ok or that it doesn't suck but thats just the way it is. I dont know if there is a distributor near you or not but if there is these are things that you can talk to them about. If you have a decent understanding of how to work on things you will be fine. I personally have trouble with electrical issues but I am Fortunate to have friends who can help if and when something like that occurs. The mechanical side of things i have learned to do on my own thankfully and i have the tools that i need to do most everything.

The good news is, pinball is growing and chances are there are some pinball groups or people people that you live close to. Its a great way to make some new friends that share the same interest as you and they are usually willing to help a fellow pinhead out. There are alot of really nice people in this hobby that will help you if needed.

Nope.

If you can't do it yourself, and you are not buying from a local distributor that can do it for you under warranty, then DO NOT buy a pinball machine.

Just like buying a Jet Ski:

If you don't have a trailer, and a truck, and the ability to back it up at a boat launch, then DO NOT buy a Jet Ski. It will cost you a fortune to have someone come take it out of the water for every service it needs.

NJ

Glad to hear it never got worse. Reassuring this one won't be a problem.

I'm getting a feeling that calling Stern out for cutting corners on some of this stuff is like calling some of your guy's babies ugly, though.

Are you really comparing knowing how to back up a trailer and get a jet ski in and out of the water to knowing electronics well enough to perform a complete pinball machine cabinet swap?

I will agree with you about buying a used game. Sure things are going to break and need tweaks here and there. However major issues in a NIB game that require major playfield and/or cabinet swaps of electronics, parts, etc shouldn't happen often. If it does, at a price point of 6-9k, all parts and labor to fix should be paid by the manufacturer IMO (including labor costs incurred)

Nm

What if there is no distributor near you though, who is going to do the repair work? Thats why they wont pay for it. They arent gonna pay Melvins Pinball Repair any money because he may screw your whole game up.

Do you have a distributor anywhere near you though? If so contact them with your concerns and talk to them about it. If there is no distributor anywhere near you, see if there are any pinball repair companies around you or better yet just try and hook up with some nearby pinheads that can help you get started in the hobby.

When i decided having a pinball machine would be cool, i got online and there happened to be a guy in my area that does pinball repair and sold machines etc. I called him and he was a super nice guy and he has helped me tremendously and because of him i have also met alot of other really nice people in the hobby. Had it not been for him i probably couldn't have got involved in this hobby because i didnt know my ass from a hole in the ground starting out. I can do most things now but its definitely possible that i will need his help again some day.

Pinball is a great hobby but it sure is much easier and more fun if you have knowledgeable people in your corner. There are also alot of great guys on here that are always willing to help and there's a ton of good info about pinball repair etc also if you want to take the time to read about it.

That's funny.

Sea-Doo will not pay to pull your Jetski ($17,000) out of the water, it's up to you to drag it into the closest dealership for repair.

Stern will not pay someone to come fix your game, it's up to you to drag it into your distributor for repair.

If you are not ready to service your own game, I beg you NOT TO BUY A PINBALL MACHINE!

The cabinets aren't as strong as 2015 and earlier. No one knows why though - lots of theories.

I would guess that Stern are urgently trying to rectify this issue. It does them no favors having to send out replacement cabinets.

Mine was split before it even came out of the box.

However, Stern agreed immediately to a replacement cabinet so not going to bitch about it.

They seem to have sorted out the ghosting issue and I think they will get their cabinets back to normal. They have to really.

They do back their product up. If they didn't they would lose so many buyers, it would seriously impact on their business.

I was disappointed about the cabinet but my playfield is the best I have had on a NIB Stern.

Not really a great analogy to a jet ski but I get your point. Guys, I already own 7 games, most of which are 20-30 year old Bally Willians games. I have problems off and on with them. If I didn't have a few guys locally that know how to fix stuff when I can't, I wouldn't be in the hobby.

Of course, that was never really the point. The point is Stern should be upping their game and QC given the rising price environment, not cutting corners and causing a lot of headaches for NIB, loyal customers.

If you’re not satisfied with Sterns quality, please don’t buy their games. You’re setting yourself up for disappointment. I promise you.

Stern did not stand behind my game, my distributor did, and it still cost me $400 to ship a new flawed game back to him.

Seriously, don’t buy a NIB Stern. I never will again.

I agree. I’ve decided I will never buy anything nib from them unless something with their QC drastically changes. Used, maybe if it isn’t falling apart.

A local distributor is also best for those not mechanically inclined, because the games were only loaded on a single truck (full container) from Stern:

Stern => Truck => Distributor.

When you have it shipped to your home, you get much more damage from all the loading and offloading of a single pallet:

Stern => Truck => Distributor => Local Hub => Truck => National Hub => Truck => Local Hub => Truck => Your Home

I talked to Chas yesterday he told me they have several cabinet manufacturers that they buy from, one of their cab suppliers was doing something different and only cabs from that Manufacture have an intermittent issue. Stern is aware of the issue and know where the cabs were coming from. It sounds like they have taken steps to correct the issue with the MFG. one last note I was worried that if I did the Williams brackets in my games and still had a problem that it would potentially void my warranty, Chas told me he/Stern was fine with it if I wanted to install the Williams brackets. Chas says his big headache is not a random cabinet failure it’s people putting 6 and 12 way power splitters on their games and frying something then calling him to sort it out.

Don’t buy ANYTHING new if these issues are concerns of yours. If you can’t inspect before you buy, don’t buy.